Jimmyfenix
Member
Was this the reason Namco released some of their games as Namcot ?
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Nintendo full year financial results [23.2B yen loss, 3.6M Wii U/12M 3DS forecast]
- Thread starter zomgbbqftw
- Start date
Was this the reason Namco released some of their games as Namcot ?
R
Rösti
Unconfirmed Member
shinra-bansho
Member
Oh, are we still pretending Nintendo's woes aren't the result of their own inability to produce a product of sufficient value proposition to a broad market and are instead the product of a collapsing industry?
Thanks.
anotherVegan
Member
Nintendo is doooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooomed
No, it isn't. Not at all.
Yep, and if DK had come out on its original date, then Nintendo's first major game this year would've been at the end of May.
1st Course
Member
Their high dividends is the only reason why their share price still above $5. The company desperately needs a new management.
Yes, you are correct with this. Original FY2013 forecast was 100 billion yen operating profit [that's during the time when Iwata dreamed about 9 mil WiiU sales for FY13], which was in January 2014 revised to 35 bil yen operating loss, which was now confirmed to be 46.4 billion yen operating loss.
Iwata is a joke.
Manmademan
Member
It's not simply a matter of Good and Bad years and cyclical sales. Nintendo isn't GM that just needs to cut fat, restructure, and come roaring back.
Nintendo's situation is more like BlackBerry, in that there is no clear way forward to remain relevant as a major player. They're sitting on cash reserves with no plausible way to spend it. From here out its a slow bleed, barring a drastic and unexpected shift.
mohsinkhan
Member
I know nintendo has a lot of money in the bank, but this is still a significant loss to stomach. I seriously can't believe there hasn't been a major senior level change up.
DrROBschiz
Member
What do you think its like to be in his shoes right now?
Bony Manifesto
Member
He meant the hit to the fabled 'Nintendo Warchest'.
ElRenoRaven
Member
Exactly. All we ever get is Nintendo going oh yea yea we're serious about supporting and bringing on the 3rd parties yet it's all talk every gen anymore. Say what you want about both MS and Sony but they support developers and publishers. They give them tools and help to get their games released on their consoles. Nintendo does nothing. They have kept that we're fucking Nintendo and we don't need shit from you mentality and it's still biting them in the ass. Until they truly try and help and do whatever it takes to get publishers truly on board you're not going to see shit from 3rd parties minus the occasional token port or yearly sports game. Part of that is making a console that is on par with the others power wise and easy of development wise. It's really that simple.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
Well, I mean, attach rate is pretty simple to look at. Attach rate is not a function of hardware sales, but a function of hardware ownership weeks. Lots of recent owners will dilute the attach rate by raising hardware sales faster than they raise software sales. Lots of older owners will raise the attach rate by raising software sales even in the absence of new hardware sales. Like, if someone bought a Wii U last week you would not expect them to have 6-10 games already. But if someone bought a Wii U day one, and then bought a game every 3-4 months or so, having 6-10 games makes perfect sense.
So with the Wii U, what we're seeing is that since sales have been quite poor, existing owners buying new software has been the primary determinant driving the attach rate--up.
This calculation, incidentally, is in part what explained the weak attach rate of the Wii at the beginning of last generation: hardware sales just kept piling up, while software sales take time. It's also what explained the PS3's attach rate hiccup when hardware sales sped up from near-0 to much more brisk mid-generation.
KoopaTheCasual
Junior Member
Just did a quick and dirty search, and came up with some key results:
Link: http://www.usgamer.net/articles/hiroshi-yamauchi-the-iron-fist-in-the-velvet-glove
http://www.theverge.com/2013/9/19/4749264/read-this-nintendo-hiroshi-yamauchi-game-over-david-sheff
Dude had a thing for "ensuring quality" at whatever the cost.
Edit: Beaten
IncandescentPrecept
Banned
1. You will have to give me some examples of some studios here.
2. I'm just going to list PS3 games that came out last year here:
The Last of Us
Puppeteer
Guacamelee!
Rayman Legends
Dragon's Crown
Ni no Kuni: Wrath of the White Witch
Brothers: A Tale of Two Sons
Sly Cooper: Thieves in Time
Beyond: Two Souls
rain
Tales of Xilia
I'm not even going to go too much into the indies, either. Are you sure you don't want to revise what you said about variety?
