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Japan, Is this as widespread as it seems?
- Thread starter Deus Ex Machina
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ten5ive9ine
They've got me haunting a family in Texas.
Not at all.
Just go, have fun.
Just go, have fun.
obsolete said:
Canada, but I spent a year in Japan then returned many times for a month here and there over the years. There are 130 million people in Japan this website list what 30 places and many of the signs are 5 years old or more. Clearly it's an epidemic sweeping the nation. I never once felt unwelcome anywhere in the country. To be honest its the complete opposite, it's probable the most welcome and safe places on the planet for a foreigner. I saw a broad range of the country from the corporate world to getting pissed with the Yaks and buying weed.
Giganticus
Member
In the US or Europe, a single sign like this would be enough to cause a serious national uproar. The people who put it up would then be fined heavily or even possibly sent to jail for discrimination. If anything, this website doesn't get enough play.darscot said:
obsolete said:
Neither, I was there doing Software and ran a team of so I was basically I mid-higher level Salary Man. Never was I treated poorly or with the slightest disrespect. Japan is a culture of status and unfortunately garden variety English teacher doesn't carry very much. I myself never thought it had much to do with color of ones skin as it did with the simple status of the job.
I knew of slew of English teachers and only could remember one or two that ever had a negative thing to say. Every once in a while you would meet someone that complaint and blamed race but even those stories were usually very on sided.
darscot said:
Because he takes/posts pictures of only the sign, neglecting to point out the sign is normally attached to a business of ill-repute.
Debito isn't stupid, he is just self-important. Although it doesn't take a rocket scientist to find de facto racism in a damn near homogeneous society. However, reactions to his over-reactions seem to range from dismissive to ridiculous to full-on orientalist.
darscot said:
Agree entirely. And what's funny is non-English teaching foreigners probably hate the English teachers more than anything. That hierarchy of foreigners in Japan pdf was so true.
http://pdf.textfiles.com/posters/japan-hierarchy.pdf
rotaryspirit
Member
Deus Ex Machina said:
The guy who writes this site is well-documented within the internet as being a guy who thrives on getting attention, using loud and obnoxious tactics to deal with problems in a country where using the kind of tactics he uses - being extremely vocal on site about the perceived insults, bringing lawyers and staging demonstrations instead of directing complaints discreetly, etc. Debito has turned from being a guy who wanted to give other tourists and foreigners interested in staying in Japan for extended periods of time information about difficult things (purchasing insurance, how to deal with getting a ticket, how to get a permanent residency visa, how to become a Japanese citizen) into a guy looking after his own self-interests and trying to bring as much attention to himself as possible by going on this ridiculous crusade against the racist treatment of foreigners in Japan.
http://www.debito.org/?p=1675
His newest crusade was trying to protest fingerprinting when entering Japan by paying his taxes in one-yen coins at the municpal office, which can get you arrested and is illegal, since there is a limit on the amount of small change you can use for a transaction with the government.
Debito does not comprehend the idea that all society is not like American society; even though he's been living in Sapporo for the past 18 years, he still retains a very bullish, aggressive attitude. In his most famous incident involving a public bathhouse in Otsu that had a sign "refusing entry" to foreigners, he saw the sign, then decided first to go get a reporter, his friend and their family, his family (wife and two kids) as well as his Japanese passport and quickly started an argument with the attending and the manager about the sign.
A small personal anecdote to this story; when Debito came to my University's campus one year for a speech on this very subject, I was in class with a Japanese woman from Otsu - we became friends and she told me when she took her boyfriend there they didn't have any problem, just walked in, paid their fees and took a bath. The sign existed, she said, to keep drunken Russians who didn't obey the rules of the bathhouse and previously trashed it out. Debito bringing it up to the manager however, put him in a position where he couldn't deny the sign even though he wouldn't have said anything if Debito hadn't brought it up first.
I lived for around ten months in Tokyo (Ropongi) many years ago (1991-1992) It was the most rascist place I've ever been to in my life.
My two friends and I (two white, one black) were refused entry into restaurants on multiple occassions. "Sorry," the host would say "but our waitresses don't speak english."
