Conciliator
Banned
all ladder and plank puzzles
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What would you want from TLOU2's gameplay?
- Thread starter Catalix
- Start date
Funny that the OP mentions AI improvements, when all I want is the 'balance of power' AI system they advertised in their 1st demo of their game, but their post-mortum indicates they couldn't pull off...and we got similar to Uncharted aka not amazing levels of AI awareness/dynamism. I want AI that tries harder to preserve itself, reacts more to friends dying, faking you have a loaded gun be a more genuine tactic, environmental hazards to utilize, and doesn't have disappearing out of thin air molotov cocktails just because the AI cancels the animation to fall back.
I'd also like better companion AI that won't immediately follow you unless they see an open path with no enemy sight lines, or at least use cover more instead of the random running in open they do. Also, something like Shadow Tactics: Blades of the Shogun "shadow mode", where you point towards an area to do a contextual maneuver, queue it, and then activate it at a specific time in sync with your own attack/distractions/movements.
Another would be a more fleshed out crafting system, that lets you make some more interesting cobbled together tools that allow for fun ways to fight or more importantly more ways to stealth. Which I guess leads into the last thing I want...better stealth. No Naughty Dog game has impressed me in this area, because they give you too few tools to make avoidance or subterfuge interesting, and the level design doesn't give you much variance of approach.
Also, the melee system needs an overhaul. It maybe look nice and brutal, but I want more than press button to activate finisher animation.
The problems with Last of Us gameplay is they don't put enough nuance or depth into any one system, so you get a cluster of serviceable gameplay systems, nothing extraordinary.
I'd also like better companion AI that won't immediately follow you unless they see an open path with no enemy sight lines, or at least use cover more instead of the random running in open they do. Also, something like Shadow Tactics: Blades of the Shogun "shadow mode", where you point towards an area to do a contextual maneuver, queue it, and then activate it at a specific time in sync with your own attack/distractions/movements.
Another would be a more fleshed out crafting system, that lets you make some more interesting cobbled together tools that allow for fun ways to fight or more importantly more ways to stealth. Which I guess leads into the last thing I want...better stealth. No Naughty Dog game has impressed me in this area, because they give you too few tools to make avoidance or subterfuge interesting, and the level design doesn't give you much variance of approach.
Also, the melee system needs an overhaul. It maybe look nice and brutal, but I want more than press button to activate finisher animation.
The problems with Last of Us gameplay is they don't put enough nuance or depth into any one system, so you get a cluster of serviceable gameplay systems, nothing extraordinary.
Chuck Norris
Banned
There isn't a lot to improve on but there are some things they can do
AI - while the AI was fantastic it wasn't quite at the level of he E3 demo. Just continue to improve upon the base
Sandbox environments - far more interactivity again the base was good but let me scavenge for far more than bricks and bottles. Let me block doors with a cupboard or chair in a dynamic way. Let me set wire traps across door ways. Make the environments big enough that there is less predictability. I'm thinking RE4's village across the whole game but better
Item building - resources are scarce in this world. Less reliance on what should be a limited amount of ammunition and guns and more building of custom weapons
AI - while the AI was fantastic it wasn't quite at the level of he E3 demo. Just continue to improve upon the base
Sandbox environments - far more interactivity again the base was good but let me scavenge for far more than bricks and bottles. Let me block doors with a cupboard or chair in a dynamic way. Let me set wire traps across door ways. Make the environments big enough that there is less predictability. I'm thinking RE4's village across the whole game but better
Item building - resources are scarce in this world. Less reliance on what should be a limited amount of ammunition and guns and more building of custom weapons
Less enemies with better AI:
The first game had pretty good AI for what it was, but I remember hearing how they were constrained by the RAM of the PS3. Well, ND you got a bunch more to work with now, go crazy.
Seriously, I want an encounter with a single person to be life or death, and 5 dudes should make me want to shit my pants.
Different infected/behavior:
Don't go RE4 crazy with the designs, cause that could really ruin the mode they are going for. Keep the designs simple but make them different by the way they look and especially how they act. Could add a lot to the combat.
Human+Infected Combat:
They did this in the DLC, so I don't see how it would be difficult. Just improve on the way they acted and reacted to each other and you.
Better ways to mask loading times:
I am well aware this was used to allow the gMr to load, but it still wasn't fun. I know it'd be wierd as fuck to have actual puzzles in this game, but nobody likes finding planks and ladders and shit. Front load the shit out of the loading if you have to. Seriously, I will wait 5 minutes to start the game just don't make me have to go swimming for planks so much.
That's all I can think of for now. I'll add any more if I can think of them.
The first game had pretty good AI for what it was, but I remember hearing how they were constrained by the RAM of the PS3. Well, ND you got a bunch more to work with now, go crazy.
