Smiles and Cries
Member
I want some good news so far I did not like the last few pages 
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Wii U Speculation Thread 2: Can't take anymore of this!!!
- Thread starter ClovingWestbrook
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ShockingAlberto
Member
I will say this very much conflicts with what I have heard (but not witnessed, in fairness). It's not a beast, but weaker than the 360 it is not. Even the earliest devkits were a step above. How incremental the upgrades were with each devkit after that, I don't know.
I claim no more confidence in my source than Arkam may in his, though. We'll find out some day, I suppose, but I am willing to bet that games will look better than 360 games.
I want some good news so far I did not like the last few pages
Board the train dude, we ain't gettin' shit until at the earliest, GDC.
Well, big news at least.
BishopLamont
Banned
Wii U weaker than 360, haha, what a joke.
It doesn't even matter that he'll be proven wrong once the Wii-U comes out, he'll just backtrack and say he was just talking about earlier dev kits.
It doesn't even matter that he'll be proven wrong once the Wii-U comes out, he'll just backtrack and say he was just talking about earlier dev kits.
he already said he was talking about earlier dev kits.
Maybe I misread, but it sounded like he was talking about a dev kit from a month or so ago.
correct
BishopLamont
Banned
Well yeah thats what I mean, he's saying that so there's no way he'll be proven wrong.
FreeMufasa
Junior Member
lol, this would so be typical Nintendo if true.
Assuming he's correct, if he's talking about anything, he's talking about clock speeds. But as he is a developer, he of all people should know that having lower clock speeds does not mean having "less power." Considering Nintendo is using modern parts and such a small case, I personally never entertained the idea of "high" clock speeds in the first place. In fact, I don't think anyone in this thread did after we got more information from different users. If the Wii U really is using a Power 7 derived CPU, it will just be hands down more efficient at everything compared to the Xenon CPU in the Xbox 360 from what I've read (and from what has been said here).
And now I'm trying to consider what exactly he would have to scale back in order to get his game to run on Wii U, even if the console was running a 2GHz Power 7-like thing, an ATi 4650 derived part that only had twice the SPU count and the same GPU clock of Xenos, and a gig of the slowest RAM available for the PC market
(but with a substantial amount of CPU cache)
BishopLamont
Banned
Because its plain illogical that the Wii-U would be even weaker than a 360.
Spieler Eins
Member
If the success of DKCR forces Retro to do another Donkey Kong game, I'm really hoping for a DK64 done right. The revival of 2D platformers has been nice, but I'm slowly getting tired of them, while there's been a serious lack of 3D action platformers lately :/
I'm kinda hoping for this too.
He is a new junior. He's only been on the boards for about a week so he might not know the rules or he might purposely be a troll account.
Uhhh, cuz that's what trolls DO, consequences be damned?!
I think the reaction to arkam is pretty understandable. We've got reputable sources saying that things are on the upward and positive path for Nintendo and some individuals have a zero tolerance policy on legit good news on the Nintendo front. They will therefore insist on trolling and unjustifiable buzzkills to deflate the positive energy (see: "lolfriendcodes" responses to the Nintendo Network announcement for recent evidence of this, or just responses in general where they only type "Nintendo" as though it were a universal pejorative), lest it tarnish their world view that Nintendo is incapable of actually producing a universally-loved mainstream console again. It's not even about fanboyism anymore, even Nintendo fans are guilty of doing this shit, like a strong Nintendo that can cater to the core gamer in the console space is somehow universe-destroying and must be derided at all costs.
N64 remakes in HD? Why not, I don't know, sounds a little weird since ports for 3DS looks more suited/lazy.
N64 was the early days of 3D, remaking with hi-res textures, thousand more polygons... Better do a brand new game, no?
Except the Zeldas (but already up on 3DS), I don't see an N64 game that will really gain something with a home console remake. Portability is a good plus on 3DS, what N64 games will have with a Wii U remake?
Does HD ports on ps3/X360 really sells that well? Even if it does, ps2 remakes are not the same, it's a one generation port, not a 3 generatiosn remake. I can't compute this idea really
Well, since this is a speculation thread, I'll guess about power from my amateur standpoint.
Nintendo felt a sting when they released the 3DS for $249 and it didn't sell. If Nintendo was originally intending on selling the U to retail for a high price, they may be second guessing now. This could tone down any higher level specs they may have been entertaining in private.
How much does this new and exclusive streaming technology cost? That alone could be pricey. Heck, simply putting a controller with a quality LCD in every Wii U retail box will be a very noteworthy expense, compared to a typical controller.
And unlike Sony / MS, Nintendo have never been one to sell consoles for a loss. The fact that they're apparently doing so for 3DS at the moment is unintended and probably puts even more pressure on them to keep their consoles profitable out of the gate.
All that said, I think it's reasonable to expect the Wii U to be about 2x the power of the 360 for $299. I don't think they'd risk a box price of higher than $349. But I don't expect crazy power due to the tablet likely being so damn expensive and the streaming being the marketing gimmick.