When the subway was packed we would have to stand in front of the seated people. Rarely would anyone face us. At times you would be surrounded by the back of people's heads. One time a really old lady got up and pushed her way into the crowd as soon as I grabbed the bar near her. It seemed she prefered giving up her seat and standing rather than having a gaijin stand over her.
If a Japanese girl hung around with a non-Japanese guy then she was looked down upon. The term we heard was "miso shobai" which loosely translated means water trout; a dirty, dull-witted fish that swims in the polluted Tokyo River.
Girls did hang out with us nonetheless, despite being branded as sluts. From them we learned to speak some Japanese. When gaijin mangle the their language is said to sound thuggish and low-born. They call it "namateru." Add to that we did this with a female lilt as that's where we learned it from. Apparently a six foot white guy speaking like a Japanese gangster with a female accent was VERY intimidating. The first impression one makes is that of a psychopath.
I assume things have changed as the years go by and I hope the newer generation is a little more laid back. By the same token however people change slowly and the older generation probably never will.
My two friends and I (two white, one black) were refused entry into restaurants on multiple occassions. "Sorry," the host would say "but our waitresses don't speak english."
When the subway was packed we would have to stand in front of the seated people. Rarely would anyone face us. At times you would be surrounded by the back of people's heads. One time a really old lady got up and pushed her way into the crowd as soon as I grabbed the bar near her. It seemed she prefered giving up her seat and standing rather than having a gaijin stand over her.
If a Japanese girl hung around with a non-Japanese guy then she was looked down upon. The term we heard was "miso shobai" which loosely translated means water trout; a dirty, dull-witted fish that swims in the polluted Tokyo River.
Girls did hang out with us nonetheless, despite being branded as sluts. From them we learned to speak some Japanese. When gaijin mangle the their language is said to sound thuggish and low-born. They call it "namateru." Add to that we did this with a female lilt as that's where we learned it from. Apparently a six foot white guy speaking like a Japanese gangster with a female accent was VERY intimidating. The first impression one makes is that of a psychopath.
I assume things have changed as the years go by and I hope the newer generation is a little more laid back. By the same token however people change slowly and the older generation probably never will.
LiveFromKyoto
Member
darscot said:
It's not an epidemic, but more bigotry exists than you realize. Great that you never ran into trouble, but if you think it's all welcoming and smiles, unfortunately it's not. I don't know how good your Japanese is, but people are constantly saying things about foreigners that if said about say, black folks in North America, would have them wind up in court.
I mean, for crying out loud they've even got two popular comedians whose entire routine is that one guy acts like a jackass and the other guy slaps him in the head because he's acting like a westerner (taka ando toshi).
I've had many people privately admit to me that many Japanese say they don't like foreigners and just steer clear of them, but will smile and be very pleasant when faced with them. My friend's wife is like that, doesn't like foreigners or foreign culture, hates the sound of English, but she's warm and welcoming to my face, I never would have guessed otherwise if I hadn't been told.
I've been flat out denied entry to a bar in Tokyo because I wasn't Japanese, been openly insulted as a stupid American (and I'm not even American) for "not understanding the rules" doing things like crossing an empty street at a red light at 7am despite the fact that Japanese do this all day every day. I've been told to sit in a corner, eat fast and get out at a restaurant. I've had shop owners smile and try to pull fast ones on me that I know they wouldn't try with Japanese. I've seen the sighs of "oh great, what now?" when a westerner comes into a store. The scowls some people will give on the street.
And as a white guy I get it easy, ask just about any long term black resident about their treatment in Japan. The looks they got if they tried to go into an onsen - and ask how many Japanese stayed in the water after they got in.
There are tons and tons of awesome Japanese people who are open minded, and the people who express hostility openly is a small percentage. And Japan is much more cosmopolitan than other Asian countries. But there's still lots of racism under the surface that never gets dealt with because it's not a multicultural society. Ask yourself how long a "whites only" sign would last in the west? And what the penalty would be for its existence?
