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Wii U Speculation Thread 2: Can't take anymore of this!!!

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L

lunchwithyuzo

Banned
SaintMadeOfPlaster said:
First of all, we have no idea if they are working on DKCR2. They've stated that they're working on a game that "everyone wants them to make," and I don't think DKCR qualifies.

Also, they've been hiring staff that have experience with games much bigger in scope than DKCR.
Click to expand...
I thought Retro had two teams now? I'm sure their big Wii U Zelda/Metroid Prime thing will take precedence, then Team B can squeeze out an iterated super polished DKCR2 for the hundred million Wii owners next Xmas.
 
C

Caramello

Member
Arkam said:
The current Wii U dev kit i am talking about (not this supposed new one in the last few weeks) Is slightly LESS powerful than the Xbox 360.
Click to expand...

How is that even possible with the specs we actually know about? Also why would developers say it can do anything the PS3/360 can do if it was weaker?

lunchwithyuzo said:
I thought Retro had two teams now? I'm sure their big Wii U Zelda/Metroid Prime thing will take precedence, then Team B can squeeze out an iterated super polished DKCR2 for the hundred million Wii owners next Xmas.
Click to expand...

The "Retro have two teams" thing hasn't been confirmed by anybody as far as I know. They probably had two teams working while they were helping out with Mario Kart 3DS but I doubt it stayed split after that title was finished.

Does anybody have proof? Their recent hires are not proof either, expanding their existing team for HD development makes much more sense than hiring more people for a second team.
 
J

Jarsonot

Member
Arkam said:
Fair enough. Not sure what I can say that will back my claims up without getting my self in trouble. But I will try to clarify a bit without getting too specific.

The current Wii U dev kit i am talking about (not this supposed new one in the last few weeks) Is slightly LESS powerful than the Xbox 360. What I mean by that is that we would have to scale back/change our Xbox/PS3 games to run on the console. Its a tri core out of order cpu with 1GB of pretty slow ram and a decently featured gpu that lacks raw muscle. Its good and efficient, just not that powerful. As we all know they can change it and according to rumors they have. But nothing they can do this late in the game is going to dramatically change its performance. When it ships it will be in the ball park of the Xbox 360/PS3 (give or take a little). But in no way will it be 2x or more powerful then the HD twins. Just not happening.

I am a huge Nintendo fanboy, so I am disappointed that they are not putting more power in the box. Nintendo will have no problem making great looking games on it, and 3rd party studios will be able to port games from 360/ps3. But when ever MS/Sony show their next consoles it might not be so true.

So believe it or not. Either way is cool by me.
Click to expand...

Hmm. I'd be disappointed if it ends up as Nintendo once again not getting big 3rd party games 'cause developers don't want to downgrade them. Combined with the necessity of coming up with something for the tablet to do, bleh.

Here's hoping that they WILL be closer to the new MS & Sony consoles. Or close enough anyway =)
 
S

sfried

Member
Although this IS the premier WiiU speculation thread, I'm surprised by the number of Junior Members suddenly popping in and making hyperboles.

Somehow I feel I should retern closer to E3 or when more info surfaces.
 
Arkam

Arkam

Member
-Pyromaniac- said:
thanks. Also in addition to my edit, if you've been using the dev kit before the latest one, why haven't you used/seen the latest? Didn't get it yet?

LAST TIME I SWEAR. Answer vaguely.
Click to expand...


Since I haven't seen it I am not sure it exists. But console makers can sometimes roll out updated kits oddly. That sure was the way it was when we got our xbox360 kits. So if these new revision kits show up great. I wouldn't expect more than minor tweaking though.
 
B

bgassassin

Member
Arkam said:
Well played sir. It won't work again.
Click to expand...

Once you get used to GAF you won't bite on that. :)

That said I believe you and your description sounds a lot like the earlier kit which from there lherre was saying wasn't seeing any hardware changes, just what sounded like firmware tweaks. Considering normal hardware development I would say it sounds like you are unfairly writing it off too soon. So I would say wait till you know how the final looks like before being disappointed. :)
 
W

-WindYoshi-

Banned
sfried said:
Although this IS the premier WiiU speculation thread, I'm surprised by the number of Junior Members suddenly popping in and making hyperboles.

Somehow I feel I should retern closer to E3 or when more info surfaces.
Click to expand...

The best way to fix that problem is to face it head on. This thread will school anyone who is uninformed and eventually things should return to the normal level of insanity.
 
