I couldn't say it any better.
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Just what is Sony doing with Vita? If they've given-up, they should just kill it.
- Thread starter ZombiePlatypus
- Start date
I couldn't say it any better.
I really hope JSR comes this year too, it's slated for winter 2012 on sega's site (recent update, after the delay announcement). No Sine Mora, dokuro..
Ollie Pooch
In a perfect world, we'd all be homersexual
Any word on Sine Mora? Pretty hyped for that one.
Sometimes I find it hard to believe that there's an actual human being at the other end, preparing these posts.
UncleSporky
Member
Because they're not the ones pretending like everyone else in the thread is completely stupid. They don't come out with the gems like "not sure what everyone is talking about??? I love my Vita lol, Sony is doing a great job!"
They're not confrontational. You're right, those kinds of comments don't belong in sales-related threads, but they're at least innocuous about it. They don't directly challenge other posters or ask why everyone is saying such-and-such about the system. Their comments don't prompt a response.
By all means, kick them out!
Every thread that asks a question should be two posts long because there is generally going to be a correct answer to that question. Unfortunately there are always people who miss the point of the thread or think they're slightly more correct or articulate than another person. And there are a number of possible reasons for how Sony is treating their system and how they might treat it in the future. There's plenty to discuss and it is regularly discussed, and it is incredibly disingenuous to pretend that it isn't worth discussing on a forum about such topics.
It's funny to see you keep trying. I welcome it.
You are suggesting they should go all out. Not possible with their finance...
Just about to start here ..thread keeps postponing fun..
I'm almost an exclusively-Vita gamer these days - and NFS is one of my favourite games on it. But you can't say the opening sales of Liberation were promising given how AC3 sold. But yeah, maybe tanked wasn't the right word
UK numbers show AC3 on Vita sold 10k. AC3 on console sold 330k. That means it sold 33x more on consoles. Now, I don't know EU console/vita hardware numbers, so for the sake of ratio, I will use worldwide sales. Vita has sold 2.3 million. PS3 and 360 combined have sold over 130 million. That means there are over 55x more PS3/360 consoles than there are Vitas.
There are over 55x more consoles than Vitas.
AC3 sold 33x more on consoles than on Vita.
That doesn't seem too bad if they are keeping sales expectations relative.
Of course, my math may be way off.
I'm about to pass out from inebriation, so savor it while you can.
Ollie Pooch
In a perfect world, we'd all be homersexual
Tanking was a bit of a hasty remark, don't bother giving it any attention
Still, I don't see them lighting the charts on fire and the reviews have been pretty middling. Which is disappointing.I really liked my Vita, but after I got my first iPhone it was banished to drawer hell. My phone has the edge when it comes to form factor, I can actually play these games on the go, and the constant stream of new games means no month long lulls between worthwhile releases. When I actually have time to sit down and play games, I prefer to it on my PC or console. I didn't have much of a use for it. I might have still hung on to it but Sony has not done a very good job of convincing me to have any hope for the future of the system.
Alex
Member
The Vita had a pretty great year one library, far beyond the PSP or either of the DS's, I just got mine recently and already have six games and a few more on a wishlist, it's just one that's saddled between niches on a limited market.
I just wish Sony would pump the money into Japan and try and hit some stable audience or spend a fraction on some more organic digital titles in the west rather than monster blockbuster console series. It's got that same stilted identity that the early PSP had, it works great for some people, I know some people ADORE having high end fighters and racing games, etc on their handheld but it's not so much for me.
But if that's how it was to end, after a few more games in 2013, and I wind up with ~10-12 keepers and a Super PSP, I'd be OK with that, I knew what I was getting into.
I just wish Sony would pump the money into Japan and try and hit some stable audience or spend a fraction on some more organic digital titles in the west rather than monster blockbuster console series. It's got that same stilted identity that the early PSP had, it works great for some people, I know some people ADORE having high end fighters and racing games, etc on their handheld but it's not so much for me.
But if that's how it was to end, after a few more games in 2013, and I wind up with ~10-12 keepers and a Super PSP, I'd be OK with that, I knew what I was getting into.
Saint Gregory
Member
Wow, this thread is... interesting.
Sony isn't going to give up on the Vita but Vita is in danger in the west. Retailers (both B&M and online) don't have unlimited space for products. If Vita sales don't pick up by this holiday season then we could see a repeat of what happened to the PSPGo and Gamecube where retailers simply stopped reordering and stocking those products.
