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[broncobuster]

Either way, no line or the one, it represents a misopportunity for good character moments.

Hey, I agree. Also believe

Spoiler

she and Lois could've had moments.

The actors have good chemistry that's not shown in the film and it is a letdown.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

There are plenty of fun and serious films, Mad Max Fury Road, Argo, even The Dark Knight, are recent films from WB's own recent filmography they can turn to to see a balance of fun and serious.

Fury Road and TDK barely feature characters having any fun at all - maybe 2 minutes of Bruce Wayne verbal sparring or mocking somebody for wearing hockey pants. They're fun movies to watch, although TDK does enter into the same extremely dark territory that BvS does and near the end it gets emotionally draining. The difference is those two films have much tighter scripts and fewer instances of audience expectations getting thrown out the window. Better editing and no shoehorned universe building stuff either.

 

[Schweinehund]

What were the "fun" moments in fury road? The only times I laughed was the guitar dude being over the top. Other then that, the action was awesome and was the main sell for me. I don't remember TDK having much more jokes than BvS had either.

 

[Nesotenso]

I see Suicide Squad as a betrayal to DC's belief as the movie seems to have too much fun. If you want fun movie, go watch those shallow Marvel films.

I dont watch DC films for fun. I watch them for the dark and gritty, deep, though provoking aspects.

I prefer future DC films to be more like BvS. It makes the audience thinks a lot and makes them feel sad (over the fate of a character) after the movie.

what the hell was thought provoking about BvS?

 

[Veelk]

Fury Road and TDK barely feature characters having any fun at all - maybe 2 minutes of Bruce Wayne verbal sparring or mocking somebody for wearing hockey pants. They're fun movies to watch, although TDK does enter into the same extremely dark territory that BvS does and near the end it gets emotionally draining. The difference is those two films have much tighter scripts and fewer instances of audience expectations getting thrown out the window. Better editing and no shoehorned universe building stuff either.

This is pretty much why I find the "light vs dark" debate so arbitrary. The problem is never that the film is dark, the problem is that it's extremely badly written.

 

[PBY]

What were the "fun" moments in fury road? The only times I laughed was the guitar dude being over the top. Other then that, the action was awesome and was the main sell for me.

A movie can be fun without quips? It was a joy to watch, and was the most fun I've had in a movie theater in a LONG time.

 

[gutter_trash]

The DCU needs a soul, not just a pretty surface.

and remove the cold blue filter. that shit has to go

 

[Toothless]

That Superman not speaking to Wonder Woman thing is weird. Surprised I didn't notice it.

 

[Freewheelin']

What were the "fun" moments in fury road? The only times I laughed was the guitar dude being over the top. Other then that, the action was awesome and was the main sell for me. I don't remember TDK having much more jokes than BvS had either.

Fun is not the same as funny.

 

[Pai Pai Master]

What were the "fun" moments in fury road? The only times I laughed was the guitar dude being over the top. Other then that, the action was awesome and was the main sell for me. I don't remember TDK having much more jokes than BvS had either.

Fucking flaming desert cars exploding all over eachother is pretty fucking fun

 

[Discotheque]

Fury Road and TDK barely feature characters having any fun at all - maybe 2 minutes of Bruce Wayne verbal sparring or mocking somebody for wearing hockey pants. They're fun movies to watch, although TDK does enter into the same extremely dark territory that BvS does and near the end it gets emotionally draining. The difference is those two films have much tighter scripts and fewer instances of audience expectations getting thrown out the window. Better editing and no shoehorned universe building stuff either.

What were the "fun" moments in fury road? The only times I laughed was the guitar dude being over the top. Other then that, the action was awesome and was the main sell for me. I don't remember TDK having much more jokes than BvS had either.

nux was entertaining as hell.

also by the sheer virtue of it's filmmaking it was fun for like 95% of it's runtime due to the way the action was on display.

i honestly think people are shortchanging eisenberg here though. i was mad at his performance but looking back at it aside from affleck and irons he was actually a highlight to watch. the mannerisms of his lex was a trainwreck but he seemed to be the only actor who was really enjoying his time on set.

 

[Blader]

What were the "fun" moments in fury road? The only times I laughed was the guitar dude being over the top. Other then that, the action was awesome and was the main sell for me. I don't remember TDK having much more jokes than BvS had either.

The movie? The characters don't need to have fun for you to have fun.

 

[gutter_trash]

That Superman not speaking to Wonder Woman thing is weird. Surprised I didn't notice it.

he didn't want Lois to think that he was hitting on her

 

[The Technomancer]

People aren't asking for Batman to have a good time. They are asking for Batman to be entertaining to watch

 

[Veelk]

also by the sheer virtue of it's filmmaking it was fun for like 95% of it's runtime due to the way the action was on display.

