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[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

It's not cynicism, it's accepting reality.

Sure, if you only have a pessimistic view, which is boring and says you should probably find a new hobby that delights you anyway. I don't talk about sci-fi books or bike riding like wrestling fans talk about wrestling.

It's like any time Roman loses and someone's like "ugh this just means he's going to win next month, same old shit!" I mean, seriously, WWE is the same old shit, but not this tired, cynical attitude? If one sees it coming, why is one still here watching and talking about it? Hate that stuff.

 

[Sephzilla]

What? there is plenty of positivity in WrassleGAF I mean look at the discussion about NJPW.

There's truth here. WrassleGAF is generally a positive place and it gets more positive when the focus shifts to stuff like the first few seasons of Lucha Underground or NJPW. Things only get negative/cynical when WWE specifically is brought up, which is an expected side effect when talking about a product that is currently really bad.

Sure, if you only have a pessimistic view, which is boring and says you should probably find a new hobby that delights you anyway. I don't talk about sci-fi books or bike riding like wrestling fans talk about wrestling.

It's like any time Roman loses and someone's like "ugh this just means he's going to win next month, same old shit!" I mean, seriously, WWE is the same old shit, but not this tired, cynical attitude? If one sees it coming, why is one still here watching and talking about it? Hate that stuff.

The reason "ugh this just means he's going to win next month, same old shit!" comments happen is because the things they're complaining about end up happening. The complaints about "same old shit" and "50/50 booking" didn't just magically appear out of thin air.

Also, please cut it with the "if you're going to be pessimistic/cynical please find a new hobby" crap. Telling people who don't share your optimism to run off and do something else is not beneficial at all.

 

[Mahonay]

Well, this post just comes back to the cynicism talk that got me into this thread initially yesterday.

Wish there was more Power of Positivity in Wrestling GAF. Or that those who know they won't feel it would just move on to a new hobby for a while.

A 50 year old man who hasn't wrestled a single match in 13 years has the primary RAW title, who is fighting another part timer at WrestleMania for that title. Explain to me how this is good for fostering future talent?

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

A 50 year old man who hasn't wrestled a single match in 13 years has the primary RAW title, who is fighting another part timer at WrestleMania for that title. Explain to me how this is good for fostering future talent?

Why are you asking me something that has nothing to do with what you quoted?

This isn't good for future talent, and we've known this for decades, and we've even had our feelings validated when CM Punk confirmed this shittiness on the Cabana podcast. But acknowledging present shittiness is different and makes sense. Predicting what shittiness awaits while sticking around to see said predicted shittiness as it comes is bizarre behavior that people here have done for far longer than Vince has booked big guys to appeal to himself at our expense.

 

[Sir_Crocodile]

A 50 year old man who hasn't wrestled a single match in 13 years has the primary RAW title, who is fighting another part timer at WrestleMania for that title. Explain to me how this is good for fostering future talent?

Global expansion into canada

 

[Foggy]

Sure, if you only have a pessimistic view, which is boring and says you should probably find a new hobby that delights you anyway. I don't talk about sci-fi books or bike riding like wrestling fans talk about wrestling.

It's like any time Roman loses and someone's like "ugh this just means he's going to win next month, same old shit!" I mean, seriously, WWE is the same old shit, but not this tired, cynical attitude? If one sees it coming, why is one still here watching and talking about it? Hate that stuff.

Major difference between informed pessimism and cynicism gor the sake of it. It's not like WWE doesn't have a track record of oscillating wildly between stubborn obstinance and wild unpredictability. The WWE has earned its pessimism.

It's actually quite easy to love wrestling and be pessimistic about WWE. There's way more to wrestling than WWE.

 

[Paracelsus]

Well, this post just comes back to the cynicism talk that got me into this thread initially yesterday.

Wish there was more Power of Positivity in Wrestling GAF. Or that those who know they won't feel it would just move on to a new hobby for a while.

You still haven't explained how exactly bringing a bunch of literallywhos is going to improve the quality of the storywriting, the feuds, and how it's gonna help them give us a new set of main event world title competitors, those that you wait for wrestlemania to go "whoa".

