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[pramod]

I mean this is getting more obvious everyday, but the latest Spiderman trailer really hit it home for me.
So in this Hollywood reality, a white teenage has a best friend who is Asian, a rival who is Indian, and 2 girlfriends who are black.
The only white person he seems to interact with in his life regularly is his aunt.

I mean this is just an example, but stuff like this is pretty common now in every "mainstream" Hollywood movie. A hero must have XX percentage of minority/female friends/associates/enemies/etc.

So I know what their agenda is, but don't people find it strangely unsettling, or even annoying, when the agenda is so transparent and forced these days and worst of all, does not really depict reality but instead if trying to push a certain type of "desired" reality?

I mean I am a minority, and when I grew up, I had very few friends outside my race. And I didn't date anyone outside my race. And this held true for 95% of other people in my high school and college. From what I observed, asians hung out with asians, blacks hung out with blacks, etc. There is very little cross-race social activity in the real world. So when I see Peter Parker hanging out with all these minorities, it feels strange and unnatural, and a bit unbelievable. He would be the 5% unusual case, not the norm. And note that I did grow up in very diverse societies, not unlike New York City where Spiderman is. So I know how things are even in "diverse" places.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

I just want to enjoy fun comic book movies. For me there’s nothing egregious about the casting in the current Spider-Man series. It’s not trying to rewrite history (well, other than changing MJ, I guess). It’s just a fun entertaining movie.

I know I’ll be the minority here. I see this discussion a lot on the politics sub.

Just my opinions. I’m not saying you or anyone are wrong, just that I look at it differently, specifically in Spider-Man’s case.

I think I just feel like there’s bigger fish to fry. I’m not sure this should really be a hill to die on.

I also think it sucks that there’s no way to please everyone. If the cast wasn’t primarily white, people upset, primarily diverse, peope upset. Everything either gets labeled as pandering, token, or insensitive, based on its basis. Nothing can just be, like just exist without hidden agenda. I can’t help but feel like people look for a fight sometimes, and also project a little bit.

I always try to question people about “diversity done right.” It seems like “forced” is automatically applied to everything too. So when has it not been forced? I’d like to be able to recognize the difference.

Times do change, source material from decades ago sometimes needs to be updated to reflect current trends. Beloved canon is precious to a fan base and I feel that. Hopefully changes and inclusion can be implemented in entertainment through tactful and nuanced means that don’t alienate anyone

 

[Nymphae]

I don't lose any sleep over it, but it's interesting to me how much they push it. Like in that Gillette commercial, at the end the scene where they show each race of child in turn, I literally lol'ed while calling out which race would be shown next. Black kid! Asian kid! White kid! Indian kid! Redhead!

I was shocked at how little diversity was in The Ballad of Buster Briggs, I would assume Netflix has a quota you must meet but damn, that movie is as white as a ghost.

 

[Sygma]

I don't really care but it better be consistent across the board.

 

[DKehoe]

There are barely any superheroes in real life yet Hollywood films are full of them. What’s up with that? Total virtue signaling.

 

[cubicle47b]

I didn't see anything weird about the trailer. I live in DC. That's what it looks like at the grocery store in my neighborhood.

 

[Super Mario]

I don't get mad if everyone isn't a white man. In fact, Denzel Washington is my favorite actor. I would go see a movie solely because he is the lead. That name is a stamp of quality to me.

What is out of place though, is when I see a movie like the new Beauty and the Beast. They captured the time period perfect in just about every essence. Stayed very true to the original. Then they added interracial and gay couples (and gun violence). Clearly out of place agenda push. Disney is the worst at this. I never once thought about political agenda when I was watching Star Wars. With Solo, it became unbearable.

 

[Sqorin Hammerfarf]

...I literally lol'ed while calling out which race would be shown next. Black kid! Asian kid! White kid! Indian kid! Redhead!

Redheads aren't a race.

 

[Nymphae]

Redheads aren't a race.

You don't say! It gave me a laugh that they bookended their race slideshow with a redhead kid is all.

 

[nocsi]

The diversity is kind of a joke still. They’re forcing diversity but how is still still no male Asians.

 

[llien]

Remind me, how well did "not being diverse" worked for "Kingdom Come..."?

I always try to question people about “diversity done right.” It seems like “forced” is automatically applied to everything too. So when has it not been forced? I’d like to be able to recognize the difference.

Before showergate I asked the question about "diversity done right" (I think it was in a thread about some fighting game having "only" so many female characters, they used the fact that many characters weren't even human to begin with, so at the end of the day there was 2 to 1 male to female ratio in a game in which user base is 97 to 3 male to female at best) and only one person bothered answering said that basically "the less straight white heterosexual males the better".

