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[Negotiator]

As for Dedi's, depends how good the service is anyway. P2P can be okay if you are getting matched with local people. Dedis become pointless if they start grouping Euro's with Mericans for example.

It's all about the quality of the matchmaking.

^ This.

I don't understand the obsession with dedicated servers, especially when people don't care about technicalities (tickrate etc.)

The only good thing about dedis is that the host (aka server) will not ragequit, therefore you will never get disconnected.

How is ND going to handle p2p host ragequits? I know there's some rudimentary host migration mechanism, but it only works if the host quits gracefully (via the in-game menu).

If you pull the cord, then everyone gets disconnected.

 

[giancarlo123x]

"Looking for Host" prompts live on....

Better than MGO's "the host has left the session" and you get nothing for the match b

 

[Revven]

Not surprising considering all ND MP games have been P2P. Disappointing but not unexpected. Hopefully they will have even better netcode then for this than their other games.

 

[Marceles]

Better than MGO's "the host has left the session" and you get nothing for the match b

Sheesh that sucks, I haven't dove into MGO yet but that's awful

 

[UrbanRats]

Well my PS+ subscription should be over before the game comes out, i guess i won't be renewing it.

 

[Yaphett Kotto]

ND online games use 15 Hz tickrate (including TLOU MP on the PS4).

Holy shit why.

They better up it to at least 30hz for UC4.

Ideally, 60hz would be nice.

 

[Summer Haze]

ND online games use 15 Hz tickrate (including TLOU MP on the PS4).

Increasing it to 30 Hz minimizes the issue that you're describing. ND did it for a weekend and it was glorious. No getting shot behind cover BS.

The downside is that it requires more upload and some people have pretty shitty internet ("waaah, I paid $60 for this game, the white plug of doom is not fair!")... :|

I see. Fingers crossed, but I won't hold my breath.

@ Bolded

I'm glad I didn't play then, I would've hated having that taken away from me so much that it would probably put me off going back to it. XD

 

[Insane Metal]

Uncharted 4 sounds less and less interesting.

 

[CyberPunked]

This games multiplayer just keep on giving doesn't jt

 

[Melfice7]

I believe ND fiddled with it on TLoU PS4 and tried 30hz.... most players couldnt play because of their crappy connections

 

[Nev]

As I said, I can trade in games without caring about voucher codes -> the games don't lose that much value.

It's fine if you don't care (digital-only purchases or no trade ins), but I do. Different strokes for different folks.

You wouldn't sell Uncharted or buy it used though, and you wouldn't have to pay a fee to play online, the price of the game would be enough. I don't see how that's more evil than a paywall for P2P.

 

[diffusionx]

Good to see that PS+ money going towards... what exactly?

 

[Negotiator]

You wouldn't sell Uncharted or buy it used though, and you wouldn't have to pay a fee to play online, the price of the game would be enough. I don't see how that's more evil than a paywall for P2P.

I sold Uncharted 3. Speak for yourself.

I believe ND fiddled with it on TLoU PS4 and tried 30hz.... most players couldnt play because of their crappy connections

Yeah, that's what I said.

 

[Blackleg-sanji1]

None of their multiplayer games had it did they? Gaf gonna gaf

 

[Nev]

I sold Uncharted 3. Speak for yourself.

And apparently the lost value from the network pass didn't bother you. What was it that you lost, 5, 10€? Sounds like a fine trade compared to the 60€ of the yearly paywall pass.

 

[Negotiator]

And apparently the lost value from the network pass didn't bother you. What was it that you lost, 5, 10€? Sounds like a fine trade compared to the 60€ of the yearly paywall pass.

I've never paid €60 for PS+. Speak for yourself again.

Both of them are evil paywalls, it's just that I prefer PS+ and I explained why. Do I need to repeat myself again? Keep in mind that I had PS+ before the PS4 paywall was introduced. I pay for the monthly games, not the online functionality.

Give me some decent ping-based matchmaking + high tickrate (30Hz minimum) and I'll be a happy camper.

 

[VICI0US]

None of their multiplayer games had it did they? Gaf gonna gaf

none of their other multiplayer games required you to pay for online play.

