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Planet Coaster Alpha |OT| underconstruction
- Thread starter SpacePirate Ridley
- Start date
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I don't think you are the only one that is fine with it being RCT3 style management. However I do feel that Frontier tried to sell me on a bigger promise than that.
Also we still miss quite a few things from RCT3 management wise:
- Park inspector
- VIP objectives
- Vandalism/Security
- Weather/Umbrella
- Custom menu items in shops
But more than that I feel that there has been a lot of improvement in terms of the game engine, graphics and 3d building tools and very little improvement everywhere else. Not only do I find the simulation elements (such as staff management) to be very bare bones but I also don't think it is very well presented to the gamer. Or as someone else on the official forums stated it:
InaudibleWhispa
Member
Is the priority pass sale/information booth system broken or am I missing something? I had my park full with 6000 people and it was working harmoniously at $20; too expensive for some, enough sales to fill the priority queues and make a healthy profit. Then when today's update hit it emptied my park of people, and when it started filling up again it seems like 90% of the guests headed towards the nearest information booth creating a gigantic crowd around each one. Nobody was buying anything, they were all complaining the pass was too expensive because the queues weren't busy (no shit, you're all at the information booths) but then they just kept looping back constantly re-trying to buy a pass and complaining about the price so the crowds never dispersed into the park. They were stuck in a loop, starving, thirsty, littering; it was a mess. I had to close all of the information booths and re-open them once the guests had spread out and started to fill queues; even lowering the prices to $5 didn't disperse the crowd.
This is a crowd that had gathered around an information booth, there was an even bigger one around two closer to the park entrance. I'm guessing they're balanced for the park filling gradually as you build it, and the prices rising naturally in response to demand. That worked fine. It seems completely broken if you open a big park that instantly attracts thousands very quickly.
This is a crowd that had gathered around an information booth, there was an even bigger one around two closer to the park entrance. I'm guessing they're balanced for the park filling gradually as you build it, and the prices rising naturally in response to demand. That worked fine. It seems completely broken if you open a big park that instantly attracts thousands very quickly.
Ah that's a shame to hear. I've always been more of a fan of the tycoon/management side of these games so I think I'll wait a bit to see if this improves.
SpacePirate Ridley
Member
Im not fine with RCT3 level management, because RCT3 was broken from the get a go (the groups bug). Im happy with RCT1 and 2 because it was basic but worked, just as this game.
Also, I dont usually like to compare a game with "it misses this and that from this game" becuase there actually a deeper meaning to not having some things and the game be improved in others. About the thing "missing" from RCT3:
-Park Inspector - was just a fancy walking menu with information delay. The menu is now in the game with no delay. Glad they got rid of it.
-VIP Objectives - one of the first character artworks actually showed VIPs, so it was probably planned and scrapped becuase it was no fun, or maybe planned for the future. I wouldnt mind having VIP missions like then ones RCTW added in the new update (probably the only creative good idea theyve had).
-Vandalism/Security - SUPER glad they actually got rid of vandalism once for all, was the worst mamangement aspect of the original games, and it would even be worse in a creative game like this. No, changing benches and lights because a "magical vandalism invisible bar" was too high was not fun. Security was actually planned, as we all know (theres a bunch of trailers with them in it), but they just found their initial idea wasnt fun enough to play 8probably the basic RCT way of security). They also have added they will try HARD bringing security back in the game and of course it would be a fun part of mamangement. My idea? Let them pester mascots and guests, like having actual vandals just bothering people and people asking for security, and your mascot staff being angy and quitting becuase of vandals. Then security guards could be cool. And they actually shoudl work getting this vandals and having to kick them out of the park, no more magic invisible bars that brake stuff, just because.
-Weather - they are working on it, HARD. They want to make rain actually not being able to enter buildings, and with the building system the game has, thats going to be hard. Of course, umbrellas are going to come when rain is in the game. I know this because I actually talked about this when I was at Frontier.
-Custom menu item on shops - thats ACTUALLY one of the things I want back, and shouldnt be too hard to implement.
People are thinking some of these things are just tickboxes easy to develop, but they are more complicated than that. As you can see, not having the stuff in your list goes deeper than just not being there (apart from the inventory menus like I explained).
Still, I wouldnt mind if they added more to management that is fun, thats for sure. But it needs to be well designed.
