It's total fucking bullshit.
I can go into a battle with a normal enemy with full health and then all the enemies decide to attack me at once and kill MC. I shouldn't have to lose hours of progress because the enemy spotted me first and attacked me.
I just got back literally just now from dying in P5 again, I have lost probably a good 5 hours worth of progress due to deaths and I'm only on the 4th dungeon
Wow I haven't bumped into that mechanic since the Shining Force games. It sucked then an I'm sure it'd suck now...
wtf? I looked up what mudo is and no just no. I've long cried out agains instant death moves so putting them in the very first area is just plain awful. Was kinda bummed when checking around on PSN for demos last week an not seeing one for this game but ya know what its fine. This ones definitely not for me!
I haven't played p5 yet. I have played other games that do this. While it's not my preference due to aesthetic reasons, I have to admit it adds some strategy to the game. A tiny bit like the goal of capturing the king in chess.
And it introduces the tension of death. Take classic ff; a character goes to 0 hp and there is no impression of death. You just pop a phoenix down. At best, you feel a warning knell of death since if you let it happen to the other three, you really die. With the mc required, when a supporting character dies, you think "that could have been me".
I wasn't a big fan of this in Persona 3 or 4 either.
Always felt more like an annoyance to deal with, rather than being some sort of interesting tactical consideration.
Preparation so that it doesn't happen is part of skill. It makes battles more strategic.
Instant death moves in rpgs pretty much always have a low chance of working. The times that they do work almost always suck unless its literally the first battle of a given session.Mudo has a very low chance of actually hitting you. It's not as big a deal as you think it is.
Came out like 2 weeks ago and its already an all time classic huh? That kinda hyperbole don't work on me! I mean I just got a PS4 last week with exactly 0 of the big name super hype games to accompany it.This is stupid. Don't not play one of the best games of the generation because a single enemy's attack. Come on, son.
Instant death moves in rpgs pretty much always have a low chance of working. The times that they do work almost always suck unless its literally the first battle of a given session.
It's total fucking bullshit.
I can go into a battle with a normal enemy with full health and then all the enemies decide to attack me at once and kill MC. I shouldn't have to lose hours of progress because the enemy spotted me first and attacked me.
I just got back literally just now from dying in P5 again, I have lost probably a good 5 hours worth of progress due to deaths and I'm only on the 4th dungeon
Wow I haven't bumped into that mechanic since the Shining Force games. It sucked then an I'm sure it'd suck now...
wtf? I looked up what mudo is and no just no. I've long cried out agains instant death moves so putting them in the very first area is just plain awful. Was kinda bummed when checking around on PSN for demos last week an not seeing one for this game but ya know what its fine. This ones definitely not for me!
I fail to see how it doesn't add giving tactical consideration to the game?
wtf? I looked up what mudo is and no just no. I've long cried out agains instant death moves so putting them in the very first area is just plain awful. Was kinda bummed when checking around on PSN for demos last week an not seeing one for this game but ya know what its fine. This ones definitely not for me!
To be fair, you're only getting one-shotted if you're getting ambushed which you can (almost always) prevent. Even the Mudo-using enemies in the first dungeon are weak to gun and easily taken down, and landing an ambush of your own gives you ample opportunity to prepare and against most enemies.
Well yes, getting a game over does suck. But this instant death skill is particularly easy to avoid.Instant death moves in rpgs pretty much always have a low chance of working. The times that they do work almost always suck unless its literally the first battle of a given session.
Well yes, getting a game over does suck. But this instant death skill is particularly easy to avoid.
You are doing yourself a disservice using this as a reason to avoid the game.
Your starting Persona, Arsene resists Mudo/Dark skills
Been playing on Merciless and the first thing I was having issue with was the idea that it seemed like the end of the dungeon put me 2 levels below what I needed and I spent a minute grinding to get the skill needed to beat the boss.