Dyno said:
LiveFromKyoto said:
This shit has lasted in the west since it was first populated. It's laughable how suddenly the west is this peaceful harmony of love. The most racist place you've ever been were the hell have you been that Japan is so bad? People act like not looking at you on a train is so horrible and take it so personally. Some one said something about you bangin a chick my god the horror. As a white man if I went to different town and banged a chick in another group of all white people some on would talk shit. That is not racism do you people even know the meaning of the word?
Honestly the hardest part for me going to Japan was the fact that I'm a married man and they would get so offended that I wouldn't go whoring and bang all the women they threw at me. 75% of the population treat you like a rockstar, 24% treat you like a normal person and 1% might treat you very well but say something in private later.
rotaryspirit
Member
Racism is everywhere = old news.
Japan is mostly Japanese = old news.
Japanese people are "tentatively" scared/wary of foreigners = old news.
Saying Japan is more racist than other places is pretty ignorant of the world though, and how things work. In Japan you signs and places of business, although an extremely small, tiny, minuscule percentage, can do this because on a yearly basis 99.9999999999% of the customers who come up there are Japanese. An restaurant in almost any place in America just can't do that. You know, except some of the places my father lives in Tennessee where if you are black and you walk in the bar and don't walk right back out, you won't walk back out.
Racism still exists here, we just can't be so open about it. This is all completely off the topic of how much Debito is out of touch with "his own" culture, since he isn't American anymore.
Japan is mostly Japanese = old news.
Japanese people are "tentatively" scared/wary of foreigners = old news.
Saying Japan is more racist than other places is pretty ignorant of the world though, and how things work. In Japan you signs and places of business, although an extremely small, tiny, minuscule percentage, can do this because on a yearly basis 99.9999999999% of the customers who come up there are Japanese. An restaurant in almost any place in America just can't do that. You know, except some of the places my father lives in Tennessee where if you are black and you walk in the bar and don't walk right back out, you won't walk back out.
Racism still exists here, we just can't be so open about it. This is all completely off the topic of how much Debito is out of touch with "his own" culture, since he isn't American anymore.
No, but this is.
http://www.bergoiata.org/fe/PowerPost/fm475_king_kong_vs_godzilla.jpg
Seriously, don't let things like this worry you. I've been in the heart of Osaka, in bumblefuck rural Japan, Fukuoka, Kagawa, Kobe, Kyoto, and other places, and the worst "discrimination" I ever found was this public bath "amusement park" that wouldn't let my friend in because he had a tattoo.
May you possibly run into some people who give you some trouble? Sure. But a lot of the examples of that I've seen were just people who didn't give me a chance to show that I could speak Japanese and were obviously nervous about the encounter. Real discrimination I never saw, and honestly, if you're just taking a trip you're going to have to actively try to find it.
Oh, and I'm not saying that it wasn't true for the person who mentioned it, but I never myself experienced any situations where a Japanese girl was "looked down upon" for hanging out with me, and trust me, in my first couple of months I was making it my duty to hang out with as many cute Japanese girls as possible. You may have some people who don't like the inter-racial thing, but hell, that's EVERYWHERE.
Hell yeah... screw Tokyo, Osaka is the place to be.
http://www.bergoiata.org/fe/PowerPost/fm475_king_kong_vs_godzilla.jpg
Seriously, don't let things like this worry you. I've been in the heart of Osaka, in bumblefuck rural Japan, Fukuoka, Kagawa, Kobe, Kyoto, and other places, and the worst "discrimination" I ever found was this public bath "amusement park" that wouldn't let my friend in because he had a tattoo.
May you possibly run into some people who give you some trouble? Sure. But a lot of the examples of that I've seen were just people who didn't give me a chance to show that I could speak Japanese and were obviously nervous about the encounter. Real discrimination I never saw, and honestly, if you're just taking a trip you're going to have to actively try to find it.
