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Project Natal - controller free gaming on 360

V

VAIL

Member
doicare said:
1 year, 2 years, 10 years down the line, whenever, it doesn't matter, if this replaces traditional controllers i quit gaming, and no this isn't some 'rage rant' it's the honest truth from a personal fun point of view and more importantly from a it would be physically impossible for me to use point of view.
Click to expand...

I think there will always be a place for traditional controls, it's not as if every Wii game even uses waggle.
 
L

laserbeam

Banned
Shadow780 said:
edit: so what's the one that ships with every future 360?

They're two different stuff?
Click to expand...

A Packin was never mentioned or announced. They simply said it will work with all current 360s and any future 360 people buy it will work it.

Its there way of saying this is not another Hard drive/no hard drive problem for developers. All 360s will handle it
 
C

Chumly

Member
Can anyone explain to me how this is something other than just impressive tech??? People were fucking masturbating over this in the conference thread....for what? Pedo/rape sim potential? Everything they showed while cool wasnt anything to use for more than 10 mins. People kept going on how this destroys the Wii tech (which it does) but it doesnt offer anything for actual games. I mean I guess we might get a cool game for it by 2011-2012 (when everyones getting ready to release next-gen consoles).
 
RubxQub

RubxQub

φίλω ἐξεχέγλουτον καί ψευδολόγον οὖκ εἰπόν
Shadow780 said:
edit: so what's the one that ships with every future 360?

They're two different stuff?
Click to expand...
They never said anything about it shipping with a console.

They said: "It will work with every 360 ever made, including the past and the future."

Nothing about packing it in with the console, just that it'll work with it.
 
T

Taker666

Member
Regardless of how far off this is..it seems fairly obvious it's what the mainstream press will be talking about this E3.

The only thing Nintendo and Sony could top this with would be their own version of the same tech with better games...or holograms.
 
T

TheOddOne

Member
laserbeam said:
A Packin was never mentioned or announced. They simply said it will work with all current 360s and any future 360 people buy it will work it.
Click to expand...

Mattrick said it would be packaged with future xbox's.
 
G

GrotesqueBeauty

Banned
Hero said:
Oh GAF, you never cease to amaze me.

Natal is still a ways off, that much is clear. No release window, no price, no third party games shown off? At least a year away for any developer who wants to jump in on this. Even so, why would you try when the install base for the Natal is starting at zero and is unproven?

I admire Microsoft for trying to improve upon technology but nothing they showed made me go "wow, that really does seem like an awesome game to play with Natal." No actual games that "core" gamers want, nothing to differentiate it from what "casuals" want who probably already bought a Wii.

And the shit with Peter at the end, while a cool premise, is still years and years and years away. That kind of AI and programming will not see the light of day for a while.

So ultimately this accessory is coming in the ending part of the Xbox 360 cycle and what will it do? I sincerely doubt this will be supported well enough outside of Microsoft. In the end, Nintendo has shown time and time again that games sell consoles/accessories, not the other way around. I am remaining highly skeptical.
Click to expand...
Lol, stop ur crying Nintendo fanboy! MS pwned nintendo six ways from sunday. Natal is everything the Wii ever wishes it could be and a bag of chips and the kitchen sink +1. U fabnbois are hillareuos! U mad!

:p
 
P

Prine

Banned
Imagine playing an FPS and NOT using the D-Pad for squad orders, but your hands,

SOOOOO coool! POTENTIAL!
 
C

charsace

Member
The only thing this has in common with what Sony and Nintendo has done is that it's a motion controller. This is way more advanced. If you watch the on stage demo of breakout the camera wasn't loading up animations. Everything was dynamic. Natal also picks up on depth. When the girl moved forward playing breakout her avatar moved forward too.
 
C

charsace

Member
The only thing this has in common with what Sony and Nintendo has done is that it's a motion controller. This is way more advanced. If you watch the on stage demo of breakout the camera wasn't loading up animations. Everything was dynamic. Natal also picks up on depth. When the girl moved forward playing breakout her avatar moved forward too.
 
R

Ranger X

Member
First, I can't wait to witness how cool movement gaming will become here since it's on 360.

Secondo, I can't wait to see you all fall down from your dream when you'll face the shortcomings, the lag, the limits and the price tag.

I actually hope this will blow out so much that it would be the last nail in the coffin of movement gaming. Sooner or later, gamers will realise that what matters is:

-Precision
-Minimal effort

EXACTLY the 2 things you lose with movement gaming.

.
 
Q

quest

Not Banned from OT
I am sold on Natal very very impressive. I think MS was going to save it for tne next xbox but with the economy they are going to use Natal to try and extend this generation a few years. So many possiblities with Natal. I want fable 3 to feature next gen Milo tech for NPC interation. I want fight night 5 to support the camera that would be so much win. I just wish it was coming out this year.
 
S

Spasm

Member
UltimaPooh said:
I don't think Microsoft will have it cost 200 bucks.