You know, this brings up the a good point. What even is 'fun'?

Is it the characters' themselves having fun? By that defintion, Fury Road is a pretty fun movie. Look at the sheer joy Nux has when he thinks he's going to be killed that that tornado. Isn't he having fun? There aren't many out and out jokes, but there's plenty of scenes where the characters are enjoying themselves.

What about when Batman is sadistically beating down on Superman, humiliating and denegrading him. He's a fuckboy, but he's clearly enjoying himself. Isn't that fun?

Conversely, we have plenty of typically fun movies that the characters are utterly miserable throughout. I mean, consider the Big Lebowski. The Dude's entire story begins with him being beaten, having his rug urinated on, having his mission go awry because of Walter, holding the guilt of a potentially dead woman over his head, being used by Maud, getting his car totalled for reasons that are not his fault, having his friend die, and having to deal with Walter's obnoxiousness. He flat out breaks down in frustration and sadness at the end. But who the fuck would say that the Big Lebowski isn't a bunch of fun?

Yet if it's a matter of the audience having fun, then something like schindler's list should be considered fun. I know I have a great time watching it. Not a pleasant time, maybe, but a great time, it's one of my favorite movies of all time. Does that make it fun?

It feels like too subjective and vague a term to mean anything anymore.

 

[Popnbake]

They can, and probably will, keep the serious time. The problem with BvS as a crowd-pleaser is that it goes past "serious" into "depressing." If future films can keep the serious tone while injecting a bit of fun, than that should be great.

There are plenty of fun and serious films, Mad Max Fury Road, Argo, even The Dark Knight, are recent films from WB's own recent filmography they can turn to to see a balance of fun and serious.

Depressing+serious can work for a Batman solo film.

I'm just not interested in seeing that for Superman.

 

[WadiumArcadium]

People aren't asking for Batman to have a good time. They are asking for Batman to be entertaining to watch

I thought he was personally. Batman's the strongest part of the film by far, The warehouse fight was entertaining. His fight scene with Superman was entertaining. They need to make Superman entertaining.

 

[Discotheque]

also when a movie called "Avengers: Age of Ultron" and "Batman v(s) Superman" has you squirming in your seat from boredom then you failed the 'fun test'

shiiit The Dark Knight gets more serious than either of these films at certain moments but it was a thrill to watch. I don't really care about the tone they went with bvs, i just think it was made (and written) poorly. hell they could have gotten away with a dour superman again if he was at least in a good movie here (though i gotta say i definitely prefer the idealized kal-el over this)

 

[Sobriquet]

what the hell was thought provoking about BvS?

It makes the audience thinks a lot and makes them feel sad

 

[Bronx-Man]

People aren't asking for Batman to have a good time. They are asking for Batman to be entertaining to watch

That sounds like Marvel shill talk.

 

[G-Fex]

It makes the audience thinks a lot and makes them feel sad

This is supposed to be BATMAN V. SUPERMAN. SUPER HERO MEN.


not FEELSBADMAN VS FEELSBADTOOMAN.

 

[Foggy]

Oof, Marvel can make Marvel from now until eternity. Good on them. People like their movies. Good for them. But man, the last thing I want is every comic book movie attempting to ape their approach. It's funny, the last line in the article pinpoints how truly one-note almost all of their movies are.

 

[Sobriquet]

This is supposed to be BATMAN V. SUPERMAN. SUPER HERO MEN.


not FEELSBADMAN VS FEELSBADTOOMAN.

I was quoting ArtHands

 

[Schweinehund]

The movie? The characters don't need to have fun for you to have fun.

Can we take a step back and define fun? It just seems so vague and a shitty way to describe what's wrong with a movie. People use it hand & hand with jokes or light heartedness (which is why I wrapped fun in quotes), but I think BvS is fun in ways, seeing the trinity fight Doomsday and Clark/Bruce's first meeting was fun to me. I had fun watching mad max, but when somebody says something is "no fun!" I assume they're talking about a lack of light heartedness.

 

[antonz]

I see Suicide Squad as a betrayal to DC's belief as the movie seems to have too much fun. If you want fun movie, go watch those shallow Marvel films.

I dont watch DC films for fun. I watch them for the dark and gritty, deep, though provoking aspects.

I prefer future DC films to be more like BvS. It makes the audience thinks a lot and makes them feel sad (over the fate of a character) after the movie.

By all accounts it is you who are out of touch with what people want from the DC Movie Universe. Reports are Suicide Squad was in fact too serious compared to the tone the trailer portrayed and early screenings found people saying they hated it because the funny was missing so they have gone back to film more funny to put into the movie.

