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[tbd]

What is Retro doing now anyway? Nothing? Why were they teasing?

 

[RK128]

Despite the underwhelming Digital Event (and that itself was solid to me, announcing some very interesting 3DS games ), the rest of there E3 effort has been great so far.

The Smash Bros. Direct was great, as not only did we get information on the final wave of Amiibo for Smash, but we got confirmation that more DLC is on the way (for stages at least) and the fact we got Ryu, Lucas and Roy alongside two DLC stages the same day was amazing. Ryu is huge, as it is a major third party icon joining the roster, Lucas plays great and Roy feels different from Marth (and in my opinion, better than Marth; faster with stronger attacks).

The Nintendo World Championship was amazing as well; some surprise announcements (Earthbound: Beginnings coming to the VC the same day was great and while it was latter disappointing, Blast Ball looked good), some great gameplay matches and a great energy coming off of everything. Ending with Super Mario Maker was a great move as well, evoking Wizard memories for many.

The Digital Event was 3DS focused and when looked at that way, Nintendo did a great job presenting some solid games. While the general theme was "Re-use out engines/assets to create new tittles fast", how they did that impressed me.

Mario and Luigi: Paper Jam looks like a blast to play and I like how the Paper Mario elements are being used for the combat system. Zelda: Tri-Force Heroes looks like a natrual evolution from the Four Swords gameplay systems and mixing that in ALBW engine is a great move. Metroid Prime: Federation Forces didn't bother me as much as it did others (as it looks a LOT less offensive then Other M :l) and Next Level Games are a great developer; a lot of hope for this one . And finally learning that Yako Watch (sorry for mis-spelling ) is coming this year to 3DS in the west is awesome, as Level-5 made some fantastic games and seeing their biggest hit come state-side is fantastic.

The Wii U line-up was under-whelming and I agree with that....but I understand the reality of the situation and to not retread discussing this again, I appreciate that Nintendo is supporting the Wii U as much as it is compared to Sony did for the Vita. Besides, hearing that SMTxFE is coming stateside is great news .

And lastly, the Treehouse Live events are great. Seeing the Wii U and 3DS line up in action was fantastic and learning more about SMTxFE was great (as I love how its a mish-mash of Persona and FE ).

Overall, they did a strong job this E3 and I look forward to seeing what they do for future directs.

 

[Azure J]

it's not like there are other directs happening this year, nope.

Even if there are other directs, I'm actually genuinely of the belief that we're not getting many more surprises for the Wii U at this point. Nintendo wants off this ride and once they've finished providing what they're contractually obligated to, I wouldn't be surprised to see them move on. It's been a good ride.

 

[gate stormer]

I was hoping more would be shown by Nintendo at E3, however it is about what I expected.

As Reggie stated, the theme for Nintendo this E3 is transformation. For 3rd party support even on the NX, Nintendo has to show it's easy to develop for and powerful enough. Even then I'm sure a lot of the 3rd party support won't be there unless the installed user base is.

At least WB was willing to take a gamble on the Wii U in support in it's early days. Probably one of the biggest 3rd party supporters of Wii U.

It will be interesting to see what kind of power is under the hood for the NX. All signs seem to indicate it being a crossover/hybrid console/portable hybrid.

I really love the Wii U and think it's a fantastic system for what it is.

 

[vagabondarts]

Treehouse Live is amazing. You get a clear idea of what each game is like, with explanations on what is happening and commentary from the developers sometimes as well.
SMTxFE went from being the biggest "WTF is this" in the direct to "omg I need to play this" during treehouse live. Same for several other games on there as well.

Fast Racing Neo is going to be freaking incredible.

 

[jeremy1456]

People say they changed their mind on Metroid because of the Treehouse but I just don't see it. Everything about it looks bland. From the logo to the character designs down to the gameplay.

I like how you list logo first, character designs second, and gameplay last.

You are a part of the problem.

 

[Plasma]

Surely they had to know how underwhelming the thing was before they put it out.

 

[KingBroly]

Maybe they should've just saved everything for Treehouse Live to keep people enticed to stay tuned in over the course of 3-days, but I can't imagine stuff like Amiibo Festival and Federation Force faring any better under any circumstances, because those are not what people wanted out of those franchises, especially with another Animal Crossing spin-off coming out in a little over a month.

 

[hydragonwarrior]

What is Retro doing now anyway? Nothing? Why were they teasing?

Maybe you can use shovels as bats in Blast Ball.

 

[Hiltz]

That's an interesting thing to think about.

Many other companies blow their entire wad in one show, E3. Nintendo has directs every few months that just make E3 kinda irrelevant to them. Add the fact that they're streaming for a solid week during E3 and the event itself just loses it's impact.