Oh, and I'm not saying that it wasn't true for the person who mentioned it, but I never myself experienced any situations where a Japanese girl was "looked down upon" for hanging out with me, and trust me, in my first couple of months I was making it my duty to hang out with as many cute Japanese girls as possible. You may have some people who don't like the inter-racial thing, but hell, that's EVERYWHERE.
tetsuoxb said:
Hell yeah... screw Tokyo, Osaka is the place to be.
darscot said:
You don't even know me and yet you infer that I'm incapable of calling rascism when I'm exposed to it. You're also quick to misrepresent and belittle the situations I explained. Is your personal opinion on Japan so important that you feel you must disqualify mine?
Just to clear up the shit you're spewing let's get a couple things straight. I didn't take anything personally, you wind up growing a thick lair of skin pretty quick in situations like that. Casually avoiding eye contact is one thing, having a cluster of people completely turn your back on you is somthing else.
You've avoided mentioning the whole restaurant thing. Multiple people have brought it up now. Japan is the only country I've ever been to where I was denied service in a public place. I think it's noteworthy and I defy you to simply dismiss it.
Nobody said anything unkind to me with regards to the female company I kept. The japanese are many things but stupid isn't one of them. Instead there were a few cowards who would try to intimidate my girlfriends when I wasn't around or start nasty rumours about them. There's was no horror involved or any of your sarcastic characterizations. It was just a bunch of bigoted assholes doing their thing.
Everyplace I have been in my life other then Japan racism always contains the threat or clear fact of violence. Yet it never does in Japan. Here in Vancouver there are many after hours places I would never go into without a friend from whatever nationality the place is based on.
I myself never had any issue and I'm not arguing that you may have been treated poorly in a restaurant. You however fail to mention that the standards in the worst restaurant in Japan is light years better then that of say NA. In Japan if you leave McDonalds and notice a missing item they will have some one hop on a bike and deliver it to you. I think many people just lose there sense of reference. In Japan you are treated so well being treated normal makes you feel slighted. I've been treated like shit in endless restaurants in NA yet it's never referenced in a racist way. I never think this country hates me. Yet in Japan bad service relates to Japan hates foreigners.
I in no way am trying to be the Japan defense force I'm just trying to add my perspective.
I myself never had any issue and I'm not arguing that you may have been treated poorly in a restaurant. You however fail to mention that the standards in the worst restaurant in Japan is light years better then that of say NA. In Japan if you leave McDonalds and notice a missing item they will have some one hop on a bike and deliver it to you. I think many people just lose there sense of reference. In Japan you are treated so well being treated normal makes you feel slighted. I've been treated like shit in endless restaurants in NA yet it's never referenced in a racist way. I never think this country hates me. Yet in Japan bad service relates to Japan hates foreigners.
I in no way am trying to be the Japan defense force I'm just trying to add my perspective.
since japan hardly has any foreigners their pretty scared/intimdated by them
whats it like? 99,9999999% of the japanese population is japanese?
no wonder non asian looking people get stared at like thet've just seen bigfoot:lol
maybe these store owners think foreign people eat babies?
must have some reason
whats it like? 99,9999999% of the japanese population is japanese?
no wonder non asian looking people get stared at like thet've just seen bigfoot:lol
maybe these store owners think foreign people eat babies?
must have some reason
LiveFromKyoto
Member
Sigh...I hate these Japan topics because people A) tend to romanticize Japan and B) write off anybody else's negative experience if it didn't happen to them.
Basically.
Japan's great, but sweeping the negatives unde the rug or trying to say they don't count because of anecdote-X-about-the-west is pretty reprehensible.
In Kyoto, there is a whole neighbourhood of Koreans. They were brought over as slave labour during the war to build planes; afterwards they had no place to go, so they stayed on that land.
To this day Japan refuses to recognize them. They've lived in one place for 60+ years in the middle of a thriving city with no running water, no electricity, no access to medical care and basically little to no rights or even citizenship for 3rd generation kids because their parents & grandparents were never recognized. They weren't allowed to even be hired to work by Japanese until the 1970s. Four years ago the UN sent inspectors and denounced this, saying these people were living in Third World conditions due to governmental negligence. But nobody cares, and nobody does anything because this is Japan and if you're not Japanese you really shouldn't be here anyway; doesn't matter if you're third generation in the country.
