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[superseohyun]

As far as I can see, mods don't go straight to the sales floor, they have a cool off period where they can be declined to be put on sale. I am confident Valve will be able to work out issues with mods making use of other people mods without the proper permissions (And it will likely be in the form of letting modes request something gets removed from sale, and possibly collect reparations)

Also, if there is over priced junk on the market, people are just not going to buy it.

Well apparently valve has been doing jack shit till now otherwise those 2 mods which gets taken down wont appear in their selections.

Somebody needs to do a horse armor mod and sell it.

Bethesda...
*Darth Vader Noooo.gif*

best of the world... they dont even need to make shitty DLC themselves to make money!

 

[Boss Doggie]

All these people saying "free mods". What if later games involve "Workshop-only" mods?

Also this gives the people illusion that "paid = better".

No, this isn't about modders getting compensation, this is about modders and consumers being exploited, and it's sad that there are naive people in this thread about it.

 

[The Llama]

If you think 25% cut is too low, don't worry...modders may have another avenue for revenue:



(taken from Nexus)

Wow. Hadn't even considered the implications with stuff like that.

 

[Slavik81]

From nexus mod page:

I just want to point out that I am all for capitalism, hell I am a frigging pure capitalist myself. This is not so, this idea was a spark when I was yapping with people in the Skyrim Reddit IRC. What steam is doing is not in any way capitalist, it is exploitation, it is greed, it is stupid. People will be pirated, people are charging way too much for crap, people will be illegally using 'student' or pirated versions of 3D tools which steam cannot enforce, but will profit from. Mod authors will not see a dime until steam makes 400, 300 of which they will keep, if they make 399.99 steam keeps it all, split with bethesda of course. There is no 100% confirmation of the 75/25 split but neither has there been any declaration of the split so we are left to wonder. Capitalism is good, this is just plain s**t. When they do not announce their profit % among other things clearly, then there is a problem.

Good luck though. most likely we will be ignored, mod authors will sign up because they will justify pennies on the dollar as worth it.

Far wiser men than me wrote a long long time ago
"And accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed."

And we will see it happen, and they will tell you 25% is better than 0%, but that is not so, because you are giving up 75% of yourself to the pieces of crap who did almost none of the work, just provided tools. Epic provides UE4 at 5% of total sales, that engine is far better than the CK, and they ask 15 times more just for hosting and allowing you the 'privilege' to sell your mods. I know people have said, "o not be down on people who choose to sell'', well selling at those rates is just wrong, no matter the legality. You should be ashamed to give up your work for such pittance, have some self respect at the very least.

http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mod...age=1&sort=DESC&pid=0&thread_id=2793739&pUp=1

Yeah, I'm not too hopeful for this. Bringing money into the equation changes motivations and expectations.

 

[MUnited83]

All these people saying "free mods". What if later games involve "Workshop-only" mods?

Also this gives the people illusion that "paid = better".

No, this isn't about modders getting compensation, this is about modders and consumers being exploited, and it's sad that there are naive people in this thread about it.

Erm, what about "workshop-only" mods has to do about "free mods"? Workshop still has a crapload of free mods.

 

[superseohyun]

So what happens exactly if the devs decide to push out an update and half the mods end up not working?

tough luck if the mod is already abandoned. Valve will thank your contribution though.

 

[WetTreeLeaf]

Erm, what about "workshop-only" mods has to do about "free mods"? Workshop still has a crapload of free mods.

He means in the future maybe Elderscrolls 6 will only allow Workshop mods to be compatible with the base game.

 

[GaimeGuy]

I weep for Valve and Bethesda's legal departments. This is going to come with a ton of liability issues since 75% of the revenue from mods using copywritten content will be going to Valve and Bethesda

 

[cdyhybrid]

tough luck if the mod is already abandoned. Valve will thank your contribution though.

"Valve and Bethesda are not responsible for ensuring player-created mods are fully functional with the latest game update."