I think of the NWC, Directs, the Event, and Treehouse stream as one overall Nintendo show. The Event was the worst part, but as a whole the show itself is pretty damn great. Especially since they're showing playable games due out this year, rather than pre-alpha trailers for game that won't release until 2017-2018.

You make a good point there.

 

[Interceptor]

Despite the underwhelming Digital Event (and that itself was solid to me, announcing some very interesting 3DS games ), the rest of there E3 effort has been great so far.

The Smash Bros. Direct was great, as not only did we get information on the final wave of Amiibo for Smash, but we got confirmation that more DLC is on the way (for stages at least) and the fact we got Ryu, Lucas and Roy alongside two DLC stages the same day was amazing. Ryu is huge, as it is a major third party icon joining the roster, Lucas plays great and Roy feels different from Marth (and in my opinion, better than Marth; faster with stronger attacks).

The Nintendo World Championship was amazing as well; some surprise announcements (Earthbound: Beginnings coming to the VC the same day was great and while it was latter disappointing, Blast Ball looked good), some great gameplay matches and a great energy coming off of everything. Ending with Super Mario Maker was a great move as well, evoking Wizard memories for many.

The Digital Event was 3DS focused and when looked at that way, Nintendo did a great job presenting some solid games. While the general theme was "Re-use out engines/assets to create new tittles fast", how they did that impressed me.

Mario and Luigi: Paper Jam looks like a blast to play and I like how the Paper Mario elements are being used for the combat system. Zelda: Tri-Force Heroes looks like a natrual evolution from the Four Swords gameplay systems and mixing that in ALBW engine is a great move. Metroid Prime: Federation Forces didn't bother me as much as it did others (as it looks a LOT less offensive then Other M :l) and Next Level Games are a great developer; a lot of hope for this one . And finally learning that Yako Watch (sorry for mis-spelling ) is coming this year to 3DS in the west is awesome, as Level-5 made some fantastic games and seeing their biggest hit come state-side is fantastic.

The Wii U line-up was under-whelming and I agree with that....but I understand the reality of the situation and to not retread discussing this again, I appreciate that Nintendo is supporting the Wii U as much as it is compared to Sony did for the Vita. Besides, hearing that SMTxFE is coming stateside is great news .

And lastly, the Treehouse Live events are great. Seeing the Wii U and 3DS line up in action was fantastic and learning more about SMTxFE was great (as I love how its a mish-mash of Persona and FE ).

Overall, they did a strong job this E3 and I look forward to seeing what they do for future directs.

Good post.

 

[Malus]

I like how you list logo first, character designs second, and gameplay last.

You are a part of the problem.

Are you serious lol? You're seriously pointing out the order in which I listed my complaints? That's a new one.

 

[BassForever]

The problem is that for a good chunk of people the digital event is the ONLY thing they're going to see. Nintendo fans will watch all the directs, the NWC, the Treehouse live segments, but they already have that audience. The Digital Event is where Nintendo should be getting fence sitters to make the leap and promising exciting stuff that gets people talking about all the good upcoming content Nintendo has.

I want Nintendo to keep doing the bi-monthly directs, but those are where stuff like Metroid Prime Federation Force and Animal Crossing amiibo party should be shown off on while the digital event should be saved for the big boys like Star Fox Zero or Super Mario Maker.

 

[Doorman]

Well, that's the thing isn't it? How does Nintendo fix that situation. You need big changes to fix that, and I don't know if they can, or are even trying to do so.

The question may not be so much "how does Nintendo fix that situation" as "Is it even possible for NIntendo to fix that situation, regardless of what they actually do?" Honestly at this point, I think they've lost any major third party support from the West even if they were to release a competitively-powered console. Getting them back on board would require Nintendo to completely change their own internal philosophy to match those interests, and once that happens the only thing that keeps Nintendo relevant and set apart in the industry evaporates. They can stay unique and irrelevant, or assimilate and become irrelevant. Tempting options.

Treehouse demonstrates, even in an anemic year like this, that the strength of Nintendo's stuff is actually playing it. It just seems like a lot of people would have learned something from last year's Treehouse and Nintendo's evenly spaced information drops via focused directs. But the cycle of pinning everything on a single moment at E3, then being furious when it can't deliver, continues.

However, that said, I do think the single biggest offender from the digital event was Animal Crossing; not even the Metroid business. People like to say Nintendo doesn't listen to fans or know what they want, and I think that's mostly an exaggeration. But the long-awaited return of Animal Crossing to a console being a Mario Party device to sell Amiibo... in hindsight that may have been the tipping point.

