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THE POWER OF BUTTERSCOTCH BOTTOMS
I thought that was obvious because the console specs were not final
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Watch_Dogs downgradeaton confirmed
- Thread starter jett
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I thought that was obvious because the console specs were not final
And more important:
-Massive always deliver in the tech side.
-They have shown tech videos.
I think Ubisoft have prepared a lot of media for Watch Dogs relaunch. First of those videos is the story trailer. Surely they will have similar content about cars, weapons, weather or hacking possibilities. Maybe they don't put attention to the b-roll gamepay because are confident enough with the trailers and it was did for a B-team too. Now they are surprised because people eyes are over b-roll quality and this situation turns people against story trailer too (that I think is awesome). So the easy path for them is to wait until next trailer appear and to not alter the PR original plan.
Jim Sterling
Member
My disagreement here is the fact that graphics are the easiest to judge before a game is out - and consequently the thing publishers hype to the Moon. It's easier to judge what a game looks like than how it feels to play before release, and I think it's perfectly fine to judge it, especially when this is all revolving around how Ubisoft is selling the game to us pre-release.
Ubisoft's track record, not to mention the industry's utterly reckless attitude toward hype and duplicitous sales tactics, is at a fairly ridiculous breaking point. I am hardly surprised people are so mad. It's hard to be shown contempt, and to be openly regarded as so stupid, time and time again without getting pissed off.
fatgamecat
Member
I'm still waiting for some low compression direct feed from gamersyde, not a trailer that apparently used upscaled footage, or badly compressed b-roll footage from gamespot.
TheHollowNight
Member
Jim in a WD thread? Can we expect a Jimquistion about this then? Or is the topic too similar to recent ones you've done.
nelsonroyale
Member
Yes. Massive aren't just another Ubi Dev. They are up there with Crytek in terms of their technical prowess in the PC space. I expect it to look close to what has been shown so far. Anything less, and yeah, backlash will obviously be justified. But I have more confiedence in these guys than the rest of UBI (minus Ancel)
Methamatics101
Member
If I'm not mistaken, the next episode of the Jimquisition will be about this.
Rip 'em a new one, Sterling!
TheHollowNight
Member
No surprises. This thread has exploded into the stratosphere!
Jim Sterling
Member
I was fairly active about ten thousand posts back.
And yeah, tomorrow's episode will touch on the ALLEGED downgrading of Watch Dogs, and focus on bullshots and vertical slices in general. Sure, I've touched on the topics before, but hey, the industry's still being rubbish about it, so a reminder's always good!
Discotheque
Banned
this can look like crysis 3 on crack and it will still be a ubisoft open world. i won't play it until i can buy it online for 15 bucks or less.
TheHollowNight
Member
Awesome, apologies for not realising you graced the thread earlier! It's pretty hard to keep track of when a squillion posts have been made in here. Looking forward to it!
What has Massive done that compares to the technical abilities of Crytek? I believe The Division will look as good as they've shown on PC, but I don't see anything Massive has worked on that makes me think "These guys are technical marvels!"
RadioactiveLobster
Member
Performance is the big one on a cross gen game.
They can't have the PC version out shining the XBO/PS4 versions all that much and in turn can't have the XBO/PS4 versions outshining the 360/PS3 versions.
If they do the players who can only get say the 360/PS3 versions may feel cheated out of something since their experience isn't as good as it is on a more powerful platform.
cyen
Member
I will wait a little more until i decide on that, the game is on my radar since the announcement, i think the downgrade is getting a little out of proportion, im not saying it looks the same as the initial reveal but it isnt looking that bad either, aside some cherry picked screenshots from the trailer.
Will wait for some reviews before getting it on PC.
Readingaid
Neo Member
I think it's safe to say this game will not meet the astronomical sales targets Ubi would have set. It's following steep trends of other games that actually had much more momentum behind them.
Dead space 3 springs to mind.
Dead space 3 springs to mind.
I'm not getting this unless one of the following two things happen.
1) it actually somehow ending up looking much better on PC or PS4 than previously expected.
2) or steam is having a major sale 6 months from now putting it under $15.
It's making me so mad to see that lady from the PR department actually lie to the consumer's face.
"Telling us that there is absolutely no downgrade at all! That the graphic has been the same since the reveal and it still look absolutely next gen! For sure... For sure."
I know you have damn job.. But how do you sleep at night and be proud of what you do.
"Telling us that there is absolutely no downgrade at all! That the graphic has been the same since the reveal and it still look absolutely next gen! For sure... For sure."
I know you have damn job.. But how do you sleep at night and be proud of what you do.
nelsonroyale
Member
Ground Control and World in Conflict...
I'd disagree with this. nvidia are still partnered with the PC version of Watch Dogs, I doubt this would be their first partnered game to not be a graphical showcase.