Because see, that's exactly why the product is tanking, there's a lot of amazing workers in the roster right now, nearly none with enough recognition you'd think "ok, I can put them front and center in the main event of Wrestlemania". And the reason for that is, you don't even believe in them yourself, you don't book them legitimately, you don't protect them, so why bring more people in when you can't even fucking manage those you have right now?

They want more people in, from Europe, but they never made Cesaro a world champion because he quote unquote "doesn't have "it". Might be because he's Swiss ... and the European style"

 

[Host Samurai]

WWE building up local territories will only be cool if they don't force that WWE style onto them. If they expand to Japan, than I wanna see Japanese style wrestling, if they expand to Mexico than give me some Luchal Libre etc...otherwise it will be monotonous and a waste of potential.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

You still haven't explained how exactly bringing a bunch of literallywhos is going to improve the quality of the storywriting, the feuds, and how it's gonna help them give us a new set of main event world title competitors, those that you wait for wrestlemania to go "whoa".

Because see, that's exactly why the product is tanking, there's a lot of amazing workers in the roster right now, nearly none with enough recognition you'd think "ok, I can put them front and center in the main event of Wrestlemania". And the reason for that is, you don't even believe in them yourself, you don't book them legitimately, you don't protect them, so why bring more people in when you can't even fucking manage those you have right now?

They want more people in, from Europe, but they never made Cesaro a world champion because he quote unquote "doesn't have "it". Might be because he's Swiss ... and the European style"

The world isn't just America. Raw will likely be shit for us for another decade as it has been for the previous two. It doesn't mean international shows featuring talent local to those brands can't exist and thrive.

Remember, 33 years ago, we thought Wrestlemania itself was a fucking stupid idea because how could you get that many people to care about wrestling? That first attempt at a sort of global expansion went pretty well.

 

[Mahonay]

It isn't, but acknowledging present shittiness is different than imagining what shittiness awaits while not considering why one would even stick around to see predicted shittiness as it comes.

...

Soooo, the current repeated pattern of a shitty product over the past 15 years means we should be predicting only good things to come in the future? What?

Just ignore all evidence that clearly suggests one should be pessimistic when it comes to long term WWE plans?

 

[Sephzilla]

WWE expansion would be a lot more interesting if it wasn't just a giant attempt to kill of their competition and, like Host Samurai said, force WWE style onto international wrestling.

The world isn't just America. Raw will likely be shit for us for another decade as it has been for the previous two. It doesn't mean international shows featuring talent local to those brands can't exist and thrive.

Remember, 33 years ago, we thought Wrestlemania itself was a fucking stupid idea because how could you get that many people to care about wrestling? That first attempt at a sort of global expansion went pretty well.

If I actually remember right most promoters were actually afraid of WrestleMania because they thought it was going to be a success and kill off the rest of the territories.

 

[Foggy]

WWE building up local territories will only be cool if they don't force that WWE style onto them. If they expand to Japan, than I wanna see Japanese style wrestling, if they expand to Mexico than give me some Luchal Libre etc...otherwise it will be monotonous and a waste of potential.

Diversity by way of stylistic homogenization

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

...

Soooo, the current repeated pattern of a shitty product over the past 15 years means we should be predicting only good things to come in the future? What?

Just ignore all evidence that clearly suggests one should be pessimistic when it comes to long term WWE plans?

I mean you could do something that you find fun and not frustrating.

I don't know that you're reading my posts and understanding what I'm trying to say without them being colored by some sort of emotion. You're leading me here. This is like the sort of emotion Roman Reigns gets going in us that makes us watch for him every week so we can talk about him.

 

[Sephzilla]

I mean you could do something that you find fun and not frustrating.

I don't know that you're reading my posts and understanding what I'm trying to say without them being colored by some sort of emotion. You're leading me here. This is like the sort of emotion Roman Reigns gets going in us that makes us watch for him every week so we can talk about him.

For all of your "the world isn't just America" talk you seem to be unable to comprehend that wrestling isn't just WWE.

Wrestling can and is fun. WWE however is not.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

For all of your "the world isn't just America" talk you seem to be unable to comprehend that wrestling isn't just WWE.

Wrestling can and is fun. WWE however is not.

This is a WWE thread.

 

[Sephzilla]

This is a WWE thread.