I'll say the same thing of AC Festival as I do with people talking about the lack of a "proper" Metroid in light of Federation Force: Taking a look at the working records of the development groups responsible for those franchises...who exactly are we expecting to make these full-fledged sequels? The heads that designed City Folk have spent the last couple of years on Splatoon, and we see now that the rest has been working on not one but two simultaneous spinoff titles to keep both of their systems supported. Where are they magically pulling resources from to make a fully-fledged AC? I was shocked to even learn that Amiibo Festival exists. It may be disappointing compared to expectations, yes, but it's understandable given their current climate, and so long as there's an understandable amount of reasoning behind it, I can't be that bent out of shape.

 

[Jack Scofield]

Fast forward to spring 2017.

"We apologize for the lack of software for the NX platform. We will do better in the future and work harder to make sure there is a sufficient amount of games available."

Strangely accurate.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=100006922&postcount=39

 

[Malus]

Strangely accurate.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=100006922&postcount=39

So long as Nintendo doesn't have 3rd party support there'll be big droughts. I knew that when I bought the Wii U, so I bought another console to fill in the gaps.

 

[MicH]

Strangely accurate.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=100006922&postcount=39

Absolutely embarrassing

 

[Mato]

I wasn't particularly disappointed with the conference - I knew they would downplay it. But the lack of spectacle from their overall E3 presence -bar the NWC- has made me see Nintendo in a new way: an old, lonely miser.

 

[Sandfox]

Strangely accurate.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=100006922&postcount=39

I've never really liked that quote chain because Iwata even apologizes for the typical post launch drought.

 

[Malus]

I wasn't particularly disappointed with the conference - I knew they would downplay it. But the lack of spectacle from their overall E3 presence -bar the NWC- has made me see Nintendo in a new way: an old, lonely miser.

I don't see why you would bar the NWC. That's a ton of fanfare right there.

 

[keisuke999]

Nintendo needs to take a loooooong look at Sony's Press Conference this year.

Sony gave fans almost EVERYTHING they asked for. (TLG, Shenmue, FF7, etc) and looks how it went. Everyone lost their shit, emptying their wallets for Shenmue kickstarter (Not Sony, but also look at the Bloodstained kickstarter)

Nintendo seriously needs to get their shit together. We've all been asking for the same games every year. 2D Metroid or Metroid Prime, real Mario RPG, F-Zero, and so on.

If they want us to buy their games, they need to make games that we actually want.

I mean, they are making some awesome games (Yoshi, Mario Maker, New Zelda) but these are so few and far between.

I guess this might sound like I'm some whiny consumer, but at the end of the day they make games for us to buy to make profit.

 

[Kucan]

Starting from the mini-Direct all the way to tomorrow, Nintendo's output has been awesome.

Sadly, most people only watch "The Event" and if it's not there, then it's not happening, somehow. Then when people find out more info they're all "Why wasn't this at E3?" when in fact, it was at E3 the entire time.

This Direct felt a lot like it was relying on everything else too much, when a lot of people are watching this and only this, then a lot of Nintendo's upcoming content is gone in the eyes of most. The mini-directs really damaged the main Direct.

The main event therefore either needs to cut down on the interviews, which is great for Treehouse and Youtube in order to fit more game info in and/or make the event longer, much longer, just to ensure that most of what Nintendo's got is being broadcast to the world.

Based on past events, I think what would work best is; Hype-building event (NWC/Smash) > Info-Dispersal event (The direct, less interviews, more info about the games!") > Demo/Interview Event (The Treehouse, of course)

 

[Mato]

I don't see why you would bar the NWC. That's a ton of fanfare right there.

Because of what followed, the aftertaste.

 

[KingBroly]

Nintendo needs to take a loooooong look at Sony's Press Conference this year.

Sony gave fans almost EVERYTHING they asked for. (TLG, Shenmue, FF7, etc) and looks how it went. Everyone lost their shit, emptying their wallets for Shenmue kickstarter (Not Sony, but also look at the Bloodstained kickstarter)

Nintendo seriously needs to get their shit together. We've all been asking for the same games every year. 2D Metroid or Metroid Prime, real Mario RPG, F-Zero, and so on.

If they want us to buy their games, they need to make games that we actually want.

I mean, they are making some awesome games (Yoshi, Mario Maker, New Zelda) but these are so few and far between.

I guess this might sound like I'm some whiny consumer, but at the end of the day they make games for us to buy to make profit.

The problem with Sony's press conference of giving fans what they want is that you can't give them everything they want, not forever. You'll run out of things to give them at some point.

 

[Louis Cyphre]

Option 1 is nice but striking gold really is a right place right time kind of deal and I just can't see it happening in the short term. The casual gamer has done motion control and is now a thing of the past. Like you said, virtual reality is the next step and with what the other companies are doing it's kind of redundant at this point, and definitely way too expensive for them to invest in their current situation. The only other gimmick is the joint system that people keep speculating about but Nintendo have denied this being the case and again, the casual market isn't interested in dedicated handhelds when the phone in their pocket can produce satisfactory visuals and gameplay.

