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Sledgehammer’s Call of Duty is “Next-Gen First”

So, the same old game only very pretty?

Seems like a magical formula if so.

Just make it pretty, make it stable, and for the love of gaming optimize the hell out of the netcode. That's what I'd focus on anyway. COD still has a lot of legs to it yet.
 

Shady859

Member
Excited to see what they do with more power yet I do not want nor think the base of the game or engine will change. Billions of dollars can't be wrong and say what you will about the worst community in all of gaming... It's still pure fun to play despite all it's glaring weaknesses best arcade sports game shooter ever.

I play on PS4 and 360 and at least the PS4 servers are stable and no host migration so that's a step in the right direction already.
 

Radec

Member
Please use a new engine for the love of god.

They did, in Ghosts didn't they?

It just turns out that the engine is still prebaked and they don't have enough time to make the game look good or atleast on par with Blops2. And thats not saying much. lol
 

kuYuri

Member
They did, in Ghosts didn't they?

It just turns out that the engine is still prebaked and they don't have enough time to make the game look good or atleast on par with Blops2. And thats not saying much. lol

Ghosts looks better than Black Ops II on a technical level though.
 
dont_believe_you_anchorman.gif
 

Claneko

Member
I guess we shall see how this pans out. I want to hope for the best, but I might be just a tad bitter that I don't get a Treyarch COD this year...hoping that extra year of dev times yields an incredible Black Ops 3 or whatever it ends up being.

These guys though? I say good luck to them and I'll give it a fair shake, but I might be renting before buying this time around. Ghosts really let me down.
 

nOoblet16

Member
Can we please stop having people begging for new game engine?
Game engines don't work the way most people think they do, they are constantly evolving so just having a numbered iteration means nothing, it just means that when that numbered version was created they decided to trademark that iteration. Frostbite 2 and Frostbite 3 are the same engine with ever evolving feature set and they named it Frostbite 3 for licencing purpose, not because it was something they wrote from scratch or even half of it.You only write from scratch (and even then you borrow elements from previous engines) if your current code is inefficient and that inefficiency cannot be optimised due to limitations from the architecture of the engine or the hardware it's suppose to run on, otherwise you always add on to it and modify it to create a new iteration.

Unreal Engine 3 got many iterations and revisions and you can see the effect of it in games over the year, compare Bioshock Infinite and Outlast to Gears of War 1 or Rainbow Six Vegas 1. Splinter Cell Blacklist is a UE2.5 game and it was one of the best looking games to be released in 2012. Engine numbers don't mean shit.

They did, in Ghosts didn't they?

It just turns out that the engine is still prebaked and they don't have enough time to make the game look good or atleast on par with Blops2. And thats not saying much. lol

It's not prebaked any more than other games out there, even the past gen COD did a lot in real time compared to UE3 games. They didn't use a linear space lighting model in Ghosts because they had the 360/PS3 version and fundamentally changing the way lighting calculations were done would have created complexities in porting the assets to 360/PS3 version and they probably didn't have the time. This is the reason why the game looks the way it does (apart from bad art) even though there are quite a lot of advanced shader effects in the game the lighting engine is still quite basic.

Oh by the way, something interesting to note Treyarch already did their lighting in linear space in Blops1 and Blops2 while IW has always done it in gamma space resulting in less realistic lighting, just to show how much different their rendering approach is even when using the same engine.
 

Nvzman

Member
Sorry, but Treyarch is the only company I still have faith in with Call of Duty.
They also made some kick-ass Spider-Man games, so I know Treyarch has the talent to make a GOOD Call of Duty.
 

farisr

Member
Should have been Treyarch.

Blops2 best cod ive played.

On one hand after the sledgehammer news I'm sad that a CoD that I am almost guaranteed to like (by Treyarch) is not coming out this year (really hate Ghosts), on the other hand, it could result in a completely awesome CoD next year.

The only CoD games I liked were 4, Blops 1 and Blops 2.

Oh and Sledgehammer + Treyarch, please bring back 4 player splitscreen. That was one of the biggest missteps (imo) with Ghosts.
 

SMZC

Member
I really don't understand how Treyarch can get so much love while Infinity Ward gets crapped on to hell and back for COD Ghosts. Every single COD thread ends up revolving around the same thing ultimately, and quite honestly, I don't get it.