Except you're talking in a broader "wrestling in general" sense when you're telling people to find something different that they find fun and not frustrating. Please stop trying to shift the goal posts.

 

[Mahonay]

I mean you could do something that you find fun and not frustrating.

I don't know that you're reading my posts and understanding what I'm trying to say without them being colored by some sort of emotion. You're leading me here. Like the sort of emotion Roman Reigns gets going in us that makes us watch for him every week so we can talk about him.

Lol nah it's alright dude. I'll keep enjoying Smackdown and NXT Takeovers like I already am.

And I will have a lot of fun next Sunday drinking beers and eating pizza while watching the glorious shit fest that is WRASSLEMANIA, with some good moments sprinkled in.


You are taking WWE way more seriously than they deserve to be taken.

 

[Foggy]

This is a WWE thread.

You really are arguing just to argue, huh?

 

[Rad Shadow]

Cesaro looks like Pitbul when he's rocking a suit and shades.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Except you're talking in a broader "wrestling in general" sense when you're telling people to find something different that they find fun and not frustrating. Please stop trying to shift the goal posts.

I've only talked WWE in here since yesterday. No clue what you're talking about. Never said anyone couldn't stop watching Raw and Roman to catch up on PWG and Shimmer.

Also, Shine 41 has the coolest fucking ending. No spoilers, but all of you should try to find it before WWN's big WM weekend show.

 

[Mahonay]

Cesaro looks like Pitbul when he's rocking a suit and shades.

 

[Bruce Springsteen]

Cesaro looks like Pitbul when he's rocking a suit and shades.

Just like Pitbul without any charisma

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Everyone watch the Shine 41 ending and get excited for new things in wrestling: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RdwG0x0R60Q

 

[Sir_Crocodile]

As long as NJPW stays as good as it's been the last year, I'm a happy wrestling fan. And a happy non-network subscriber.

 

[Mahonay]

As long as NJPW stays as good as it's been the last year, I'm a happy wrestling fan. And a happy non-network subscriber.

Get ready for your Bad Luck Fale main events for the next year.

But really, NJPW is fucking great right now with the talent up and down their roster.

 

[Sir_Crocodile]

Get ready for your Bad Luck Fale main events for the next year.

But really, NJPW is fucking great right now with the talent up and down their roster.

That one company has Okada, Omega, Suzuki, Naito, Shibata, Tanahashi, Ishii, Kaimatachi, Sanada, Kushida, Ospreay and ZSJ is insane.

I hope War Machine become permanant. They'd be a solid fit for suzuki-gun.

 

[Heroman]

Big problem with WWE global territory thing is that pro wrestling is really big in 3 to places in the world

USA
Japan
Mexico
Europe

And all those places besides USA and to a lesser extent Europe already have serval big promotion.

 

[Sir_Crocodile]

Mexico & Japan only have one big promotion each - CMLL and NJPW.

UnIess I forgot one, I wouldn't consider AAA, Crash, Noah, AJPW or DDT big.

 

[OniBarubary]

Just be like me and watch Black Terry and Trauma I matches on VHS tapes some old lady taped from the latest IWRG show. Then you'll never be disappointed with wrestling.

 

[Sephzilla]

Big problem with WWE global territory thing is that pro wrestling is really big in 3 to places in the world

USA
Japan
Mexico
Europe

And all those places besides USA and to a lesser extent Europe already have serval big promotion.

Isn't it also pretty big in India?

And yeah there's no way they're cracking into Japan unless they raid a ton of NJPW's talent

 

[Heroman]

Mexico & Japan only have one big promotion each - CMLL and NJPW.

UnIess I forgot one, I wouldn't consider AAA, Crash, Noah, AJPW or DDT big.

I know but can't see them going into Japan and drawing more then let say DDT. Cause even WWE proper only draws around 5k to 6k.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Beast in the East happened for a reason, guys!

 

[Sir_Crocodile]

because they have no idea what to do with the Lesnar dates they paid through the nose for

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

because they have no idea what to do with the Lesnar dates they paid through the nose for

Or a practice show for international live PPV on the Network on a small budget, like how NXT Arrival was the first live show before WM or main brand PPVs. (This is just wild speculation for fun.)