3. Ok. I guess I'll have to take your word for it.
Oh, their cash pile, yes.
No the Wii u is the result of Nintendo fucking up. That isn't debatable. That doesn't mean everything is a-OK and that the market at large doesn't play a role as to why the market conditions are the way they are. That also isn't debatable. There are other gaming markets that are extremely healthy.
To the above poster:
Look at EA last generation. Now, look at them this generation. Feel free to use their financial reports. As far as variety goes, excellent titles like Rayman, ni no kuni, donkey kong, etc aren't what's driving the current market. AAA is increasingly homogenous. That is pretty easy to see.
Psycho_Mantis
Banned
Sadly it looks like some people are still living in their own little world.
DrROBschiz
Member
The timing of that announcement sure is interesting eh?
But as you said they also make hardware.
Even though I do not think is just high R&D costs that has made them lose so much money, that comparison makes no sense, they also release hardware that is not even produced by themselves, R&D costs of that are completely different from just software development.
Kageshinzo
Member
They still managed to sell you their hardware, though.
Mysterious
Banned
COD alone would have exceeded his claim.
biggersmaller
Banned
Not controversial, just hilariously lacking self awareness.
To say the uniquely refined tastes of the fans he apparently speaks for demand a quality of game so great that only Nintendo is capable of providing it is fanboyishly arrogant. To say Nintendo systems are purchased for Nintendo games? Absolutely. To say Nintendo fans love Nintendo games more than any other? Alright.
To say:
Maybe that's why 3rd party fail to be successful on Nintendo platforms, we (Nintendo fans) have too high demands on what the quality of the games should be?
Is dumb. A great many universally loved games on many Nintendo platforms weren't even made by Nintendo.
Nothing surprising with the fiscal report, we already knew that they would post a loss, that sales are down and Wii U is almost a dead platform.
They need to change strategy and come out with new products which can generate growth asap. Also 3DS is not going to do 12m this year considering the lineup and without a price cut....9m seems realistic so I expect that they will have to revise the forecast down later in the year.
They need to change strategy and come out with new products which can generate growth asap. Also 3DS is not going to do 12m this year considering the lineup and without a price cut....9m seems realistic so I expect that they will have to revise the forecast down later in the year.
DrROBschiz
Member
JB2448
Member
Sociocultural economic deflection? I mean, I guess, since this does seem like something they were saving for E3, but still, it comes off a bit conspiracy theory-esque.
Randolph Freelander
Member
Updating some graphs I've maintained out of boredom.
Just a continued trend of year-over-year declines in hardware and software for both of their core markets. They're already projecting a further decline in handheld next year, which I think will be even steeper than they've projected since the trend for the (calendar) year is already quite low, and a slight rebound in home console, which I guess we'll have to see if it will materialize. I personally don't think it will, but then, perhaps some heavy bundling/discounting with Mario Kart and Smash Brothers might help a little bit.
Just a continued trend of year-over-year declines in hardware and software for both of their core markets. They're already projecting a further decline in handheld next year, which I think will be even steeper than they've projected since the trend for the (calendar) year is already quite low, and a slight rebound in home console, which I guess we'll have to see if it will materialize. I personally don't think it will, but then, perhaps some heavy bundling/discounting with Mario Kart and Smash Brothers might help a little bit.
Mithos
Member
Defending their platform choice possibly.
All I know is myself and 3rd party offerings on Nintendo Wii U are sub-par (in terms of quality), they need to step up their game if they want me to buy them at €/$59.
Fifa 2013, sorry I meant Fifa 2012 relabeled as 2013, DROP DEAD EA, or "I'd buy that for a dollar" MAX.
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
But alot were. Doesnt mean 3rd parties cant be loved (RE4) and doesnt mean all Nintendo games are loved. (other M)
Manmademan
Member
It's most certainly debatable. From a hardware end, the ps4 and xbone are both successful, two of the most successful launches of all time- which is even more impressive considering they launched right on top of each other and share the EXACT same demographic, to say nothing of Microsoft's very high price on that unit.