Spoiler

We'll still gladly take your money for them though :')

 

[Netherscourge]

So what happens exactly if the devs decide to push out an update and half the mods end up not working?

Well, if the modders have abandoned their mods...

...buyers remorse?

I don't think Skyrim will be getting any new updates or patches from now on anyway. Not from Bethesda. They're done with it.

 

[MattPeters]

So what happens exactly if the devs decide to push out an update and half the mods end up not working?

If its after the 24 hour refund period, then you're fucked unless the modder puts out a patch to fix it.

 

[mercenar1e]

If they expand this system maybe more developers will allow modding for a share of the revenue? 25% seems a bit low for the creator though.

 

[MUnited83]

He means in the future maybe Elderscrolls 6 will only allow Workshop mods to be compatible with the base game.

Won't happen, and even if it did, free mods would still exist on the workshop, which he implied that there wouldn't be.

 

[cdyhybrid]

Won't happen

Can you tell me when Elder Scrolls 6 is coming out?

 

[chocoedd]

This is DLC on steroids. sad face.

Agreed. A paid mod to me is a third party DLC. A "mod" to me is always free and has this community emotion behind it. A DLC is nothing but a business product made by business entity.

And if some mods become DLCs, I will treat them as any DLCs: will not buy it at set price, only buy it at discounts, wait for the Steam Sale third-party GOTY versions, etc. And I also expect a certain of quality and support, so I will wait even more to buy it in order to make those bugs fixed first. Most of the time, I will not buy those, because I one of the guy who only buy Humble Bundles and Steam Sales. Most DLCs in my game list come from GOTYs and discounted ones.

If this model proved to be a good source of revenue stream for Valve and Bethesda, I can see it working on PSN and Xbox Live, because it's nothing more than DLC. They already selling first-party DLCs, why not third party DLCs ?

 

[MUnited83]

Can you tell me when Elder Scrolls 6 is coming out?

17th October 2016. 85% metacritic.

 

[Boss Doggie]

Won't happen, and even if it did, free mods would still exist on the workshop, which he implied that there wouldn't be.

There would be, but far and few and again, lack of quality control. At least if something is free you could easily unsub when it's crap or incompatible.

 

[Vincent Grayson]

Well then ... It's the end of the world!

Best case scenerio: great mods come out and everyone loves it! What will most likely happen is that it will slowly die off like Games For Windows LIVE.

You realize your best case scenario is literally just what we already had, except now we're paying extra for it?

I see absolutely no sign that this is anything but consumers being asked to pay more money for no gain on our part whatsoever, masked by a bullshit offering of "Now you'll be supporting authors!"

 

[Helznicht]

Every time I look at the title of this thread, All I read is:

Gonna be a long night.

 

[cdyhybrid]

17th October 2016. 85% metacritic.

So they're putting out something even worse than Skyrim? Goodness.

 

[FyreWulff]

What's stopping anyone from stealing someone else's work, customize it and then sell it? Who is going to verify it? Can people copyright mods too? The accusations of stolen assets and the ensuing chaos will be hilarious.

Welcome to being a game developer! People steal your shit.

As usual, it'll be dealt with takedown notices and other avenues of recourse.

And yes, you can copyright mods. Any creative work can be copyrighted.

If this model proved to be a good source of revenue stream for Valve and Bethesda, I can see it working on PSN and Xbox Live, because it's nothing more than DLC. They already selling first-party DLCs, why not third party DLCs ?

As I pointed out up thread, this has already been happening for a while. Groups would sign contracts with companies to make what amounted to official mod content and sell that content. Certain Affinity started by making maps as DLC for Halo 2 - that's a third party making content for the game. They made content again for Halo 4. The difference is that you don't know the terms of their contract, but what they did, anyone else could do since they used the same tools everyone else had.

