Support NeoGAF

[kyser73]

What? I never disputed that at all.

And the fact that you expect these companies to lie to you and are seemingly ok with it is telling. This is the perfect example of what companies strive to achieve from consumers and what they think their rights are.

My point all along is that we as consumers should be advocating for more transparency in these situations...

It's not just 'these companies' it's a learned response to all advertising & marketing.

 

[Laughing Banana]

Regardless of who is at fault here, EA or Sony, for those saying "what's the issue?", you folks don't see the problem of presenting something as running on something that is not representative of that actual platform? If a game runs like a charm on platform A but shit on platform B, for example, you don't have an issue of them using footage from platform A to sell the game to people owning platform B, claiming that the footage is played on B?

 

[rokkerkory]

This is just all so funny.

 

[EmiPrime]

I'm not.

But demo's are demo's and in this case it was targeted at a specific hardware.

What I was positing is that it might not have been possible to run the same exact demo on any other console because it may have been pushing this one to it's max while at the same time actually achieving it's target even though it's rare. I'm saying that there could be effects that have been added to this that they are pretty sure are achievable here but not on other hardware.

I'm also saying that we don't know. Therefore transparency is the best option for the sake of the consumer.

How many consumers that see this are even going to understand the things that you or others here do who are more involved in this stuff than normal?

That is my point. For the consumer, it is just best to be as transparent as possible.

I really don't think at least labeling their footage is unreasonable at all.

You're still assuming this is Xbox footage. I don't believe for one second that they have it running at 2160c at a rock solid 30fps on a console (one that isn't even out yet and would have been using the old SDK that doesn't have access to all its power) this early in development. Why optimise this early on? It would be a huge waste of time.

Maybe there should be a disclaimer stating that it's running on a PC but I maintain that for these heavily scripted alpha vertical slices the hardware is barely relevant. They're not advertising anything resembling a finished product.

 

[VlaudTheImpaler]

It's not just 'these companies' it's a learned response to all advertising & marketing.

Yeah, that's actually what I meant. Sorry if I made it seem like it was just the ones involved.

 

[Aselith]

Regardless of who is at fault here, EA or Sony, for those saying "what's the issue?", you folks don't see the problem of presenting something as running on something that is not representative of that actual platform? If a game runs like a charm on platform A but shit on platform B, for example, you don't have an issue of them using footage from platform A to sell the game to people owning platform B, claiming that the footage is played on B?

This game is not coming out until late next year. No platform that this is shown on will be representative of the final product

 

[VlaudTheImpaler]

You're still assuming this is Xbox footage. I don't believe for one second that they have it running at 2160c at a rock solid 30fps on a console (one that isn't even out yet and would have been using the old SDK that doesn't have access to all its power) this early in development. Why optimise this early on? It would be a huge waste of time.

Maybe there should be a disclaimer stating that it's running on a PC but I maintain that for these heavily scripted alpha vertical slices the hardware is barely relevant. They're not advertising anything resembling a finished product.

Dude, I'm not assuming anything,

Most of the time this is true and as I've been saying, I think this should be stated when footage is used to advertise.

However, I believe it has been confirmed that it was running on a 1X.

"In a previous version of this article, we stated that it wasn't clear what hardware this demo was running on - in fact, EA's Patrick Soderlund does confirm that it is a real-time Xbox One X demonstration. Many apologies for the error, we will have a deeper look at the demo very soon, but we can confirm 2160p checkerboarding from our tests - something that would be unlikely on PC and very much in line with Frostbite's console technologies."

Unless this was proven false?

EDIT: I just realized I butchered the quote on that lol. That was digital Foundry quoting Patrick. So a quote within a quote. It was confusing.

 

[RuhRo]

Surprising that they're claiming it's not PC footage, if that continues to fact-check. I'd just assumed that's what it was.

 

[Wollan]

Fighting over PC footage for a game releasing two-three years from now (but no doubts that XBX can display those visuals, just thinking it's too early to having bothered fitting it onto there?). Likely the various gameplay systems displayed are shells of intended development, real-time concept demo.

edit: Confirmed XBX footage.