G

Grampa Simpson

Banned
If Arkam wanted to validate himself as being someone who might know what they are talking about, he might associate his GAF account to his work email (in the control panel) and then ask a mod to tell the thread whether or not he works somewhere that might have access to dev kits.

The mods aren't going to out what company he works for who he is in real life (that would be bad for GAF) and Arkam gets to be in the exalted position of being someone who might know something.

Of course if he's lying, he's going to get fucked.
 
P

-Pyromaniac-

Member
bgassassin said:
Once you get used to GAF you won't bite on that. :)

That said I believe you and your description sounds a lot like the earlier kit which from there lherre was saying wasn't seeing any hardware changes, just what sounded like firmware tweaks. Considering normal hardware development I would say it sounds like you are unfairly writing it off too soon. So I would say wait till you know how the final looks like before being disappointed. :)
Click to expand...
so obv bgassassin knows something and isn't saying it outright
 
A

AceBandage

Banned
Arkam said:
Fair enough. Not sure what I can say that will back my claims up without getting my self in trouble. But I will try to clarify a bit without getting too specific.

The current Wii U dev kit i am talking about (not this supposed new one in the last few weeks) Is slightly LESS powerful than the Xbox 360. What I mean by that is that we would have to scale back/change our Xbox/PS3 games to run on the console. Its a tri core out of order cpu with 1GB of pretty slow ram and a decently featured gpu that lacks raw muscle. Its good and efficient, just not that powerful. As we all know they can change it and according to rumors they have. But nothing they can do this late in the game is going to dramatically change its performance. When it ships it will be in the ball park of the Xbox 360/PS3 (give or take a little). But in no way will it be 2x or more powerful then the HD twins. Just not happening.

I am a huge Nintendo fanboy, so I am disappointed that they are not putting more power in the box. Nintendo will have no problem making great looking games on it, and 3rd party studios will be able to port games from 360/ps3. But when ever MS/Sony show their next consoles it might not be so true.

So believe it or not. Either way is cool by me.
Click to expand...

Yeah, you're either BSing us, or being fed false information...
 
W

-WindYoshi-

Banned
radcliff said:
My theory is that EAD 4 is making New Super Mario World for 3DS and then a 2D Mario Platformer for Wii U in 2014. I believe EAD Tokyo 1 is making a 3D Mario platformer for Wii U’s launch (or launch window). I also think EAD Tokyo 2 will make a 3DS Zelda game with Grezzo (Koizumi has said he would like to make another Zelda, both Grezzo and Koizumi have experience with the series, and both Grezzo and Koizumi’s teams are in Tokyo) due in 2014, and then make a follow-up to EAD Tokyo 1’s Mario platformer in 2016. This would give Nintendo a Mario title for Wii U every 2 years (2012- 3d Mario platformer by EAD Tokyo 1, 2014- 2D Mario platformer by EAD 4, and 2016- 3d Mario platformer by EAD Tokyo 2.)
Click to expand...

Good speculation... I can solidly envision this being what actually happens.
 
S

sfried

Member
-WindYoshi- said:
The best way to fix that problem is to face it head on. This thread will school anyone who is uninformed and eventually things should return to the normal level of insanity.
Click to expand...
I dunno. To much effort to waste energy on internet forums.

I'd rather Nintendo just release the damn thing and prove everyone wrong or something. It's like trying to second guess Deep Thought's answer: all the slagging and disproving is just for fun and profit.
 
S

sfried

Member
Arkam said:
Not unless Nintendo has an amazing sense of humor and like wasting people's time. Oh wait that is exactly what their submission process it like!
Click to expand...
Snide remarks against Nintendo on a WiiU speculation thread. Seriously this isn't productive at all...
 
A

Antioch

Member
nckillthegrimace said:
I still don't believe they just made that as a tech demo. Maybe they switched it to 3DS because they think that platform needs it more this year than the Wii U needs it at launch. NSMB is a game with very broad appeal, so it makes sense to wait until the user base is larger in order to sell more units. The Wii U NSMB can come out next year or the year after.
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure prior to GDC 2011 Miyamoto or Iwata said that both 2D and 3D Marios were in development for 3DS, we got 3D Land, so NSMB 3D coming this year is no surprise, NSMB was always going to come out on 3DS before it would on Wii U. Besides the 'demo' looked basically like a Wii game and used assets from NSMB Wii, so I don't think it required much effort on their part to throw it together for E3.

AceBandage said:
Yeah, but think about this.
We'll have:
Mario 2D
Paper Mario
Mario Tennis
Mario Party 9


That's four already! I just can not see a new Mario platformer being shown at E3 for the Wii U.
Maybe before the end of the year, but not at E3.
Click to expand...