(having done the 4th dungeon on my first try (there is a funny story about this and it involves a Persona that doesn't take damage from certain things), I'm hoping that I'm beyond this point now since there doesn't seem to be too many unique skills left and it's just a matter of getting my defense and damage up... which still kinda involves grinding I guess because you know you're underleveled if someone can't survive a boss's ultimate attack even with defense buffs and guarding and whatever >_>)
Instant death moves in rpgs pretty much always have a low chance of working. The times that they do work almost always suck unless its literally the first battle of a given session.
Came out like 2 weeks ago and its already an all time classic huh? That kinda hyperbole don't work on me! I mean I just got a PS4 last week with exactly 0 of the big name super hype games to accompany it.
But then, you playing on merciless, so you all about that unfair life.
Merciless mode is kind of weird, difficulty wise. I like how critical hits, weaknesses, and technical attacks have triple damage, and it goes both way. But cutting the amount of experience and money you get down to 40% of it's regular value is more tedious than outright difficult.
I suspect I would be done with this game by now had I been playing on hard or something like a sensible person.
That said, I haven't experimented too much with the hit evasion stuff, actually.
I just assumed that you will get hit at some point in a longer fight, so I don't bother lol
(but then, this might be like... RE7 block button tier, so I should actually give it a go during the next boss fight)
No, he's saying "if you can't handle a little challenge then play the baby mode for babies." It's condescending.He's not...if the protagonist getting knocked out and getting a game over is a huge issue for you, switch to the lowest difficulty where that isnt an issue
The game provides you with numerous methods of avoiding a game over, and save spots are never that far away for you to lose significant progress
SMT titles, in the late game, usually give you some spell a la debilitate, which will lower attack/def/tohit all at once, and another spell to give the whole party att/def/hit increases, precisely because that's kinda expected for the optional bosses, and you could very well be dead by the time you finish casting them (plus it's boring as hell to keep casting those things)
It's pretty dang close to a re7 block button, tbh. Especially important with multihit attacks, since each dmg rolls for a separate tohit.
Bull shit. I've not played the enhanced edition but this sure as hell wasn't the case in the original games.They don't even know that in Baldur's gate serie you don't have a game over when Mc dies.
Does safety mode mean no insta death moves and no game over if MC dies? If so I'd take that difficulty all day every day. Haven't played an rpg yet where higher difficulty means anything more then higher numbers for baddie stats anyhow, though I still normally pick normal so as not to completely roll over every encounter.Honestly, it's not really as big of a deal as it might seem. The player just needs to be a bit more aware for battles, since it's not one of those rpgs where you can spam attack and expect to breeze through everything. And if it's still problem, you can always switch to the safety difficulty mode.
A chance is still a chance an when it succeeds it sucks hard. Especially if its a game over scenario! >_<You have minimum four chances of taking them out before they even cast it, assuming you are getting player advantage in a game where it's possible to start every fight with advantage. And in the off-hand chance that somehow they do cast it, it's still a really small chance you'll actually get hit by the ability.
Also, the very first Persona you get in the game resists such attacks, so... : \
Well yes, getting a game over does suck. But this instant death skill is particularly easy to avoid.
You are doing yourself a disservice using this as a reason to avoid the game.
Your starting Persona, Arsene resists Mudo/Dark skills
I dunno about TLOU since I never played it. Its a 3rd person survival shooter with a good story by gaming standards right? Not my kinda thing. I played some of Ocarina of Time back in the day an didn't care for it but thats a beloved all time classic. Not every classic is for everybody! If I was ruled by #'s I wouldn't have been obsessively playing Shining Soul recently (meta: 58%)! I think this is okay logic?Was TLOU not one of the seventh generation's best games two weeks after it was released? It was one of the seventh generation's best games the day it released. What is your logic?
You're the one jumping to conclusions by saying you won't play the third highest rated game on PS4 (metacritic) because of one move that enemies (and you) have access to. It's absurd.
Does safety mode mean no insta death moves and no game over if MC dies? If so I'd take that difficulty all day every day. Haven't played an rpg yet where higher difficulty means anything more then higher numbers for baddie stats anyhow, though I still normally pick normal so as not to completely roll over every encounter.