Rock Band let anyone make custom songs for the game, and sell them via the XBL and PSN stores, for a 30%~ish cut of the profits per sale. You had to obviously secure the rights if you used another band's song, and that was on you legally to make sure everything was legit. This was after a huge custom content community already existed, and it did not end the customs community. A lot of the Rock Band Network authors were well known GH/RB1 modders. And this wasn't some small flash in the pan, there's roughly 4,000 songs you can buy for Rock Band from your Xbox right now and 2,000 of those are third-party DLC songs made via RBN.

This has been going on for a while, people are seemingly reacting to the fact that the situation is just more open and direct than before. Third parties that aren't related directly to the original publisher or developer make DLC for games already.

 

[PepsimanVsJoe]

Just to reiterate.
There is no way in hell Bethesda is going to allow Workshop-only mods for TES6 and/or Fallout 4.

Two of the most popular mods in Skyrim are CBBE(3.5 million unique downloads) & UNP (2 million unique downloads). These two mods will NEVER appear on the workshop because they're adult-only. So if Bethesda tries to kill off third-party mods, they stand to lose millions of customers. It would require a crapton of mod-dollars to make up for this completely avoidable loss.

 

[Zel3]

You know how Bethesda games usually have terrible User Interfaces on PC. Well now they get money from you for getting that UI Mod that makes their game playable on PC.

Hooray!

Thank you Valve and Bethesda!

 

[cdyhybrid]

Just to reiterate.
There is no way in hell Bethesda is going to allow Workshop-only mods for TES6 and/or Fallout 4.

Two of the most popular mods in Skyrim are CBBE(3.5 million downloads) & UNP (2 million downloads). These two mods will NEVER appear on the workshop because they're adult-only. So if Bethesda tries to kill off third-party mods, they stand to lose millions of customers. It would require a crapton of mod-dollars to make up for this completely avoidable loss.

Companies would never short-sightedly prioritize immediate profits over the long-term viability of their product, you're right.

 

[PepsimanVsJoe]

Companies would never short-sightedly prioritize immediate profits over the long-term viability of their product, you're right.

Hah.

I pray to the nine divines that Bethesda isn't that stupid.

 

[WetTreeLeaf]

You realize your best case scenario is literally just what we already had, except now we're paying extra for it?

I see absolutely no sign that this is anything but consumers being asked to pay more money for no gain on our part whatsoever, masked by a bullshit offering of "Now you'll be supporting authors!"

Cant wait to buy that Horse Armor DLC, then we would have come full circle.

 

[Vincent Grayson]

You know how Bethesda games usually have terrible User Interfaces on PC. Well now they get money from you for getting that UI Mod that makes their game playable on PC.

Hooray!

Thank you Valve and Bethesda!

I'm as against what they're doing here as the next guy, but you guys really need to just give up on the whole "Bethesda games are unplayable without mods" thing.

It isn't true now, and hasn't ever been true. You may prefer the heavily-modded version to vanilla, but the games are 100% playable, enjoyable, and IMO, utterly fantastic even before mods. Mods simply make the already great game better.

 

[baterism]

Hah.

I pray to the nine divines that Bethesda isn't that stupid.

I'll join you. But I lack faith...

This is depressing.

 

[justjim89]

17th October 2016. 85% metacritic.

It's gonna take a lot of modder cooperation to get Valenwood's walking, sentient tree cities to work properly, I suppose.

 

[FLAguy954]

What? How would this destroy modding?

If anything it's going to improve it. You're going to see a huge improvement in the quality and ambitiousness of mods for Skyrim (and hopefully Fallout 4 when that inevitably hits).

Modders who want to make free mods will still be able to do so.

This sounds eerily similar to YouTube content creators before YouTube monetization:

"It will only improve the quality of YouTube videos. If content creators want to refuse monetization and release content for free they will still be able to do so."

This is true but many YouTube content creators choose monetization or accept donations. Very rarely will you see them provide consistent content out of the kindness of their hearts like before monetization.

