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[Protome]

American McGee said some pretty bad stuff back when Gamergate was relevant but his views always seemed less about being a bigot and more about taking Gamergate at face value rather than the hate group they were. Which is still bad but not bad enough to stop me buying his games.

I believe that was on Kickstarter and it did not get funded. Which is pretty sad since I'd love to see this type of game based off another story.

His card game and fairy tale book was successfully funded though. I skipped out on it but it looked neat.

 

[TriAceJP]

These GamerGate nonsense posts are so overhyped that I can only be reminded that I'm on NeoGAF. You guys need to take it down a few notches.

I would love another Alice game. EA most likely will not fund it, but if it finds a way into existence I will buy it.

 

[Nightwing123]

Wow I did not know about the whole GamerGate and sister thing about him until now.

 

[BlackAlbatross]

Putting GG and Milo on the same level as Anita using the "both sides" argument is pretty enough for me to lose any respect for him.
Shame, because I loved Madness Returns and I'd really like a sequel similar to it.

Just remember though that the last time he pitched an Alice sequel this is what it would have looked like:

 

[Anteater]

I like Alice madness returns despite the slow pacing, I'd play 3, I also want to play the first one...

 

[Lime]

These GamerGate nonsense posts are so overhyped that I can only be reminded that I'm on NeoGAF. You guys need to take it down a few notches.

I would love another Alice game. EA most likely will not fund it, but if it finds a way into existence I will buy it.

The dude is subscribing to misogynist thunderfoot and neonazi Sargon, while throwing out 'SJW' shit, legitimizing harrassment of Anita Sarkeesian, calls harassment 'disagreement', and a whole bunch of other shit.

No idea why people are whitewashing his defense and enabling of gaming's own bigots, MRAs, neo-nazis, and so on.

 

[N° 2048]

I would love another Alice game. EA most likely will not fund it, but if it finds a way into existence I will buy it.

Well said. Day 1 for any Alice game for me.

 

[CSJ]

The dude is subscribing to misogynist thunderfoot and neonazi Sargon, while throwing out 'SJW' shit, legitimizing harrassment of Anita Sarkeesian, calls harassment 'disagreement', and a whole bunch of other shit.

No idea why people are whitewashing his defense and enabling of gaming's own bigots, MRAs, neo-nazis, and so on.

Because nobody has posted anything of the sort that backs up your claims. (Unless I skipped over it.....) Being someone who has no knowledge of what happened, you're doing a bad job presenting anything over what others are posting.

 

[SlipperyMoose]

I actually really enjoyed Madness Returns. It was a little drawn out at some points but still very fun. I hope a game similar to that gets made. Madness Returns is actually backwards compatible on the Xbox One which is cool.

 

[Lime]

Because nobody has posted anything of the sort that backs up your claims. (Unless I skipped over it.....) Being someone who has no knowledge of what happened, you're doing a bad job presenting anything over what others are posting.

I personally don't like all this screencapping of people's social media to this extent, but since people can't be bothered to research themselves (@mods: please delete this post if necessary):

Look at who he is following on Twitter:

Ann Coulter
@AnnCoulter ‏

Bro Team Pill
@BroTeamPill ‏

AlphaOmegaSin
@AlphaOmegaSin ‏

ᖇεɗ ᑭίιι ᖇεѵσιυτίση
@RedPillRe ‏

KotakuInAction
@KotakuInAction ‏

InternetAristocrat
@internetarist ‏

Mark Kern
@Grummz

thunderf00t
@thunderf00t ‏

Matt Jarbo @ PAX
@mundanematt ‏

Paul Watson
@prisonplanet ‏

social media bullshit

https://twitter.com/leighalexander/status/671450574622236672

 

[humansarehorses]

social media bullshit

Jesus Christ. What kind of ridiculous lens are you reading these posts through that they come off as bigoted?

 

[OmegaX]

social media bullshit

He is chilling for Play-Asia? What a monster.

Spoiler

Play-Asia is awesome, I don't care what stupid memes they use as advertisements as long as I can buy stuff I can't get in my country.

 

[ezodagrom]

-snip-

This is all I'm seeing from those pictures:

To be very clear, American McGee's views on censorship and criticism are different than many of ours, and he's a huge advocate towards free speech - even caustic and toxic views - in part because he's lived in China for many years and their own brand of censorship and speech suppression has given him quite a bit of pause.