Mario Party 9 will be out by then and they'll want to give the Wii U the best showing they can muster. If a few seconds of EAD Tokyo's Super Mario Wii U can be shown, it will be, this is also why I have a little shred of hope for a cg SSB trailer.


Also for those discussing DKCR2, I personally believe it will be treated as a once a system kind of game, much like a lot of other Nintendo games, I don't think we'll see it on Wii U for at least a few years. I also think that we will see DK 3D Land before long, likely developed by NST with SPD 3, I mean they haven't made anything since late 2010 that we know of. This game would probably be similar to MPH in terms of Retro's capacity in its development.

And just because I feel it's relevant, here is a post I made about 20 pages back about the launch line-up:
I think in terms of first party stuff the launch line-up will consist of:
Wii U Play (Probably a pack in game that compiles the demos from E3, possibly under a different and new title though)
Yoshi's Island (I think Good Feel are pretty much due a new game this year, and this'd be the perfect game for them, 3DS line-up for 2012 is big enough as it is, so I think they're making a launch game)
Pikmin 3 (This has been in development for years, so it goes without saying. I actually think it might be developed by EAD Tokyo 1, simply because the timeline would fit. At the end of 2007, EAD Tokyo split in 2 when SMG was finished, one team (probably a bigger one) starts work on SMG 2 while the smaller one starts work on Pikmin 3, at E3 2008 Miyamoto confirms they're making it, but it's very early. Nothing ready in 2009 as most of EAD Tokyo is working on SMG 2. In 2010 we hear that they could have shown it but decided against it because of how much other stuff they showed, at this point I think they intended for it to be a Wii game released in 2011. But at E3 2011 we hear it's moved to Wii U, I would guess this decision was reached late 2010/early 2011. That's my theory anyway).

These three games would make for a great launch because that way the traditional Nintendo fans will pick it up for Yoshi's Island and Pikmin 3, while some of the Wii Sports audience would be tempted by Wii U Play. Launch I think will be worldwide in November and December this year, like the Wii. In terms of Launch window games (let's just say until Q2 2013) Nintendo could release Retro's game, Wii U Sports or Fit, a Monster Games game (my guess is something like Wave Race or 1080, or Diddy Kong Racing?), Monolith's game (which could be at launch in Japan), WarioWare, an Nd Cube party game and another Project M Metroid. Obviously they wouldn't release all of this within 3 months, but I think in theory they could have each one ready by that time.

Let's not forget that launch could be supported by 3rd party stuff like RE 6, Ninja Gaiden 3, COD etc. and that there are multiple 3rd party exclusives lined up, like Rabbids, that Ubisoft sports game, Killer Freaks, THQ's supposedly exclusive game, Sonic Dimensions, and my personal prediction of Scribblenauts Wii U (which is also my guess for the Wii U/3DS game Paul Gale has talked about).
Click to expand...
 
B

BY2K

Membero Americo
Arkam said:
Anyone who has ever submitted a game for certification to Nintendo knows what I am talking about. It it 10x more painful than dealing with MS/Sony.
Click to expand...

I do have an idea, being a QA Tester, but I don't see how it's more of a waste of time than MS/Sony/GW.
 
A

AceBandage

Banned
So, let's see.
First he says that the 360 is the PSP and the 3DS is the Wii U, so the PS4/720 is a Vita.
Then he says the Wii U is WEAKER than the 360 (despite even the most conservative reports from every developer putting it a step above), which of course contradicts his earlier statement.
And then he makes snide remakes that are completely irrelevant...
Yeah, time to put up or shut up, man.
 
W

watershed

Banned
I don't believe for a second that the wii u is gonna be weaker than the 360 in actual performance or theoretical performance. Even on the record statements from developers have said it will be more powerful/be the most powerful console on the market when it launches. That doesn't mean it will be a beast but it also isn't gonna be a step down from the current hd consoles.
 
B

BY2K

Membero Americo
ANY submission process is a pain in the ass, may it be from Nintendo, Sony or Microsoft.

But swear to God, if there wasn't any, may have mercy on the game's overall quality.
 
A

antonz

Member
Nintendo is going to have had to fuck up the Wii U pretty bad considering the very first Dev kit leak was already several times more powerful than current gen consoles.
 
B

botty

Banned
Are you guys telling me that anyone can just come along, say they're a developer (without any proof) and you will believe them?

Is that how this place works?
 