Seriously, I want an encounter with a single person to be life or death, and 5 dudes should make me want to shit my pants.
Different infected/behavior:
Don't go RE4 crazy with the designs, cause that could really ruin the mode they are going for. Keep the designs simple but make them different by the way they look and especially how they act. Could add a lot to the combat.
Human+Infected Combat:
They did this in the DLC, so I don't see how it would be difficult. Just improve on the way they acted and reacted to each other and you.
Better ways to mask loading times:
I am well aware this was used to allow the gMr to load, but it still wasn't fun. I know it'd be wierd as fuck to have actual puzzles in this game, but nobody likes finding planks and ladders and shit. Front load the shit out of the loading if you have to. Seriously, I will wait 5 minutes to start the game just don't make me have to go swimming for planks so much.
That's all I can think of for now. I'll add any more if I can think of them.
TLOU had deeply satisfying gameplay past Bill's town all the way to the end a dozen hours later as you had plenty of stuff to keep you busy with.
Uncharted has gameplay pacing problems in that it's not fully intriguing mechanically at all times.
Uncharted has gameplay pacing problems in that it's not fully intriguing mechanically at all times.
- Give us way more crafting options and deepen this aspect (but keep it grounded with limited resources and no positive-reinforcement).
- Tools which lets us dismantle objects for crafting resources.
- Limited inventory space so you have to ration your tools & resources and make choices (making every play-through 'unique').
- Include some really nasty, more 'out there' mutations.
- I loved that crafting and everything concerning the backpack was handled in real time not pausing the action. Keep this.
- For a second play-through (with an unlocked difficulty) have messages like Demon's Souls and invading players ('bandits') !
- Traditional physics puzzles are boring. Scale this way back.
- But building barricades (in a highly customizable ways) could be really cool and tense! Defend a location from waves or from super nasties.
After 5 minutes of walking around the room trying to trigger some other event and nothing happening, I tried shooting around the room to make them evacuate... still nothing happened. Then I decided to shoot the doctor in the foot to make him move his ass.... Instant Death.
What a way to ruin the experience Druckmann. There was no reason you couldn't have just made that a cutscene rather than provide me the illusion of a choice.
FarFromAnyGame
Banned
Listen mode is more realistic than marking enemies and seeing them wherever they are.
It only shows enemies who are close to you and only if they're making sounds hence the "listen" part.
Quiet enemies are not shown.
Characters should be aware of their surroundings and that's one way to deliver that sense to the player.
And BTW, you can turn it off and still enjoy the game. Harder difficulties have it off by default.
I've been playing through TLOU1 and the combat feels stiff after playing Uncharted 4. I hope it gets even more fluid in TLOU2 and more violent.
Vital Tundra
Member
More Interesting AI.
NightShift
Member
Two major things I want.
-Don't have every enemy encounter be in an arena like Uncharted 4. It feels unnatural and would be even worse in TLOU since the series focuses more on realism.
-More mixes of human enemies and infected like what they attempted to do in Left Behind. There's a lot of potential there.
-Don't have every enemy encounter be in an arena like Uncharted 4. It feels unnatural and would be even worse in TLOU since the series focuses more on realism.
-More mixes of human enemies and infected like what they attempted to do in Left Behind. There's a lot of potential there.
I'm probably going to be eaten alive by saying this but... less of an emphasis on stealth. I get that TLOU was a stealth game and asking for the sequel to be less stealth is like asking for a Metal Gear game to be less stealth, but that is how I feel. Uncharted 4 was great in allowing you to choose to stealth or open-combat, but TLOU really didn't support that due to limited supplies and ruthless enemies. I'd love for them to balance the game to where you can actually have a good time with open-combat. It's unlikely as TLOU is a survival horror stealth series, but hey, that's what I'd like.
vpance
Member
And a moveable dumpster as a permanent member of the party.
NightShift
Member
I somewhat agree. The Last of Us should not be a 'good time' with open combat as that would make no sense with its themes but I would like less emphasis on stealth. Those moments where shit goes wrong and you are forced to stand off with agrovated enemies are tense as fuck. It's the closest thing we have had to survival horror since the first Dead Space so I would love more of that. Even though survival horror looks to be returning any way with Resident Evil 7.
Did you miss the giraffe bit in the original? Or the lemur portion in Uncharted 4? Naughty Dog has an amazing reverence toward animals - I remember someone years ago mentioning there was a big Naughty Dog-sponsored shelter in San Diego (IIRC) and most impressive was that zero dollars were spent in the publicity of that charity. You will never, ever harm wildlife in a Naughty Dog game. Even in the context of the fungal outbreak, man is still the motivator of most ills in the world.
John Kowalski
Banned
Yeah they need to at least be able to hold a conversation for longer than five minutes or else i'm out of there.