That leaves only option 2 which is safe but a dead end. If the status quo is what they're aiming for then they shouldn't really be ditching the Wii U. Things aren't necessarily going to get better, and unfortunately for them, their treatment of the Wii U isn't exactly going to entice people to invest in a status quo console. My only other thoughts are that they're really going to push their characters in a Disney type of way and go all out with Universal, movies, tv shows, amiibos and games, becoming a kind of whole entertainment suite rather than game focused. Sure, the games will be the back bone and presumably where theses characters will originate from, but the focus of franchises will be shared between all these mediums, rather than just one entity. Curious times for sure.

Never thought about that option, quite interesting and you could be right.

I find this explanation interesting. And quite fitting to everything that happened. They tried to steer the discussion with focus on 2015, sacrificing Zelda in the process (Miyamoto already confirmed that they had a lot of things to show from Zelda U) to make it more "real". And thus they wouldn't have to explain the lack of other games that are already in development for NX now. Their bad luck is that it backfired completely. Helped also by the great smoke and mirrors show from Sony, but that wasn't critical. What is critical is that we reached the peak in the Wii U's life, the time in a console life where you expect some of the "core" franchises (Metroid, F-Zero, Animal Crossing etc) to make an appearance. Funny enough this expectation was also fueled by Nintendo itself through the MK8 DLC and amiibo. When two of them were there through spin-offs and others where totally absent it all went down the drain.

Ironically, if they would have shown Zelda U, the backfire would have been limited in my opinion.

On top of that, for an Event focusing on 2015 and early 2016 games, some of the best upcoming games were ignored in favor of the spin-offs.

When you don't have F-Zero or anything similar in the show, to ignore a great looking game like FAST Racing Neo is a crime.

I honestly think Zelda is being shoehorned for the next system now. The delay and not to show anything new is odd. Then when you add the Starfox game that looks rather rushed by Nintendo's standards it appears Nintendo blew it's load at last year's E3 Direct event of what's to come for the Wii-U. Apparently they don't have much on the showroom floor either.

 

[keisuke999]

The problem with Sony's press conference of giving fans what they want is that you can't give them everything they want, not forever. You'll run out of things to give them at some point.

This is completely true. The gas runs out eventually. But its a good way to build excitement

 

[Garuroh]

I don't care if the Treehouse event is good. People want a new Metroid, a new F-Zero, new Mother, etc. not gimmicky Zelda games or Amiibo Party.

 

[Malus]

Because of what followed, the aftertaste.

Maybe next year they'll finish with a tournament like they did in 2014 lol.

 

[evilromero]

Finally got to watch the event from start to finish and I LOVED the muppet angle. A perfect match for Nintendo. Hope they bring those back.

Looking at the reactions to this as a person who didn't watch the event but was witness to the discussion, it was way way overblown. I thought it was a cool event with some thoughtful effort put into the story behind each game. Star Fox, Yoshi and Mario Maker look great and I'm hoping that Amiibo Party will be the Mario Party that's been missing. The new Paper Mario also looks very cool so there's plenty to be happy with including the stuff like Fatal Frame and Xenoblade.

As for Metroid, it does look very bad visually but watching the Treehouse footage, I'm legitimately excited now. I like the idea of expanding the universe a bit. It's unfortunate we forgot how awesome Sunday was with the Smash reveals, the Mario Maker awesomeness, the Earthbound Beginnings. Personally I'm totally fine with what's coming for the Wii U and even the 3DS, though I don't find myself as drawn to handhelds lately. With that said, it's kind of a shame that an executive has to acknowledge fanboy rage.

 

[Interceptor]

Nintendo needs to take a loooooong look at Sony's Press Conference this year.

Sony gave fans almost EVERYTHING they asked for. (TLG, Shenmue, FF7, etc) and looks how it went. Everyone lost their shit, emptying their wallets for Shenmue kickstarter (Not Sony, but also look at the Bloodstained kickstarter)

Nintendo seriously needs to get their shit together. We've all been asking for the same games every year. 2D Metroid or Metroid Prime, real Mario RPG, F-Zero, and so on.

If they want us to buy their games, they need to make games that we actually want.

I mean, they are making some awesome games (Yoshi, Mario Maker, New Zelda) but these are so few and far between.

I guess this might sound like I'm some whiny consumer, but at the end of the day they make games for us to buy to make profit.

