Worse actually, since Bungie was taking away quite a bit of money away from Marty. The inital money from the unpaid vacation, and now the value of the stock he got back.
At least Brady still gets paid even if he was suspended.
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Ex-Bungie composer Marty ODonnell wins legal fight (document in the OP)
- Thread starter Steverulez
- Start date
Worse actually, since Bungie was taking away quite a bit of money away from Marty. The inital money from the unpaid vacation, and now the value of the stock he got back.
At least Brady still gets paid even if he was suspended.
Sola Scriptura
Member
Can't a guy dream? Don't spoil my fun.
Marty actually comes out of this looking like a passionate artist. Bungie/Activision come out of this looking like money-grubbing shitbags.
Sola Scriptura
Member
Bungie board meeting:
P1: "So guys, we need to find a publishing partner who can help us execute our vision. Any prospects?"
P2: "Well, there's this company that has a buttload of money and who said they would be willing to work with us."
P1: "Great! What are some of their strengths?"
P2: "Well, it appears that they like to single-handedly run franchises into the ground by milking them via yearly installments."
P1: "Sounds promising."
P2: "Oh and they prefer grinding game design that keeps players hooked so that they want to regularly buy DLC that basically makes all their previous work irrelevant, but they're willing to tolerate it because a carrot on a stick gets dangled in front of them again with the promise of grinding for new gear."
P1: "We could do that. Speaking of game design, what is their relationship with developers like?"
P2: "Says here that their contracts allow financial officers who know nothing about the games themselves, who don't care about artistic integrity, and who don't play video games with any regularity, to have ultimate creative control over the game."
P1: "Perfect! It's settled, then. Everyone in favor?"
Everyone in room: "Aye!"
P1: "Activision it is! Take that, evil Microsoft overlords!"
P1: "So guys, we need to find a publishing partner who can help us execute our vision. Any prospects?"
P2: "Well, there's this company that has a buttload of money and who said they would be willing to work with us."
P1: "Great! What are some of their strengths?"
P2: "Well, it appears that they like to single-handedly run franchises into the ground by milking them via yearly installments."
P1: "Sounds promising."
P2: "Oh and they prefer grinding game design that keeps players hooked so that they want to regularly buy DLC that basically makes all their previous work irrelevant, but they're willing to tolerate it because a carrot on a stick gets dangled in front of them again with the promise of grinding for new gear."
P1: "We could do that. Speaking of game design, what is their relationship with developers like?"
P2: "Says here that their contracts allow financial officers who know nothing about the games themselves, who don't care about artistic integrity, and who don't play video games with any regularity, to have ultimate creative control over the game."
P1: "Perfect! It's settled, then. Everyone in favor?"
Everyone in room: "Aye!"
P1: "Activision it is! Take that, evil Microsoft overlords!"
They've already done that.
Multiple times.
What does it matter who made those decisions when they're already responding to those criticisms?
I have no idea what the original vision for the game was. There are rumors.
I only know two things for certain in regards to Destiny's music.
I couldn't mute it when Destiny launched.
This.
neogaffer1
Banned
the game imploded in dev like 90 times or something. joking, but in actuality
http://www.pcgamer.com/bioshock-infinite-gold-irrational/
that game went through many phases over its 5 year development
Obliterator
Member
Yeah this part kind of surprised me, as its absolute proof of what kind of power Activision has over the franchise.
Not saying they choose everything, I'm sure Bungie makes the majority of decisions, but the fact Bungie can "veto" something as a company and say no, and Activision can just say fuck that you are doing it anyways is pretty enlightening
Whether or not Bungie is still under contract is irrelevant, really, and my point is just that it's an unrealistic expectation. Being an independent studio is all about keeping your options open. Acti sticking its fingers into Destiny's pie may have been to the game's detriment, but Bungie would have been aware when signing off on the publishing deal that Acti reserved the right to steer the ship where it sees fit.
This is the only time I've seen a majority of posters defend a right-wing ass (O'Donnell). To add on to that, it's verified now that he literally held Destiny hostage, one man holding a couple hundred million dollar game from release, or trying to.