 

[King Gilga]

To his defense (as much as I am able), someone claiming to be anti-Gamergate threatened to kill him and his sister, and then his sister went missing and is currently presumed dead.

As I said earlier, doesn't excuse it his stance, but this is a messier case than most.

I mean that more than excuses his pretty harmless stances if anything.

 

[BasilZero]

How about pitching EA to rerelease the original Alice on their store again

 

[purseowner]

He is chilling for Play-Asia? What a monster.

Spoiler

Play-Asia is awesome, I don't care what stupid memes they use as advertisements as long as I can buy stuff I can't get in my country.

You can import stuff without supporting Play-Asia. Their anti-feminist agenda deterred me from ever using them again.

 

[Fou-Lu]

Who he follows on Twitter is much more of a statement than the posts themselves.

 

[Indelible]

I think both Alice games are pretty underrated, I would be down for a third one on PS4.

 

[OmegaX]

You can import stuff without supporting Play-Asia. Their anti-feminist agenda deterred me from ever using them again.

They have coupons and even their cheapest shipping option offers tracking while YesAsia's does not, so: ¯\_(&#12484_/¯
Like I said, I don't care if they use lame memes on Twitter to rile up people.

 

[pswii60]

Another day and I see someone else is in the stocks and having tomatoes thrown at them again.

Sometimes I feel like the internet is a virtual medieval land. The internet will be drowning 'witches' soon.

 

[Poor GRIMES]

Best go find yourself a nice cozy hole to live in then, cause otherwise yes, yes you do.

lol

It's their prerogative on whether or not they want to fund something from a creator with a history of bad politics. It's up to the individual whether or not they're willing to do it themselves. Just because there's probably a lot of morally bankrupt creators on this Earth does not mean his freedom of choice is removed.

 

[Helloween]

Disgusting replies in this thread. Honestly.

OT: A new Alice game would be fan-fucking-tastic and like someone earlier said, i will happily buy a ton of Alice dresses to support it if need be!

 

[dlauv]

He's mad because the free market is frowning on gratuitous cleavage. He's mad that the publisher -- could be anyone, but let's say Capcom with Cammy -- felt the need to change the game in order to pursue more sales via avoiding bad press due to the free market frowning on it.

It's a far cry from censorship. These perv games can and are produced, but the free market discourages it because the price of development is increasing while the rate of perv gamers is likely at a constant. He's hating on the glorious laissez-faire process which thrives on free market/free speech.

Either way, this doesn't really seem like bigotry, lol. And it's horrible to read what happened to his sister. Holy shit.

 

[rochellepaws]

Look at who he is following on Twitter:[/URL]

He's also following several identifying as feminists, "The anti-Trump" and Hillary Clinton herself, I don't think you can conclude a pattern from a handful of questionable people when he's tracking 474 accounts.

 

[Garlador]

Who he follows on Twitter is much more of a statement than the posts themselves.

Looks like he follows a lot of folks across the spectrum... Including Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton.

 

[Azure Phoenix]

Who he follows on Twitter is much more of a statement than the posts themselves.

Knowledge, discussion and understanding is not gained by shutting yourself off from opinions you disagree with or don't wish to hear.

 

[Poor GRIMES]

This is all I'm seeing from those pictures:

As the progeny of immigrants that come from countries that suppressed free speech, that isn't a meaningful defense of McGee following Ann Coulter on Twitter and emboldening GamerGate garbage with "you might be right or wong, who knows!" rhetoric.

 

[Combichristoffersen]

social media bullshit

I fail to see anything particularly bad here.

 

[humansarehorses]

He's mad because the free market is frowning on gratuitous cleavage. He's mad that the publisher -- could be anyone, but let's say Capcom with Cammy -- felt the need to change the game in order to pursue more sales via avoiding bad press due to the free market frowning on it.

It's a far cry from censorship. These perv games can and are produced, but the free market discourages it because the price of development is increasing while the rate of perv gamers is likely at a constant.

Either way, this doesn't really seem like bigotry, lol. And it's horrible to read what happened to his sister. Holy shit.

Actually, he's not mad because the free market is frowning on gratuitous cleavage. He's upset because there are people who are actively discouraging those games from being developed at all regardless of what others want. That's a completely different situation than simply not purchasing a game because it doesn't align with your sensibilities.

 

[Carlius]

oh man.. a third game with todays graphics and alices artstyle would be amazing.