 

[entremet]

Nolan's success ended up biting them in the ass.

 

[Error]

For once I agree with Faraci, the only character that looked like she was having fun was Wonder Woman, no wonder she got the most positive reaction. Her smirk while fighting Doomsday was all Gadot improvising, too, good on her.

 

[Discotheque]

Nolan's success ended up biting them in the ass.

for their entire dc comics universe sure. but he was absolutely necessary to repair the batman brand, brought him back to pop culture again making him one of the all time greats once more. it was hard work salvaging that guy after schumacher.

 

[Senoculum]

People aren't asking for Batman to have a good time. They are asking for Batman to be entertaining to watch

Umm. He totally was. He rocked in the movie. He rocked and steamrolled in the movie. Baleman failed miserably trying his best in Ong Bak impersonation and was barely worth the price of admission (movies were awesome... but certainly not because of Christian Bale's Batman), whereas Batfleck was the Dark Knight personified.

 

[KonradLaw]

For all the complains about BvS people generally still seem to really like this take on Batman and Wonder Woman. So the interest for Suicide Squad and Wonder Woman movies should be there, as long as they end up being good, especially since the concept between them is fresher than most flicks from the genre (villains movie and first big female superhero movie).

After those two are out though it might get bad unless they somehow steer Snyder into making good movie out of JL, as the later slate of movies will lack the same catchy premises as SS and WW and if they screw up JL I'm not sure people will be there to see Flash or Cyborg. Wan can probably pull of Aquaman though

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

This is pretty much why I find the "light vs dark" debate so arbitrary. The problem is never that the film is dark, the problem is that it's extremely badly written.

OTOH the idea of Dark Superman Movies being "wrong" comes up constantly. I think there is definitely opposition to that. If not that the movie is dark then that they don't feel Superman is being heroic and bright enough as a contrast.

 

[Garlador]

Umm. He totally was. He rocked in the movie. He rocked and steamrolled in the movie. Baleman failed miserably trying his best in Ong Bak impersonation and was barely worth the price of admission (movies were awesome... but certainly not because of Christian Bale's Batman), whereas Batfleck was the Dark Knight personified.

Affleck's Batman is one of the highlights of an otherwise bad film...

... But he's still mowing down criminals, slaughtering his adversaries, and generally is a far, FAR cry from "World's Greatest Detective".

He fights well. Okay? That's like dangling keys in front of a toddler.

I'm more interested in the reasons behind WHY he fights, rather than how impressive the choreography is.

 

[Dabanton]

For all the complains about BvS people generally still seem to really like this take on Batman and Wonder Woman. So the interest for Suicide Squad and Wonder Woman movies should be there, as long as they end up being good, especially since the concept between them is fresher than most flicks from the genre (villains movie and first big female superhero movie).

After those two are out though it might get bad unless they somehow steer Snyder into making good movie out of JL, as the later slate of movies will lack the same catchy premises as SS and WW and if they screw up JL I'm not sure people will be there to see Flash or Cyborg. Wan can probably pull of Aquaman though

I think that's one good thing they can take from this. I just want to see a slightly more happy and less confused Superman.

 

[PBY]

for their entire dc comics universe sure. but he was absolutely necessary to repair the batman brand, brought him back to pop culture again making him one of the all time greats once more. it was hard work salvaging that guy after schumacher.

Superman needs this treatment tbh

 

[WillyFive]

It looks like dc will be doing the exact same thing with their solo movies. Wonder Woman basically seems like a rip of thor/captain America 1

And also many of these movies fail to commit to their concept after the first half hour. Ant Man stopped being a heist movie, Cap 2 dumped the cool spy angle after a bit, Thor went from asgard to that cornball fish out of water plot etc

So it's inaccurate to paint them as such

No, it would still be very much accurate; it doesn't matter on what you think about the quality of it.

I thought Ant-Man's heist was rather mediocre. It doesn't stop making it a heist movie, because it's plot and premise revolved entirely around performing a heist.

 

[Discotheque]

Superman needs this treatment tbh

they should have let singer continue with superman. the first one made batman begins money..the sequel could have had good growth and would have been an improvement.

the preferred tone of character was there at least. big mistake by WB canning that and rebooting with snyder.

 

[PeskyToaster]

Nolan's success ended up biting them in the ass.

Yeah kind of. He revitalized Batman so well that they can't get anyone to competently follow in the same footsteps. If Faraci is correct in that Warner Brothers thinks the problem was that the movie was too dark then they are getting the wrong message.

 

[Cuburt]

False.

Spoiler

They did have just one exchange.

Wonder Woman: "I've fought creatures from other worlds before."