I don't believe RCT1 had any AI whatsoever. Just peeps aimlessly walking around and getting on rides. That's just a hallow shell to make it look like your park is running well.
I think for the most part what is there works but I don't think they are fully there yet. I think the money management of the guest is not fully there (they can't really compare the price of one ride vs others vs total value of the park). This also makes that you can't really run a park based on entrance fee alone.
As for the staff management I think it's rather hollow. Train them to make them work better, raise wages to keep them happy. It kinda misses all the charm and personality the rest of the building game does have.
The whole guests evaluating your scenery is also not really true. It seems mostly based on the amount of objects that are in the vicinity of a ride and the system appears to be very basic.
You very much have a point here. But you also understand that RCT3 is currently still the golden standard to live up to. I'm perfectly fine with removing elements from RCT3 that are unnecessary and don't improve the game (such as vandalism/security mechanic).
I guess this is just a weird Frontier thing in that they like to keep things secret and then do a #SpoilerSam thing on a livestream but I really think they would benefit from more open and honest communication towards the community. This is easily something they could just say they are trying to make it work and explain why it is difficult. The community I think is plenty patient they just want to know what Frontier is working on and planning for the future.
I'm absolutely not saying development is easy to do. What I am saying is that it is a matter of allocated development time. It is obvious that they spent so much time and effort on making the 3d building part of the game function as it should that they ran out of time to spent as much effort on the management part. For a gamer like me that is a disappointment.
I would say as of now, no. I think there's certainly the potential for it, but the management portion needs work, quite a lot of it. It's not easy to get to the information required for good management of your park, and there's just not a lot of depth to the management as of now. For now, the game is a lot more creation tool than it is management game.
Rocky Raccoon
Banned
It has been since 1999/2000 since I played a good Roller Coaster theme park game.
Year 2016 and now I want to play again. I can't wait for Planet Coaster.
How is the Roller Coaster Tycoon world? I heard that has been delayed a bit and that is releasing in a few days.
Year 2016 and now I want to play again. I can't wait for Planet Coaster.
How is the Roller Coaster Tycoon world? I heard that has been delayed a bit and that is releasing in a few days.
Given that it was certainly pushed to release the day before Planet Coaster, I don't have high hopes for it.
Shader complexity? Blending materials based on height requires a bunch of textures (height, normal, base color, roughness...), they are already blending a bunch so maybe that's why? They could have had slots instead and let you pick 6 (or whatever amount they're blending) out of all the ones in the game. Far Cry 4 editor does this, letting you choose 4 from a larger amount.
SpacePirate Ridley
Member
I don't believe RCT1 had any AI whatsoever. Just peeps aimlessly walking around and getting on rides. That's just a hallow shell to make it look like your park is running well.
I think for the most part what is there works but I don't think they are fully there yet. I think the money management of the guest is not fully there (they can't really compare the price of one ride vs others vs total value of the park). This also makes that you can't really run a park based on entrance fee alone.
As for the staff management I think it's rather hollow. Train them to make them work better, raise wages to keep them happy. It kinda misses all the charm and personality the rest of the building game does have.
The whole guests evaluating your scenery is also not really true. It seems mostly based on the amount of objects that are in the vicinity of a ride and the system appears to be very basic.
You very much have a point here. But you also understand that RCT3 is currently still the golden standard to live up to. I'm perfectly fine with removing elements from RCT3 that are unnecessary and don't improve the game (such as vandalism/security mechanic).
I guess this is just a weird Frontier thing in that they like to keep things secret and then do a #SpoilerSam thing on a livestream but I really think they would benefit from more open and honest communication towards the community. This is easily something they could just say they are trying to make it work and explain why it is difficult. The community I think is plenty patient they just want to know what Frontier is working on and planning for the future.
I'm absolutely not saying development is easy to do. What I am saying is that it is a matter of allocated development time. It is obvious that they spent so much time and effort on making the 3d building part of the game function as it should that they ran out of time to spent as much effort on the management part. For a gamer like me that is a disappointment.
The guests reacting to theming is a real thing in the game. Yeah, its not the quality of the theming, becuase programming that type of AI is:
1. impossible, how would an AI gauge if something is beautiful or not.