 

[dlauv]

Actually, he's not mad because the free market is frowning on gratuitous cleavage. He's upset because there are people who are actively discouraging those games from being developed at all regardless of what others want. That's a completely different situation than simply not purchasing a game because it doesn't align with your sensibilities.

I think that's strongly correlated to my original post.

And even if you disagree: at the end of the day, he's complaining about free speech.

 

[humansarehorses]

I think that's strongly correlated to my original post.

Nope. He's saying that people should have the freedom to produce and consume these types of games whether or not they will. The views he's addressing are from people who want to limit that freedom.

And even if you disagree, at the end of the day, he's complaining about free speech.

What the hell. That's completely backwards.

 

[AlexFlame116]

That whole thing with his sister is heartbreaking and I hope that one day they find closure. Especially worse since it happened during those times.

I cannot judge his views at the moment then. I'm guessing that the disappearance of his sister might have warped some views later on as well.

Either way I hope he gets his game made. But I thought there was supposed to be a movie to finish the story?

 

[Garlador]

Either way I hope he gets his game made. But I thought there was supposed to be a movie to finish the story?

There was a Kickstarter for a bunch of Alice short films. Those actually already got made and they're pretty good.

I'd prefer another game over a movie though.

 

[VichoCardenas]

Please don't jump down my throat here - I'm likely asking from a position of ignorance - but is there a reason why you can't dissociate the creator from their content, and consume it separate of political opinion? Even if the author's a total scumbag, I feel like you can enjoy their work without condoning or supporting them. Though maybe I haven't unpacked this problem properly.

It is really hard dude. I loved a local comic here when I was a child, but then everybody found out his author was a pedophile. It is so hard to separate the creation from his creator.

 

[dlauv]

Nope. He's saying that people should have the freedom to produce and consume these types of games whether or not they will. The views he's addressing are from people who want to limit that freedom.

The increasingly dissenting views are symptomatic of more voices in the more inclusive gaming arena of today. It's less of a boy's club now, less of a perv's club, and even less of a nerd's club too.

What the hell. That's completely backwards.

Not at all. Actively discouraging anything is a part of free speech. Just as there will be those who are receptive of those kinds of games, there will be others that are repulsed and offended. As long as those in dissent don't infringe on anyone's rights or liberties, then American is just complaining about free speech. Voices of dissent are allowed in the free market.

 

[AlexFlame116]

There was a Kickstarter for a bunch of Alice short films. Those actually already got made and they're pretty good.

I'd prefer another game over a movie though.

Well I mean yeah I definitely would rather have a full fledged game than a movie but I remembered that there were talks about those films before.

Either way thank you for answering!

 

[Silvawuff]

I played the original Alice game from way back when on PC and enjoyed it for what it was. I can't say how it's aged, or that the game play was better or worse than Madness. I really enjoy the "Dark Alice" aesthetic, I've just yet to see it executed as a game that's brilliant, memorable, and fun.

It's a shame about that social commentary and the consequences it's bringing.

 

[Garlador]

Not at all. Actively discouraging anything is a part of free speech. Just as there will be those who are receptive of those kinds of games, there will be others that are repulsed and offended. As long as those in dissent don't infringe on anyone's rights or liberties, then American is just complaining about free speech. Voices off dissent are allowed in the free market.

Um, that's what American was saying. You have it backwards.

He's lived in China, endured the China Ministry of Culture, and thus he is staunchly pro-free speech, even if it's stuff you don't like or stuff that upsets you or makes you feel bad. He's long welcomed dissenting voices at every opportunity. That's the point he makes about ALICE... the original game was held up as something offensive and EA initially didn't even want to be associated with it. It was rated "Adults Only" at first because it offended particular people. That's his point.

 

[dlauv]

Um, that's what American was saying. You have it backwards.

He's lived in China, endured the China Ministry of Culture, and thus he is staunchly pro-free speech, even if it's stuff you don't like or stuff that upsets you or makes you feel bad. He's long welcomed dissenting voices at every opportunity.

He's complaining about people bullying perv games and people into perv games.

He seems to believe that supporting expression means you should support all expression. I think it's more complicated than just that. You can support someone's right to express themselves, but that doesn't mean you have to like it or support it financially with a private company or be host to it on your private website.

 

[Alucrid]

i just hope his love of wikileaks, julian assange and james damore makes it into the next game

 

[MUnited83]

Knowledge, discussion and understanding is not gained by shutting yourself off from opinions you disagree with or don't wish to hear.