What exactly makes Treyarch the undeniable "superior developer", as a lot of people like to refer to them? Objectively speaking, how are they superior to Infinity Ward exactly, or how are the Black Ops games better than Ghosts? Ghosts gets a lot of shit around these parts, but can we honestly say that the Black Ops games are superior products? I get that the COD name stirs up lots of emotions here in GAF, but somehow Infinity Ward gets the shorter end of the stick, receiving an always categorical, even harsher, more unfair bashing, while Treyarch is somehow more immune to that. Why is this so?

I understand that Ghosts has had technical issues, with the performance of the PC version being garbage and the infamous resolutiongate Xbox One issue. But is Treyarch somehow any better with their infamous PS3 ports? For everything bad that Ghosts may have, it has undeniably the best netcode and hit detection of the series so far, while Treyarch, after three games, is still completely incapable of getting those things anywhere near right, something that is arguably way more deserving of an uproar than any of Ghosts issues. Why is this not taken into account when Treyarch is exempted from the trashing?

I know, I know. Preferences, and all that. I'm not arguing that it's not reasonable to prefer Treyarch's games. That's not my intent here. I'm just baffled and confused about why one developer gets so harshly and mercilessly criticized, while the other one doesn't. Anyone care to clarify this for me?

As for the topic at hand, I welcome the change. Having some new people's take on Call of Duty may just be the breath of fresh air that the series needs. I'm very much looking forward to seeing what these guys can bring to the table.
 
As with every COD, I will read up on every detail released, but maybe this year I will feel compelled to actually pick it up. Release schedule for end of year is still light, so who knows. Adding in 4 Player split screen, bots and lan would ensure a buy (or 4) even if it is the same old shit... Just putting that out there.
 

Apoc87

Banned
What exactly makes Treyarch the undeniable "superior developer", as a lot of people like to refer to them?

For me it's because Treyarch changes up the UI/general look of the game and menus, adds new gameplay elements (such as loadout handling and equipment), and has a lot of customizable stuff.

Inifinity invented the successful formula but they like to re-hash. Even though the jump from modern warfare 1 to 2 was pretty significant, it wasn't as significant as blops 1 to 2. MW3, even as my most played COD with friends, was a joke. Everyone I knew (even people who aren't that into video games) said that MW3 looked exactly like MW2.

Call of duty really is getting old though. I personally think it's time to kill the series.
 

nOoblet16

Member
I really don't understand how Treyarch can get so much love while Infinity Ward gets crapped on to hell and back for COD Ghosts. Every single COD thread ends up revolving around the same thing ultimately, and quite honestly, I don't get it.

What exactly makes Treyarch the undeniable "superior developer", as a lot of people like to refer to them? Objectively speaking, how are they superior to Infinity Ward exactly, or how are the Black Ops games better than Ghosts? Ghosts gets a lot of shit around these parts, but can we honestly say that the Black Ops games are superior products? I get that the COD name stirs up lots of emotions here in GAF, but somehow Infinity Ward gets the shorter end of the stick, receiving an always categorical, even harsher, more unfair bashing, while Treyarch is somehow more immune to that. Why is this so?
They try new things. Zombies for one and the weapons you find in them.

Blops 1 had wager matches, gun customisation, that mini zombie game etc. Blops 2 had , the pick 10 system, the Strikeforce missions, quite large areas in SP, options to engage...all these were ideas unheard of in COD. The SP also had a branching storyline which was so well done that you never knew that you were ever given a choice (You could avoid entire levels if you managed to do something, but I thought it was just a regular COD and I was following the script). They do a lot more fan service as well.

I understand that Ghosts has had technical issues, with the performance of the PC version being garbage and the infamous resolutiongate Xbox One issue. But is Treyarch somehow any better with their infamous PS3 ports? For everything bad that Ghosts may have, it has undeniably the best netcode and hit detection of the series so far, while Treyarch, after three games, is still completely incapable of getting those things anywhere near right, something that is arguably way more deserving of an uproar than any of Ghosts issues. Why is this not taken into account when Treyarch is exempted from the trashing?

I know, I know. Preferences, and all that. I'm not arguing that it's not reasonable to prefer Treyarch's games. That's not my intent here. I'm just baffled and confused about why one developer gets so harshly and mercilessly criticized, while the other one doesn't. Anyone care to clarify this for me?