2. it would limit creativity, A LOT. The themes in this game were designed to be mixed and matched, so you can create an americana main street with western+fantasy for example. If guests start to be negative becuase of mixing, or actually know which theming your are using, parks will start looking the same just to get a better guest rating. Thasts actually somehting that happens with RCTW, and its as bad of an idea as it sounds.
So they decided to make the variable quantity and a percentage, which I think is something realistic to strive for. If you make a short queue, just a few pieces can make it go 100% rating. But for longer queues that really need scenery, the rating percentage is harder to fill (I tested it), and you seem to need more variation of things (not themes), so for example adding a lot of vegetation and rocks actually does not fill the rating that much, you actually need to build some type of building.
Of course you can "cheat" and just use 1 or 2 times one of the frontier blueprints (like the thin cool building, that makes rating up a lot) but wheres the fun in that?
And then comes the gameplay system of the 100% rating theming in queues. You can make a much longer queue, till you fill it up, if you get a 100% theming rating. If you dont have a 100%, no matter how cool is the coaster, they will not fill the whole queue ("Will not wait that much for x ride" guests will say). So say you added 100%, now another problem arises, people will actually want to get into the queue even if its full, but they will get angry now becuase "the queue is full for x ride". And here is where the priority pass queue comes into place.
What I mean here is, I actually like a lot the problem solving of the theming and how it affects the guests. And thats something adavnced from the RCT days (be it 1, 2 or 3).
About being more transparent, while I completly understand you, when they were actually showing more thing is when now probelm have arised because, as much as you say people are intelligent enough to understand, the froums this last month have actuallle demonstrated people dont understadn simple things even when explained, and the only thing they want is more, more and more.
Take the go karts for example, even after explained they are coming, that they are one of the most difficult rides to make, etc... people arestill demanding it for release just because "they showed the 3d model of the go kart at the beggining"
Same as the security.
So they cant actually say they want to implement rain if they are not sure they can resolve the problem, becuase if they say its coming, people will say "they have been promised", not matter how many times its explained is hard to do and they are having problems.
Im with you though, they could expand managment of the staff areeas, for example make them get tired bar, and they need to go to the nearest brake staff room to get that bar of. Things like that would be cool from a game and building standpoint.
Yeah Mik is right, they actually said it was a technology limit with textures and voxel terrain and thats why they created biomes.
They could still be a bit better mixing those textures instead of having some similar repeats in some of them (red terrain, and a little less red terrain, etc...), but oh well.
Thats game is absolutely broken, its in an awful state and its very possible zombie atari explodes again before they actually fix anything (the game is so bad from a starting point that its impossible to fix actually without making a complete new game). Its releasing on the 16th becuase Planet Coaster releases on the 17th, nothing more nothing else. They actually think that is going to make an actual change to their sales.
They could easily solve this problem above by making it important to cover the entire area around your ride with scenery.
I understand that the system can't gauge artistic quality. I understand that they need to account for shorter queue's and less room for scenery. I understand that people mix scenery. But as the system is right now I think there can be improvements to make it more realistic.
One of these two rides has 100% rating the other doesn't and to me it just doesn't make enough realistic sense. Also the ride with 100% scenery rating still has 30% saying they don't want to queue that long.
SpacePirate Ridley
Member
Actually, thats a good idea. Maybe bring it into feedback?
InaudibleWhispa
Member
Make sure you're banking all of the fast turns. Make sure it isn't going too fast over hills/inversions; the train should generally slow down a bit at peaks like the top of a loop, not zoom through everything. And when you've finished the layout, go through and use the smooth tool to remove any harsh segments.
SirMossyBloke
Member
So the priority pass issue was introduced in the latest update? Damn. Me and the gf spent hours redesigning our park because of massive congestion 
SpacePirate Ridley
Member
This is actually super important in this game. In the older games, banking curves and not getting killing Gs was enough, but this game takes a lot into account no going at top speed on bunny hills and inversions.
Got a decent start on a park and I think I'm happy with what I've got so far - which is pretty much just a starting area with 3 rides and a coaster with the beginning of a monorail built for when I do the next zone.
I'm already hurting for more non-themed scenery pieces, though.
Sci-fi is pretty barren too. I really hope we get a lot more scenery at launch, because unless you want to literally a bunch out of the shapes, there's not a whole bunch of variety outside of western and pirate.