 

[Uno Venova]

it's like watching dancing puppets

 

[VlaudTheImpaler]

This game is not coming out until late next year. No platform that this is shown on will be representative of the final product

If it is indeed running on a 1X though it could be pushing it as is and if that is so it would be even less of a representation of the game on other platforms.

Regardless. Transparency hurts no one but maybe some companies.

It absolutely benefits the consumer though because it is more information for us regardless.

Fighting over PC footage for a game releasing two-three years from now.

See my post above yours.

 

[wachie]

OP, how do you know its Sony who did this and not the pub?

Fighting over PC footage for a game releasing two-three years from now.

lol

 

[Purest 78]

Regardless of who is at fault here, EA or Sony, for those saying "what's the issue?", you folks don't see the problem of presenting something as running on something that is not representative of that actual platform? If a game runs like a charm on platform A but shit on platform B, for example, you don't have an issue of them using footage from platform A to sell the game to people owning platform B, claiming that the footage is played on B?

Companies have shown games running on PC for years.

 

[DMONKUMA]

I mean doesn't this stuff usually happen? I mean in terms of reusing gameplay trailers and such for advertisement?

 

[Floody]

I'm not.

But demo's are demo's and in this case it was targeted at a specific hardware.

What I was positing is that it might not have been possible to run the same exact demo on any other console because it may have been pushing this one to it's max while at the same time actually achieving it's target even though it's rare. I'm saying that there could be effects that have been added to this that they are pretty sure are achievable here but not on other hardware.

I'm also saying that we don't know. Therefore transparency is the best option for the sake of the consumer.

How many consumers that see this are even going to understand the things that you or others here do who are more involved in this stuff than normal?

That is my point. For the consumer, it is just best to be as transparent as possible.

I really don't think at least labeling their footage is unreasonable at all.

Those people will most likely just assume what was shown will be what it'll look like on their platform too, regardless of it saying only "representative of X platform" in small print at the end of the video, they stopped watching before it even showed up (which is where it'd go if they got forced to be 100% transparent with that) and by the time it releases probably won't even remember anyway. Now if the game is close to release I think it's a different story, but 18+ months out, there's a good chance it's bs anyway, the button prompts are just the most obvious now.

Also I'd imagine they'd force 3rd party to remove all button prompts if they were forced to be 100% transparent and still show it running on different, likely more powerful hardware most of the time. Just with a tiny bit of smallprint saying it's "running on PS/PC/Xbox/Ninty hardware and subject to change." at the end. Sony/MS/Nintendo will never give the other free marketing by making it stand out if it doesn't benefit them the most.

 

[Head.spawn]

Jeez, not a thread worth you want to lose your account over.

Namaste.

 

[Dlacy13g]

Companies have shown games running on PC for years.

Yup...and when it's posed as console footage gamers lost their shit over it as they were being sold a false bill of goods. So why should we suddenly be ok with this?

 

[Laughing Banana]

This game is not coming out until late next year. No platform that this is shown on will be representative of the final product

Then tell the audience that, instead of editing buttons in videos/photoshopping images to make a false impression of things.

Companies have shown games running on PC for years.

How many times have they actually tried to make it so that the footage is running on a platform that they are advertising the video for but it's actually not?

I don't understand how people can be so okay with stuff like this.

 

[ThatOneMexican]

This happened the other way around a few years ago if I remember correctly. Xbox trailer with PlayStation button prompts. I'll have to look for it.

 

[ArtHands]

This game is not coming out until late next year. No platform that this is shown on will be representative of the final product

Then why bother overlaying the PS4 button prompts over it?

 

[Floody]

Then tell the audience that, instead of editing buttons in videos/photoshopping images to make a false impression of things.



How many times have they actually tried to make it so that the footage is running on a platform that they are advertising the video for but it's actually not?

I don't understand how people can be so okay with stuff like this.