Sony pulled a cheap one time trick and gave people 3 names with nothing behind. Unfotunately that´s all what E3 is about. Nintendo should ditch their conference/digital event alltogether and just focus on the tournament and the treehouse streams. Concentrate on fanservice and avoid contact to this toxic "gamer culture" wherever possible. Don´t believe half of the outrage i see online. Lot´s of trolls having a field day.

 

[DICKS AHOY]

Bowser's Inside Story sold more than every Paper Mario game combined.

Not sure why people think Paper Mario "deserves" a game more.

Paper Mario The Thousand Year Door is a better game than every Mario & Luigi game combined.

It balances out.

 

[timetokill]

Nintendo needs to take a loooooong look at Sony's Press Conference this year.

Sony gave fans almost EVERYTHING they asked for. (TLG, Shenmue, FF7, etc) and looks how it went. Everyone lost their shit, emptying their wallets for Shenmue kickstarter (Not Sony, but also look at the Bloodstained kickstarter)

Nintendo seriously needs to get their shit together. We've all been asking for the same games every year. 2D Metroid or Metroid Prime, real Mario RPG, F-Zero, and so on.

If they want us to buy their games, they need to make games that we actually want.

I mean, they are making some awesome games (Yoshi, Mario Maker, New Zelda) but these are so few and far between.

I guess this might sound like I'm some whiny consumer, but at the end of the day they make games for us to buy to make profit.

Yup. Nintendo could have easily remedied this.

- Show a high quality render of Samus, then a logo for "Metroid Prime 4." Don't give a date, because who gives a shit. It's Metroid Prime 4!

- Put up a kickstarter for Skies of Arcadia 2 and ask fans to "prove" their dedication before you'll fund it.

- Make a quick 3D flyover of Onett. "Earthbound." Quick shot of a baseball bat. "Remake." Give no date or any shot of gameplay.

E3 is all about hype, not reality. Sony's technique of overpromising and underdelivering works for them because people quickly forget the underdelivered parts when you keep overpromising the next thing.

 

[Plinko]

Yup. Nintendo could have easily remedied this.

- Show a high quality render of Samus, then a logo for "Metroid Prime 4." Don't give a date, because who gives a shit. It's Metroid Prime 4!

- Put up a kickstarter for Skies of Arcadia 2 and ask fans to "prove" their dedication before you'll fund it.

- Make a quick 3D flyover of Onett. "Earthbound." Quick shot of a baseball bat. "Remake." Give no date or any shot of gameplay.

E3 is all about hype, not reality. Sony's technique of overpromising and underdelivering works for them because people quickly forget the underdelivered parts when you keep overpromising the next thing.

I get that you're being facetious, but if they did exactly what you wrote, there's one MAJOR benefit:

Fans would actually feel like Nintendo knows what they want.

Nobody left that Digital Event feeling that way.

 

[victreeb3l]

Nintendo needs to take a loooooong look at Sony's Press Conference this year.

Sony gave fans almost EVERYTHING they asked for. (TLG, Shenmue, FF7, etc) and looks how it went. Everyone lost their shit, emptying their wallets for Shenmue kickstarter (Not Sony, but also look at the Bloodstained kickstarter)

Nintendo seriously needs to get their shit together. We've all been asking for the same games every year. 2D Metroid or Metroid Prime, real Mario RPG, F-Zero, and so on.

If they want us to buy their games, they need to make games that we actually want.

I mean, they are making some awesome games (Yoshi, Mario Maker, New Zelda) but these are so few and far between.

I guess this might sound like I'm some whiny consumer, but at the end of the day they make games for us to buy to make profit.

Do you really think you'll get your hands on FF7 or Shenmue 3 within the next 2 years? I wouldnt be surprised if The last Guardian also gets delayed, again. TLG wasn't exactly a brand new game since we knew about it years ago.

Yup. Nintendo could have easily remedied this.

- Show a high quality render of Samus, then a logo for "Metroid Prime 4." Don't give a date, because who gives a shit. It's Metroid Prime 4!

- Put up a kickstarter for Skies of Arcadia 2 and ask fans to "prove" their dedication before you'll fund it.

- Make a quick 3D flyover of Onett. "Earthbound." Quick shot of a baseball bat. "Remake." Give no date or any shot of gameplay.

E3 is all about hype, not reality. Sony's technique of overpromising and underdelivering works for them because people quickly forget the underdelivered parts when you keep overpromising the next thing.

They should put up a Kickstarter for Mother 3. I bet Shenmue was already in the process of being developed. The Kickstarter was just a fantastic marketing ploy.

They did a smart thing by ditching the entire E3 hype train bullshit. Just cause a bunch of whiny fans had unrealistic expectations doesnt mean they should change their gameplan around for E3.