Sony isn't going to give up on the Vita but Vita is in danger in the west. Retailers (both B&M and online) don't have unlimited space for products. If Vita sales don't pick up by this holiday season then we could see a repeat of what happened to the PSPGo and Gamecube where retailers simply stopped reordering and stocking those products.
UncleSporky
Member
The thread asks what Sony is doing with the Vita. Do you have input on this point? Do you believe Sony should kill the Vita on the basis of its sales?
Why are so many people here hoping for the vita to fail and sony to cease its production? As fans of games, shouldn't we all be hoping systems survive and flourish so we can enjoy them? The Vita has plenty of wonderful games already and many more on the way, and it's the best way to play ps1 games on the go.
Tricky I Shadow
Banned
Sony has given up on the Vita no more than Nintendo has given up on the 3DS.
People tend to forget that the 3DS's library isn't much to write home about too.
People tend to forget that the 3DS's library isn't much to write home about too.
great way to answer my question.
im trying to be on topic here like you said, this is not "are you enjoying your vita?" thread
Snowden's Secret
Banned
Are you Kaz?
Oh come on now. If you only count the 3DS at a single great game (majority answer will say SM3DL), that's 100 great iPad games you have to come up with, which I know from iPad ownership is impossible. If you say the 3DS has zero great games, then mathematics would say iPad also has none. (more likely than the former).
OldJadedGamer
Banned
Nintendo saw that the 3DS wasn't selling as well as they had hoped and third parties were appearing skittish then they dropped the price right after launch. Sony did the same thing with the PS3. PS3 saw it's first price drop at around 7 months.
They have not done the same with Vita.
Problem is that those type of games probably won't help the system increase its sales.
Lumpy Onion
Member
I think a lot of people are genuinely worried about the Vita's success. I seriously doubt anyone wants to see it burn out of pure joy. Bringing up honest criticisms is a good thing. Nobody's got it out for the Vita.
GraveRobberX
Platinum Trophy: Learned to Shit While Upright Again.
Well they sorta did the Bundle Price Drop scenario
Give you a Vita + Mem Stick + Game for the MSRP of a vanilla Vita
See Ass Creed III Lib White & COD BLOPS DC Bundle
Madden 13 also
OldJadedGamer
Banned
Sorta still means you can't bring a Vita out of the store for cheaper than $250. First off, the memory card should be standard in every box... period. There is no "value" in adding in something that is required to even boot games. But Vita + game like Hot Shots Golf 6 for $199 would be a good start IMO.
GraveRobberX
Platinum Trophy: Learned to Shit While Upright Again.
Some retailers did give you a $50 Gift Card on top of that
So rather than paying $250 for Vita + $40 for Ass Creed III LIB + $20 for Stick for roughly $310, you could get it for $250, and with bonus you get for roughly $200
That's roughly $450+ dollars worth of games, all releasing in a 4 month period. I know the average Gaffer is apparently rolling around in disposable income that they can throw at all these titles, but as a married man with bills, student loans, and other responsibilities to take care of, I can't blow $500 on games in 4 months.
Out of that list, I want/own 9 of those games. I own LBP and AC3: Lib. I want SFxT, Virtues Last Reward, SH: BoM, Ragnarok Odyssey, Persona 4, PS All Stars, and Ratchet. That's $280 worth of games, and I only have a budget of one game a month (I promised my wife that I wouldn't overspend on games like I did last year, so I'm on a one game a month budget). AC3: Lib was my October game. All Stars will be my November. Ragnarok will probably be my December, although I did give myself a $100-$150 gaming budget for Black Friday, so I may get lucky and can nab a few extra titles that month.
Not everybody will rush out and buy all the games they want on day one. Yes, Sony released a lot of titles in October, but not everybody is going to buy them all in October, or November, or December.
I guess, because of my budget, I don't mind when there are slow months of releases. It gives me a chance to catch up on games that I'm behind on. Since I'm not interested in Sonic All Stars, I'm using my December gaming budget for one of the many games on my list that I couldn't pick up on release date.
I know gaming is an addiction here on GAF, but I don't feel compelled to just buy all the games that I'm interested in/hyped for, when they release, because they are released, and then I whine and bitch that there isn't anything new during slow months like April and May, or August and September. I'm sure some of the people complaining about a lack of things to play have a back catalog a mile long.
Because I've been pacing my game purchases for the most part (I did nab some PSP games I really wanted when I first got my Vita), I'm not experiencing a shortage of titles to play on my Vita, and the ones I have will carry me through well into next year, when some of the 2nd gen titles hit.