I'll wait for reviews as always before I make my purchase.
I'll bet you a cyber pint this sells considerably more than DS3.
Long as I hear the story/gameplay isn't complete ass I will buy it
The Incredible Muffin
Member
This makes sense
I cancelled my pre-order for no other reason but to send a message. but i'm willing to re-order as long as they pull their finger out and get the game looking great again. It'll be one of the first games in years i'll be waiting for reviews for though, if not a price drop. Because if the game turns out to be repetitive and boring to PLAY while also being a downgraded mess...then it's all irrelevant anyway. i'll be avoiding it like the plague.
I'll wait for reviews and friends to say what they think, then I'll wait for it to be in a steam sale. I'm in no particular rush as I am yet to build a new machine or have the time to play recently
IISANDERII
Member
Mods should've changed the thread title ages ago. An animated gif as confirmation?
Games get target renders, then there is a phase where actual gameplay is implemented which might lead to a certain visual downgrade. Then often in a later phase the engine gets optimized around what is needed for the game, developers find new tricks to use the hardware and add effects that might be totally cool but implemented completely diffferent from target render. Then we have a final result that may be threadworthy if it still looks like ass.
What's going on here is just NeoGAF hyperbole and arrogance.
What's going on here is just NeoGAF hyperbole and arrogance.
RadioactiveLobster
Member
I can see your point, however I am not in total agreement. Nvidia was a partner for AC IV and had several PC only effects, particularly Nvidia only effects (PhysX, TXAA, etc...) but all in all the difference between the PC version and the XBO/PS4 versions (resolution and framerate aside) is not all the big.
Nydius
Member
I suppose some people will laugh at the notion, but it was the 2012 Reveal that made me decide to abandon consoles and focus on PC again. Since we didn't know what the next gen's were going to look like at the time, it only stood to reason that the reveal was PC based (which was later made known), so I decided to spend my money on a massive new PC build rather than buy either of the "next gen" consoles.
I just finished a major upgrade (i7, GTX 770) about two weeks before that new story trailer and release date dropped. Imagine my disappointment when I watched the trailer. The gamersyde high resolution version made my disappointment even more palpable.
Like others, the biggest thing, that I noticed was just the complete and utter decimation of lighting. All of the lighting looks flat, lifeless, sterile. The shadowing in the shot under the elevated train tracks looks painted on, ditto the shadowing in the on-foot shot near the shop with the awning. The grass in that store shot isn't impressive in the least and the tree shadowing on the sidewalk doesn't look dynamic at all. The world looks bland now and the cars look more cartoonish than realistic.
Although it's been said before (and, really, what hasn't been said in 100 pages?), the "new" trailer immediately made me think of Sleeping Dogs, which, since my upgrades, looks as good as, if not better than, what was shown for Watch_Dogs. Hell, based on the story trailer and b-roll, Sleeping Dogs actually has MORE ambiance than Watch_Dogs.
Therein lies the problem: The 2012 WD reveal lit a fire under my ass to upgrade because I wanted to be able to play games with such graphical fidelity and realistic environmental ambiance. Instead, we're going to end up with a typical shoddy port that looks like Sleeping Dogs did in 2012. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure I won't regret the upgrade one bit later down the line, but I find it really depressing that the game that motivated me to upgrade is just going to be graphically average. (And judging by the free copy of AC4:Black Flag I got with the 770, probably horrendously optimized.)
Edit: I've basically gone from pre-order to "wait for sale".
I just finished a major upgrade (i7, GTX 770) about two weeks before that new story trailer and release date dropped. Imagine my disappointment when I watched the trailer. The gamersyde high resolution version made my disappointment even more palpable.
Like others, the biggest thing, that I noticed was just the complete and utter decimation of lighting. All of the lighting looks flat, lifeless, sterile. The shadowing in the shot under the elevated train tracks looks painted on, ditto the shadowing in the on-foot shot near the shop with the awning. The grass in that store shot isn't impressive in the least and the tree shadowing on the sidewalk doesn't look dynamic at all. The world looks bland now and the cars look more cartoonish than realistic.
Although it's been said before (and, really, what hasn't been said in 100 pages?), the "new" trailer immediately made me think of Sleeping Dogs, which, since my upgrades, looks as good as, if not better than, what was shown for Watch_Dogs. Hell, based on the story trailer and b-roll, Sleeping Dogs actually has MORE ambiance than Watch_Dogs.
Therein lies the problem: The 2012 WD reveal lit a fire under my ass to upgrade because I wanted to be able to play games with such graphical fidelity and realistic environmental ambiance. Instead, we're going to end up with a typical shoddy port that looks like Sleeping Dogs did in 2012. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure I won't regret the upgrade one bit later down the line, but I find it really depressing that the game that motivated me to upgrade is just going to be graphically average. (And judging by the free copy of AC4:Black Flag I got with the 770, probably horrendously optimized.)