As for the topic at hand, I welcome the change. Having some new people's take on Call of Duty may just be the breath of fresh air that the series needs. I'm very much looking forward to seeing what these guys can bring to the table.
You might want to check back on that, Blops 2 is the ONLY COD that runs at a locked 60FPS in multiplayer on both consoles.
and the resolution it runs on is higher than any COD that came before it (or after) on that respective platform.
 

cuyahoga

Dudebro, My Shit is Fucked Up So I Got to Shoot/Slice You II: It's Straight-Up Dawg Time
Reading this as Sledgehammer not being the studio who is doing current-gen SKUs.
 

SMZC

Member
For me it's because Treyarch changes up the UI/general look of the game and menus, adds new gameplay elements (such as loadout handling and equipment), and has a lot of customizable stuff.

Inifinity invented the successful formula but they like to re-hash. Even though the jump from modern warfare 1 to 2 was pretty significant, it wasn't as significant as blops 1 to 2. MW3, even as my most played COD with friends, was a joke. Everyone I knew (even people who aren't that into video games) said that MW3 looked exactly like MW2.

Call of duty really is getting old though. I personally think it's time to kill the series.

They try new things. Zombies for one and the weapons you find in them.

Blops 1 had wager matches, gun customisation, that mini zombie game etc. Blops 2 had , the pick 10 system, the Strikeforce missions, quite large areas in SP, options to engage...all these were ideas unheard of in COD. The SP also had a branching storyline which was so well done that you never knew that you were ever given a choice (You could avoid entire levels if you managed to do something, but I thought it was just a regular COD and I was following the script). They do a lot more fan service as well.

MW3's rehashing was scandalous, that much is certain, but I don't think it's very fair to gauge Infinity Ward (whether the old or the new one) based on that game. Due to the massive IW exodus and to Activision's obvious demands to put out a COD game any way possible by the holiday season, neither the people left at IW nor SledgeHammer had many options other than reusing lots of elements from MW2.

Ghosts, on the other hand, is a better indication of how much (the new) IW can switch things around. It has more new perk additions than any other recent COD, it has many new unique weapons even including a whole new weapon category, new modes, Extinction, and since the UI was mentioned, I'd argue that Ghosts' has been the one to change the most. Even MW3 brought things such as strike packages and Kill Confirmed (arguably the best alternative to TDM ever put in a COD game) to the table. IW gets called out a lot for their recycling, but it's important to note that Treyarch too recycles lots and lots of elements, such as weapon models and reload animations (although in all fairness, every COD developer will probably always do this).

As far as the old IW goes, COD4 and MW2 will never be touched by Treyarch in terms of innovation within the series. Even Blacks Ops 1 was essentially just a rebalance of all of the elements introduced in MW2. People bitched about Commando, Danger Close, OMA, the ridiculous killstreaks and so on, so Treyarch cut some of those out, rebalanced what was left, and gave it a Cold War flavor. I wouldn't call that particularly innovative.

Again, I understand perfectly well when someone prefers Treyarch's games. I just really don't get why one developer gets such insane amounts of bashing and trashing, while the otther is exempt from that. As someone who prefers IW's games, it's frustrating to come into every COD thread and find the same picture every single time.
 

SMZC

Member
call-of-duty-ghosts-pc-screenshot-1920x1080-007.jpg



iBj2gKNrdrZhZ.jpg


Insert dumb quake 3 joke here _____

Indeed. Ghosts look great on the PS4 at 1080p. It's also one of the few non-sports games (if not the only one) that achieves both 1080p and 60fps on the system. And yet, it gets called out on the graphical department? Give me a break.
 

MercuryLS

Banned
Indeed. Ghosts look great on the PS4 at 1080p. It's also one of the few non-sports games (if not the only one) that achieves both 1080p and 60fps on the system. And yet, it gets called out on the graphical department? Give me a break.

Yeah I thought the SP in Ghosts on PS4 was beautiful. It was really sharp.
 

Drainer

Banned
This is the last chance really.

I skipped BO2 and Ghosts. MW3 was the last one I bought so let's see if Sledgehammer can bring me back. If not, I'm done forever.

Titanfall all but has me already as it is.
 

level44

Member
The title of this thread made me laugh.
Definite no buy.

Will look into Treyarch's COD one year after but only if the zombies mode has been completely bolstered up for next gen.
 

SMOK3Y

Generous Member
On one hand after the sledgehammer news I'm sad that a CoD that I am almost guaranteed to like (by Treyarch) is not coming out this year (really hate Ghosts), on the other hand, it could result in a completely awesome CoD next year.