 

[warheat]

Q. What happens if a mod I bought breaks?
A. Sometimes one mod may modify the same files as another mod, or a particular combination of mods may cause unexpected outcomes. If you find that mod has broken or is behaving unexpectedly, it is best to post politely on the Workshop item's page and let the mod author know the details of what you are seeing.

 

[cdyhybrid]

Hah.

I pray to the nine divines that Bethesda isn't that stupid.

Them agreeing to this doesn't make me optimistic.

I'm as against what they're doing here as the next guy, but you guys really need to just give up on the whole "Bethesda games are unplayable without mods" thing.

It isn't true now, and hasn't ever been true. You may prefer the heavily-modded version to vanilla, but the games are 100% playable, enjoyable, and IMO, utterly fantastic even before mods. Mods simply make the already great game better.

I mean, if you want to ignore all the bugs, broken quests and scripts, etc., then yeah, it was perfectly playable.

 

[Krejlooc]

This thread is embarrassing.

 

[GHG]

Maybe that Unreal dude will release his enb settings now that he can get paid for it...

 

[Zel3]

Preorder the collectors edition of Elder Scrolls 6 and get a $20 mod coupon!

 

[justjim89]

Anyone try sending an email to the SKSE folks to nip this whole thing in the bud? Every significant mod uses it.

 

[Haroon]

Preorder the collectors edition of Elder Scrolls 6 and get a $20 mod coupon!

I can't wait! I am looking forward to giving away more money, and help support this great cause!

Spoiler

/s

 

[Guri]

If you are worried about mod creators, just see how much this helped Garry, from Garry's Mod. Creators deserve to be paid for their hard work. Everyone I know that has worked with games in some way agree with that.

Now, if you are worried about being exploited, just don't pay for mods you don't want to pay. There will definitely be some free mods too, because there's more chance they will be popular. Vote with your wallet. As for the 75/25% share, we don't even know how much Bethesda and Valve will keep. And what if Gamebase (Gamebyro creators) demand a part of that too?

Anyway, like I said, vote with your wallet. I know I will.

 

[superseohyun]

I'm as against what they're doing here as the next guy, but you guys really need to just give up on the whole "Bethesda games are unplayable without mods" thing.

It isn't true now, and hasn't ever been true. You may prefer the heavily-modded version to vanilla, but the games are 100% playable, enjoyable, and IMO, utterly fantastic even before mods. Mods simply make the already great game better.

i think the problem with ppl hating vanilla bethesda games is that... they are too long for their own good. They are still great games and extremely attractive during the first 10-20 hours. But the games dont end there and thats where the repetition sets in. Veils broken, all weakness starts becoming apparent. It then turns into a shitty game and left a bad taste to gamers. For most of them, thats the last impression they got from Bethesda games, not the one during the first 10-20 hours.

 

[cdyhybrid]

If you are worried about mod creators, just see how much this helped Garry, from Garry's Mod. Creators deserve to be paid for their hard work. Everyone I know that has worked with games in some way agree with that.

Now, if you are worried about being exploited, just don't pay for mods you don't want to pay. There will definitely be some free mods too, because there's more chance they will be popular. Vote with your wallet. As for the 75/25% share, we don't even know how much Bethesda and Valve will keep. And what if Gamebase (Gamebyro creators) demand a part of that too?

Anyway, like I said, vote with your wallet. I know I will.

What if the mod I don't want to pay for is Elder Scrolls 6?

 

[Drkirby]

If they expand this system maybe more developers will allow modding for a share of the revenue? 25% seems a bit low for the creator though.

Yeah, this has always been my biggest issue with community stuff, the cut for the content creator is to low. For stuff like TF2 and Dota hats, Valve is at least handling the advertisement and ensuring they work, but for these mods, the mod creators are the ones who are in charge of ensuring compatibility and the mod store page is no where near the level of advertisement compared to the the curated stores for Dota/TF2/CSGo.