B

bgassassin

Member
Arkam said:
Anyone who has ever submitted a game for certification to Nintendo knows what I am talking about. It is 10x more painful than dealing with MS/Sony.
Click to expand...

I have seen this mentioned.

As for info, you don't have to really worry about getting in trouble. We already had someone with kit access give us info while some of us have been able to dig things up elsewhere to fill in some of the gaps.

For example we know that the L2 cache on the CPU is divided asymmetrically and one core acts like a master core. The "slow memory" coincides with what wsippel talking about a long time ago of being told the memory was GDDR3 in the kit.

-Pyromaniac- said:
I'm starting to doubt all of you now, wiiU sucks, nintendo sucks, you all sucks, this thread sucks, retro sucks.

I'm having a breakdown.
Click to expand...

*gives Pyro a hug*
 
S

stupidvillager

Neo Member
So...you have a dev kit that is less powerful than a 360 so you have to scale your games/plans back but yet back around E3 we had Gearbox saying that they had Aliens running at textures and resolutions not seen before on PS360. We have Crytek saying that they are happy and excited with the specs and was it Epic that was saying it was going to be a powerful box. Gabe Newell says it seems to be a lot more powerful than the current generation. Vigil says (in July) that there is plenty of power and they dont have to make any concessions. This is what developers are saying and there are plenty of rumors stating its between 2-5 times as powerful. But your dev kit is less powerful?
 
A

AceBandage

Banned
stupidvillager said:
So...you have a dev kit that is less powerful than a 360 so you have to scale your games/plans back but yet back around E3 we had Gearbox saying that they had Aliens running at textures and resolutions not seen before on PS360. We have Crytek saying that they are happy and excited with the specs and was it Epic that was saying it was going to be a powerful box. Gabe Newell says it seems to be a lot more powerful than the current generation. Vigil says (in July) that there is plenty of power and they dont have to make any concessions. This is what developers are saying and there are plenty of rumors stating its between 2-5 times as powerful. But your dev kit is less powerful?
Click to expand...

Obviously Nintendo gave his company a joke dev kit.
 
T

TheNamesPlissken

Neo Member
Arkam said:
Fair enough. Not sure what I can say that will back my claims up without getting my self in trouble. But I will try to clarify a bit without getting too specific.

The current Wii U dev kit i am talking about (not this supposed new one in the last few weeks) Is slightly LESS powerful than the Xbox 360. What I mean by that is that we would have to scale back/change our Xbox/PS3 games to run on the console. Its a tri core out of order cpu with 1GB of pretty slow ram and a decently featured gpu that lacks raw muscle. Its good and efficient, just not that powerful. As we all know they can change it and according to rumors they have. But nothing they can do this late in the game is going to dramatically change its performance. When it ships it will be in the ball park of the Xbox 360/PS3 (give or take a little). But in no way will it be 2x or more powerful then the HD twins. Just not happening.

I am a huge Nintendo fanboy, so I am disappointed that they are not putting more power in the box. Nintendo will have no problem making great looking games on it, and 3rd party studios will be able to port games from 360/ps3. But when ever MS/Sony show their next consoles it might not be so true.

So believe it or not. Either way is cool by me.
Click to expand...

so... you are saying it has more RAM and a more modern CPU/GPU than the xbox 360 has, but at the same time is less powerful?
 
B

bgassassin

Member
botty said:
Are you guys telling me that anyone can just come along, say they're a developer (without any proof) and you will believe them?

Is that how this place works?
Click to expand...

I'm will to give someone the benefit of the doubt till they do enough to show otherwise. But that's just me.
 
B

BY2K

Membero Americo
stupidvillager said:
So...you have a dev kit that is less powerful than a 360 so you have to scale your games/plans back but yet back around E3 we had Gearbox saying that they had Aliens running at textures and resolutions not seen before on PS360.
Click to expand...

How did I missed that? Source?
 
Arkam

Arkam

Member
BY2K said:
ANY submission process is a pain in the ass, may it be from Nintendo, Sony or Microsoft.

But swear to God, if there wasn't any, may have mercy on the game's overall quality.
Click to expand...

I agree. And Nintendo is incredibly strict on their hardware standards and gives less waivers than MS/Sony.

What I always hated about their submission is that they don't give your your concerns as they find them like MS/Sony. Instead they wait until they are done reviewing it and THEN tell you everything you need to fix. When you are working against a hard deadline to get to retail those days are HUGE.
 