Infact I think it will just be 50 dollars.
Click to expand...
They could pack it in with a +$10 tech demo, that could turn out to be the best selling game of the year!
 
A

adelante

Member
DrGAKMAN said:
"You ever wonder what the bottom of an avatar's shoe looks like?"
(Not really...)
*WAGGLES LIKE A TARD, AVATAR DOESN'T WORK RIGHT*
"This is so much more accurate than stupid waggle AMIRITE?"
(Not really...)
Click to expand...
Lol talk bout missing the point
 
S

Shiggy

Member
Prine said:
Imagine playing an FPS and NOT using the D-Pad for squad orders, but your hands,

SOOOOO coool! POTENTIAL!
Click to expand...

How do you want to walk? And the other problem is that there is no kind of pressure when pulling the trigger or hitting somebody. With the Wii Remote there was rumble but even that was not that great.
 
M

Mik2121

Member
DrGAKMAN said:
"You ever wonder what the bottom of an avatar's shoe looks like?"
(Not really...)
*WAGGLES LIKE A TARD, AVATAR DOESN'T WORK RIGHT*
"This is so much more accurate than stupid waggle AMIRITE?"
(Not really...)
Click to expand...
:lol :lol :lol :lol


zvzcxi.gif
 
G

gofreak

GAF's Bob Woodward
The breakout demo was sort of..not a very good demo for this tech. It didn't look like something that was very far ahead of eyetoy stuff. And the character on screen was obscuring the view of what you were doing a bit..

Paint Party - was so excited when they introduced this, but totally fucking WASTED the opportunity to show off per finger control which frustrated me no end. I presume this thing can do that kind of finer grained control? They should have shown that here. Was sort of funny to watch though.

The dashboard stuff - really good, really sweet, do want.

Milo - this looks like it could be genius in a mad scientist kind of way. I'm gonna be careful about the hype and promises for it (Peeeterrrr!) but I really hope this is something special. Passing 'drawings' to him and stuff looked really cool. Very curious about just how robust he is. And I really appreciate MS greenlighting this.
 
Z

Zabka

Member
Yoschi said:
i mean, it is impressive to watch but i don't want to judge any of this until they show how well it integrates into actual hardcore games like bionic commando, metal gear solids, platformers etc. And using just your hands instead of a wheel for racing games i think is going to get tiresome very fast.
Click to expand...
I don't think it's meant to integrate with any traditional games or replace the controller.
 
D

Ding

Member
I didn't see the Natal demo, so I'm going by live-blogged accounts, but I'm confused...

It sounds like the demo's main features were:

  1. Spooky AI and human-like interactivity, and...
  2. Voice recognition

The first one is the holy grail of computing, and is, of course, completely impossible to achieve on current console hardware. Come'on Peter, pull the other one. Oh, and how does motion control figure into this?

The second one is just confusing. Why would you need motion sensing to enable voice recognition in games? What? Seems like, I don't know, some sort of mic headset that you plug into your controller might work better. I wonder how much that would cost....

Can someone better explain how this Milo demo required and used the camera?

And, as I expected, I'm disappointed to see this peripheral positioned purely as a waggle enabler. Unless they work this functionality into "normal" games, this thing is gonna sink without a trace.

$200? Not a chance. If MS didn't think they could sell them for less that $100, they wouldn't even bother talking about this.

Is this thing the 3DV camera, or is it something else? The only description I read was, "flat thing, below the screen". That doesn't really sound like a camera.
 
O

OwlBoy

Neo Member
What went though my head when I saw people kicking into the air was:

1. No more Wii remotes in TVs, now it is shoes.
2. Someone is gonna pull something real fast.
 
Cygnus X-1

Cygnus X-1

Member
TheOddOne said:
:lol
Click to expand...

Boy, the point 3 is determinant. And that's why the success will be limited, if it will be a success, since NO games are now announced.

And there are more problems: now the 30+ millions 360's sold work with games that have nothing to do with this thing and all major games are not intented to use Natal. Thus, the installed base have to be built up from the ground.
Secondarily, the development of such a thing will require time (let's suppose it will be short, but it won't) and games will come out at the end of the lifecycle of the console. Would have not been better to wait until the next system?

I'm full of doubts about this technology, even if it is looking impressive. But even an explosion in a movie is impressive. Still, the movie can be a shitty one even if "good looking" effects, if no good actors are there.
 
RubxQub

RubxQub

φίλω ἐξεχέγλουτον καί ψευδολόγον οὖκ εἰπόν
stuminus3

stuminus3

Member
That Milo demo was mind boggling. If they can fit that tech into an actual game - like maybe a Fable game or something - it could be quite amazing.
 
M

mrgone

Member
I don't care at all about this new and presumably fantastic method of trading dignity for controlling a video game, but I'm very happy to see we're already getting fixed for new Robbie Drums-style video humiliation. I wasn't sure there was pez left in that particular dispenser, but here we are!
 
K

krypt0nian

Banned
Very cool Milo demo.