Still, really happy with the game.
I'm already hurting for more non-themed scenery pieces, though.
Sci-fi is pretty barren too. I really hope we get a lot more scenery at launch, because unless you want to literally a bunch out of the shapes, there's not a whole bunch of variety outside of western and pirate.
Still, really happy with the game.
D
Deleted member 465307
Unconfirmed Member
You can make monorails? That's awesome.
It is a fairly big bummer to hear about the management part of the game lacking as of now, because I do really enjoy that element these kinds of games. I am torn, but I will likely end of buying this do to the simple fact I want more games in this style it also doesn't hurt that the game looks stunning and I also enjoy the beatification/creation elements of theme park games as well.
I mean, is the simulation next level hype shit?! nah, but it is the best available. The fact that it is better at handling groups vs RCT3, the current reigning king in coaster/park sims, means a lot.
I definitely fall more casual on sim elements, but the things I was looking for that I remember from RCT1 and 2 was here and I was so excited. Guest thoughts, following them, finding out their spending habits and finances and favorite ride. The infographics and data on park management has me excited as someone who deals with data on a daily basis, but I do think what it conveys and how it conveys it can be improved, as has already been brought up. I think getting the engine and creative stuff down first was a top priority as the simulation of AI and park management is mainly data driven and can totally be improved easily in time without impacting how the game runs and looks and simulates physics and stuff.
I definitely fall more casual on sim elements, but the things I was looking for that I remember from RCT1 and 2 was here and I was so excited. Guest thoughts, following them, finding out their spending habits and finances and favorite ride. The infographics and data on park management has me excited as someone who deals with data on a daily basis, but I do think what it conveys and how it conveys it can be improved, as has already been brought up. I think getting the engine and creative stuff down first was a top priority as the simulation of AI and park management is mainly data driven and can totally be improved easily in time without impacting how the game runs and looks and simulates physics and stuff.
Moz La Punk
Member
So, I wanted to show off the early stages of my first park on NeoGAF! I've been a HUGE Rollercoaster Tycoon 3 fan so this game is right up my alley
Keep in mind when you look at the pics that I am a Steam Workshop-user, so some buildings are from other talented players! Most of the castles or parts of the castles on the picture can be found for free on the workshop. Props to the talented designers of them!
The best thing about theme park sims for me has always been the possibilities of making a THEME park. Here in the Netherlands, you have Six Flags and 'De Efteling', and I prefer the second one way more, because when you enter you feel like you step into another world seperated from the normal mundane life. Six Flags on the other hand is just some rollercoasters thrown together. So, my challenge with every coaster sim-game isn't so much in making unique rides or coasters, but to really give visitors the feeling they are in another world and never breaking that experience. Game system be damned, I don't care if my virtual visitors don't appreciate it, its about the fantasy I create in my own head of being a park designer.
As you can see in the pictures here, I'm working on the first 'section' of my park which has a kind of medieval setting. Next to the rides I want all sorts of houses and castles to really give visitors a feeling that they're there. It's still early stages and this section is nowhere near done (I expect it to grow in size exponentially), but that's because I spend hours on each piece of park, deciding where I place benches, lights, trash cans, trees, plants and rocks. I leave more or less no empty piece of grass in the park, everything is used. When the park is even half full, my computer will probably start lagging like a b*tch thanks to the countless trees and bushes in the park, but oh well.
I'll probably be busy with the medieval setting for a few weeks, the plan is to make a carreabaen theme on the other side of the park.
I'm pretty much addicted by now.
Oh by the way the graphics look much better in person. Probably compression from OneDrive, Photo Editor Online or Imgur.
Keep in mind when you look at the pics that I am a Steam Workshop-user, so some buildings are from other talented players! Most of the castles or parts of the castles on the picture can be found for free on the workshop. Props to the talented designers of them!
The best thing about theme park sims for me has always been the possibilities of making a THEME park. Here in the Netherlands, you have Six Flags and 'De Efteling', and I prefer the second one way more, because when you enter you feel like you step into another world seperated from the normal mundane life. Six Flags on the other hand is just some rollercoasters thrown together. So, my challenge with every coaster sim-game isn't so much in making unique rides or coasters, but to really give visitors the feeling they are in another world and never breaking that experience. Game system be damned, I don't care if my virtual visitors don't appreciate it, its about the fantasy I create in my own head of being a park designer.