Edit: I've basically gone from pre-order to "wait for sale".
Nuh uh, you can't make fair comparisons because the weather and location are different!
/s
plagiarize
Banned
If the weather effects we saw in last year's footage are still present and correct AND the game is still 1080p, then it will purely come down to impressions and reviews.
however, if the IQ is anything approaching as bad as that '1080p' story trailer, then, nope. I'm not going to buy it any time soon, until I have an upgraded PC that can run it with the sort of image quality and framerate I can tolerate.
I have no desire to buy any games on PS4 that are less than 1080p, and can't keep at least a stable 30 fps.
Raven77
Member
Showing a ten minute gameplay demonstration is not a "target tender"...
They showed a PC version, people assumed the ps4 etc. versions would look just as good, it very clearly doesn't, and now we are mad about it.
The real problem comes from Ubi trying to play it off like the current footage looks just as good as the initial reveal.
nelsonroyale
Member
Pretty much. Also, I want to add that I need to see a bit more of the lighting system they have going. The game looks super clean now (more AA problems and pop-in was present in 2013 footage), but the lighting system does not seem the same. There is no depth to it. Assets are probably the same as the 2012 reveal, but a ton of effects are missing. Those were things making it look 'next gen'.
People are upset and rightly so! This shitty practise of "Target Renders", in other words, "fabricated visuals to trick your customers into believing your game looks a certain way that's not representative of the final product" is pretty outrageous. EVEN MORE SO if companies have the nerve to sell those target renders as actual gameplay. This is deception at its finest!
Target Renders should be banned from previews/from the E3 stage once and for all.
OR they need to be labeled as such: "This is not real gameplay footage", "These are not the final graphics", "This is not running on target hardware" etc. Publishers should stop demoing those fake "target renders" with real console controllers, only to make it look like they are playing the game on target hardware. This is some borderline deceptive bullshit!
Do they think gamers are stupid and will never find out or be ok with it? Ubisoft deserve all the flak they get and hopefully serve as an example for other publishers, which clearly are to blame as well.
#SayNoToTargetRenders
#StopFalseAdvertisement
MutonCommander
Banned
Why would anyone think that the console versions would look just as good as a maxed out PC version? It was never going to happen.
Brofist
Member
I think the fact that the game was pushed for the longest time on the strength of the graphics is what makes it a big deal for most.
plagiarize
Banned
indeed. scenes no longer seem to have depth, and are missing huge amounts of atmosphere from what we saw before, though some of that *could* be time of day. if it's just when the sky is clear and the wind is still that the game looks like ass, I can live with that at native 1080p and locked 30 fps.
but if the environment looks that devoid of life and atmosphere all the time... the gameplay is going to have to be pretty special to make me want another open world game just a couple of months after Infamous.
Clearly this topic is about whether or not Ubisoft was dishonest about how the game looks and to what degree they were being honest. No one here is arguing the game is going to be any less fun. So I'm not sure who your comment is directed at.
They've shown PS4 footage multiple times (PS4 Feb reveal, E3 2013, September 2013 walkthrough), and while slightly downgraded over the E3 2012 on closer inspection, it still looked fantastic. And then the March 2014 trailer happened.
As someone who thought the initial reveal was ridiculously overhyped for what looked like a shitty scripted sequence, the previews have me interested in actually playing the game. The Gamespot article is a fun read.
MutonCommander
Banned
Are we sure it was actual PS4 footage?
Can Crusher
Banned
It's very ridiculous that there's even a downgrade. Why show something that you won't be able to achieve? It's stupid, and lacks respect for the fans.
The graphics at the reveal set the tone. It gave to me at least a nice blade runner feel when he fired that gun. Atmosphere was everything this game had going for it. The hacking was a very nice addition. but in the end it's yet another 3rd person action game by ubi. So you know it won't be stellar. So the graphics are important when these new graphics don't adhere to the tone and atmosphere first revealed.
plagiarize
Banned
don't forget the Aisha Tyler trailer which everyone was allowed to believe was last gen footage.
I don't see anything in that which looks particularly different to the March 2014 footage. If it's indeed NOT last gen footage (and we'll know that when we see the last gen versions) then I think Ubisoft deserve blame for allowing everyone to get an impression they knew was false.
My excitement for the game was mostly dead after the delay. It's in a shallow grave after a shitty Q&A, Ubisoft dishonesty part 12, and an obvious downgrade.
I don't think we are sure if either is the PS4 version at this point. And the creative director himself said that the game would look like the E3 2013 demo which was supposedly running on a PS4 dev kit. I'm inclined to believe him. Though the last we saw of this game before this new trailer and b-roll is the Aisha Tyler trailer...
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