T

TheCongressman1

Member
artwalknoon said:
I don't believe for a second that the wii u is gonna be weaker than the 360 in actual performance or theoretical performance. Even on the record statements from developers have said it will be more powerful/be the most powerful console on the market when it launches. That doesn't mean it will be a beast but it also isn't gonna be a step down from the current hd consoles.
Click to expand...

This. Something's gotta' give.
 
C

Caramello

Member
Antioch said:
I'm pretty sure prior to GDC 2011 Miyamoto or Iwata said that both 2D and 3D Marios were in development for 3DS, we got 3D Land, so NSMB 3D coming this year is no surprise, NSMB was always going to come out on 3DS before it would on Wii U. Besides the 'demo' looked basically like a Wii game and used assets from NSMB Wii, so I don't think it required much effort on their part to throw it together for E3.

They hadn't announced a new 2D Mario for the 3DS before this year. I do agree though that the Wii U version was clearly just a tech demo, not a game in development at all but will be a game in development after the 3DS version is finished.


Mario Party 9 will be out by then and they'll want to give the Wii U the best showing they can muster. If a few seconds of EAD Tokyo's Super Mario Wii U can be shown, it will be, this is also why I have a little shred of hope for a cg SSB trailer.

I assumed Mario Party 9 would be out after E3 based on AceBandage's claim that it'd be at E3 so thank you for bringing that up. Also Nintendo didn't talk about Wii at all last year outside of Zelda so I don't think Wii will be touched on this year either. However a SSB CG trailer is absolutely out of the question as they won't have even started it yet and the 3DS version is going to be the one they show off first I'm betting (unless it's a simultaneous release).

If you take out Super Mario Galaxy from E3 2006, the quality of the show drops. It was obviously fantastic either way but Mario really boosted it higher than it would otherwise have been. So showing a couple of early levels with a working title is pretty much locked in I'd say.

Also for those discussing DKCR2, I personally believe it will be treated as a once a system kind of game, much like a lot of other Nintendo games, I don't think we'll see it on Wii U for at least a few years. I also think that we will see DK 3D Land before long, likely developed by NST with SPD 3, I mean they haven't made anything since late 2010 that we know of. This game would probably be similar to MPH in terms of Retro's capacity in its development.

I agree here. Nintendo won't make a sequel to DKCR straight away as it just won't sell as well early in a generation or as a sequel on the same system. A 3DS version would make sense and sell to the userbase built from Super Mario 3D Land.

I don't think NST is a good fit though based on their recent output.



And just because I feel it's relevant, here is a post I made about 20 pages back about the launch line-up:
Click to expand...

I'm going to post each team and see what we can come up with in terms of when they're due for a new title.
 
P

-Pyromaniac-

Member
bgassassin said:
*gives Pyro a hug*
Click to expand...
WlXSV.gif


alright I've returned with a calm and stable mind. Back to discussion. So I think it's realistic to expect power = 2x + 1 increase from the ps360.

So now we just need to solve for X I guess. I have done so and concluded that the WiiU will be 3x more powerful.
 
B

BY2K

Membero Americo
Arkam said:
I agree. And Nintendo is incredibly strict on their hardware standards and gives less waivers than MS/Sony.

What I always hated about their submission is that they don't give your your concerns as they find them like MS/Sony. Instead they wait until they are done reviewing it and THEN tell you everything you need to fix. When you are working against a hard deadline to get to retail those days are HUGE.
Click to expand...

Oh God, I feel that, man.
 
S

sfried

Member
Arkam said:
Instead they wait until they are done reviewing it and THEN tell you everything you need to fix. When you are working against a hard deadline to get to retail those days are HUGE.
Click to expand...
Don't they do some rigorous bug check to make sure it doesn't crash their system?
 
T

TwilightPrincess

Member
antonz said:
Nintendo is going to have had to fuck up the Wii U pretty bad considering the very first Dev kit leak was already several times more powerful than current gen consoles.
Click to expand...

The first "leak" was 50% stronger. What makes me wonder is the "would not be fair to compare" statement. But the same company told as "at least PS360 power". The Battlefield Guy was angry about low WiiU power but stated it would be the strongest console "by far" at release..... And that is all about the older devkits.....
 
B

bgassassin

Member
-Pyromaniac- said:
WlXSV.gif


alright I've returned with a calm and stable mind. Back to discussion. So I think it's realistic to expect power = 2x + 1 increase from the ps360.

So now we just need to solve for X I guess. I have done so and concluded that the WiiU will be 3x more powerful.
Click to expand...

So the formula is 2x = 5x. That's what you solved?
 
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