Catalix
And on the sixth day the LORD David Bowie created man and woman in His image. And he saw that it was good. On the seventh day the LORD created videogames so that He might take the bloody day off for once.
Ah, a nemesis type system. Good call, makes sense.
I can actually undestand not liking the stealthier approach. It can get tiring after a while. But I did recently watch a girl basically shotgun her way through the entire game, expressing her distaste for stealth every step of the way lol. So being extra aggressive is definitely a viable option in the first game. She actively avoided scavanging as well. She still very much enjoyed herself.
She was playing on normal though.
FarFromAnyGame
Banned
Don't count on that.
Well y'know other than Ottsels and Bandicoots.
There was a close up of Ellie shooting a rabbit with an arrow and a section where you were hunting a deer in the first game. They showed that Ellie both loved animals but was also willing to hunt to survive. Those things aren't mutually exclusive.
There isn't player agency in that cutscene, it's survival. It's like the dogs in the Pittsburgh section or the giraffes in Utah. You can't discharge your firearm at them.
Also Callous' (the horse's) death can't be enacted by the player directly.
Edit (add'l): The rabbit cutscene, I mean. The deer is necessary for Joel and Ellie's survival, and it demonstrates that she's learned well from him.
davidwhangchoi
Member
a section you play when she's playing the guitar.
Catalix
And on the sixth day the LORD David Bowie created man and woman in His image. And he saw that it was good. On the seventh day the LORD created videogames so that He might take the bloody day off for once.
No joke, I would enjoy this.
Bioshock Infjnite will tide you over until TLOUP2.
Make it possible for a %100 stealth playthrough if you wanted. No forced encounters unless part of a cinema.
Dynamic weather that impacts vision: Snowstorms, dust, fog, heavy rain. Up that tension level.
Open ended partner system: If you want to befriend a dog and have it as your tag along NPC, you can... or simply leave the dog be. Or choose start a friendship or relationship with someone and let them tag along and impact story (maybe you choose a someone who betrays you). Just give more interaction and choice with the NPC partner.
More pallets... because why swim?
Dynamic weather that impacts vision: Snowstorms, dust, fog, heavy rain. Up that tension level.
Open ended partner system: If you want to befriend a dog and have it as your tag along NPC, you can... or simply leave the dog be. Or choose start a friendship or relationship with someone and let them tag along and impact story (maybe you choose a someone who betrays you). Just give more interaction and choice with the NPC partner.
More pallets... because why swim?
wapplew
Member
Sure, Left behind have Ellie play imaginary arcade, TLOU2 can have mini rhythm game.
texhnolyze
Banned
I'm already happy with the core gameplay from the first game.
What I would want for the sequel is one thing: choice. Give us branching paths with multiple endings. No need to make dozens of endings like in some RPGs, just 2 or maybe 3 (good, normal, bad) endings would do just fine for this kind of game. It'll improve the replayability a lot, so that people have a reason to replay instead of just aiming for them trophies.
I believe you can do it ND, if you want.
What I would want for the sequel is one thing: choice. Give us branching paths with multiple endings. No need to make dozens of endings like in some RPGs, just 2 or maybe 3 (good, normal, bad) endings would do just fine for this kind of game. It'll improve the replayability a lot, so that people have a reason to replay instead of just aiming for them trophies.
I believe you can do it ND, if you want.
TheSpaceBetween
Member
-First and most importantly, they need to, at the VERY least, double the enemy variety.
-Second most important, for the love of God, no boss battles Naughty Dog. I love you, but you are fucking garbage at them.
-If you are going to rely so much on stealth, you need to make it less bare bones. Give us more options to take enemies out quietly.
-DO NOT make the game longer than the amount of time the gameplay remains engaging just for the story's sake.
-No more crafting
-No forced slow walking
-No Quick time events
-Make it more challenging than the first one. They expressed how you need to be conservative with your resources, but there was rarely a case where you actually needed to use your bullets- most enemies were easily dispatched with stealth or straight fist.
-For friendly AI to not run around like idiots around while you are trying to be stealthy.
-No finding conveniently placed object to push somewhere to reach higher ground "puzzles"
-Second most important, for the love of God, no boss battles Naughty Dog. I love you, but you are fucking garbage at them.
-If you are going to rely so much on stealth, you need to make it less bare bones. Give us more options to take enemies out quietly.
-DO NOT make the game longer than the amount of time the gameplay remains engaging just for the story's sake.
-No more crafting
-No forced slow walking
-No Quick time events
-Make it more challenging than the first one. They expressed how you need to be conservative with your resources, but there was rarely a case where you actually needed to use your bullets- most enemies were easily dispatched with stealth or straight fist.
-For friendly AI to not run around like idiots around while you are trying to be stealthy.