 

[orthodoxy1095]

I believe ND fiddled with it on TLoU PS4 and tried 30hz.... most players couldnt play because of their crappy connections

Most people's connections are really that bad? I have no idea what most people run on...

 

[Negotiator]

Most people's connections are really that bad? I have no idea what most people run on...

Potato-powered sub-512 Kbps upload speeds are pretty common, especially in 3rd world countries.

Not to mention that 60% of the player pool uses WiFi (ND said so), so even if you have a fast connection, you're still prone to packet loss -> white plug of doom.

 

[FinalStageBoss]

Whatever they did the with TLoU for online worked pretty well for me. Never experienced much issue tbh.

 

[NippleViking]

This is not true. Dead Rising 3 and Killer Instinct use P2P, and many have alluded to Gears Ultimate using the hybrid system which mostly relies on P2P as well. MCC uses a similar hybrid set up afaik.

Ah. Sorry, my mistake. Totally forgot about Dead Rising and Killer Instinct (which as fighting game, basically has to be P2P).

 

[IvanJ]

Not that it will bother me because I have no intention of playing MP in this game, but the news is really disappointing, even unacceptable.

While previous games were also P2P, at least they were on a system where online was free. With paid online for multiplayer, the least Sony could have done is dedicate servers for first party games.

 

[The Baron Count]

Paying to play online does not automatically guarantee you dedicated servers. Though the fact that MS offers this certainly makes Sony look a little behind. They always have been when it comes to online stuff though. The entire reason they added a paid model is to improve the PSN infrastructure, but I don't expect that to happen right away, they have only had this model since this generation and MS have only had the dedicated server thing since this generation despite having a paid model for years and years. Chill people.

I'm pretty ignorant when it comes to Uncharted multiplayer stuff, but going off the posts in here, it seems that there hasn't historically been big issues with lag right? No reason for that to change now.

 

[Vital Tundra]

The amount of games still using P2P is gross.

Also I guarantee Melee attacks will be just as fucked as they were in 3.

 

[wachie]

Not a big deal, unless we were expecting Uncharted MP to deviate from Sony's norm.

 

[ironcreed]

Uncharted 4 sounds less and less interesting.

The microtransactions are my only concern. But yeah, I am sure the campaign will mainly be where it is at for me. I am sure they will knock that out of the park.

 

[MysteryM]

I haven't had any lag in any P2P server setup in

Be thankful. As a UK gamer, lag has been a part of gaming on consoles for me since H2 release day. I've lived in different houses, but have always paid for the best gaming broadband connection that I can.

We currently have high speed fibre, but MCC can still be up and down with lag issues. Some games I can go 20+ kills, and then the next game be seven down at the end. Its not skill, you can literally see the injustices whilst playing with people running through frags and still finishing you off when you shoot first.

Any developer who has an intention of building a modern multiplayer environment must go dedicated.

 

[Dick Justice]

Paying to play online does not automatically guarantee you dedicated servers. Though the fact that MS offers this certainly makes Sony look a little behind. They always have been when it comes to online stuff though. The entire reason they added a paid model is to improve the PSN infrastructure, but I don't expect that to happen right away, they have only had this model since this generation and MS have only had the dedicated server thing since this generation despite having a paid model for years and years. Chill people.

I'm pretty ignorant when it comes to Uncharted multiplayer stuff, but going off the posts in here, it seems that there hasn't historically been big issues with lag right? No reason for that to change now.

If people are suddenly having to pay for online now, then they should reasonably be able to expect a better experience. I'm not particuarly inclined to sympathize with the corporation that's happy to take money for a shitty, half-baked service that's arbitarily locked behind a paywall.

 

[Zombegoast]

Remember when Free to play and Dedicated Servers use to be an argument to buy a Ps3?

 

[Kssio_Aug]

Thats sad. But at least for me that's okay... Uncharted is more of a SP campaign game anyway.
Yet, after getting some awesome results out of MP games using dedicated server it's hard to go back to those who doesn't use it.


About the PS+ stuff, you should do like I did. Stop paying it! =)
I was holding it cause of "free games" until I realized I was playing none of them, and when something slightly interesting shows up I certainly can buy for less than an annual subscription. No regrets.