As you can see in the pictures here, I'm working on the first 'section' of my park which has a kind of medieval setting. Next to the rides I want all sorts of houses and castles to really give visitors a feeling that they're there. It's still early stages and this section is nowhere near done (I expect it to grow in size exponentially), but that's because I spend hours on each piece of park, deciding where I place benches, lights, trash cans, trees, plants and rocks. I leave more or less no empty piece of grass in the park, everything is used. When the park is even half full, my computer will probably start lagging like a b*tch thanks to the countless trees and bushes in the park, but oh well.
I'll probably be busy with the medieval setting for a few weeks, the plan is to make a carreabaen theme on the other side of the park.
I'm pretty much addicted by now.
Oh by the way the graphics look much better in person. Probably compression from OneDrive, Photo Editor Online or Imgur.
Moz La Punk
Member
Glad I'm not alone in that.
If you're worried about image compression from hosts btw, you might want to try using abload.de
Thanks for the tip will use that next time.
And yeah i like to mix workshop stuff with my own build buildings. Still learning how to build beautiful stuff myself as I go forward
Sun Bather
Member
Loving it right now. I hope the campaign is good, I have only done the first park thing. But having a decent lengthy campaign is fairly important to me in these games, as I way too quickly lose focus with sandbox games.
SirMossyBloke
Member
My gf spent 3 hours making a big castle entrance for a park. She did it in pieces though but wants to save the whole thing as a blueprint. How does she join multiple buildings together to make one big bp?
Moz La Punk
Member
When you click on a building, it says 'edit building' top right. Can't you just edit one of the buildings, then drag the other building to it and then place it next to it, and then complete it? I don't know for sure though but that seems like the logical step?
SpacePirate Ridley
Member
Giving the final touches to the OT for tomorrow. We will be moving there soon, will ask kabouter to close this so people dont mix threads.
This, 100%
This looks really cool, loving the entrance.
And yeah, abload is your friend when uploading stuff.
Theres a button called the multi select tool in the right low corner of the screen.Click that and just select everything she wants with a click and drag. A new menu will appear on the top right eith the number of pieces used. The first button is the saving as blueprint button.
The building has to be less than 2000 pieces to be able to be saved
After that put all the info about the item, and if she want to upload to the steam workshop, enter the blueprint button in the menu, and she will fin it there with a steam button that uploads it.
This, 100%
So, I wanted to show off the early stages of my first park on NeoGAF! I've been a HUGE Rollercoaster Tycoon 3 fan so this game is right up my alley
Keep in mind when you look at the pics that I am a Steam Workshop-user, so some buildings are from other talented players! Most of the castles or parts of the castles on the picture can be found for free on the workshop. Props to the talented designers of them!
The best thing about theme park sims for me has always been the possibilities of making a THEME park. Here in the Netherlands, you have Six Flags and 'De Efteling', and I prefer the second one way more, because when you enter you feel like you step into another world seperated from the normal mundane life. Six Flags on the other hand is just some rollercoasters thrown together. So, my challenge with every coaster sim-game isn't so much in making unique rides or coasters, but to really give visitors the feeling they are in another world and never breaking that experience. Game system be damned, I don't care if my virtual visitors don't appreciate it, its about the fantasy I create in my own head of being a park designer.
As you can see in the pictures here, I'm working on the first 'section' of my park which has a kind of medieval setting. Next to the rides I want all sorts of houses and castles to really give visitors a feeling that they're there. It's still early stages and this section is nowhere near done (I expect it to grow in size exponentially), but that's because I spend hours on each piece of park, deciding where I place benches, lights, trash cans, trees, plants and rocks. I leave more or less no empty piece of grass in the park, everything is used. When the park is even half full, my computer will probably start lagging like a b*tch thanks to the countless trees and bushes in the park, but oh well.
I'll probably be busy with the medieval setting for a few weeks, the plan is to make a carreabaen theme on the other side of the park.
I'm pretty much addicted by now.
Oh by the way the graphics look much better in person. Probably compression from OneDrive, Photo Editor Online or Imgur.
This looks really cool, loving the entrance.
And yeah, abload is your friend when uploading stuff.