The only CoD games I liked were 4, Blops 1 and Blops 2.

Oh and Sledgehammer + Treyarch, please bring back 4 player splitscreen. That was one of the biggest missteps (imo) with Ghosts.

I think im same as you 4 & Blops 1 were the best as Treyarch basically made a CoD4 in its own way IW just tried to go to too big with everything for a CoD game I mean it aint BF CoD4 was was the most perfect size etc of all the games
 

teh_rhn

Banned
Sure, in the same way Titanfall is using the Quake 1 engine. (Source = Modified GoldSrc = Modified Quake)

I agree that CoD's tech updates have been pretty underwhelming, but this "quake 3 lol" meme is silly.

It used to be when Half Life 2 was released but over time through updates they have pretty much phased out the old code. There was only bits and pieces of the very old code so it was easy to replace it, because updating engines after they've been released isn't an easy task.
 

SFenton

Member
MW3's rehashing was scandalous, that much is certain, but I don't think it's very fair to gauge Infinity Ward (whether the old or the new one) based on that game. Due to the massive IW exodus and to Activision's obvious demands to put out a COD game any way possible by the holiday season, neither the people left at IW nor SledgeHammer had many options other than reusing lots of elements from MW2.

Ghosts, on the other hand, is a better indication of how much (the new) IW can switch things around. It has more new perk additions than any other recent COD, it has many new unique weapons even including a whole new weapon category, new modes, Extinction, and since the UI was mentioned, I'd argue that Ghosts' has been the one to change the most. Even MW3 brought things such as strike packages and Kill Confirmed (arguably the best alternative to TDM ever put in a COD game) to the table. IW gets called out a lot for their recycling, but it's important to note that Treyarch too recycles lots and lots of elements, such as weapon models and reload animations (although in all fairness, every COD developer will probably always do this).

As far as the old IW goes, COD4 and MW2 will never be touched by Treyarch in terms of innovation within the series. Even Blacks Ops 1 was essentially just a rebalance of all of the elements introduced in MW2. People bitched about Commando, Danger Close, OMA, the ridiculous killstreaks and so on, so Treyarch cut some of those out, rebalanced what was left, and gave it a Cold War flavor. I wouldn't call that particularly innovative.

Again, I understand perfectly well when someone prefers Treyarch's games. I just really don't get why one developer gets such insane amounts of bashing and trashing, while the otther is exempt from that. As someone who prefers IW's games, it's frustrating to come into every COD thread and find the same picture every single time.

Sorry, but for all the good ideas IW had for multiplayer in Ghosts, the atrocious map design on the majority of maps destroys the experience, and the latest patch on XB1 has the framerate doing all sorts of crazy things.

I gave IW one last shot on this one- I never played MW2 or 3. They do not get another chance from me. Treyarch, though? Out of the three CoD games they've made, WaW was good, and the BLOPS segment has been great. You couldn't possibly convince me that it would be as bad as Ghosts.
 
Indeed. Ghosts look great on the PS4 at 1080p. It's also one of the few non-sports games (if not the only one) that achieves both 1080p and 60fps on the system. And yet, it gets called out on the graphical department? Give me a break.
Indeed, some great texture work in places.

IW hired some Hollywood talent to help them with that. So hopefully Sledge can provide something on the same level.
 

teh_rhn

Banned
call-of-duty-ghosts-pc-screenshot-1920x1080-007.jpg



iBj2gKNrdrZhZ.jpg


Insert dumb quake 3 joke here _____

If only I could run that on high or above. I can run BF4 on High 1080p 50-60 FPS.
This "new" engine is not that demanding compared to Frostbite yet i can barely run it at Medium at 30fps. What a fucking joke that new engine. Plus it doesn't look that great, just a lot of HDR and high res texture, WHICH I CANT FUCKING USE BECAUSE ENGINE IS UNOPTIMIZED AS FUCK
 

Cygan

Neo Member
If only I could run that on high or above. I can run BF4 on High 1080p 50-60 FPS.
This "new" engine is not that demanding compared to Frostbite yet i can barely run it at Medium at 30fps. What a fucking joke that new engine. Plus it doesn't look that great, just a lot of HDR and high res texture, WHICH I CANT FUCKING USE BECAUSE ENGINE IS UNOPTIMIZED AS FUCK

Well that's less of a problem with the engine and more of a problem with the port itself.