For the mod workshop, something in the range of 35%-50% would make a lot more since.

 

[cdyhybrid]

Yeah, this has always been my biggest issue with community stuff, the cut for the content creator is to low. For stuff like TF2 and Dota hats, Valve is at least handling the advertisement and ensuring they work, but for these mods, the mod creators are the ones who are in charge of ensuring compatibility and the mod store page is no where near the level of advertisement compared to the the curated stores for Dota/TF2/CSGo.

For the mod workshop, something in the range of 35%-50% would make a lot more since.

It should be 75% minimum unless Valve/Bethesda/Zenimax are actually going to dedicate resources towards compatibility/general QA.

 

[reckless]

This thread is embarrassing.

Are we all supposed to be happy that something that has been free for the last couple of decades suddenly costs money?

Not to mention most of that money is going to companies that have been nickel and diming people for as much as they can.

 

[superseohyun]

If you are worried about mod creators, just see how much this helped Garry, from Garry's Mod. Creators deserve to be paid for their hard work. Everyone I know that has worked with games in some way agree with that.

Now, if you are worried about being exploited, just don't pay for mods you don't want to pay. There will definitely be some free mods too, because there's more chance they will be popular. Vote with your wallet. As for the 75/25% share, we don't even know how much Bethesda and Valve will keep. And what if Gamebase (Gamebyro creators) demand a part of that too?

Anyway, like I said, vote with your wallet. I know I will.

there really is no point to only focus on extremely successful story if you want to discuss the overall impact of this move.

Valve probably keeps 30% like they always do for host your files and provide payment platform. You get 25% for creating the stuff. Seems fair.

i really applaud valve's genius though. Third-party DLC is absolutely brilliant idea from business standpoint.

 

[Krejlooc]

Are we all supposed to be happy that something that has been free for the last couple of decades suddenly costs money?

i dont give a damn if you are happy or not. instead, i see a thread full of consumers throwing hissy fits because content creators want to be able to make money off the hundreds of hours of work they do.

the word entitled is used frequently these days, but it truly applies to this topic.

 

[Guri]

What if the mod I don't want to pay for is Elder Scrolls 6?

Well, then don't. It's your choice, after all. I'll only buy another AAA game next year, because I want to upgrade my PC first. I could play any game released this year if I wanted to, but I made a choice.

there really is no point to only focus on extremely successful story if you want to discuss the overall impact of this move.

Valve probably keeps 30% like they always do for host your files and provide payment platform. You get 25% for creating the stuff. Seems fair.

i really applaud valve's genius though. Third-party DLC is absolutely brilliant idea from business standpoint.

It is the example of a paid mod we have. Garry said that the mod wouldn't survive anymore if it didn't go to Steam when it did. So, if there are people happy with that mod now (and playing it), that's because of his choice.

 

[PepsimanVsJoe]

It should be 75% minimum unless Valve/Bethesda/Zenimax are actually going to dedicate resources towards compatibility/general QA.

That's the part that really gets to me.
Bethesda & co. aren't going to do shit.

There's no way that a modder can be reasonably expected to troubleshoot their mods with the millions of possible hardware/mod configurations floating around.

At least when the mods are free the community is more willing to help out; mentioning which mods are incompatible, doing bug reports, that sort of thing. With a paid mod, the community is going to expect the modder to do ALL of that work.

 

[TheSeks]

So what happens exactly if the devs decide to push out an update and half the mods end up not working?

People tell others not to buy it, surely. And Valve will delist it automatically.

 

[The Llama]

i dont give a damn if you are happy or not. instead, i see a thread full of consumers throwing hissy fits because content creators want to be able to make money off the hundreds of hours of work they do.

the word entitled is used frequently these days, but it truly applies to this topic.

TIL being pro consumer is a bad thing.

 

[Zolo]

Look at it this way, Witcher 3 mods will be free.