Theres a button called the multi select tool in the right low corner of the screen.Click that and just select everything she wants with a click and drag. A new menu will appear on the top right eith the number of pieces used. The first button is the saving as blueprint button.
The building has to be less than 2000 pieces to be able to be saved
After that put all the info about the item, and if she want to upload to the steam workshop, enter the blueprint button in the menu, and she will fin it there with a steam button that uploads it.
SpacePirate Ridley
Member
What ana amazing trailer. Brings your spirits up!
So the idea is to build a sandbox park with pirates on one side vs redcoats on the other. Or, wooden constructions vs stucco walls.
The original idea was to run a monorail from the entrance to the redcoats harbour and pirate town, but I saw a reddit post claiming that visitors do not consider transport rides to be perfect transport rides. E.g. because they find transport rides boring, they do not use it to reach other places in the park. So I will have to run a path to both sides later on..
The park.
The main station.
Easy flat ride near main entrance.
Colonial station at the redcoats harbour.
Watchtower with small cottage and a small fisherman's hut near the shore.
So it's not nearly complete, but we'll see how it does.
The original idea was to run a monorail from the entrance to the redcoats harbour and pirate town, but I saw a reddit post claiming that visitors do not consider transport rides to be perfect transport rides. E.g. because they find transport rides boring, they do not use it to reach other places in the park. So I will have to run a path to both sides later on..
The park.
The main station.
Easy flat ride near main entrance.
Colonial station at the redcoats harbour.
Watchtower with small cottage and a small fisherman's hut near the shore.
So it's not nearly complete, but we'll see how it does.
God I love that music, great trailer !
The "passing on the torch" at the end was a really nice touch
That looks great !!
Can't wait to dig in tomorrow...
Baron von Loathsome
Member
Man, I wish I had the patience to make something that cool.
Workshop is often a godsend, but there's some stuff that I have to do myself, and you can often tell what I did myself just by how bland it looks.
I'll start posting screens of my park once some of the back areas get fleshed out.
Workshop is often a godsend, but there's some stuff that I have to do myself, and you can often tell what I did myself just by how bland it looks.
I'll start posting screens of my park once some of the back areas get fleshed out.
Moz La Punk
Member
Playing this game between working, so addicted to it, haha... will update with more pictures tonight.
The music in this game is something else! The main menu music (its also in the launch trailer) is like a super catchy Of Monsters and Men song, haha. In the game there are some good laid back tunes, I swear one of them sounds like the start of a Bon Iver song, lol.
The music in this game is something else! The main menu music (its also in the launch trailer) is like a super catchy Of Monsters and Men song, haha. In the game there are some good laid back tunes, I swear one of them sounds like the start of a Bon Iver song, lol.
Baron von Loathsome
Member
I've heard similar music in recent radio ads for Universal Studios Hollywood.
Moz La Punk
Member
I think I'll reserve the pictures of the progress I've made in my park for the official thread, lol.
Any idea who's making it and when it comes online?
Any idea who's making it and when it comes online?
Work in progress day/night shots of the fantasy/medieval area in my park. Tents have shops in them, saved me from having to actually design a non-ugly building. Oh, the large fountain is (of course) from the workshop, the rest (again obviously) is my own work:
Was pretty happy with how this worked out in my first beta park, might try to do something like it again in my new park:
Was pretty happy with how this worked out in my first beta park, might try to do something like it again in my new park:
Baron von Loathsome
Member
How did you manage to fit buildings inside the tents? I wanna try the same thing for a fairy tale-ish part of my park.
Well, the large ones will *just* fit the shops without sticking out if you just place them in normally through advanced move or just using shift or whatever. I put an ATM in the medium one, the small one is empty.
Baron von Loathsome
Member
Thanks, noted.
Moz La Punk
Member
Yeah I love that you can just place shops into bigger buildings. When I realised that, it was a real gamechanger for me. Makes it easier to hide the ugly shops. I just use the 'bare bones' shops now and place them in beautiful buildings.
Edit:
Is it an idea to have a seperate post in the OT (like, second post or whatever) reserved for complete parks from NeoGAF-users, including a link to the Steam workshop? Not planning to upload mine for a few weeks until Im finished but still, would be nice to share our parks and see other parks in a more interactive way compared to simple screenshots.
Sevenfold
Member
Lovely trailer.
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