These people have been raising money for decades to buy the land they live on, and have met governmental resistance every step of the way even though the land hasn't been used for anything else since the 1930s.
Canada is not without its problems, but this sort of thing doesn't happen there.
Dyno said:
Basically.
Japan's great, but sweeping the negatives unde the rug or trying to say they don't count because of anecdote-X-about-the-west is pretty reprehensible.
In Kyoto, there is a whole neighbourhood of Koreans. They were brought over as slave labour during the war to build planes; afterwards they had no place to go, so they stayed on that land.
To this day Japan refuses to recognize them. They've lived in one place for 60+ years in the middle of a thriving city with no running water, no electricity, no access to medical care and basically little to no rights or even citizenship for 3rd generation kids because their parents & grandparents were never recognized. They weren't allowed to even be hired to work by Japanese until the 1970s. Four years ago the UN sent inspectors and denounced this, saying these people were living in Third World conditions due to governmental negligence. But nobody cares, and nobody does anything because this is Japan and if you're not Japanese you really shouldn't be here anyway; doesn't matter if you're third generation in the country.
These people have been raising money for decades to buy the land they live on, and have met governmental resistance every step of the way even though the land hasn't been used for anything else since the 1930s.
Canada is not without its problems, but this sort of thing doesn't happen there.
rykomatsu
Member
Dyno said:
One of the 2 times this happened in Kyoto a few months back, my party and I were eating at a small restaurant (seats about...15 people in total around a bar) which is awfully popular...we were rather lucky going there right after opening and being able to get a few seats at the counter.
Anyhow, we were told that since they were expecting another party shortly, that we would only have about an hour to dine and knowing the situation, we were perfectly OK with that. They were booked for the rest of the evening, basically.
It's a quaint but nice looking restaurant from the outside so naturally people would come in and the chef would have to let them know that they were booked and all was fine.
In comes an american couple (based on their accent or lackthereof) who spoke little Japanese and the chef was trying to let them know that they were booked for the evening, but the only thing she could say was "we're full". The husband/bf started getting belligerent and said that there were spaces open at the counter (mixed english and trying to insert Japanese here and there). I don't know why at this point the couple didn't decide to leave but things just started escalating one sidedly with the husband/bf starting to raise his voice pretty significantly and it disrupted the dining situation pretty horribly.
I don't like sticking my head into other's businesses, but I actually had to step in to get them to leave since I think I was the only person who actually spoke fluent English there (or others just didn't want to deal with it...though I'm guessing it's the former).
It's not a common occurrence, but when it does occur, it's HIGHLY disruptive, especially in a smaller intimate setting. Obviously if either party spoke the other's language, this wouldn't have happened. However, there's no obligation for the business owners to learn another tongue...it might be nice if they do, but that's like telling me that I can't run a business in the US unless I cater to every nationality's language. The easy (and effective imho) way out is to post a "no foreigners" sign. They're just trying to achieve a similar effect to what "no cellphones allowed" signs are trying to do...maintain some order and quiet.
I've been to a number of restaurants and bars which have the signs up, but they've had absolutely no issues when the people coming in a) understand Japanese, b) can reasonably communicate in Japanese, and c) they don't cause a scene.
I lived in Japan for 8 years, and me, my brothers, and my father never encountered anything like this. I know it exists, and Japan has an unfortunate tendency to look the other way or blame someone else for their social problems, but I don't think this kind of thing is common. Generally, these signs are not too common, but the places where they crop up tend to be places that have seen vandalism from drunken military types, or straight up shady places like brothels (and even most brothels are fine. I remember walking through Kobe at night when I was 15 and 16 and was constantly hit up by ppl whose job it was to get ppl into their sex shops that peddled everything from strippers to blowjobs).
My experience in Japan is that the places that are wary of military types are cool with you so long as you are polite and observe local etiquette. Don't be a dick, and you'll be fine.
My experience in Japan is that the places that are wary of military types are cool with you so long as you are polite and observe local etiquette. Don't be a dick, and you'll be fine.