 

[Joeshabadoo]

Nope lol. Still annoyed that Next Level is working on that Federation thing

Next Level is most certainly working on something else as well. MP Federation whatever is a little side project by a B team

 

[MatrixMan.EXE]

Sony pulled a cheap one time trick and gave people 3 names with nothing behind. Unfotunately that´s all what E3 is about. Nintendo should ditch their conference/digital event alltogether and just focus on the tournament and the treehouse streams. Concentrate on fanservice and avoid contact to this toxic "gamer culture" wherever possible. Don´t believe half of the outrage i see online. Lot´s of trolls having a field day.

And lots of the outrage is real, from myself included, being a Nintendo fan who is getting pretty fucking frustrated with the way they're doing business. The Last Guardian is releasing next year, so is Horizon, and I got a good look at both of those. The way Final Fantasy VII and Shenmue were introduced was no worse than the way Nintendo introduced #FE and Xenoblade back in January 2013, yes, 2013, where 2 and a half years on I still don't have either sitting on my shelf.

Sure, the hype culture surrounding E3 needs to be taken down a few notches, but at the same time, I expected more.

They did a smart thing by ditching the entire E3 hype train bullshit. Just cause a bunch of whiny fans had unrealistic expectations doesnt mean they should change their gameplan around for E3.

No one had unrealistic expectations though. The same group saying that people need to keep their expectations in check, were the same group doing damage control a few months ago in the thread where Nintendo said they'd only talk about 2015 games at E3, claiming that people were jumping the gun thinking they had fuck all to announce for Wii U. Lo and behold, they had fuck all to announce save for Mario Tennis and a F2P Amiibo party game.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

Paper Mario The Thousand Year Door is a better game than every Mario & Luigi game combined.

It balances out.

I'm sure it wishes it were.

 

[Doorman]

I get that you're being facetious, but if they did exactly what you wrote, there's one MAJOR benefit:

Fans would actually feel like Nintendo knows what they want.

Nobody left that Digital Event feeling that way.

True, and for the next week or two Nintendo fans would have that warm feel-good factor to bank on, but...honestly, Nintendo doesn't generally operate like Capcom in that sense. Outside of some little things like the Smash Bros Ballot, they don't really bill themselves as being centered around giving hardcore fans "what they want." If that'd been the case, Wii never would have existed to reinvigorate their pocketbook. Maybe we'd have an Animal Crossing U coming off the heels of New Leaf, but there would be no Splatoon. Everyone would keep clamoring for more Metroids until they start complaining instead that we're being inundated with cheap, quickly-produced Metroid games that don't match the lofty standards of Metroid 3 and that Nintendo clearly doesn't understand the "magic" of the originals anymore.

Nintendo has their own philosophy. They do things their own way generally, from everything from console construction down to game development philosophy and IP usage. If people aren't thrilled with the games they're seeing, then fine, that's understandable, but "Nintendo doesn't listen to message board requests" should not be some new revelation to just now hit people in 2015.

 

[Mato]

Maybe next year they'll finish with a tournament like they did in 2014 lol.

I can see why they chose to have the tournament precede the Direct this year. The fans would riot like a bunch of football hooligans.

 

[diaspora]

Yup. Nintendo could have easily remedied this.

- Show a high quality render of Samus, then a logo for "Metroid Prime 4." Don't give a date, because who gives a shit. It's Metroid Prime 4!

- Put up a kickstarter for Skies of Arcadia 2 and ask fans to "prove" their dedication before you'll fund it.

- Make a quick 3D flyover of Onett. "Earthbound." Quick shot of a baseball bat. "Remake." Give no date or any shot of gameplay.

E3 is all about hype, not reality. Sony's technique of overpromising and underdelivering works for them because people quickly forget the underdelivered parts when you keep overpromising the next thing.

To be frank, that would have been better.

 

[timetokill]

I get that you're being facetious, but if they did exactly what you wrote, there's one MAJOR benefit:

Fans would actually feel like Nintendo knows what they want.

Nobody left that Digital Event feeling that way.

That's a good point, and I'm not dismissing it. I'd love for all those things to actually become games, and I definitely would like Nintendo to acknowledge what their fans want more. But at the same time, I find it refreshing that they (generally) don't just show something for hype's sake. When they do, it tends to bite them in the ass (see: Zelda Wii U).

They should put up a Kickstarter for Mother 3. I bet Shenmue was already in the process of being developed. The Kickstarter was just a fantastic marketing ploy.

I don't think so. I'm sure they took some initial steps, but I'm not surprised that they used Kickstarter as a metric, as sort of slimy as that is. Shenmue doesn't exactly have a history of being a good financial investment.

To be frank, that would have been better.

As far as E3 fan reactions, yeah.

 

[DashReindeer]

Yup. Nintendo could have easily remedied this.