The insta death stuffs just an added sour note to be honest. I've played many rpgs with that in them so on its own its not enough to keep me away, just something to complain about when a cheap party wipe happens because of it an hoping someday devs do away with it. Getting ambushed or critical hit is more than enough random pain chance. Throwing in a "hey you're dead because" is one level of asshole to far lol.
The problem is less management and more the occasional lack of manual dexterity in ambushing creatures because failure to execute an ambush (e.g. you accidentally jumped out of cover or something) generally results in you being surrounded and subject to a ton of hits without the opportunity to switch your defensive persona.
Hey, guess what
For a lot of people this IS their first Persona game
I'm not quite sure why you're being a condescending piece of shit about it
This is stupid. Don't not play one of the best games of the generation because a single enemy's attack. Come on, son.
Using "git gud" for this is absolutely hilarious. What skill is involved in not having RNG fuck you over?
Using "git gud" for this is absolutely hilarious. What skill is involved in not having RNG fuck you over?
Nobody likes this mechanic, they just tolerate it because it's either deal with it or play something else.
So you're playing with a guide at all times to know which demon does what beforehand. That's cool, but don't pretend like that's some display of skill or whatever. Its honestly not that deep, its just RNG catching you off guard.But if you're gud, you're carrying Light- and Dark-resist Persona. And you're never even letting enemies attack. If you're ahead of the level curve -- and you should be -- you can fuse most Persona before you encounter them so you already know if they have Hama or Mudo. There's definitely counter-play.
Everything you said still applies even if the game didn't game over when the MC dies. I would have to deal with them being dead, like you do in plenty of other turn based jrpgs. Choosing who to heal or using group heals, focusing on who to protect and all that are all things you consider in a lot of other jrpg combat systems.
I know the common argument for why it's done here is because of how powerful the MC is and how it would make the game too easy if they changed it. But in that case, I would rather they re-balance the whole system. I personally feel like the MC is too powerful/useful compared to your party members anyways so I would be totally fine with them changing things in a future game.
Bull shit. I've not played the enhanced edition but this sure as hell wasn't the case in the original games.
Also just because people disagree with a critism doesn't mean they are Fanboys or whatever name you want to call them too discredit them.
Fucking hell, angry much?
Using "git gud" for this is absolutely hilarious. What skill is involved in not having RNG fuck you over?
Nobody likes this mechanic, they just tolerate it because it's either deal with it or play something else.
Yes, I was pretty pissed and in hindsight I probably should have toned it down a bit, but I really really hate when people talk down to others who don't like a certain mechanic or don't understand how to play "properly." The advice he gave was good but his attitude bothered me.
It's funny to all these post from SMT newcomers.
I created a simple FAQ
1. Mudo/Hama is bullshit
A: Create a demon/persona with Resist/Repel/Null these elements
2. I don't want to fuse <insert first persona/demon>
A: You have to, it's basically how you progress.
3. Matador is impossible or <insert demon/boss> 1 hit me
A: Kaja and Kunda spell, use it. Pay attention to your weakness and enemy weakness and exploit it. Unlike most JRPG, buff, debuff, weakness, and status ailments are extremely important in SMT games and it's the only way you can survive through the game especially in higher difficulty. Matador boss in Nocturne is basically there to make sure you don't progress further without understanding the game mechanic.
To OP: Lower the difficulty if you don't enjoy these mechanic and stay away from Nocturne.
In persona 5 at least it's pretty easy to get a null curse or bless persona especially with lockup.Oh come on. You can't seriously be saying that one should only be using Persona that at least Resist both Mudo and Hama (or have an anti-Instadeath skill) for the entire game (or until your party memebrs get Protect or you have a bunch of Homunculus). That's like saying you shouldn't use most of the Persona in the game (which is why Hama / Mudo are bullshit).
Ehh Persona 5 is pretty much Persona 4 New Script Edition. I love the game but it's hardly surprising or revolutionary.