Nintendo felt a sting when they released the 3DS for $249 and it didn't sell. If Nintendo was originally intending on selling the U to retail for a high price, they may be second guessing now. This could tone down any higher level specs they may have been entertaining in private.
How much does this new and exclusive streaming technology cost? That alone could be pricey. Heck, simply putting a controller with a quality LCD in every Wii U retail box will be a very noteworthy expense, compared to a typical controller.
And unlike Sony / MS, Nintendo have never been one to sell consoles for a loss. The fact that they're apparently doing so for 3DS at the moment is unintended and probably puts even more pressure on them to keep their consoles profitable out of the gate.
All that said, I think it's reasonable to expect the Wii U to be about 2x the power of the 360 for $299. I don't think they'd risk a box price of higher than $349. But I don't expect crazy power due to the tablet likely being so damn expensive and the streaming being the marketing gimmick.
N64 remakes in HD? Why not, I don't know, sounds a little weird since ports for 3DS looks more suited/lazy.
N64 was the early days of 3D, remaking with hi-res textures, thousand more polygons... Better do a brand new game, no?
Except the Zeldas (but already up on 3DS), I don't see an N64 game that will really gain something with a home console remake. Portability is a good plus on 3DS, what N64 games will have with a Wii U remake?
Does HD ports on ps3/X360 really sells that well? Even if it does, ps2 remakes are not the same, it's a one generation port, not a 3 generatiosn remake. I can't compute this idea really
Well, I was more hoping for a sequel rather than a remake.
Yeah its not like people have posted fake info on GAF before or anything...lol. But seriously, I don't think it would be an issue if we didn't already have info coming from sources that contradicts his posts. There are some discrepancies between what others have posted and what he is now posting, so it only fair to question his info.
We better describe it as a new 3D Donkey Kong then
Yeah! A reboot maybe rather than a remake then
Nope
When is the OT gonna be put up? And what is going to make it different from this thread?
Thunder Monkey
Banned
Given the tech in the early SDK's that we know of there's not much of a way it could be weaker than a 360.
I remain hesitant to believe his claims.
I remain hesitant to believe his claims.
Naked Prime
Member
while I'd have no problem believing the "slightly less than PS3/360" claim. Its kinda tuff to ignore most if not all info that has seeped out sketching out a rough idea of the initial dev kits, that the system performance in below current gen offerings. I know some RAM is faster/more efficient/better than others is it possible today to have 1GB perform noticeably worse than 512? Barring early dev kit bottlenecks with a similar if not more efficent CPU than the 360 and a more recent, powerful and feature heavier GPU; how is it possible that their is a need to scale a project back? Even IGN in their crap-tastic video managed to run titles slightly better than their console counterparts. The claims can be totally correct and I could just not have any understanding of how anything works; I'm willing to admit that. But if I had to put all the "info" side by side and say which of these doesn't belong.....under performing PS360 would be on the chopping block.
blu
Wants the largest console games publisher to avoid Nintendo's platforms.
Just entertaining the thought that Arkam's colleagues might indeed have faced the need to scale down something versus an existing 360 content, I'd say it could be something that heavily relied on Xenon's VMX128 units. That would be the scenario I touched upon earlier when BMF and me were discussing the CPU options. Back then I said nintendo needed a clock-y CPU there just to hit the single-thread FLOPs of Xenon, even though a lower clock CPU could still be times more efficient at general-purpose scenarios than Xenon.
Everything else from Arkam's post raises eyebrows, though. No matter what slow-ass memory or modest AMD GPU circa the past four years nintendo might have put in there, it would not be LESS powerful than 360's counterparts, no matter how you looked at those. More so that WiiU overall architecture is supposed to be modeled after 360's so no huge architectural discrepancies would be hampering 360-originating content ala 360->ps3 situations.
m.i.s.
Banned
No doubt they'll be taking notes and watching nervously at the Vita reception too. ie it just doesn't pay, in a commercial sense, to go for anything more powerful than they what can get away with. Particularly when the world economy is on the brink and household incomes are shrinking.
With the Wii heading for complete sales irrelevance, perhaps Nintendo are shooting for a $250 launch price and a 5 year lifespan?
Ninja Moomin
Banned
The updated version of the Garden Demo (i.e. showfloor versus the conference showreel), did in fact blow away anything seen on PS3 or 360.... with the caveat it's not a game so might not be reflective of in-game performance, of course.
It blew everything away because it looked interesting and was not a brown-greyish FPS.
I have to say what makes me skeptical about the power of the system is how many recourses are going to be needed for a good use of the controller, and how much this could impact the graphics.
Of course the rumors of 5x 360 power are stupid, since the power of the system cannot be measured in a linear way, but even if it is much more powerful than the 360, i wonder if some particular uses of the controller (like showing more of the game area via the touchscreen) will use much of the system's power and force the games to be of equal (or even less?) graphical quality with the 360 average title.