I still don't understand the reasoning behind the elaborate cruiserweight rope switches, but we'll know eventually.

Wish you guys speculated instead of cynically cutting everything down.

 

[Sir_Crocodile]

Or a practice show for international live PPV on the Network on a small budget, like how NXT Arrival was the first live show before WM or main brand PPVs. (This is just wild speculation for fun.)

I still don't understand the reasoning behind the elaborate cruiserweight rope switches, but we'll know eventually.

Wish you guys speculated instead of cynically cutting everything down.

You know they wasted one of Lesnar's dates monday having him come out after the show aired on a night they lost hundreds of thousands of viewers from hour one to hour three right?

And that's by far not the first time.

 

[Mahonay]

I still don't understand the reasoning behind the elaborate cruiserweight rope switches, but we'll know eventually.

Lol what? There's no secret meaning in the ring appearance change for the cruiserweight matches. It's because they wanted to have clear branding for the Cruiserweight Division as it's own thing.

 

[Heroman]

Isn't it also pretty big in India?

And yeah there's no way they're cracking into Japan unless they raid a ton of NJPW's talent

Eh, not really but it is bigger then places like China.

But to raid the top guys at NJPW they would basically have to offer them main roster money which they won't do.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Lol what? There's no secret meaning in the ring appearance change for the cruiserweight matches. It's because they wanted to have clear branding for the Cruiserweight Division as it's own thing.

Yeah, I guess what I was implying there was we're going to have a lot of brands with their own colors. I believe.

 

[Mahonay]

Yeah, I guess what I was implying there was we're going to have a lot of brands with their own colors. I believe.

They already have different colors for the brands. WTF are you going about my man?

RAW = red
Smackdown = blue
205 Live/Cruiserweight Division = purple
NXT = yellow

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

You know they wasted one of Lesnar's dates monday having him come out after the show aired on a night they lost hundreds of thousands of viewers from hour one to hour three right?

And that's by far not the first time.

Do we know their contract details?

As far as I knew, Lesnar is around to be a star to appear for the crowd since Rollins is out (I'm guessing this because I saw him at a house show a month ago where he replaced the not-appearing Jericho, Reigns, and Rollins for a weekend right after Rollins's injury).

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

They already have different colors for the brands. WTF are you going about my man?

RAW = red
Smackdown = blue
205 Live/Cruiserweight Division = purple
NXT = yellow

You think that's the end of the list?

 

[Sir_Crocodile]

Do we know their contract details?

As far as I knew, Lesnar is around to be a star to appear for the crowd since Rollins is out (I'm guessing this because I saw him at a house show a month ago where he replaced the not-appearing Jericho, Reigns, and Rollins for a weekend right after Rollins's injury).

Meltz said they agree on a fixed number of dates per year and pay him for those.

If they want more dates they can pay for extra.

It's like an enhanced luger deal in that there's no worry of running out of dates, but wwf wastes some of the fixed ones.

Lesnar is around to lose to Reigns at wrestlemania next year and coronate reigns for the 4th time or whatever

 

[Mahonay]

You think that's the end of the list?

They like to color code pretty much everything. So, no?

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

What country is going to get stuck with pink?

Edit: Or gender. :/

 

[Mahonay]

What country is going to get stuck with pink?

Edit: Or gender. :/

They already use pink for Susan G. Komen where they pretend to be charitable, while partnering with one of the biggest for-profit charities out there.

 

[Heroman]

Beast in the East happened for a reason, guys!

Because they wasting a Brock date for a house show in Japan.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Is it a coincidence that every wrestling forum reads like a bunch of Alvarezs and Meltzers out-cynicing each other on knowingly little verifiable information?

 

[Sir_Crocodile]

Is it a coincidence that every wrestling forum reads like a bunch of Alvarezs and Meltzers out-cynicing each other?

because vince is as carny as the day is long.

 

[Mahonay]

Is it a coincidence that every wrestling forum reads like a bunch of Alvarezs and Meltzers out-cynicing each other on knowingly little verifiable information?

KING MELTZ FOR COMMISSIONER

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

because vince is as carny as the day is long.

Well if you recognize that, you must also recognize Roman is part of the work in 2017. They're never not working us.