- Show a high quality render of Samus, then a logo for "Metroid Prime 4." Don't give a date, because who gives a shit. It's Metroid Prime 4!

- Put up a kickstarter for Skies of Arcadia 2 and ask fans to "prove" their dedication before you'll fund it.

- Make a quick 3D flyover of Onett. "Earthbound." Quick shot of a baseball bat. "Remake." Give no date or any shot of gameplay.

E3 is all about hype, not reality. Sony's technique of overpromising and underdelivering works for them because people quickly forget the underdelivered parts when you keep overpromising the next thing.

They totally did that back in 2005 when I think they had only Metroid Prime Hunters and Metroid Prime Pinball to actually show off at the show.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=69vFDd6PRpc&t=11m19s

It was effective and got across the idea that a new entry in the series was coming without having to overcommit to any details about said game. In fact, that whole thing was a lie cuz it was trying to demonstrate the power of the Wii when we now know the console wasn't capable of much more than a GameCube.

Now, I'm not saying I think Nintendo should adopt all the shadier practices of its competitors when it comes to E3. The fact that they are different than the rest of the industry is a large part why I still like them so much. However, I think you are right in your view that there are remedies that could have been taken to assure than goodwill was not lost this E3 like we have seen.

 

[TDLink]

Nintendo needs to take a loooooong look at Sony's Press Conference this year.

Sony gave fans almost EVERYTHING they asked for. (TLG, Shenmue, FF7, etc) and looks how it went. Everyone lost their shit, emptying their wallets for Shenmue kickstarter (Not Sony, but also look at the Bloodstained kickstarter)

Nintendo seriously needs to get their shit together. We've all been asking for the same games every year. 2D Metroid or Metroid Prime, real Mario RPG, F-Zero, and so on.

If they want us to buy their games, they need to make games that we actually want.

I mean, they are making some awesome games (Yoshi, Mario Maker, New Zelda) but these are so few and far between.

I guess this might sound like I'm some whiny consumer, but at the end of the day they make games for us to buy to make profit.

Yeah no. First of all, two of those 3 games weren't even Sony's but third parties. Nintendo doesn't have that luxury.

None of them have a solid release date, one of them has been in development hell for an entire console generation, another is from a company who has a game they announced a decade ago and still hasn't released, and the third wasn't even funded at the time of announcement. Yeah it's "hype" that people finally got some announcements of things they've been dying to see...but now that they have been announced what comes next? None of those games are going to be out for a couple of years at least and considering the track records here I wouldn't be surprised if it was longer for all of them. The coolest thing out of Sony's conference was none of those over-hyped games with nebulous release dates, but an actual first party title coming soon with real gameplay: Horizon Zero Dawn. That game looks fantastic. That other stuff, while cool, was nearly meaningless. You had Adam Boyes literally pull out a checklist and gloat about ticking the boxes off.

Is that all E3 is to some people? Checking some boxes? "Yay Square is making a much requested remake of a really popular game from nearly two decades ago! When is it coming out? Who knows, who cares, it's happening!" I mean seriously, what the hell is this type of mentality?

That type of E3 model isn't sustainable anyways. Okay, these are announced now...so what next year? They can't announce them again. None of them will be out by then. Will there be some gameplay to show? We can hope, but I am not sure that's even a guarantee.

Nintendo basically did do this with the Zelda reveal last year. Lo and behold it didn't show this year and now people are upset. Should they have shown it? Yeah probably, but this is what happens when something gets announced so far in advance. It leads to temporary "hype" and "praise" but "winning" E3 really means nothing in the long run. At the end of the day Nintendo did show some pretty cool stuff and nearly all of it is going to be out and playable this year. The stuff that isn't will be out before next E3.

 

[ktroopa]

Nintendo is done with the wii u, next e3 will be about ' what is ninty possibly going to unveil' que megaton hype. I doubt we will see anyone hoping for zelda on wii u, rather when can i play mario, metroid and more on NX. Im thoroughly disapointed now my wiiu pretty much was the first nintendo console that i regret buying. If the nx is underpowered which is most likely gona be the case, then rinse repeat this fuck up from nintendo.

 

[ArtHands]

Starting from the mini-Direct all the way to tomorrow, Nintendo's output has been awesome.

Sadly, most people only watch "The Event" and if it's not there, then it's not happening, somehow. Then when people find out more info they're all "Why wasn't this at E3?" when in fact, it was at E3 the entire time.

This Direct felt a lot like it was relying on everything else too much, when a lot of people are watching this and only this, then a lot of Nintendo's upcoming content is gone in the eyes of most. The mini-directs really damaged the main Direct.