However, I have to say, what Bungie did was wrong. They were within their rights to terminate him, but he was a company founder. He deserved his shares. Denying him that was never a winnable fight.
It's the same general theme for both developers. They went from being fan favorites who designed fun, interesting games, to soulless cogs in the corporate machine. Destiny was a game born of management. It's a game developed by the numbers rather than a product of a developer who cares about its final creation.
Bioware might even be worse because they let EA their greatest series and run it into the ground (Mass Effect). Then they took the heir-apparent to the WRPG crown (Dragon Age) and turned it into an action game idiot monstrosity. At least SWTOR tanked, unlike Destiny, and Dragon Age Inquisition shows some tiny promise that Bioware will return to some semblance of their old form. Bungie is making money hand-over-fist with the mediocre Destiny game, so it's unlikely that they'll recover.
However, I have to say, what Bungie did was wrong. They were within their rights to terminate him, but he was a company founder. He deserved his shares. Denying him that was never a winnable fight.
It's the same general theme for both developers. They went from being fan favorites who designed fun, interesting games, to soulless cogs in the corporate machine. Destiny was a game born of management. It's a game developed by the numbers rather than a product of a developer who cares about its final creation.
Bioware might even be worse because they let EA their greatest series and run it into the ground (Mass Effect). Then they took the heir-apparent to the WRPG crown (Dragon Age) and turned it into an action game idiot monstrosity. At least SWTOR tanked, unlike Destiny, and Dragon Age Inquisition shows some tiny promise that Bioware will return to some semblance of their old form. Bungie is making money hand-over-fist with the mediocre Destiny game, so it's unlikely that they'll recover.
Kor of Memory
Member
This thread is such an interesting read.
You can really tell the posts from people who just read the title and/or the OP compared to the posts from people who actually read the whole article.
Personally I think something else was at play here. To me it looks like activision overstepped their bounds, Marty turned unprofessional and bungie let him go. But something about that last bit isn't adding up. I'm willing to bet they let him go "without cause" specifically so he could file suit and come out ahead. Maybe activision was putting pressure on them or something.
It just doesn't add up. They flat out list the reason for termination in the article yet didn't list one formally for the record. Someone was doing him a favor without it looking like doing him a favor.
You can really tell the posts from people who just read the title and/or the OP compared to the posts from people who actually read the whole article.
Personally I think something else was at play here. To me it looks like activision overstepped their bounds, Marty turned unprofessional and bungie let him go. But something about that last bit isn't adding up. I'm willing to bet they let him go "without cause" specifically so he could file suit and come out ahead. Maybe activision was putting pressure on them or something.
It just doesn't add up. They flat out list the reason for termination in the article yet didn't list one formally for the record. Someone was doing him a favor without it looking like doing him a favor.
DanielJr82
Member
Good for him.
My best guess is that Activision had rights on marketing. They tried out the music with test audiences, determined the music they picked resonated with their target demographic more than Marty's, and decided to go with their own.
chronic_archaic
Member
I can't believe they took his music out of the reveal for Destiny after he worked on a whole suite of songs for it. Not to mention - I'm wondering if they'll still put the rest of the music in the sequels and stuff, or compose new music entirely. Or if Marty will ever share it if he's ballsy enough.
lol at MS treating Bungie badly. They treated Bungie so bad that they let them buy the company back and go independent.
The real issue between MS and Bungie was IP ownership. Bungie saw the deals Epic and Remedy had and thought they could make a more popular IP and stack that paper.
The real issue between MS and Bungie was IP ownership. Bungie saw the deals Epic and Remedy had and thought they could make a more popular IP and stack that paper.
Kor of Memory
Member
Thought and executed.
Obliterator
Member
Not sure if Destiny is bigger than Halo actually. Halo 3 sold well over 10 million copies. Its entirely possible Destiny has as well but we have no official numbers on that
Death Metalist
Member
Good on you, Marty! Congrats! Your soundtrack was the most memorable thing about Destiny to me.