Of course the rumors of 5x 360 power are stupid, since the power of the system cannot be measured in a linear way, but even if it is much more powerful than the 360, i wonder if some particular uses of the controller (like showing more of the game area via the touchscreen) will use much of the system's power and force the games to be of equal (or even less?) graphical quality with the 360 average title.
StreetsAhead
Member
Eh, it was still rendering a second perspective on the screen in the floor version, although that did experience some wonky fps drops/lag when moving the camera.
FreeMufasa
Junior Member
That's what I thought too, same with the 3DS. But after seeing games like Revelations and DOA: Dimensions (Which are a huge step above PSP graphics), I think we'll see better than 360. That's if the system is more powerful.
Wow, that were interesting posts to read to get up to date...
I dont know what to say to that Arkam, but I'm following that threads (1 and 2) since September/October last year and cant believe his posts cos so many ppl out of thread have proven him wrong.
I believe that the WiiU will be stronger than current gen for sure.
MAYBE a bit weaker than his new brothers nextbox/PS4 (but maybe not).
I work in the marketing field and have connections to some of the developers and console makers - that said I have no information further to what was already mentioned in that thread by others. (if I will get some I will provide it here)
If ppl are knowing something, then they dont tell you all - but if asking them some "harmless" yes/no questions, you get the answers that can be seen as evidence for the truth of most of the things written here in the thread.
Hardwarewise it should be on par with the next gen and better than current systems for sure.
(Nintendo is not looking at PS360 and say "oh thats what we need to achieve" -> they have their focus on nextbox/PS4)
I came to GAF to back up that small informations that I got (cos got it from marketers -but working in right company- also) and I see that Information as true.
I dont know what to say to that Arkam, but I'm following that threads (1 and 2) since September/October last year and cant believe his posts cos so many ppl out of thread have proven him wrong.
I believe that the WiiU will be stronger than current gen for sure.
MAYBE a bit weaker than his new brothers nextbox/PS4 (but maybe not).
I work in the marketing field and have connections to some of the developers and console makers - that said I have no information further to what was already mentioned in that thread by others. (if I will get some I will provide it here)
If ppl are knowing something, then they dont tell you all - but if asking them some "harmless" yes/no questions, you get the answers that can be seen as evidence for the truth of most of the things written here in the thread.
Hardwarewise it should be on par with the next gen and better than current systems for sure.
(Nintendo is not looking at PS360 and say "oh thats what we need to achieve" -> they have their focus on nextbox/PS4)
I came to GAF to back up that small informations that I got (cos got it from marketers -but working in right company- also) and I see that Information as true.
This is directly contradicting what other reputable sources said. Unless you people got half a devkit to save costs.
Absolutely. There has been a HUGE reinvigoration of 2d platformers this gen. Hopefully everyone is as sick of it as me. Havin grown up on 3D platformers I hope it is time for their reinvigoration. It'd be great if they attempted sequel to DK64 and do as good a job as with DKCR. Seeing as DK64 was something of a Magnum opus of the genre I'm not sure they'd want to attempt it though
Cosmonaut X
Member
...other half to be shipped in dev kit revision DUCT-TP-003?
blu
Wants the largest console games publisher to avoid Nintendo's platforms.
As it was already universally agreed upon, it's all in the superconductive duck tape.
So far none of these rumors touch upon the effect the edram has on the capabilities of
this system. Unless the scaling back that Arkam referred had to do with the developers only using the edram to run their game?
I recall during early Wii development, several developers only used the 24mb of the Wii because it was set up similar to the Gamecube.
this system. Unless the scaling back that Arkam referred had to do with the developers only using the edram to run their game?
I recall during early Wii development, several developers only used the 24mb of the Wii because it was set up similar to the Gamecube.
btw why are you guys taking "arkam" seriously? Speaking of his name, port of Arkham City already has beena nnounced. How could they port that if it was less powerful than 360!? Lego City Stories screenshots also indicate graphics as good as current ps3 games...He is obviously jnot a developer. If I said I was really Zach Galifinakis would you believe me too?
Cosmonaut X
Member
Well, you look awfully like him in your avatar... drugged anyone's drinks recently?
fabricated backlash
Member
Pleased to meet you, greetings from Nasa Headquarters, we really like your movies^^
AceBandage
Banned
His own posts contradict him...
What kind of developer would only use the eDRAM?
cyberheater
PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 Xbone PS4 PS4
If WiiU did turn out to have just a little more power then PS360. Would gaffers still buy it?
FreeMufasa
Junior Member
AceBandage
Banned
Is it still the only system that will have Nintendo games in HD?
It would have to launch with the greatest launch lineup in the history of console gaming and cost no more than $200.
But really, I don't even want to consider the idea that Nintendo would do something as stupid as launch a console weaker than the 360 in 2012. Heck, even "comparable to" would be pushing it.
themadcowtipper
Smells faintly of rancid stilton.
Just like the people who ignore those that have devkits saying it has more power. Everyone has an agenda.
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