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Fudgepuppy · Jul 16, 2016

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-36775398

Don't see a problem with it in general, but the definition is so vague, that I can't see how it will make any difference:

The force defines misogyny hate crime as: "Incidents against women that are motivated by an attitude of a man towards a woman and includes behaviour targeted towards a woman by men simply because they are a woman."

Symphonia · Jul 16, 2016

Dat definition doe...

Oersted · Jul 16, 2016

That sounds like Google Translate

entremet · Jul 16, 2016

Isn't Nottingham one of the poorest sections in the UK?

daviyoung · Jul 16, 2016

entremet said:
Isn't Nottingham one of the poorest sections in the UK?

no, and not sure how that's even relevant here

maquiladora · Jul 16, 2016

entremet said:
Isn't Nottingham one of the poorest sections in the UK?

What....

Deleted member 231381 · Jul 16, 2016

entremet said:
Isn't Nottingham one of the poorest sections in the UK?

Nottingham has some areas that are quite poor, but the city as a whole is increasingly affluent these days. One of the fastest growing UK cities outside London.

hodgy100 · Jul 16, 2016

entremet said:
Isn't Nottingham one of the poorest sections in the UK?

I don't think so. Nottingham is largely middle class with spots of poorer areas. Even the ex miners town I come from (Eastwood) is pretty well off on the whole.

On the topic at hand. The sentiment is great but it depends how this is all applied. If people start getting arrested for wolf whistling or catcalling then that leaves a real bad taste in the mouth. If this is used to allow the police to better deal with people harassing women and allow them to intervene and tell the guy to get lost then that's pretty good.

It's kind of an off thing to pass really. I never thought cat calling was a massive issue in the UK or in notts specificall for that matter. I thought it was very much a US thing.

thesoapster · Jul 16, 2016

Little bit...vague?

entremet said:
Isn't Nottingham one of the poorest sections in the UK?

This is not Robin Hood.

entremet · Jul 16, 2016

daviyoung said:
no, and not sure how that's even relevant here

maquiladora said:
What....

Just asking a question.

I ask because a lower educated populace may not even be aware of these passing, let alone challenge them on legal grounds.

This is stuff is common in the US regarding minority communities.

These types of laws get passed and disportionately affect the poor, for the worse.

thesoapster said:
Little bit...vague?

This is not Robin Hood.

LOL.

I wasn't thinking about that. But these types of laws are very much out of the fuck the poor playbook in the US.

Dennis · Jul 16, 2016

What about misandry? Is there equality before the law?

hodgy100 · Jul 16, 2016

Dennis said:
What about misandry? Is there equality before the law?

I wouldn't know how to spot misandry myself :/

Dennis · Jul 16, 2016

Will they actually have the balls to tackle communities where women are treated as second class or is this just going to be used against online trolls?

Sinfamy · Jul 16, 2016

That's a word salad if I've ever seen one.

The Incarnation · Jul 16, 2016

entremet said:
Isn't Nottingham one of the poorest sections in the UK?

Not even close.

Anyway, no more getting my knob out, outside of Forman's.

War Peaceman · Jul 16, 2016

Dennis said:
Will they actually have the balls to tackle communities where women are treated as second class or is this just going to be used against online trolls?

Do you actually know anything about Nottingham lol?

Quite pleased to see this even though the definition itself is very bad. I think it sends an important message that wolf-whistling is not acceptable and will hopefully move people away from that sort of behaviour

Rich! · Jul 16, 2016

I...I don't like this.

So if I'm out in the town, a bunch of drunk girls start slinging insults my way, if I respond in turn I can be done for a hate crime?

That's not right. Stopping abuse towards women is obviously important, but this new bylaw is so vague, one sided and open for misinterpretation and misuse.

hodgy100 · Jul 16, 2016

Rich! said:
I...I don't like this.

So if I'm out in the town, a bunch of drunk girls start slinging insults my way, if I respond in turn I can be done for a hate crime?

That's not right.

I think that would be an incorrect interpretation of this law. I believe the intention is to turn casual sexual harassment.
I think we need to see how this is applied in practice before we jump to conclusions.

Demoskinos · Jul 16, 2016

Good intentions sloppily written law.

benicillin · Jul 16, 2016

Rich! said:
I...I don't like this.

So if I'm out in the town, a bunch of drunk girls start slinging insults my way, if I respond in turn I can be done for a hate crime?

That's not right. Stopping abuse towards women is obviously important, but this new bylaw is so vague, one sided and open for misinterpretation and misuse.

This might be one of the more ridiculous examples of jumping to conclusions I've seen yet.

xandaca · Jul 16, 2016

benicillin said:
This might be one of the more ridiculous examples of jumping to conclusions I've seen yet.

Not at all. His criticisms of the law being vague, one-sided and open to misuse are completely accurate. These reactionary measures solve nothing, at best they simply paper over the cracks rather than address the root causes, at worst they create more tension and resentment. There are already good harassment laws on the books (applicable to both sexes, both from the position of perpetrator and victim, dealing with sexual and non-sexual situations) which the police take seriously when they are made aware of possible transgressions. It would be wiser to better inform people of their rights and responsibilities and what they are able to do in difficult or scary situations, rather than taking these loosely-sketched gestures which help no-one and solve nothing.

Fudgepuppy · Jul 16, 2016

The problem with this law, is how are you supposed to prove it?

"Your honor, that man whistled at me with bad intentions"
"Is there any proof?"
"No... except for my statement"
"Did you whistle at this woman"
"I whistled, but not at the woman"
"Oh for crying out loud!"

NoblesseOblige · Jul 16, 2016

Rich! said:
I...I don't like this.

So if I'm out in the town, a bunch of drunk girls start slinging insults my way, if I respond in turn I can be done for a hate crime?

That's not right. Stopping abuse towards women is obviously important, but this new bylaw is so vague, one sided and open for misinterpretation and misuse.

Would your response be about how women are lesser than men, or a response you would not give to men as well?

Dennis · Jul 16, 2016

War Peaceman said:
Do you actually know anything about Nottingham lol?

It has a Sheriff, I know that much.

TheHolyTurnip · Jul 16, 2016

NoblesseOblige said:
Would your response be about how women are lesser than men, or a response you would not give to men as well?

Are the women hurling insults about how men are lesser than women, or an attack that they would not use against women as well?

emag · Jul 16, 2016

Fudgepuppy said:
The problem with this law, is how are you supposed to prove it?

"Your honor, that man whistled at me with bad intentions"
"Is there any proof?"
"No... except for my statement"
"Did you whistle at this woman"
"I whistled, but not at the woman"
"Oh for crying out loud!"

"No, sir, I do not bite my thumb at you sir; but I bite my thumb, sir."

Rich! · Jul 16, 2016

NoblesseOblige said:
Would your response be about how women are lesser than men, or a response you would not give to men as well?

My response is that this law does not treat people equally. It should be targeting those who abuse women verbally, yet fails on doing so without being hopelessly one sided and open for misuse.

Bear in mind I have a daughter too, and I have to consider her safety and future daily. This law does not benefit her.

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