This is not going to happen, you know this.
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Digital Foundry: Xbox Scorpio
- Thread starter LelouchZero
- Start date
This is not going to happen, you know this.
Scorpio screams 399 to me as well...Outside of the cooling expense. Seems like a logical progression from ps4 pro one year later. It's a super charged Jaguar and RX480 with 12gb gddr5.
Question is does ps4 pro go to 299 and ps4 199.
Why would Rockstar want to talk down the version of RDR2 that will sell the most by far worldwide.
I'm sure DF will run tests so you'll know what version to get. Though I would expect Scorpio to run the best. Shame there won't be a PC version at launch.
Question is does ps4 pro go to 299 and ps4 199.
Why would Rockstar want to talk down the version of RDR2 that will sell the most by far worldwide.
I'm sure DF will run tests so you'll know what version to get. Though I would expect Scorpio to run the best. Shame there won't be a PC version at launch.
SolidusDave
Member
No, only if the Scorpio wouldn't achieve 4k for most games. The other way around, the OG XB1 should not be advertised as a 1080p gaming system. While the OG PS4 is one.
Now if the OG XB1 on top of that would also only play DVDs...
That's cool but doesn't contradict anything I wrote
Sad Affleck
Member
It is in theory, at Xbox One quality and framerates.
Well whatever theory you are referring to isn't reality.
No it's not, not general case 'PS4 quality'. It's not a round 4x more powerful than PS4, which is what you would need theoretically to guarantee that.
It might take 1080p XB1 games to 4K relatively easily, if they were only really ALU-bound at least, but that's another matter. And if Scorpio is to 4K what XB1 was to 1080p, people could easily argue that that's not exactly a resounding endorsement (regardless of Pro being even further below that mark or not).
Scorpio won't be a general, compromise-free '4K PS4'. There'll be less compromises than with Pro of course. It doesn't make it half-assed for 2017 any more than Pro was for 2016.
edit - I see this is already being talked about...
hanspampel
Banned
Going by the one screenshot we have, it does look a bit bad though.
edit:
The image I mentioned. Give it some proper AA and there goes the 66% GPU utilization.
Yes adding more stuff than just 4k would further demand the GPS. And glad there is headroom for that. At least forza. How other games will turn out, we'll see.
That screenshot performance of Forza is masterful PR. You have a one (ONE) screenshot of one game in one situation with FPS,GPU and memory usage. No video, no other game and people already project those gains to other games thinking it will be simillar.
I think it will at 1080p. 4K 60FPS for most games doesn't seem likely.
I think it will at 1080p. 4K 60FPS for most games doesn't seem likely.
how can it not?
Literally will max out any non VR game in active development at 4K probably.
Not to mention gameplay at 1080p will open up more resources
hard to make a game that would run slower than 1080/60 on this thing
StoppedInTracks
Member
I think this will be a great, really powerful console (I own both PS4+XBone) that will be a waste of time and money becuase of:
- PS4 parity from EA, Activision, Ubi etc.
- XBox One parity (no games exclusive to Scorpio)
- lack of MS investment in 1st party IPs (Scalebound cancelled etc.)
It is up to MS to prove me wrong of course. I think they would win big if they showed a Scorpi exclusive title but looking at PS4 Pro it just ain't gonna happen
- PS4 parity from EA, Activision, Ubi etc.
- XBox One parity (no games exclusive to Scorpio)
- lack of MS investment in 1st party IPs (Scalebound cancelled etc.)
It is up to MS to prove me wrong of course. I think they would win big if they showed a Scorpi exclusive title but looking at PS4 Pro it just ain't gonna happen
You are setting yourself up for disappointment.
Why would they say anything either way? They didn't come forth and say the PS4 had the best console version of GTA5.
You can at least expect the Scorpio to have the edge in absolute resolution and frame rate consistency of course.
Any XB1 game with a 30hz CPU frametime is an unlikely candidate. So that's not going to be hard at all.
Frostman
Member
This is a ridiculous expectation to have. Why don't you just relax and wait and see, rather than set yourself up for disappointment. This machine isn't going to run many games at 1080/60.
🤔I think this will be a great, really powerful console (I own both PS4+XBone) that will be a waste of time and money becuase of:
- PS4 parity from EA, Activision, Ubi etc.
- XBox One parity (no games exclusive to Scorpio)
- lack of MS investment in 1st party IPs (Scalebound cancelled etc.)
It is up to MS to prove me wrong of course. I think they would win big if they showed a Scorpi exclusive title but looking at PS4 Pro it just ain't gonna happen
So I assume the pro is a waste as well then? Throwing out the forced 16xAF.
It's a much bigger step than anything else and I'm not sure why you want Scorpio exclusives games. Exclusive games are bad for us and while at it should Sony make their games Pro exclusive too?