In the many many times I've been in Japan I can't say that I've been the target of anything like this. Though, my girlfriend was groped during the busy hustle of the JR letting out at 5 PM at Ikebukuro, all the immediate female head-turning made me realize that she was not the only victim.
rotaryspirit
Member
It seems like every time we get a story or on this topic, the same things always seem to pop up. The guys who get discriminated against come to Japan with little to no knowledge of the Japanese culture; they have only "What I was able to read from the pocket dictionary" ability in the Japanese language.
To guys like Dyno who seemed to have a good mindset about things - I don't know how you and your friends come off in real life - but still had these things happen to you, just look at what goes on around you. You are there for 10 months, with no real intention to stay, just take money out of the country and have a good time. That's fine, but look at the area (filled with foreigners) you lived in. You are going to get the girls who are looking to have a white guy to show off to their friends - don't think for a second that your girl wasn't doing this either.
Yes, people say bad things about foreigners, but again - it just goes back to what kind of society you are dealing with in comparison to the West. They aren't a multi-cultural society, they don't have very many foreigners, and even though it's unfair to the rest of the foreigners who are there to experience what kind of culture Japan offers there's still a lot who come because it's easy to get laid and make a bit of money while basically having a vacation.
Nah man, Canada doesn't have those problems at all.
Not at all.
Who are you kidding man?
To guys like Dyno who seemed to have a good mindset about things - I don't know how you and your friends come off in real life - but still had these things happen to you, just look at what goes on around you. You are there for 10 months, with no real intention to stay, just take money out of the country and have a good time. That's fine, but look at the area (filled with foreigners) you lived in. You are going to get the girls who are looking to have a white guy to show off to their friends - don't think for a second that your girl wasn't doing this either.
Yes, people say bad things about foreigners, but again - it just goes back to what kind of society you are dealing with in comparison to the West. They aren't a multi-cultural society, they don't have very many foreigners, and even though it's unfair to the rest of the foreigners who are there to experience what kind of culture Japan offers there's still a lot who come because it's easy to get laid and make a bit of money while basically having a vacation.
Live From Kyoto said:
Nah man, Canada doesn't have those problems at all.
Not at all.
Who are you kidding man?
uh oh, 20 stores in Japan had signs up saying they don't want foreign customers. End of the fucking world.
If any of you worried about Japan know any black guys living in the U.S., ask them if they've ever been discriminated against (if they're honest, the answer is "you better fucking believe it.")
Just like the U.S., racism/xenophobia is a sticky problem that will take a very long time to remove. The country's ports were closed off from the rest of the world until the end of the 19th century (iirc) and the U.S. just shy of 50 years with equal rights on the books. Both countries are still dealing with untangling the problem of racism on several levels. I thought I read a little while back that Japan is considering initiatives to bring in a large amount of foreigners (for economic reasons, I think.)
Point of the analogy is that you don't need to worry about getting egged the second you step off the plane, though you might run into a few situations, as you might if you aren't a white guy living in the U.S. (or if you're a white guy hanging out in predominately non-white areas.) If you go out to a rural area in Japan, your chances of running into that are higher than if you're in downtown Tokyo where people are more sophisticated (also like the U.S.)
Thread will still be a clusterfuck, but w/e I tried :lol
If any of you worried about Japan know any black guys living in the U.S., ask them if they've ever been discriminated against (if they're honest, the answer is "you better fucking believe it.")
Just like the U.S., racism/xenophobia is a sticky problem that will take a very long time to remove. The country's ports were closed off from the rest of the world until the end of the 19th century (iirc) and the U.S. just shy of 50 years with equal rights on the books. Both countries are still dealing with untangling the problem of racism on several levels. I thought I read a little while back that Japan is considering initiatives to bring in a large amount of foreigners (for economic reasons, I think.)
Point of the analogy is that you don't need to worry about getting egged the second you step off the plane, though you might run into a few situations, as you might if you aren't a white guy living in the U.S. (or if you're a white guy hanging out in predominately non-white areas.) If you go out to a rural area in Japan, your chances of running into that are higher than if you're in downtown Tokyo where people are more sophisticated (also like the U.S.)