Kor of Memory
Member
I was comparing it to epic and remedy but in wouldn't be surprised if it beat halo 3 due to multiplat alone.
The only official number we have is 3.9 million by the end of the first month.
RagingAvatar
Member
In terms of comparing Bungie pre-Activision and now in partnership with Activision, what happened to Bungie's humour?
I loved the humour in the Halo games. The little easier eggs, the silly one liners.. What happened?!
I loved the humour in the Halo games. The little easier eggs, the silly one liners.. What happened?!
Obliterator
Member
Ah i see. And yeah its possible Destiny is bigger than Halo in its prime. Just unfortunately no way to know as Activision refuses to give out the global sales for it
Krappadizzle
Member
All I say from just reading the blurb in the OP.......
Good.
Regardless of how you may feel about the Halo franchise, he's a very talented musician/composer and I'm glad to see him win this.
Good.
Regardless of how you may feel about the Halo franchise, he's a very talented musician/composer and I'm glad to see him win this.
Nathion Fillions dialogue in The Taken King seems to be quite humourious. I think they're going back towards it.
Kor of Memory
Member
It's still there?
See Nathan Fillions character or most one liners from the ghost.
Kor of Memory
Member
Also, did anyone notice the part about Marty acting as the director for the voice actors?
So now who's fuck up was it that ghost was terrible?
Dinklage's voice or Marty's direction?
So now who's fuck up was it that ghost was terrible?
Dinklage's voice or Marty's direction?
ComputerBlue
Member
That's great, and it gives me hope that they will continue to use his music throughout the series since the article says he's already written it all. It would really suck if they didn't knowing that it's there for the taking.
The only thing being held hostage here is the album he co-created, which the company currently using Bungie's logo didn't intend to distribute and instead tried to use their ownership of the work against the original artist.
Destiny would come out either way, maybe a bit sooner if he didn't have a reason to throw his hissy fits, but we'll likely never get to hear Music of the Spheres purely due to corporate fuckery.
He could be a jerk in real life, but it's a good thing that the majority is siding with a person and not a corporation.
killer rin
Member
You know, it is sad that things had to end up like this. Bungie was considered to be the best of the best developers... though it just seems like things keep on going downhill for them ever since they signed on with Activision.
Damn, I didn't know that. Super excited, Contact Harvest is near the top of my list for Halo novels.
Damn, I didn't know that. Super excited, Contact Harvest is near the top of my list for Halo novels.
Monocle
Member
Seems like that Activision deal turned out to be the worst version of what Bungie feared from Microsoft's buyout.
I could hardly believe it when I first heard Marty and Bungie were at odds. He's the John Williams to Halo's Star Wars. One of the pillars of Bungie as I knew it. I'm glad he got the stock he was entitled to.
I could hardly believe it when I first heard Marty and Bungie were at odds. He's the John Williams to Halo's Star Wars. One of the pillars of Bungie as I knew it. I'm glad he got the stock he was entitled to.
SenjutsuSage
Banned
I read this story and thank my lucky stars that Microsoft took Halo as seriously as they did and opted to build an entirely new studio to carry on the franchise. People may not agree, but 343i taking over Halo is exactly what the franchise needed.
And by the way, did anyone really see the guy that made the flintstones vitamins jingle losing a battle of any kind, be it a literal one or a court based battle? He clearly took his vitamins before filing that suit. He was prepared for the long haul.
And by the way, did anyone really see the guy that made the flintstones vitamins jingle losing a battle of any kind, be it a literal one or a court based battle? He clearly took his vitamins before filing that suit. He was prepared for the long haul.
RagingAvatar
Member
The Ghost is not funny.
And Nathan Fillion's character (love Nate) is simple lines about the present situation that state the obvious. Didn't make me laugh once during the trailers.
Kor of Memory
Member
I don't think the Ghost is funny either, but he is clearly written to be funny.
Didn't bungie sign this contract months after that IW ordeal with MW2 and Activison?
Chalupa Batman
Member
He wouldn't have gotten paid if he was suspended.