 

[Tagg9]

Is there an up-to-date list of which recent games have dedicated servers? Because I'm not sure I could easily tell the difference between those that do and those that do not.

 

[Freiya]

stupid, especially since you have to pay to play MP.

Seriously, what exactly am I paying for? The right to host games with my own connection? Psn sucks.

 

[The Baron Count]

If people are suddenly having to pay for online now, then they should reasonably be able to expect a better experience. I'm not particuarly inclined to sympathize with the corporation that's happy to take money for a shitty, half-baked service that's arbitarily locked behind a paywall.

Yeah, I get the frustration there certainly, from my perspective it means I simply can't play online because I already pay for XBL and can't justify PS+ at the moment.

I imagine Sony has plans to use the subscription model to expand PSN. They always have plans, but it does kind of suck has long we tend to have to wait for theses things to come to fruition. We all know how long it took them to implement things on the PS3. Hopefully they can be more on the ball this time around.

 

[Caja 117]

Man how have I not noticed this. I can't recall anytime I thought - "Man this game is laggy!"

Is possible you are most of the time getting host, your 400 hundreds hour is about crucible right? because in crucible is where you notice lag.

and Interesting note that could apply to you, in XBOX 360 the game (Halo 3, Halo Reach) recorded your bandwidth, so after a while you xbox will get marked and based on that you could always get host, or never get it. is possible that if you pulled host a lot of time at the beginning of your Destiny play-trough, now every time you play Destiny you are the host. in My case I never pull host in destiny and I get killed a lot after I hide behind a wall, or delayed sounds.

About PS+ paywall for MP, Im glad they started doing that, maintaining servers cost money, but also that revenue serve for SONY to get resources to better the PSN and overall online experience, maybe 2 or 3 years down the line You will see SONY using dedicated server on exclusives, it took Xbox live 10 years for that.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

People are saying it like paid services automatically means dedicated servers. In the gears of wars of before we had plenty of host advantage.

 

[Kssio_Aug]

People are saying it like paid services automatically means dedicated servers. In the gears of wars of before we had plenty of host advantage.

It's not about dedicated servers only. I am not in favour even of Live subscrption value, but in the case of PSN it feels that absolutely nothing justifies it. In Live they at least have a better structure (and now plenty of XB1 exclusive games are using dedis).

 

[Caja 117]

It's not about dedicated servers only. I am not in favour even of Live subscrption value, but in the case of PSN it feels that absolutely nothing justifies it. In Live they at least have a better structure (and now plenty of XB1 exclusive games are using dedis).

But it took 10 years to live to get where it is now., and you are talking a bout MS here, Software is their line of work, so this should come as second nature to MS to do.

 

[The Baron Count]

But it took 10 years to live to get where it is now.

I think it's just a bitter pill to swallow for people to pay for something that was free for years while seeing no benefit. Understandably so.

 

[TimeEffect]

This is nonsense. Flagship Sony studio. We pay for PS+. Neither the publisher or developer could find it to think dedicated servers are important enough?

Way to take the MP seriously.

Little studio Psyonix has given me dedicated servers because they understood how serious it is to make multiplayer be taken seriously This really sucks.

It's 2015, and I wish this kind of thing didn't exist for giants like Naughty Dog.

 

[Kssio_Aug]

But it took 10 years to live to get where it is now., and you are talking a bout MS here, Software is their line of work, so this should come as second nature to MS to do.

You made a point. I actually agree with you there. But still paying for PS+ feels like a steal nowadays.
Tbh, even Live does sometimes.

 

[Papacheeks]

It's not about dedicated servers only. I am not in favour even of Live subscrption value, but in the case of PSN it feels that absolutely nothing justifies it. In Live they at least have a better structure (and now plenty of XB1 exclusive games are using dedis).

If people are suddenly having to pay for online now, then they should reasonably be able to expect a better experience. I'm not particuarly inclined to sympathize with the corporation that's happy to take money for a shitty, half-baked service that's arbitarily locked behind a paywall.

PS+ which is the service you pay to play online didn't start with having online behind it. Most of the people who are members, are people who had it for PS3 for free games, cloud save backups and discounts.