Please don't use Caps.
 

Kallor

Member
Is this Sledgehammer COD getting a full 3 years then? Been in development since MW3 ended I'm guessing?

Regardless I'm looking forward to seeing what Treyarch can do with 3 years and what should be a mostly current gen game.
 

NHale

Member
My guess is 2014 will be the last cross-gen CoD and then 2015 will be the first real next-gen Cod.

And leave that 160M+ consoles without a Call of Duty to sell? EA is still releasing FIFA for the PS2 for a reason.

Unless Sony and Microsoft share the cost of not having a PS3/X360 version it's not going to happen so soon.
 

knitoe

Member
I really don't understand how Treyarch can get so much love while Infinity Ward gets crapped on to hell and back for COD Ghosts. Every single COD thread ends up revolving around the same thing ultimately, and quite honestly, I don't get it.

What exactly makes Treyarch the undeniable "superior developer", as a lot of people like to refer to them? Objectively speaking, how are they superior to Infinity Ward exactly, or how are the Black Ops games better than Ghosts? Ghosts gets a lot of shit around these parts, but can we honestly say that the Black Ops games are superior products? I get that the COD name stirs up lots of emotions here in GAF, but somehow Infinity Ward gets the shorter end of the stick, receiving an always categorical, even harsher, more unfair bashing, while Treyarch is somehow more immune to that. Why is this so?

I understand that Ghosts has had technical issues, with the performance of the PC version being garbage and the infamous resolutiongate Xbox One issue. But is Treyarch somehow any better with their infamous PS3 ports? For everything bad that Ghosts may have, it has undeniably the best netcode and hit detection of the series so far, while Treyarch, after three games, is still completely incapable of getting those things anywhere near right, something that is arguably way more deserving of an uproar than any of Ghosts issues. Why is this not taken into account when Treyarch is exempted from the trashing?

I know, I know. Preferences, and all that. I'm not arguing that it's not reasonable to prefer Treyarch's games. That's not my intent here. I'm just baffled and confused about why one developer gets so harshly and mercilessly criticized, while the other one doesn't. Anyone care to clarify this for me?

As for the topic at hand, I welcome the change. Having some new people's take on Call of Duty may just be the breath of fresh air that the series needs. I'm very much looking forward to seeing what these guys can bring to the table.

I don't get the Treyarch lovefest either. Their netcode is terrible. What seems like half the time, you shoot someone from behind only to see them do a 180 and kill you while on replay it shows frozen like a statue. All the stuff they added to multiplayer means jack shit if the online shootings mechanics are broken. Guess, if you only care about single player, maybe, blops 1 & 2 are better. Not for me, I only care about multiplayer and good netcode.
 

SMZC

Member
Sorry, but for all the good ideas IW had for multiplayer in Ghosts, the atrocious map design on the majority of maps destroys the experience, and the latest patch on XB1 has the framerate doing all sorts of crazy things.

I gave IW one last shot on this one- I never played MW2 or 3. They do not get another chance from me. Treyarch, though? Out of the three CoD games they've made, WaW was good, and the BLOPS segment has been great. You couldn't possibly convince me that it would be as bad as Ghosts.

I understand that. I'm not the greatest fan of the MW3/Ghosts philosophy behind the map design either. It takes a lot of time to get used to it before it really starts to get fun (or so has been my experience), and I understand that people don't want to go through that phase before fully enjoying the game. For me, though, even more important than map design, is good netcode/hit detection; that is even more essential to a multiplayer shooter than map design (as important as the latter is), and in that regard Treyarch has always failed miserably, without exception. I gave them a free pass on BO1, but no way in hell am I giving them a cent more for any of their games after how ripped off I felt with BO2.

I will say, though, for all of my criticism towards Treyarch, they really do get the map design philosophy behind COD4. They may not have been able to make maps on par with COD4's Crash or Overgrown, but their maps are usually quite good, and very much in line with what map design should be in a COD game.

I don't get the Treyarch lovefest either. Their netcode is terrible. What seems like half the time, you shoot someone from behind only to see them do a 180 and kill you while on replay it shows frozen like a statue. All the stuff they added to multiplayer means jack shit if the online shootings mechanics are broken. Guess, if you only care about single player, maybe, blops 1 & 2 are better. Not for me, I only care about multiplayer and good netcode.

My thoughts exactly.
 
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