Kor of Memory
Member
Notable parts from this article that reveal info about Destiny as a project:
*This fits with the whole even year full title, odd year mega expansion schema they have going.
- Marty was the Director for the Voice Actors
- Destiny is a 5 part series*
- The Story was scrapped and reworked in August of 2013.
- All the music for Destiny is done (all 10 years worth)
*This fits with the whole even year full title, odd year mega expansion schema they have going.
The Dear Leader
Banned
That was an interesting article, I wonder what the story was like before they scrapped it, I would imagine reworking the origin story of your 5 part series a year before it comes out would make the remaining 4 games a mess. I'd love to hear the whole story about this entire situation.
Congrats to Marty for getting what was owed, good that the courts saw it in his favor.
Congrats to Marty for getting what was owed, good that the courts saw it in his favor.
No splitscreen + no big team battle in Halo 5 makes me strongly disagree with this assertion
OrlanisWorks
Banned
Combo of Marty's direction and, of course, the writers. Mostly the writers though, because they fucking sucked. Dinllage too. It's a team effort really.
Deserved the win. But I generally don't care if he deserved or not, as long as Bungie and Activision suffer in some way. /biased
I get your point on the funding and you are correct. My point is that the old saying "the grass isn't greener...." applies to this. (Though they made a lot of green out of this).
Just found it ironic that's all.
neogaffer1
Banned
Kor of Memory
Member
SenjutsuSage
Banned
And while it's impossible to know what Destiny could have been, it still strikes me as pretty obvious that the game they ended up delivering was likely not what was originally intended. I always believed that there was meant to be more of a singleplayer story experience along very similar lines to what one got in Halo, but just with more freedom to explore and go off the beaten path.
I think at some point they must have seen the RPG elements and all that comes with that as such a challenge along with getting the gameplay right that they simply opted to simplify the game around those elements and chose not to explore a more epic singleplayer story.
I was never a fan of splitscreen to begin with. In fact, I don't think I've ever made use of it in a single Halo title. I always felt that trying to accommodate split-screen led to the game's ambitions having to be scaled back. I didn't feel for what they were possibly giving up to provide that experience that splitscreen ever truly filled that gap. I much rather have a more impressive looking/playing singleplayer experience where they end up trying some newer things as a result of what they've gained from no splitscreen. I think a more authentic team based experience throughout with what they are promising to be better built and larger playspaces with a number of alternate means to get to mission completion is far more exciting than splitscreen. As far as I'm concerned splitscreen has long just been yet another checklist feature that wasn't contributing in any meaningful way to the core campaign experience actually being better.
I think at some point they must have seen the RPG elements and all that comes with that as such a challenge along with getting the gameplay right that they simply opted to simplify the game around those elements and chose not to explore a more epic singleplayer story.
I was never a fan of splitscreen to begin with. In fact, I don't think I've ever made use of it in a single Halo title. I always felt that trying to accommodate split-screen led to the game's ambitions having to be scaled back. I didn't feel for what they were possibly giving up to provide that experience that splitscreen ever truly filled that gap. I much rather have a more impressive looking/playing singleplayer experience where they end up trying some newer things as a result of what they've gained from no splitscreen. I think a more authentic team based experience throughout with what they are promising to be better built and larger playspaces with a number of alternate means to get to mission completion is far more exciting than splitscreen. As far as I'm concerned splitscreen has long just been yet another checklist feature that wasn't contributing in any meaningful way to the core campaign experience actually being better.
Was.
Seth Enosh
Member
The leaks of the people who played the version with the original story (I think two separate beta testers) said it wasn't a very good game. That leak accurately described large parts of the game that weren't public knowledge and was posted on the internet before the game came out. It seems likely enough to me that the game just got such poor reviews in play testing that Activision delayed the game and told bungie to re-tool it.
The guys at penny arcade said the same thing - they had played a pre alpha version of the game and the final one was much better.
Auto-Reply
Member
I have more respect for O'Donnel now after reading this, at least his fear of loss of artistic integrity was completely justified going by the result (Detiny).