This has never happened before, and you'd better believe there's some cannibalization between the two. The vast majority picked up one or the other but not both, especially when you consider that a yearly fee for Live or PS plus is essential now.
From a software end....a decline compared to when? Last year? The year before? It takes time for third parties to ramp up new generation production. Compare this year to the launch year of the ps2, ps3, or 360. Those years were software deserts. The only console that bucked this trend was the DC.
The PS4's first year is stronger than the ps2 or ps3 by a fair margin.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
Sure, they also make hardware. But we expect today's hardware and software sales (paid for by yesterday's R&D) to cover today's hardware and software R&D (which will release tomorrow and pay for tomorrow's R&D). If Nintendo is spending large amounts of money making future hardware, and they can't pay for that R&D now because their current hardware and software is doing poorly, that only increases the financial pressure on future hardware to perform.
So it's still not something where you say "Oh, it's only R&D, we can spend an unlimited amount on that". An R&D-induced loss is a very ordinary way to lose money. It means your sales aren't covering your primary operating costs.
If you have strong confidence that the Wii U is just a weird aberration and their next console is going to be a major comeback, so bleeding a ton of money now is worth it because next time around they're going to make stacks of cash, then I guess massively ramping up R&D is no problem. But if you're wrong, then the consequences are pretty grave.
RE: "Not even produced by themselves" I don't actually know what you're saying here--you mean they use external manufacturers? Of course, but the process of developing the hardware would still be classed as R&D. It's not like they tell Foxconn and IBM "Make us a console lol".
shesh Nintendo has a huge warchest
DrROBschiz
Member
Thank you for posting this
On the bright side, Daily Mail readers are now aware of the Wii U.
The landscape of any industry changes so frequently. Failing this generation does not mean they will the next or even their next console. They have the 3ds and their handhelds always sells.
I am not saying the Wii U is a runaway success but saying Nintendo is doomed and will go out of business is just ridiculous.
As I said before, every company falls no matter how powerful they were in the past. What separates companies if if they will survive it. Nintendo is not RIM in the least. Come on man.
michaelius
Banned
Yes they really are amazing at making sure that people who weren't interested in their software lineup remain not interested in it.
DrROBschiz
Member
Their next set of investments and decisions from here on out will be very interesting for sure
And they have Pokemon remakes, Smash and the 2DS still to release in Japan this year.
That's not to say they'll hit their target, but it doesn't seem too outlandish now.
TreasureHunterG
Banned
Wow, that's a huge loss.
When shareholders will break their silence and decide to move against Iwata?
When shareholders will break their silence and decide to move against Iwata?
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
Actually sequels
Mysterious
Banned
IncandescentPrecept
Banned
Are we going to compare EA's output last generation to their output this generation which is basically half a year old?
Your previous post was about variety in games. I've showed you that the variety is out there but you are now moving the goal post and talking about variety of what is driving the market..
LegendofLex
Member
Gotta admit, this was my initial reaction to that announcement, too. They'll get good software sales out of it, but it won't drive hardware sales (why would it? the last Pokemon barely did)
EDIT: Also, actually remakes
From Nintendo PR
shinra-bansho
Member
The console market isn't a-okay. But it isn't in the dire situation that people like to paint.
It's a low growth market with escalating costs. There are less titles being released as publishers consolidate towards fewer, bigger titles. Software sales as they are now are a reflection of that, but also likely a reflection of an extended cycle and reduced active userbase amongst last gen owners.
All that said, the industry isn't at any risk of a real "collapse", growth in hardware has returned in the US market on a TTM basis. Growth in software should return during the year as increases from new platforms eventually outpace declines in old, at least for the Xbox and PlayStation lines. There's been a contraction a large part of which has been cyclical.
Which doesn't really have any bearing upon why Nintendo is failing to compete, and so ultimately seems irrelevant and something of a Red Herring in discussing their performance.
Fattony12000
Member
They should release the Nintendo Entertainment System 2 in 2015. Announce at E3 2015 and launch on October 18, 2015.
Job done.
Job done.
silver.tongue
Member
DrROBschiz
Member
I kind of like the new console market now
Streamlined AAA's. Heavily inclusive Indie scene with community support. Lots of growth and exciting prospects honestly