Don't you see that the concept is rather flawed?

 

[Trojita]

He lives in NYC ya dingus

 

[AngularSaxophone]

Propaganda.

 

[pramod]

I didn't see anything weird about the trailer. I live in DC. That's what it looks like at the grocery store in my neighborhood.

But they're not all best friends/hanging out with each other....which was my point.

 

[Trojita]

Does it bother anyone that Spider-man does not reflect reality? Peter grew up in a middle class house in Queens and is somehow best friends with an incredibly rich guy named Harry Osborne whose father puts on a power rangers tier Green Goblin costume.

 

[SKM1]

I don't care if it reflects reality unless it is pretending to do so. If the movie is good, it's good.

 

[pramod]

He lives in NYC ya dingus

I already addressed that, or did you not read my whole post?

 

[Trojita]

I already addressed that, or did you not read my whole post?

I did but it needed to be reiterated.

 

[SKM1]

But they're not all best friends/hanging out with each other....which was my point.

I don't really get your point. Does it make you uncomfortable or something?

 

[Xenon]

The only problem I have with the new Spider-Man is Flash. Such a disappointing character.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

Does it bother anyone that Spider-man does not reflect reality? Peter grew up in a middle class house in Queens and is somehow best friends with an incredibly rich guy named Harry Osborne whose father puts on a power rangers tier Green Goblin costume.

As a lower class, guy with no friends, who puts on Sesame Street tier giant friendly monster costumes, I’m really bothered by a lot of things

 

[Trojita]

Peter goes to Midtown Science and Technology School which seems to be a school for gifted, overachievers, and the children of helicopter parents.

That school is going to have a higher East Asian and Indian representative population going by average statistics.

Peter's friend was taken from Ultimate Spider-Man, he was originally Miles Morales friend but in this reboot they thought it would be a good idea to make him a good friend for Peter. I like his character in both movies.

Peter's got game with melanin rich sisters. Shuri in the comics wants a piece of him.

Flash's actor being that dork is a misstep in many ways.

 

[cubicle47b]

But they're not all best friends/hanging out with each other....which was my point.

I see plenty of mixed race couples / groups. My wife's best friend up here is a 2nd generation from Algeria (I think, I just remember it was North African and not Egypt) and on NYE we went out as a group with some German soldiers, a Czech woman, a Chinese woman, an Ashkenazi Jewish woman, a couple from Argentina, and a few others.

 

[Grinchy]

I guess it slightly bothers me when certain types of people don't just want, but demand, that shows and movies have a level of diversity that isn't always reflective of actual reality. For example, it's annoying when people complain that there's one black guy in a main cast of 5 people when that's a realistic representation for the area in which the show takes place.

There's nothing inherently wrong with the show if they had 3 black people out of the 5 main cast members instead, even if it takes place in an area where that's not realistic. The annoying part is just the arbitrary demands and the screeching about a show that doesn't choose to do that. It's like there's this weird idea that every single show better have a minority white cast or else it's doing something immoral.

 

[NickFire]

No, I don't really care about whether it reflects reality. I'm not a fan of forcing this stuff for diversity sake, but actual divergence from reality isn't a problem. It's the tactics that typically bother me more than the end result.

 

[mckmas8808]

I mean this is getting more obvious everyday, but the latest Spiderman trailer really hit it home for me.
So in this Hollywood reality, a white teenage has a best friend who is Asian, a rival who is Indian, and 2 girlfriends who are black.
The only white person he seems to interact with in his life regularly is his aunt.

I mean this is just an example, but stuff like this is pretty common now in every "mainstream" Hollywood movie. A hero must have XX percentage of minority/female friends/associates/enemies/etc.

So I know what their agenda is, but don't people find it strangely unsettling, or even annoying, when the agenda is so transparent and forced these days and worst of all, does not really depict reality but instead if trying to push a certain type of "desired" reality?

I mean I am a minority, and when I grew up, I had very few friends outside my race. And I didn't date anyone outside my race. And this held true for 95% of other people in my high school and college. From what I observed, asians hung out with asians, blacks hung out with blacks, etc. There is very little cross-race social activity in the real world. So when I see Peter Parker hanging out with all these minorities, it feels strange and unnatural, and a bit unbelievable. He would be the 5% unusual case, not the norm. And note that I did grow up in very diverse societies, not unlike New York City where Spiderman is. So I know how things are even in "diverse" places.

What city is the movie happening in?

 

[mckmas8808]

And you need more friends bro. It's sick how people honestly think cross-racial friendships don't exist on multiple levels. Like a white kid can't be friends with an Asian kid, that dates black girls.