Superman: "This one is from my world."

It's easy to miss since the music is blaring so loud it's hard to even understand what they are saying in that scene.

 

[Htown]

Umm. He totally was. He rocked in the movie. He rocked and steamrolled in the movie. Baleman failed miserably trying his best in Ong Bak impersonation and was barely worth the price of admission (movies were awesome... but certainly not because of Christian Bale's Batman), whereas Batfleck was the Dark Knight personified.

I do not understand why the action scenes were so bad in that movie.

I mean, they weren't amazing in Nolan's first two Batman movies, but they at least were serviceable, in that you believed Batman was fighting people and was good at it.

 

[Big One]

I have no issues whatsoever DC having a darker tone from the MCU. The Nolan trilogy by and large was fantastic. More importantly, it was easy to understand and all three movies had their own tone to them that made them unique, fun experiences in the theater.

BVS doesn't have any of these qualities. Nothing is explained worth a shit, the editing is a mess, the writing is a mess, etc. The only character in the movie that gets a real arc that resolves properly is Batman. The movie begins with Batman saving innocent girls from being sold as sex slaves in the human trafficking market, and ends with

Spoiler

Doomsday and Superman getting into a Dragonball Z style beam struggle and beating each other into space.

What kind of tone is that? "Manchild"?

 

[Fancy Clown]

Just give us more Batfleck

 

[Schweinehund]

I do not understand why the action scenes were so bad in that movie.

I mean, they weren't amazing in Nolan's first two Batman movies, but they at least were serviceable, in that you believed Batman was fighting people and was good at it.

The h2h was never great, but I still enjoy it for the same reason I enjoyed the SW OT's fights, they had a lot of emotion and story behind it. Bat vs Bane (both fights) were great. Not technically but it had a rewarding setup.

 

[Veelk]

OTOH the idea of Dark Superman Movies being "wrong" comes up constantly. I think there is definitely opposition to that. If not that the movie is dark then that they don't feel Superman is being heroic and bright enough as a contrast.

While I'm sure there will be a faction that will hold steadfast to their one and true superman being a shining beacon, I feel if we had a good movie with a dark superman, there would be far less resistance to it.

Good writing always wins out in the end, I think, or hope atleast.

 

[KonradLaw]

OTOH the idea of Dark Superman Movies being "wrong" comes up constantly. I think there is definitely opposition to that. If not that the movie is dark then that they don't feel Superman is being heroic and bright enough as a contrast.

I think funny light Superman movie Marvel style would be just as bad as uber dark one. People want serious Superman movie. But they want him to not be depressing, but inspirational. Superman is embodiment of heroism, a symbol of hope and an example for others to follow. Hollywood made so many historical movies of this type that it;s bizzare to see WB not being able to replicate that in superhero movie.

 

[Chariot]

I do not understand why the action scenes were so bad in that movie.

I mean, they weren't amazing in Nolan's first two Batman movies, but they at least were serviceable, in that you believed Batman was fighting people and was good at it.

I still belueve they wanked Rises together with half a heart, because Heath Ledger and whatever was planned for him didn't work out.

 

[RoninChaos]

I never realized that Wonder Woman and superman didn't say two words to one another.

 

[KonradLaw]

While I'm sure there will be a faction that will hold steadfast to their one and true superman being a shining beacon, I feel if we had a good movie with a dark superman, there would be far less resistance to it.

Good writing always wins out in the end, I think, or hope atleast.

That is true. People love Injustice comics and there Superman is a villain. But it's fun story with many great moments and big payoffs, that's why it works.

 

[Toxi]

People so obsessed with the jokes vs no jokes narrative when Faraci explicitly says the problem isn't the lack of comedy.

The problem is the characters aren't interesting.

 

[G-Fex]

People so obsessed with the jokes vs no jokes narrative when Faraci explicitly says the problem isn't the lack of comedy.

It's overall mood not stupid jokes.


If i'm sitting in the theater genuinely depressed by the events currently going on screen and it's supposed to be a big mainstream superhero film of two world's finest then well you really went out of your way to fuck this one up.

 

[tomtom94]

I still belueve they wanked Rises together with half a heart, because Heath Ledger and whatever was planned for him didn't work out.

It's painfully obvious in hindsight that Scarecrow's role in Rises was written for Joker.

TDKR and Age of Ultron are what happen when you get film-makers who are simultaneously burnt out and trying to beat a creative endeavour that was probably their zenith. The scale is there for an epic movie (and make no mistake, both are good movies on scale alone) but there are pretty basic errors that stop them both reaching their potential.

Of course Age of Ultron had the added problem of producers meddling while TDKR's problems were more on the script but that's beside the point.