Awesome Nintendo slam. :lol

Way to one up the Tony Hawk demo. :lol



Still not waggling for anyone. Menu control - cool I guess.
 
D

dollartaco

Member
Facts you should know about Natal:

1) Your parents will mention that they saw it on that morning show they just love.
2) Following its release, your girlfriend will play a carnival games Natal demo at Best Buy. Based on that experience, you will purchase it.
3) Shortly after downloading your third Natal game on XBLA, you will find a new job in Austin, TX. Following the move, Natal will remain in your garage.
 
G

GitarooMan

Member
:lol at how people are expecting perfection out an early prototype

What do people think on price/release date?

I say Fall 2010 at $99.
 
S

Shockgamer

Banned
As tempted as I am to take a side here, it's pointless to choose between the Wii and the 360 because future consoles will probably have both cameras and IR/motion controllers.

Also, I'd rather wait until Sony shows their motion solution so the fanboy wars can really get going!
 
S

SecretBonusPoint

Banned
What I can't understand really is peoples impressed reactions when the actual real life current demoes are stuff easily achieveable with the current Playstation Eye. Basic outline capturing stuff with a bit of voice recognition. That stuffs available to buy right now.

Whats really captured people was that imaginary trailer full of complete fucking fabrications. When it was then linked into them live demo'ing the 3d avatar model and contorting in the worst display of tech at E3 I have ever seen, EVER, you learn the horrible horrible truth about this project.
 
S

Sadist

Member
The tech is awesome, but it will take a while. Milo was developed in only a few months?

As for now, it comes across as full body waggle. MS should have kept the tech under wraps, for now.
 
A

Azure Dream

Member
Xater said:
That Milo thing is not going to work at all. That's why it's behind closed doors. It's impossible that the character can react to whatever you throw at him.
Click to expand...

*clap*

When Peter started on the "Did you see what he did there? He saw the paper, recognized it, the camera scanned the image, he interpreted the image," my eyes just rolled. He was programmed specifically to recognize a piece of paper in the hand at that exact instant, and at the angle she held up the picture, I doubt it scanned well. It was all about it being the right "point" in the conversation for him to look for that, and even then the whole thing was probably just bluffed and they'll have problems with it looking good in the live demo. Presuming they're smart, it just glosses over that part as being good no matter what the camera sees. Developers can only predict so much, the 360 only has so much of a memory footprint, it's just not going to be as good as they're pretending it is. I'm not saying it's not impressive, but they're saying it can do things as if it does them naturally, not cued to the conversation sequence (I.E. clever development and scripting).

I like the tech, I can see where it'll be great, but that "vision" video was too full of perfect bullshit "I FOUND THE DRESS FOR YOU" sequences and everything moving perfectly despite confusing and conflicting motions (like when they waved their arms around to cheer, sure didn't show the game messing up for it), and I just don't like when they lay it on that thick.

You've got to wonder if Nintendo is pretty frustrated with this easily showing up Motion Plus, though. I wonder if Miyamoto is genuinely upset that they don't have a similar technology, since he's spoken positively of Eyetoy games in the past, and it seems like a genuine step toward some of his ideals of gaming.
 
D

Dever

Banned
Whatever this thing turns out to be, it will be totally worth it just for the inevitable Giant Bomb quick looks
 
G

gofreak

GAF's Bob Woodward
Ding said:
Is this thing the 3DV camera, or is it something else? The only description I read was, "flat thing, below the screen". That doesn't really sound like a camera.
Click to expand...

It's the 3DV, I'm nearly sure. It looked like a consumer-ised version of the '3 camera' leaked photo we saw from engadget a while back. You could see the three yokes along the bar..the infrared emitter thingy, the infrared receptor, and the camera itself.
 
Cygnus X-1

Cygnus X-1

Member
GrotesqueBeauty said:
Lol, stop ur crying Nintendo fanboy! MS pwned nintendo six ways from sunday. Natal is everything the Wii ever wishes it could be and a bag of chips and the kitchen sink +1. U fabnbois are hillareuos! U mad!

:p
Click to expand...

Oh shit. If you are that objective, just contest what he says point by point.
 
T

TheKingsCrown

Banned
GrotesqueBeauty said:
Lol, stop ur crying Nintendo fanboy! MS pwned nintendo six ways from sunday. Natal is everything the Wii ever wishes it could be and a bag of chips and the kitchen sink +1. U fabnbois are hillareuos! U mad!

:p
Click to expand...
No.

Its really not from a business standpoint. Its cool tech, but so was the Eyetoy.

Also, don't get yourself banned for calling people fanboys and stating things as facts when they are opinions.
 
RubxQub

RubxQub

φίλω ἐξεχέγλουτον καί ψευδολόγον οὖκ εἰπόν
Dever said:
Whatever this thing turns out to be, it will be totally worth it just for the inevitable Giant Bomb quick looks
Click to expand...
Wow...good freaking call :lol

I can already see Ryan and Jeff flailing about in some recut video at the end of a review or something.
 
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