To Far Away Times
Member
The Vita has a varied library but no must have games.
Comparatively, the 3DS has several must have games.
Comparatively, the 3DS has several must have games.
famousmortimer
Banned
The thing that's weird to me is that the Vita is a gamer's device. It didn't cut corners, it has great power, an amazing screen, twin sticks, touch screens, tilt, cameras. It has a wonderful library filled with games that hardcore gamers like (but I agree it lacks something with mass appeal - but why do we care about mass appeal?).
The thing is everything that the 3DS and iPhone are not. Yet people here, who are supposed to be into games, get completely caught up in the sales of the thing. Did low sales make the dreamcast a crap console? That thing was one of the best consoles I ever owned - just because the mass market doesn't like something doesn't make it bad. In fact, judging by most other forms of media, it usually means its good. The music, movies, TV and books that sell the most are usually the most worthless.
Pet peeve. Got it out. I feel better now.
The thing is everything that the 3DS and iPhone are not. Yet people here, who are supposed to be into games, get completely caught up in the sales of the thing. Did low sales make the dreamcast a crap console? That thing was one of the best consoles I ever owned - just because the mass market doesn't like something doesn't make it bad. In fact, judging by most other forms of media, it usually means its good. The music, movies, TV and books that sell the most are usually the most worthless.
Pet peeve. Got it out. I feel better now.
Really? I think looking at Sony's 1st party games on the Vita (Past and future) and do the same for Nintendo and the 3DS it's pretty obvious which of the 2 has 'given up'.
Not that I think Sony have given up, but they're pretty much out of options apart from Price Cut ATM, Capcom's not bailing them out this time.
OldJadedGamer
Banned
Needs to be standard from Sony. No retailer special here and there, needs to be under the $200 mark. Nintendo didn't put in more "value" to the system, they lowered the price. Sony with the PS3 didn't dick around, they lowered the price. That is what needs to happen with Vita.
Green Yoshi
Member
If Rockstar Leeds would develop GTA San Andreas Stories only for Vita, sales of the hardware would go up very quickly. I guess most people are satisfied enough with their smartphone/tablet games, that are less cheaper.
UncleSporky
Member
No.
Let's say every TV manufacturer decides to enter the console market, each console costs $600, and each has 5 awesome exclusives. Samsung, Sanyo, Acer, Vizio, Sharp, Philips, everybody. They want in on this action and are buying exclusives to prove it.
If those consoles all flourish, we can expect the exclusives to continue, but if I'm going to experience those games it's going to cost me $600 for each system and however much for the games. I'd much rather have only one or two consoles I feel compelled to buy. Presumably the exclusives would consolidate onto fewer platforms and I'd save a lot of money.
Games matter, not platforms. As gamers we want software to flourish, not hardware.
So to your first sentence:
Let's say I am definitely buying a PS4 because I'm really invested into Sony's PS3 infrastructure, but I don't know if I want a Vita. I don't see how I can fit another mobile device into my life and frankly I'd rather play those games on a big screen in my living room. Unreasonable? I dunno. But I'm this hypothetical person.
I can see two scenarios.
Scenario A, Sony makes 5 Vita exclusives and 2 PS4 exclusives that I really want to play. The PS4 is $500 and its games are $60, Vita's $250 and its games are $40. This costs me $450 for the Vita stuff and $620 for the PS4 stuff, a total of $1070.
Scenario B, Sony drops Vita support and redirects studios to make only PS4 games. They're more expensive to make so we only get 6 PS4 games out of this, but they don't make any Vita games I feel like I have to play. I pay $360 for the games and $500 for the PS4 and it costs me $860 total.
I just saved $210 on my entertainment because Sony decided to support one platform and didn't make me feel like I needed the second platform that I didn't want as much.
That's why.
EDIT: Or heck, let's say I kind of want to play those Vita exclusives but I just can't rationalize buying the system. Sony has spent their resources on games that I will never experience because I don't want to invest in that platform. Maybe I think it's dying, who knows. But it's valid to want to see those games developed for a platform you know you will buy instead.
To Far Away Times
Member
What do you think will turn it around?
I don't think anyone wants the platform to fail, but Sony is doing nothing to attempt to make it a success..
GraveRobberX
Platinum Trophy: Learned to Shit While Upright Again.