Every time they all upload identical trailers to their channels with just a PS, Xbox or whoever logo at the end.

Then why bother overlaying the PS4 button prompts over it?

To let as many people know it's also coming to PS4, which is all EA and Sony care about at this point.

 

[VlaudTheImpaler]

Those people will most likely just assume what was shown will be what it'll look like on their platform too, regardless of it saying only "representative of X platform" in small print at the end of the video, they stopped watching before it even showed up (which is where it'd go if they got forced to be 100% transparent with that) and by the time it releases probably won't even remember anyway. Now if the game is close to release I think it's a different story, but 18+ months out, there's a good chance it's bs anyway, the button prompts are just the most obvious now.

Also I'd imagine they'd force 3rd party to remove all button prompts if they were forced to be 100% transparent and still show it running on different, likely more powerful hardware most of the time. Just with a tiny bit of smallprint saying it's "running on PS/PC/Xbox/Ninty hardware and subject to change." at the end. Sony/MS/Nintendo will never give the other free marketing by making it stand out if it doesn't benefit them the most.

The bolded is speculation. And even if it happened it would still be a step in the right direction. IMO Just because some might miss it doesn't mean all would. People would figure out what to look for and it would become standard practice. I'd still fight for more transparency in that case though.

I don't think that would become an issue though. I think that pubs would actually start making versions for different platforms if they wanted to make console versions of demos. Either that, or they would make more demo's running on PC but targeted toward x platform and that would be even easier for them to make versions of for different platforms with PC being the lead like it almost always is for multiplat games anyway. Either way, if it became common place the process would eventually end up getting streamlined as to keep costs down.

As it stands, the way it is now only benefits the companies not the consumer. I'd like more information and transparency for the products I'm being sold especially when we are talking about companies trying to keep consumers firmly in their ecosystems.

 

[Raitosaito]

Regardless of who is at fault here, EA or Sony, for those saying "what's the issue?", you folks don't see the problem of presenting something as running on something that is not representative of that actual platform? If a game runs like a charm on platform A but shit on platform B, for example, you don't have an issue of them using footage from platform A to sell the game to people owning platform B, claiming that the footage is played on B?

Its not coming out for quite awhile. None of this is running on an actual real time enviroment of either consoles.

 

[Mass Effect]

how is this thread 10 pages?

 

[Dynomutt]

how is this thread 10 pages?

People are bored. This is one of the dumbest threads in recent memory. Also that thinly veiled cover of advocacy is getting tiring.

This is about a trailer for game we all know is coming out. My head hurts.

 

[VlaudTheImpaler]

Its not coming out for quite awhile. None of this is running on an actual real time enviroment of either consoles.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=242458161&postcount=457

 

[ArtHands]

Every time they all upload identical trailers to their channels with just a PS, Xbox or whoever logo at the end.




To let as many people know it's also coming to PS4, which is all EA and Sony care about at this point.

That is a weak excuse...they can simply overlay a phase "coming to PS4" at the corner of the video, to tell people that it is coming to PS4.

Take less work then overlaying the button prompts, and also more direct and easier to communicate that message.

 

[VlaudTheImpaler]

People are bored. This is one of the dumbest threads in recent memory.

No one is making you read it man.

 

[meirl]

whoa. this is fucked up. Holy shit.

 

[shmoglish]

To be fair I'd be making threads like this if I owned an Xbox one too considering there's been nothing to play on it since 2016

Now they dont have exclusive trailers. Poor Ms.

 

[Floody]

That is a weak excuse...they can simply overlay a phase "coming to PS4" at the corner of the video, to tell people that it is coming to PS4.

Take less work then overlaying the button prompts, and also more direct and easier to communicate that message.

EA and Bioware can sure, but wouldn't really work on Sony's channel would it? They don't want to advertise MS' console. Suppose the could just ask for a cinematic trailer with no UI and very little gameplay and use that, but probably won't be watched as much and still wouldn't be PS4 footage (looking at the Xbox channel they seem to do a lot of that actually).