Ah yes, you absolutely need to follow fucktards on Twitter that say that black people are subhuman to truly understand black people are not subhuman.
Makes a lot of sense, m8, no holes in that logic, no sir.

That list of people he follows presents people who have zero knowledge and don't give a shit about actual discussion of any kind.

 

[humansarehorses]

The increasingly dissenting views are symptomatic of more voices in the more inclusive gaming arena. It's less of a boy's club now, and less of a nerd's club too.

Which has jack to do with what I said. Those gamers are free to have any opinion about the games that they want to. McGee has absolutely no problem with negative opinions about games.

This is the real issue: should games producers have the freedom to create those games? They might not find it profitable to create those games, but should they not have the freedom to make them in the first place?

Not at all. Actively discouraging anything is a part of free speech. Just as there will be those who are receptive of those kinds of games, there will be others that are repulsed and offended. As long as those in dissent don't infringe on anyone's rights or liberties, then American is just complaining about free speech.

Either you didn't read his posts or you didn't understand them.

Read through this:

Where is he complaining about free speech?

He seems to believe that supporting expression means you should support all expression. I think it's more complicated than just that. You can support someone's right to express themselves, but that doesn't mean you have to like it or support it financially.

Yep, you didn't understand him at all.

 

[grosvenor_92]

I'd love a third game but I don't see EA green lighting it now

 

[Astral Dog]

Hmm i remember the last Alice game playing well 🤔 just repetitive.if they cut the lenght and improve pacing you have a winner.

Its among the most beautiful games ever made

 

[dlauv]

Which has jack to do with what I said. Those gamers are free to have any opinion about the games that they want to. McGee has absolutely no problem with negative opinions about games.

Do we know what he's complaining about exactly, because it seems to be the SJW zeitgeist.

This is the real issue: should games producers have the freedom to create those games? They might not find it profitable to create those games, but should they not have the freedom to make them in the first place?

They do have the freedom to create those games. That's never been an issue. He seems to think that the free market/free speech movements to shun those games is threatening the ability to create them, when really it's just free speech. And a free market doesn't guarantee your ability to distribute your product anywhere you want. People like to pretend that free speech and the free market are under attack, but we have more avenues to express ourselves through games and art than what would be acceptable even 20 years ago, with far less resistance. Social taboos have always existed.

Read through this:

Where is he complaining about free speech?

He's complaining about it in this and this.

People like this and people who complain about colleges lately seem to think that free speech means that independent and private institutions should function with governmental non-bias in terms of "free speech" laws and "free expression." That's just not how things work, no matter how big the institutions are and in spite of the seemingly indomitable synergy of the free market.

 

[Zizbuka]

He had some tweets thanking Gamergate advocates for raising donations to search for his sister and commented that the "defenders" of women hadn't done so.

It's a bit messier and more complicated than a typical stance. It's pretty ugly overall across the board.

I don't use twitter, so maybe I'm reading it wrong, but that all seems like rational responses. Please explain the major controversy to me.

I admit I have no idea what GamerGate is really about, I probably intentionally avoid politics and just enjoy the games I like. Maybe I'll read up on it.

 

[nvrndr]

I'd buy.

Could give zero fucks about his personal opinions, I enjoyed MR.

 

[humansarehorses]

Do we know what he's complaining about exactly, because it seems to be the SJW zeitgeist.

He's made his stance clear. Well, clear to anyone with basic reading comprehension skills.

They do have the freedom to create those games. That's never been an issue. He seems to think that the free market movements to shun those games is threatening that, when really it's just free speech.

It's actually becoming an issue which is exactly what he's talking about.

He's complaining about it in this and this.

Good god, no He's not complaining about free speech. He's complaining about restrictions to free speech:

A game in which the player controls scantily clad women playing volleyball? Well, that's bad. Can't have it.

If you think that scantily clad women in games playing volleyball is bad, that's fine. You find it offensive? That's fine too. You don't want to purchase it? Okay, no big deal.

You want to restrict the freedom of developers to make these games or the freedom of consumers to purchase them? Nope. Crossing the line.

 

[thumb]

You want to restrict the freedom of developers to make these games or the freedom of consumers to purchase them? Nope. Crossing the line.

Who is actually advocating for this though? Any major organizations? Any people with a great deal of influence? And beyond social influence, any people with formal power: senators, presidents, representatives? American had a chance to quote anyone advocating for this, but instead he talked about Western journalists not liking objectification, and implied it could turn into the Ministry of Culture.

Basically, I think his argument is muddled.