HellforLeather
Member
C'mon guys. Even Ben Affleck can disarm a knife wielding guy!
Small 21 year old student approaches group of muscular police officers with a knife.
Explain exactly why they had to use a gun? They might get a cut on their arm, or something? Ridiculous police work from America as always.
I am. They are dangerous racist devils who are completely incompetent and incapable of policing properly. Fuck blue lives and fuck all cops. They are dangerous and not who you should ever call in an emergency.
So what non-lethal options were used?
Did you miss this post?
Did you miss this post?
They clearly are trained to use their weapon. I am not sure what you are getting at.
UnlessIf someone has a knife and is threatening you with it...it doesn't matter how big your muscles are mate. You still turn the other cheek.
It's like you haven't even read the last few replies if you're going to recommend a taser.A taser would have been a better option here. No one's gonna be able to stab you while they're getting tased. If I had to take any guess, I'd say that they went with the gun over the taser because they were responding to reports of someone with both a knife and a gun, so the cops didn't want to take the risk of them possibly pulling out the gun as well.
Don't these types of situations happen in Europe? How do they address them?
It's a US centric board after all, not really surprising.Obviously, the victim should've eaten someone's face, then these hardworking officers would do everything they could to not shoot even when attacked.
All these people in the thread bending backwards to make excuses for these cops, while police in civilized countries are able to handle situations exactly like these without any deaths, ...this forum sometimes, it's really fucking something.
Don't these types of situations happen in Europe? How do they address them?
That video makes it worse for me. I'm not sure what is at the side, but they should have just kept the distance between them and the suspect. Like the first officer seems to do well.Looks to me like they gave the activist enough opportunity to drop the knife.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pD1XePJ3syw
There's more to carrying a weapon than knowing how to shoot it.
Like, knowing how to apply techniques where you don't have to shoot it. Being aware how to deal with "suicide by cop" ect. Especially as a group.
If that's too much for a school cop, don't give him deadly weapons.
They shoot the assailant's leg in a way that the ricochet will also bounce back and knock the knife out of their hand.
Magic. Unarmed UK police literally employ magic spells and buffs to safely disarm and detain aggressive knife wielding individuals. Over in America, they haven't been taught these skills.Don't these types of situations happen in Europe? How do they address them?
Obviously, the victim should've eaten someone's face, then these hardworking officers would do everything they could to not shoot even when attacked.
All these people in the thread bending backwards to make excuses for these cops, while police in civilized countries are able to handle situations exactly like these without any deaths, ...this forum sometimes, it's really fucking something.
Don't these types of situations happen in Europe? How do they address them?
After watching the youtube video I don't see why the cops couldn't handle it without killing. Their training is complete garbage if they can't deal with that situation.
Nah, not always. There are single officer responses too.since UK cops always work in pairs
The US has 112.6 guns per 100 residents.They buy the assailant pizza.
I'm only half joking.
The vast majority of the UK police do their jobs without being equipped with firearms. You'd be amazed what can be accomplished when your go-to tactic of choice doesn't include a bang bang.
You can keep saying "it's not Hollywood, you can't aim for the leg, tazer, baton" but statistically the US training for an officer is bad, underfunded, not centralised ruling, etc. Police aim for the leg in some other countries first, then chest area if absolutely necessary. Finland included where I am from. The loss of life is considered less risky on leg shots so they aim there first. There legal rule is not written as "aim leg first" but as a "use guns as a last resort" and the training is given as legs first, then chest.
They were campus cops so I undestand that they are even more undertrained but stop defending something that can be changed. So, with them the situation is a bit different. Still, a loss of life. They did not want that to happen. Things need to change in the US regarding gun training, for officers and sales to citizens.
US police shoot 100 times more likely than a Finnish police officer.
https://newrepublic.com/article/126473/american-cops-100-times-deadlier-finnish-police
The US has 112.6 guns per 100 residents.
The UK has 6.6.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estimated_number_of_guns_per_capita_by_country
The UK model is pretty simple. If the assailant isn't actively engaging, create a sterile environment (aka getting the public the fuck away), verbally engaging the assailant while a perimeter is formed. Then overwhelming the assailant with numbers. UK police will only physically engage an armed assailant if that assailant is attempting to engage the officer or the public and there is no other choice.
If the assailant continues to approach and is non responsive to commands, then the officer will go up the force tree: maintain distance (since UK cops always work in pairs, as assailant approaches one officer the other will close distance from the side or behind to confuse and distract), spray, taser, baton (baton is more of a last resort than spray or taser because UK police are trained to hit the extremities once at full force which given it's a metal baton is more likely to cause lasting damage than taser or spray).
If perimeter has held long enough for reforcements to arrive, they'll just set up a shield cordon and continue to negotiate, then if necessary use the shields with full riot protective gear to engulf the assailant (either pinning them against a wall or pinning them against other officers shields)
Only in really extreme conditions will a baton round or firearm be used for a knife wielding assailant.
Can't blame the officers here. This was an appropriate use of force under the current guidelines.
Which absolutely, positively need to be changed, so that shooting someone dead isn't the first use of force in a situation like this.
Can we stop saying suicide by cop likes it's fucking acceptable? What is wrong with you people. Suicide by cop is an American invention, and generally does not need to happen.
They brought him down with a gunshot when a taser or pepper spray would have been more than sufficient.
Suicide by cop. What a disgusting thing that it's even in our vernacular.
The US has 112.6 guns per 100 residents.
The UK has 6.6.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estimated_number_of_guns_per_capita_by_country
Not saying shooting to death is a good answer (it's not), but I think people severely underestimate the lethality of knives.
I guess the question is, did the cop deviate from his training protocol? You cannot expect cops to do something different from how they are trained.
You can keep saying "it's not Hollywood, you can't aim for the leg, tazer, baton" but statistically the US training for an officer is bad, underfunded, not centralised ruling, etc. Police aim for the leg in some other countries first, then chest area if absolutely necessary. Finland included where I am from. The loss of life is considered less risky on leg shots so they aim there first. There legal rule is not written as "aim leg first" but as a "use guns as a last resort" and the training is given as legs first, then chest.
The UK model is pretty simple. If the assailant isn't actively engaging, create a sterile environment (aka getting the public the fuck away), verbally engaging the assailant while a perimeter is formed. Then overwhelming the assailant with numbers. UK police will only physically engage an armed assailant if that assailant is attempting to engage the officer or the public and there is no other choice.
If the assailant continues to approach and is non responsive to commands, then the officer will go up the force tree: maintain distance (since UK cops always work in pairs, as assailant approaches one officer the other will close distance from the side or behind to confuse and distract), spray, taser, baton (baton is more of a last resort than spray or taser because UK police are trained to hit the extremities once at full force which given it's a metal baton is more likely to cause lasting damage than taser or spray).
If perimeter has held long enough for reforcements to arrive, they'll just set up a shield cordon and continue to negotiate, then if necessary use the shields with full riot protective gear to engulf the assailant (either pinning them against a wall or pinning them against other officers shields)
Only in really extreme conditions will a baton round or firearm be used for a knife wielding assailant.
Right. But it's a tragedy the protocols are the way they are
Why would you agree? It's half bullshit.Yes I did.
It's a welp situation then. Still don't agree but hey, whatever. Ain't nothing new.
The US has 112.6 guns per 100 residents.
The UK has 6.6.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estimated_number_of_guns_per_capita_by_country
In the UK, most people do not have access to handguns. US police protocols are set up as a defensive reaction to the insane gun situation here.Everyone in the world has access to a knife, maybe US police should be given better training in not having to solve every problem with a gun.