 

[CryptiK]

whats the difference between a gaming PC and developer PC?

Couple of thousand dollars. Developers generally don't use consumer parts. Just google Workstation cards for the massive difference in consumer graphics cards and industry graphics cards.

 

[Gradly]

This happens a lot, I remember when PlayStation button prompts appeared on Xbox Gameplay of Watch_Dogs before the video edited later

Edit: This screenshot

And there is even a very next level when Xbox button prompts appeared on Tales from Borderlands ep. 4 on a PS4 version:

was playing just there when these button prompts appeared on my screen, I had to double check I was still playing on my ps4 and not my xbox haha.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=upuMqvHf3ng

 

[VlaudTheImpaler]

Well I've tweeted this thread to @PlayStation @Yosp @EA @BioWare asking if they could clear it up.

Anyone I'm missing?

 

[ArtHands]

EA and Bioware can sure, but wouldn't really work on Sony's channel would it? They don't want to advertise MS' console. Suppose the could just ask for a cinematic trailer with no UI and very little gameplay and use that, but probably won't be watched as much and still wouldn't be PS4 footage (looking at the Xbox channel they seem to do a lot of that actually).

They can create and show the same video but without any button prompts

 

[televator]

Well I've tweeted this thread to @PlayStation @Yosp @EA @BioWare asking if they could clear it up.

Anyone I'm missing?

KazHiraiCEO

 

[Floody]

They can create and show the same video but without any button prompts

Oh, sure, but no button prompts or PS button prompts it's still the same issue of being misleading, there's just no way they'd intentionally show Xbox button prompts on their YouTube channel.

 

[SlickShoesRUCrazy]

Are people really arguing about this? Who gives a shit lol.

 

[AlexFlame116]

I'm very curious as to why this thread is 10 pages(!) long but I'm scared to find out.

 

[Midas]

People are bored. This is one of the dumbest threads in recent memory. Also that thinly veiled cover of advocacy is getting tiring.

This is about a trailer for game we all know is coming out. My head hurts.

I saw this thread posted by a Twitter "bot" and thought "oh, well, that's a little bit funny", only to click it and see how large it became. People are really bored, it was the weekend after all.

KazHiraiCEO

Yes, that's the only one who can clean up this mess.

 

[RobRSG]

Game is running on PC, this should be common knowledge.

 

[Chauzu]

I don't understand how this thread is 10 pages long over EA being EA.

 

[Ghost Slayer]

Well I've tweeted this thread to @PlayStation @Yosp @EA @BioWare asking if they could clear it up.

Anyone I'm missing?

yosp? Doesn't he handle 1st party stuffs? Who is running 3rd party relationship now? I can't remember since Boyes left

 

[The_Endgamer]

Might see more of this if publishers opt to show the Xbox One X version for smooth gorgeousness.

Sony bra, get your house in order.

 

[AbandonedTrolley]

Wow

A lot of defensiveness in this thread.

Given that the OP has come out with a unsubstantiated assumption, there's a whole lot of crap all in this thread. But one would guess that the trailer was produced by EA and passed to Sony.

 

[VlaudTheImpaler]

Game is running on PC, this should be common knowledge.

Unfortunately it is common knowledge.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=242458161&postcount=457

 

[Prophaniti]

Well I've tweeted this thread to @PlayStation @Yosp @EA @BioWare asking if they could clear it up

Why?

 

[VlaudTheImpaler]

Why?

Because I don't like to just complain about things. If there is a way that I can do something about something that I don't like then I will try.

 

[ArtHands]

Oh, sure, but no button prompts or PS button prompts it's still the same issue of being misleading, there's just no way they'd intentionally show Xbox button prompts on their YouTube channel.

Its not (as) misleading since they are just leaving it ambiguous by not showing any button prompts at all, rather than slapping on the PS4 button prompts and pass them off as PS4 gameplay.

 

[Christocolus]

Sony and EA just wanted to show the best version of the game.

Lol.