Let's see what they do with Black Friday
That should be a barometer to see if Sony is in the game or just given up
They Holiday Bundle has been seen for the PS3
250GB PS3 SuperSlim + Uncharted 1 & 2 Combo Pack + inFamous 1 & 2 & FOB Combo Pack + 30 Day 1 month PS+ for $199-$219.99
Vita might get the same treatment... Hopefully
Skel1ingt0n
I can't *believe* these lazy developers keep making file sizes so damn large. Btw, how does technology work?
UberTag
Member
Clearly the Vita needs an exclusive on the next Twilight movie or Angry Birds sequel in order to be accepted by the supposed hardcore GAF gaming enthusiasts.
Once it's on Oprah and accepted by the mainstream they'll all say: "You know what? That Vita is kind of cool. I just played that Gravity Rush title and had a blast with it."
Never fear. They'll react the exact same way once its bundled with every PS4 that's sold.
(And when I say a Vita will be bundled, I don't necessarily mean the Vita in its current incarnation.)
Ollie Pooch
In a perfect world, we'd all be homersexual
I'd pay money to see Oprah using a Vita.
PLAYSTATION... VITTAHHHHHHHHHHHH!! *crowd goes wild*
Absolutely agree about it being a gamer's dream handheld in design - the games might not appeal to everyone - but I think it appeals to me more because it has a library of 16-bit style platformers (Rayman Origins, Prinny, Megaman etc) along with old style score attack/time attack stuff (Wipeout, Motorstorm RC, Super Crate Box) and other stuff that looks great on the system. The asyncrhonous online integration in some of those games is fantastic. It has good games. It has some really great games. The negativity around it is incredible. Neither handheld has a killer library, so to suggest it's some wasteland of content is confusing.
Like famousmortimer said - it lacks that mass market appeal of Mario and Pokemon, but noone would buy a Sony machine expecting those games, so asking for something on that level to be pulled out of thin air makes no sense.
That said, Sony's treatment of it since launch has been puzzling - the COMPLETE lack of an E3 presence (show floor aside) was so strange. To me it speaks of a controversial product within the company - some wanted it, some didn't - but I can't pretend to know.
PLAYSTATION... VITTAHHHHHHHHHHHH!! *crowd goes wild*
Absolutely agree about it being a gamer's dream handheld in design - the games might not appeal to everyone - but I think it appeals to me more because it has a library of 16-bit style platformers (Rayman Origins, Prinny, Megaman etc) along with old style score attack/time attack stuff (Wipeout, Motorstorm RC, Super Crate Box) and other stuff that looks great on the system. The asyncrhonous online integration in some of those games is fantastic. It has good games. It has some really great games. The negativity around it is incredible. Neither handheld has a killer library, so to suggest it's some wasteland of content is confusing.
Like famousmortimer said - it lacks that mass market appeal of Mario and Pokemon, but noone would buy a Sony machine expecting those games, so asking for something on that level to be pulled out of thin air makes no sense.
That said, Sony's treatment of it since launch has been puzzling - the COMPLETE lack of an E3 presence (show floor aside) was so strange. To me it speaks of a controversial product within the company - some wanted it, some didn't - but I can't pretend to know.
OldJadedGamer
Banned
Again, these need to be standard and permanent changes. Not one off deals.
The comparision to Dreamcast isn't good as you pointed out the Dreamcast had a lot of exclusive content that if you didn't have Dreamcast... you were not playing those games (unless you went to an arcade)
To Far Away Times
Member
The Dreamcast was one of the best consoles ever for people who love arcade games. I'm very big into the arcade scene and the Dreamcast was absolutely amazing for me. Lots of unique home content at the time, even if most of it found it's way to other consoles years later.
Most of the stuff on Vita is spinoffs and outsourced versions of popular 360/PS3 games.
PapaEmeritus
Member
IDK it def has stuff to play the problem, I think are the prices. Why would I buy a full price digital when I can wait for it on gamefly to buy used for like 1/4 price. Also there are a lack of psn games coming for this. Also, people can't just say times have changed and no one wants handhelds, as 3DS is now making a profit and actually has a fun/large library to play. The vita does have games I want to play but I'm not paying 40$ for a vita game when I can pay 40$ and play a very similar game on my 60" tv.
polyh3dron
Banned
I haven't bought any vita titles pretty much since launch other than Gravity Rush, but I'm buying AC: L and P4G now. I'm sure other Vita owners are in the same boat. I like the system, it just needs more games.