Lack of first party investment? Sure, I'd like more from them but please give up the scalebound already. They have a lot of games of all genres and we haven't even seen E3 yet which I expect some more announcements.
Milly Osworth
Member
Will this be the ultimate 1080/60 box? That would be naaaaaais.
There will never be such a thing. Oh wait...
should point out I'm not even a certainty to own the thing.
the raw numbers are huge, hard to see 60fps not becoming a lot more achievable
granted many older games are specifically coded for 30fps
Can they afford to take a hit on hardware costs? Sony murdered themselves with the PS3.
Head.spawn
Junior Member
60fps is almost always doable with the right sacrafices... Now whether a developer wants to aim there or not is a completely different question altogether. A lot of them don't.
The fact that you care about this means you're the niche of the niche of the niche. Just now PS4 has reached the 200 price point (not officially yet) and Pro is 400. The Pro is the niche machine, that's why it's not even advertised to a greater degree. Sony has no interest in investing tons of money into new hardware again. Pro is fine for now.
Business isn't as easy as making arguments on a message board. 400 makes perfect message board sense. But at some point reality is more important. If MS loses too much at 400, they won't sell it at 400.
Well if that screenshot is anything to go by then yes.
That said when im going native 4k or downsampling on PC I don't normally need AA so not really sure whats going on with that pic.
I appreciate that was only thrown together a couple of days ago though.
cartoon_soldier
Member
That is important point, this was not something specifically built for Scorpio.
4k via reconstruction has shown itself to be highly effective, and considering consoles are naturally limited in power vs high end PCs, that seems like an efficient approach. If MS goes native 4k that'll be a waste IMO
Both systems are similar. The biggest difference is the marketing messaging behind both. Sony more protective of the core PS4 as it is doing so well, so pro had a slightly softer marketing message. MS have nothing to lose so they're going all in on pushing this as a huge leap in performance.
Because graphic sells, frames don't in the console market.
Jaguar Victory
Member
Right. But it will sure as hell run a lot more things at 4K. And with better textures. Why are we pretending this is not a thing?
Who's pretending that? Especially Matt? Come on. Dude has been spot-on all this time.
Richard Ledbetter has stated several times that this is the Premium option, whereas the S is the value option.
He believes there is less overlap between the Xbox One and Scorpio users than there is on the PS4/Pro. It's going to be pitched as the hardcore option, for the people that really care about this stuff.
Name some things that significantly increase the price compared to ps pro?
Well that's true but seems fairly obvious? Xbox one was already lower power than PS4, and Scorpio is more powerful than pro. So basically XB1 < PS4 < ps pro < Scorpio
So any existing Xbox customers will see much bigger improvements moving to Scorpio, than PS4 owners did if they moved to pro
Jaguar Victory
Member
Why? That makes no sense. Please explain.
Shpeshal Nick
aka Collingwood
The fact that Sony still won't bundle with the Pro tells me that they're either breaking even, or have a razor thin margin on the Pro.
No way they drop it $100 in a year. It'll be $349 when Scorpio releases at $399.
Yes, AA is needed to avoid certain artifacts like crawling and shimmering. This has little to do with resolution.
UHD drive, cooling, Memory, the whole R&D process (MS certainly spent more than Sony on this regard) and I am sure other things as well...
Why is everyone acting as if 499 is unreasonable all of a sudden? Hell, even DF guys (who we are considering pretty knowledgeable of these things) suggested 499$ as the price tag.... and remember they had an exclusive showing with MS and I am sure MS was provided with a draft of their article/video prior to them going public.
Also, you should take into consideration the fact that MS themselves marketed Scorpio as a high end hardcore console machine, implying that it aint gonna come cheap. Thats the company that launched with a 499$ XB1 system.
All in all, I think 499$ is pretty damn reasonable and an amazing price for what you get.
Flintty
Member
Why wouldn't they? They have been shaken by PS4s amazing success and need to get bums on seats. Making a loss on hardware fits with their business strategy of games as a service. If they can get the numbers in they'll be happy. I'm sure they made a loss on OG Xbox (memory fails me).
scoobs
Member
I think before the reveal many people thought it would have an entirely new CPU and GPU (Vega not Polaris, Ryzen not Jaguar), when its actually just the same as the Pros just clocked way higher. That makes me think they'll be able to keep the cost down.
They might not bundle to guarantee it's third parties sales.
It might matter there because the Pro customers are core gamers buying at full price anyway and not old greatest hits releases.
Hoo-doo, the jaguar is evolved!
The larger chip at higher clockrates. I don't know if they plan to release a regular Xbox One based on binned Scorpio parts, but if they don't they might throw away a lot of chips not hitting the high clockrates.
You didn't watch the DF video did you? Your wrong.
Also, it's going to be $499, Spencer has gone out of his way to hint at premium price, $399 is not premium pricing. There's alot of kit and R&D cost in there. Jesus.
even the one s has a uhd drive and thats cheap as piss