The main event therefore either needs to cut down on the interviews, which is great for Treehouse and Youtube in order to fit more game info in and/or make the event longer, much longer, just to ensure that most of what Nintendo's got is being broadcast to the world.

Based on past events, I think what would work best is; Hype-building event (NWC/Smash) > Info-Dispersal event (The direct, less interviews, more info about the games!") > Demo/Interview Event (The Treehouse, of course)

We have already seen what we have been seeing in the direct though. Why are we getting a "Let’s Super Mario" instead of Devil's Third or Fatal Frame, Fast Racing Neo, Bravely Second etc?

 

[Doorman]

Nintendo is done with the wii u, next e3 will be about ' what is ninty possibly going to unveil' que megaton hype. I doubt we will see anyone hoping for zelda on wii u, rather when can i play mario, metroid and more on NX. Im thoroughly disapointed now my wiiu pretty much was the first nintendo console that i regret buying. If the nx is underpowered which is most likely gona be the case, then rinse repeat this fuck up from nintendo.

Just curious, regardless of whatever software or features it might have, why is power the one thing you cite in deciding whether the NX will be a viable system or a "fuck up"?

 

[RagnarokX]

Do you really think you'll get your hands on FF7 or Shenmue 3 within the next 2 years? I wouldnt be surprised if The last Guardian also gets delayed, again. TLG wasn't exactly a brand new game since we knew about it years ago.

TLG should be in the same boat as Star Fox. It's a game that's been requested for years that looks graphically underwhelming. TLG looked like it was still a PS3 game.

 

[Terrell]

Get a grip.

First, no, the Wii U will have outsold the Dreamcast by the end of this year, if it hasn't already.

Second, I'm not talking about Nintendo "sinking further". I'm merely pointing out that they've made the same or similar mistakes multiple times. We've seen this before, that's what I'm saying, and not just once. I'll be as pleased as anyone if Nintendo pulls its head out, but there's little to differentiate this transition from any other one they've flubbed.

And third, "rock bottom" could be, and certainly was, used to describe Nintendo's situation at the end of the N64 and Gamecube's lives. It's meaningless. Of course there's somewhere to go besides up. But I'm not predicting whether they'll "go up" or not. I'm just quite accurately pointing out that they've historically been, and continue to be, very slow to develop and release their products.

I quite firmly have a grip on the situation, thank you.

Wii U is at 9 million consoles sold as of March 31st of this year. Dreamcast sold just above 10 million units, and Wii U is selling on average about 20K units in Japan per month, assuming that situation doesn't get worse after Splatoon hype deflates. North America is not in a much better situation regarding monthly console sales. It will have taken Wii U 5 years to reach the sales of the worst-selling major console on record, a sales low that they achieved in 2 and a half years before it was discontinued. It might pass the Dreamcast, but just barely, and in double the time.

You actually think it can get feasibly worse than barely crawling over the Dreamcast's finish line? Especially when it followed their best-selling console ever?

No, this is absolute rock bottom. They're at bedrock now, they can't dig that hole any deeper. So there is a LOT to differentiate this situation from any other that Nintendo has been in, it is legitimately the worst they've ever done and the worst they could possibly do without their console business being a zero sum game financially, if it's not already.

And getting out of it is going to require a major re-think of their business approach to the console market.

So there's a reason people are bullish. Some perhaps are more bullish than they probably should be, but there's reason to see this situation in a different light.

I love some of Nintendo's ips and design, but I have no faith in the longevity of their consoles and business strategy. That's why, I would rather they go third party, but of course fans hate that idea.

Nintendo's not exactly a big fan of that idea, either.

 

[Kevtones]

Super Mario Maker impressed me today. Pretty rad.


Starfox didn't control that well and was a huge letdown. Lovely helper at least.

 

[TDLink]

We have already seen what we have been seeing in the direct though. Why are we getting a "Let’s Super Mario" instead of Devil's Third or Fatal Frame, Fast Racing Neo, Bravely Second etc?

Way too much importance is being placed on this less than one hour event. Nintendo is doing more than just this and people aren't considering that. They have a mini-drect a week prior which had Bravely default in it. In the week leading up to the event they had a long in-depth Devil's Third overview video. They had a Smash Direct on Sunday, and the NWC in which they announced a couple of new things. Then they had the event. And then following the even they had in-depth demos on everything in the lineup, including Fast Racing NEO on the Treehouse.

Yeah, maybe they could have jammed it all into that one hour event video but honestly it doesn't matter. Ok, people aren't at maximum "hype" from seeing it in one "conference" so that means Nintendo "loses" E3 or whatever. Who cares? The lineup is fine and people aren't considering the fact that Nintendo has spread this shit out this year. It's like the actual games don't matter to people anymore, just the way they are presented.