Thread will still be a clusterfuck, but w/e I tried :lol
Maybe I'm wrong but I'm getting the impression that these signs are only an issue because white Americans are simply not used to being discriminated against.
Btw, I'm a white American. I'm not offended by these signs but I can imagine others who would be simply because they've never experienced discrimination of their race.
Btw, I'm a white American. I'm not offended by these signs but I can imagine others who would be simply because they've never experienced discrimination of their race.
LiveFromKyoto
Member
rotaryspirit said:
That's not the same thing at all. There's a dialogue with the government. There's a story you can link to on the government owned TV station's news site. The UN isn't stepping in, saying these people are being treated like cattle and the Canadian government then clears its throat and politely ignores the issue altogether. Second, those people recieve money and recognition from the government. They don't lack any status whatsoever and are denied medical attention or running water.
As I said, Canada's not without its problems, but that sort of thing doesn't happen.
Sweedishrodeo
the smegma spreader
ive been to japan a few times, once for an extended stay, and i've only been hated on once (drunken fool). friendliest place ever. i'm probably moving there to work next year.
chaostrophy
Member
rykomatsu said:
Ugh. As an American I hate people like that for proving that the stereotype of Americans being arrogant assholes while overseas has some basis in truth. Demanding service from a business when you don't speak the language and the staff has respectfully declined your patronage just seems like a horrible idea. What good could really come of it?
DCharlie
Banned
flip side anecdote :
my wife was refused stamps (store refused to sell them to her! ffs)
and spat on twice , with one time the phrase "fucking asians" hurled in her direction
in Liverpool.
re: Tokyo : there's been bars where i've not been allowed in, but it's not like there's a lack of bars in Tokyo and if they don't want my custom, then i'll vote with my wallet elsewhere. That sort of thing isn't that common place, and i find it trivial and on an individual basis.
where japan scares me is the mass institutionalised racism. It amazes me that whenever any crime is committed a number of Japanese will immediately jump to the equivalent of "bloody chinese!" without even seeing or hearing what has happened. Anti-china hysteria is rampant, as is anti-Korea.
Oh, and yeah, even though i have the cash to do it - most (all but two) banks won't let me take out a mortgage. I have to be a permanent resident. But that should be okay.... because my wife is Japanese....
... or is she?
you see, she looks Japanese, but she's not pure Japanese. She has filthy portuguese blood in her. And since marriage she has a completely western name.
So now the banks are being dicks and the converstations with a few banks have been like this :
"oh, you need your husband to co-sign for the mortgage..."
"oh"
"he's japanese right?"
"not as such"
"... that's a shame. Bye!"
She's neither considered Japanese by the Japanese
or western by the westerners
cockpunched, twice.
my wife was refused stamps (store refused to sell them to her! ffs)
and spat on twice , with one time the phrase "fucking asians" hurled in her direction
in Liverpool.
re: Tokyo : there's been bars where i've not been allowed in, but it's not like there's a lack of bars in Tokyo and if they don't want my custom, then i'll vote with my wallet elsewhere. That sort of thing isn't that common place, and i find it trivial and on an individual basis.
where japan scares me is the mass institutionalised racism. It amazes me that whenever any crime is committed a number of Japanese will immediately jump to the equivalent of "bloody chinese!" without even seeing or hearing what has happened. Anti-china hysteria is rampant, as is anti-Korea.
Oh, and yeah, even though i have the cash to do it - most (all but two) banks won't let me take out a mortgage. I have to be a permanent resident. But that should be okay.... because my wife is Japanese....
... or is she?
you see, she looks Japanese, but she's not pure Japanese. She has filthy portuguese blood in her. And since marriage she has a completely western name.
So now the banks are being dicks and the converstations with a few banks have been like this :
"oh, you need your husband to co-sign for the mortgage..."
"oh"
"he's japanese right?"
"not as such"
"... that's a shame. Bye!"