Agent X
Gold Member
Good points, but do many Vita games really have the budget of a PS3 or Xbox 360 game? Perhaps some downloadable games do, but this isn't a uniquely Vita thing. Game budgets in the download space vary relative to developer ambition--we've seen very grandiose iOS/Android projects, and likewise some shoestring efforts for PS3/Xbox 360. At the retail level, though, even the very best retail games for Vita seem to have development budgets comparable at most to midrange PS3/Xbox 360 products, and/or (especially in the case of direct conversions) have shared resources with the PS3/Xbox 360 versions.
I really, truly believe that PlayStation Mobile could be a key aspect of the overall PS Vita strategy. If you recall, Sony announced PlayStation Mobile (originally named "PlayStation Suite") at the same conference where they first announced the PS Vita system. Sony might have been reading the tea leaves longer than most people give them credit for.
If I were in Sony's shoes, I'd encourage developers of smaller-scale downloadable games to target PS Mobile, rather than making Vita-specific versions of the games. By this time next year, any PS Vita game that could be on PS Mobile should be on PS Mobile. The only games that should be made specifically for Vita are retail games, and some larger and more ambitious games that truly push the Vita hardware. Everything else needs to be on PS Mobile.
Sony also needs to certify more devices as PS Mobile compliant (in order to attract developer support), and continue promoting PS Mobile as a flexible and secure development platform for mobile games. Vita will benefit from this by virtue of having these games available, and being seen as the best device for playing these games.
I don't think PS Mobile has gone into full swing yet, even though there are some games available. However, Sony needs to work quickly to get it into full swing, and also tie in other PSN features more closely (such as trophies).
Just to clarify, LittleBigPlanet PS Vita is not a port of an earlier game. It's a completely new game developed specifically for the system.
Is that commercial actually running on American television? If not, then they need to put it on TV as soon as possible. While this commercial is not anywhere near Sony's best efforts, it's a great deal superior to what they've done for Vita to date.
If I were in Sony's shoes (again), then I'd request that my marketing team develop similarly styled ads for LittleBigPlanet, Call of Duty: Black Ops Declassified, and maybe even Uncharted: Golden Abyss (yes, I know it's an older game), and run them through the holiday season along with this one.
GraveRobberX
Platinum Trophy: Learned to Shit While Upright Again.
Well once the bundles go away, Sony does stick with that MSRP
Last year it was $249.99 Holiday Bundle from $299.99 MSRP
PS3 stayed $249.99 until a little price bump up this year when SuperSlim release with UC3 GOTY
PS3 will be most likely $199.99 moving forward
Waiting for the scans to appear from BF retailers, might show the direction Sony heading
That is about the sum of it, really. I think we'll start seeing it garnering dwindling retail space in the 6-12 months after the holidays. Which will be terminal for its chances of ever making a comeback, which was already a ridiculously slim prospect.
Edit: Also I find it funny that people frame the system failing being the fault of consumers. No, it's Sony's fault. Like how the Dreamcast was Sega's fault.
Yeah, and I'm saying, it was mis-designed from jump. While I don't think they should kill it, I think it'll have a hard time finding success unless consumer preference changes. Most people don't want console quality games on the go. Why? Because Vita is probably most often played at home, where... people have their consoles. Plus, people want all in one devices, so they prefer to game on their phones rather carry around yet another device.
In order to succeed, Vita needs to give consumers something that they simply can't get anywhere else. Right now, that's just not the case.
To expand on this idea, in order for Sony to deliver on such a goal, they have to make a game to define the core Vita experience and stand out as a title not found elsewhere. The problem with this is I don't see how Sony could make such a game. They don't have a history of making standout titles that get people lining up for their system; most of their consumers line up for third party games, or a specific catalog of games, not just one title, which is what the Vita needs for momentum. The only first-party product they have that gets people to rush to get a new platform in droves is primarily Gran Turismo, a franchise that has a lot of competition with newer racers.
Sony has this issue in general, however. They don't have the hook Nintendo does with making a game to be the "system seller" as a standalone experience exclusive to a platform. Perhaps this has to do with the fact they don't design their hardware for their own ideas with software. Sony has never released a particular game that stood out as THE reason to own any of their platforms to me, but it's always been the collection of solid titles that got me to buy them anyway. The issue with the Vita is it simply lacks a standalone must have and a beefy library, so it lacks significant interest from the mainstream and the hardcore. I think that explains the anemic sales despite it being a hardcore gamers dream in regards to a portable platform.
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