-No finding conveniently placed object to push somewhere to reach higher ground "puzzles"
The focus should be interactions with AI. I should feel that they are real humans trying to survive. They should value their own survival above all else and the player should have a choice whether to kill them or not. AI vs AI should play a big role and would make for some dynamic fights.
Environmental interaction is another thing I want to see. Days Gone is supposed to heavily feature it so it would be cool to see it in The Last of Us as well. We should be able block doors and windows, create cover and shelter, set environmental traps, etc.
Lastly, I'd like to see more types of infected. They can explain it with the fungus evolving after all these years which results in new stages of infection and it can now infect other mammals as well.
Combine the above together and you get some really interesting and dynamic combat. Then add a co-op survival mode that allows us to use all of the above.
Environmental interaction is another thing I want to see. Days Gone is supposed to heavily feature it so it would be cool to see it in The Last of Us as well. We should be able block doors and windows, create cover and shelter, set environmental traps, etc.
Lastly, I'd like to see more types of infected. They can explain it with the fungus evolving after all these years which results in new stages of infection and it can now infect other mammals as well.
Combine the above together and you get some really interesting and dynamic combat. Then add a co-op survival mode that allows us to use all of the above.
Benzychenz
Member
More puzzles and less combat.
Graphics Horse
Member
Ellie can turn into and out of being a clicker at will. And she learned to fucking swim.
Neverthelesser
Member
MORE CRAFTING OPTIONS!
Domcorleone
Member
huh? thats like a core part of the game? Did you play the game on normal/ easy?
James Sawyer Ford
Gold Member
More set pieces like uncharted
I see no reason why they couldn't have some
I see no reason why they couldn't have some
Comfort Jones
Banned
Don't have enemies absolutely moronically split up once they're aware of you. Don't make take downs so easy and yet drawn out. Seriously strangling guys felt like such a chore and at the same time felt so goofy choking someone out that long with no one in this abandoned building hearing a single noise. Let me hide bodies, let me use hiding places, fuckin anything to actually give it some depth. The stealth is so absurdly bare bones I'm stunned at how people hold the game as some pinnacle of tense gameplay. It was pretty basic to pick off enemies and then run away, hide behind a wall and wait for them to stupidly split up and pick more off in any section that allowed stealth all the way up to the very end of the game.
BLOODED_hands
Member
I would like it if ND would allow us more choices before heading into a battle with humans. Based on the trailer, we know she's going to kill them all but ND should allow us ways to not murder everybody. Knock them out, scare them away, cripple them, etc. Maybe they can implement random ai of scavenger's that aren't hostile and people who just wants to survive. Have them appear randomly in all stages before the end-game. That can also be applied to wildlife.
Ellie is scoping out the location of the enemies and a pack of wolves (or a bear, etc.) appear out of nowhere and attacks the human enemies or the infected. The same can be applied to a roving band of scavengers. Ellie is hiding in a bush and randomly a bunch of scavenger's enter the level and you can hear them planning on how to attack the hostile enemies.
The random scavenger's also have the chances of trusting Ellie based on your action's as Ellie. If you have been murdering nearly everybody during your playthrough, the scavenger's will be able to identify you as Ellie the Demon (or something) and will not attack you and will leave you alone. If you have been playing the game in the middle, the scavenger's will be neutral towards you and will work with you or not help you during a fight. If you are not killing everybody and have offered to help others, the scavenger's are more than likely to aid you and give you supplies. It's the system from MGS4 but x10.
This require's that ND make their levels bigger than normal and I'm not sure if people will like that though.
Ellie is scoping out the location of the enemies and a pack of wolves (or a bear, etc.) appear out of nowhere and attacks the human enemies or the infected. The same can be applied to a roving band of scavengers. Ellie is hiding in a bush and randomly a bunch of scavenger's enter the level and you can hear them planning on how to attack the hostile enemies.
The random scavenger's also have the chances of trusting Ellie based on your action's as Ellie. If you have been murdering nearly everybody during your playthrough, the scavenger's will be able to identify you as Ellie the Demon (or something) and will not attack you and will leave you alone. If you have been playing the game in the middle, the scavenger's will be neutral towards you and will work with you or not help you during a fight. If you are not killing everybody and have offered to help others, the scavenger's are more than likely to aid you and give you supplies. It's the system from MGS4 but x10.
This require's that ND make their levels bigger than normal and I'm not sure if people will like that though.
ChronotriggerJM
Member
Expand on crafting, make weapons more janky, but give me more makeshift options.
Hiding would be awesome.
Listen mode that's actually just focused listening.
Hiding would be awesome.
Listen mode that's actually just focused listening.
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
It's mostly a question of what I don't want: open world.
I feel like the people who want less forced slow walking segments and less cutscenes and the such. Want a different game all together. That isn't to say those things solely define TLOU but they did help letting you breathe in the atmosphere and the such. Honestly where some of my favorite moments.