There are games on PC you pay a fee for monthly that don't have dedicated servers, yet I don't hear as much bitching.
Consoles I agree need to sort their shit out in what they offer for the premium price for Online. But I mainly have PS+ for the game library and cheap discounts on games, I just bought Resident evil 2 revelations complete edition for 14.99. It was More than 24.99 in retail stores.
Same goes for Transistor and Rocket league which I got for Free, and that game is My GOTY.

You get more than just online Multiplayer. I play multiplayer mostly on my pc anyway, and not because it's free, mainly because I can host, or connect to custom servers.

If you don't like it don't pay for it. Same goes with any other service. There are MMO'S out there that have shitty server's and ask for monthy premium that's 2-3 times the amount it cost you per month for PS+. If you want it to get better I guess hold off wait.

 

[Septic360]

2016 and no dedicated servers? For a MAJOR first party title? Come on; we can all admit that this is a big misstep surely?

The power of the cloud looks less and less like something to laugh at.

 

[Freiya]

But it took 10 years to live to get where it is now., and you are talking a bout MS here, Software is their line of work, so this should come as second nature to MS to do.

What is your point? Sony is taking our money and they have the ability to hire people to get the job done. This is not 10 years ago, it's 2015 and sony need to compete now and not 5 years from now.

Was someone expecting different? The sooner you realise the paywall in consoles is a fucking joke and a scam the less dissapointed you will be. What you're paying for is a renting service for indie games, nothing more.

How can some people justify this bullshit is beyond me. And there will be million of microtransactions to boot. Ay lmao.

Tbh, Micro transactions on a p2p game sounds so damn dirty.

 

[ironcreed]

This is nonsense. Flagship Sony studio. We pay for PS+. Neither the publisher or developer could find it to think dedicated servers are important enough?

Way to take the MP seriously.

Little studio Psyonix has given me dedicated servers because they understood how serious it is to make multiplayer be taken seriously This really sucks.

It's 2015, and I wish this kind of thing didn't exist for giants like Naughty Dog.

PSN on the whole has been worse for me on PS4 than it was on PS3, when it was free. I am just not going to pay for it anymore until there is something I really want to play online. I will just buy 3 months here and there.

 

[Papacheeks]

2016 and no dedicated servers? For a MAJOR first party title? Come on; we can all admit that this is a big misstep surely?

The power of the cloud looks less and less like something to laugh at.

Then people should still be bitching about Call of duty's shitty server's that say they are dedicated when they still use a host.

PSN on the whole has been worse for me on PS4 than it was on PS3, when it was free. I am just not going to pay for it anymore until there is something I really want to play online. I will just buy 3 months here and there.

That's pretty much what I do. I bought it for bloodborne, Farcry, and The last of us. I'll buy it in February again for Street Fighter v, uncharted 4.

 

[Exploratory]

This is not true. Dead Rising 3 and Killer Instinct use P2P, and many have alluded to Gears Ultimate using the hybrid system which mostly relies on P2P as well. MCC uses a similar hybrid set up afaik.

Do fighting games need dedis?

 

[Mass Appeal]

Are you serious? I have honestly never had that happen to me once and I have over 400 hours in that game. Are you playing in the US?

You have never had lag in destiny? That's bs lol. I have over a 1000 hours in destiny on my ps4 and lag in crucible is horrendous at times...especially during iron banner and sometimes in trials. Even raids can have bad lag but it's usually when Iron Banner and trials go up...

And I am in the US with a very good connection.

 

[Kill3r7]

All ND games have been P2P so not all that surprising. Still sucks considering that people are now paying for MP/PS+.

 

[Caja 117]

What is your point? Sony is taking our money and they have the ability to hire people to get the job done. This is not 10 years ago, it's 2015 and sony need to compete now and not 5 years from now..

My point is that it took MS 10 years of charging people Xbox live to get where we are now, PSN has always bee free, so it harder to allocate resources on something you are giving out for free. Maintaining Servers cost money, so all the time SONY was giving out online for free, they were swallowing this expense.

 

[Kintaro]

Sony and Naughty Dog really pulling out all the stops for their biggest game on PS4 eh?

Bummer. =