She's neither considered Japanese by the Japanese
or western by the westerners
cockpunched, twice.
phalestine
aka iby.h
DCharlie said:
I know how she feels. I am a Palestinian who was born in America. Lived there for 7 years and every time I went for a walk or just outside there was some sort of trouble (not the stores, but the people, business over there didn't care what nationality you were, as long as you had money) , they considered me a foreigner. but like there(japan), they arent all like that, most were actually really nice to me. came to America at the age of 13 I believe, well I can tell I am not welcome here either. it sucks really.
rotaryspirit
Member
Blackace said:
A friend and I have a plan to go around to some of the pink clubs, we've been looking some up on the internet. There's some crazy swingers couple's clubs that I'm interested in as well. It's amazing just how open sex can be there.
Kuro Madoushi
Unconfirmed Member
The attitudes in this thread are just insane!
"Yes lets all protect Japan's honor there is nothing negative about this country what's so ever!"
You guys are entitled to your opinion, but I don't think anyone is out to protect Japan's honor.
Since when has it been a bad thing to get both sides of the story? There's an issue that foreigners are discriminated against, some say it's not true and suddenly "lolz! Japan Defense Force!" To all you assholes, just because I happen to like the culture, it doesn't mean I think they're perfect, sheesh!
The fact of the matter is, Japanese, and I would say the same of most Koreans and Chinese as well, are still a very traditional and patriarchal society that is not used to multiculturalism and not used to foreigners. You would never understand it unless you were born and raised in that culture. Imagine growing up among only people of your own culture and suddenly some foreigners come and cause some shit. Of course you're going to associate other foreigners with trouble because they're different from you. Now of course, I think this is a totally outdated way of thinking, but parts of the world are developed differently than other parts.
Do I wish racism was stamped out? Hell, yeah. But what I see is that the Japanese are no better or worse than the rest of the world. There are a few restaurants/spas/whorehouses where you're not allowed in in Japan? END OF THE MOTHERFUCKING WORLD! You know there are places you can get shot or worse in the rest of the world due to the colour of your skin.
"Yes lets all protect Japan's honor there is nothing negative about this country what's so ever!"
You guys are entitled to your opinion, but I don't think anyone is out to protect Japan's honor.
Since when has it been a bad thing to get both sides of the story? There's an issue that foreigners are discriminated against, some say it's not true and suddenly "lolz! Japan Defense Force!" To all you assholes, just because I happen to like the culture, it doesn't mean I think they're perfect, sheesh!
The fact of the matter is, Japanese, and I would say the same of most Koreans and Chinese as well, are still a very traditional and patriarchal society that is not used to multiculturalism and not used to foreigners. You would never understand it unless you were born and raised in that culture. Imagine growing up among only people of your own culture and suddenly some foreigners come and cause some shit. Of course you're going to associate other foreigners with trouble because they're different from you. Now of course, I think this is a totally outdated way of thinking, but parts of the world are developed differently than other parts.
Do I wish racism was stamped out? Hell, yeah. But what I see is that the Japanese are no better or worse than the rest of the world. There are a few restaurants/spas/whorehouses where you're not allowed in in Japan? END OF THE MOTHERFUCKING WORLD! You know there are places you can get shot or worse in the rest of the world due to the colour of your skin.
Absinthe (Permed)
Banned
Racism exists in every country. Is it tragic? Yes, but it's there.
I'm positive that there are many westerners, black or white, that go to Japan and act like total fools. This makes westerners look like uncouth hayseeds. Can you blame them for feeling some anti-westerner sentiments when some westerners go to Japan and act disrespectful, loud, and have no regard for the country they're visiting?
I know quite a bit of people that have done JET and they love it. Every single one of them have told me that they're practically worshipped.
And one more thing--I'm willing to bet that most of the "stupid gaijin" mindset stems from the older Japanese people.
I'm positive that there are many westerners, black or white, that go to Japan and act like total fools. This makes westerners look like uncouth hayseeds. Can you blame them for feeling some anti-westerner sentiments when some westerners go to Japan and act disrespectful, loud, and have no regard for the country they're visiting?
I know quite a bit of people that have done JET and they love it. Every single one of them have told me that they're practically worshipped.
And one more thing--I'm willing to bet that most of the "stupid gaijin" mindset stems from the older Japanese people.
- Status