 

[quickwhips]

The only thing I don’t like is MJ not being a red head hotty. I wish they would of made their MJ into just a cool girl he liked and if it didn’t work out we could have had the real MJ. But that ship has sailed now and we still might get Gwen.

 

[Dr.Guru of Peru]

Peter Parker has never been the popular kid or ran with a clique. It makes perfect sense that an outsider growing up in NYC would have a diverse group of friends. Just because you’ve lived an an insular racist lifestyle doesn’t mean your comic book heroes have to.

 

[King of Foxes]

I live in a country thats 99.99% white, any western media i watch looks weird to me.

 

[mckmas8808]

I live in a country thats 99.99% white, any western media i watch looks weird to me.

That's a good point. Where you are from total changes how a person can view the "races" of the characters in a movie.

 

[Joe T.]

I don't know if bother is the right word for it, but it does make me stop and think, which effectively pulls me out of the movie/show. Suspension of disbelief is... suspended. If the push for better representation in media was generally handled in a more subtle way, both in movies/TV and the media outlets covering it - news headlines, talk shows and social media - then I'm not sure I would give it as much thought. Sometimes it's handled in such a ham-fisted way that it's impossible not to see that they're more interested in appealing to social justice advocates than staying true to their artistic vision, whatever that may have been.

 

[materdolorosa]

Isn't spiderman set in new york city lol

 

[pramod]

Peter goes to Midtown Science and Technology School which seems to be a school for gifted, overachievers, and the children of helicopter parents.

That school is going to have a higher East Asian and Indian representative population going by average statistics.

Peter's friend was taken from Ultimate Spider-Man, he was originally Miles Morales friend but in this reboot they thought it would be a good idea to make him a good friend for Peter. I like his character in both movies.

Peter's got game with melanin rich sisters. Shuri in the comics wants a piece of him.

Flash's actor being that dork is a misstep in many ways.

That actually is a good explanation. It makes sense there would be a lot more Indians/Asians in that school and thus Peter would be spending more time with them than he would in a regular high school.

 

[NahaNago]

The only thing I don’t like is MJ not being a red head hotty. I wish they would of made their MJ into just a cool girl he liked and if it didn’t work out we could have had the real MJ. But that ship has sailed now and we still might get Gwen.

I agree she seems to be the main person I don't like in the movie, when she should be the person every one should want to see after spiderman. Her personality is just painful. I get that they are trying to go for the cool thorny personality girl but I just don't find her likeable at all.

 

[Vicetrailia]

Seems good to me. I'm able to enjoy shows like Mad Men to Sex Education to Lucifer to Friends from College without a hitch.

I had the Peter Parker experience for a good chunk of my youth though. My first girlfriend was fresh from Russia, my second from China.

 

[bitbydeath]

It never occurred to me. I just see people as people.

 

[highrider]

I do notice it but it just doesn’t rank high on my what the fuck meter. It’s kind of in line with the infantilization of minorities and women. Look, see the x in the movie kids, you can do it too, follow your dreams. This kind of myopic ‘ encouragement ‘ is actually kind of disrespectful when you think about it. Parents have to instill that in their children, and provide an environment where they can find it in themselves.

 

[cr0w]

I grew up on military bases, so I went to school and hung out with all types of people. Lived in Chicago, Oakland, Texas and Mississippi. In more urban areas like NYC it's accurately reflected. Houston, where I live now, is one of the most diverse cities in the US. It would be stranger for me to see a movie set in NYC that wasn't diverse. Girls, for example, was set in NYC and had an all-white cast and it was unbelievable as shit. Hollywood doesn't reflect reality anyway, so it's not something I really even give a shit about.

I do, however, take issue with Ned and Flash being completely different races from their comic counterparts. Flash especially...he's not a skinny, obnoxious Indian kid.

 

[Kadayi]

Mainly it makes me just do this: -

and then go about my day.

 

[mckmas8808]

I do notice it but it just doesn’t rank high on my what the fuck meter. It’s kind of in line with the infantilization of minorities and women. Look, see the x in the movie kids, you can do it too, follow your dreams. This kind of myopic ‘ encouragement ‘ is actually kind of disrespectful when you think about it. Parents have to instill that in their children, and provide an environment where they can find it in themselves.

You think there's characters of different races in movies to "encourage" minority kids to strive for better?

 

[yeahokaywhatever]

I don't care about that stuff. I don't demand it, either. I grew up iwith white kids, black kids and hispanic kids too. It's annoying when they add diversity and decide to make it a focal point. I don't like the MJ character in the new Spider-Man. But when I was watching Sabrina on Netflix, they drop some SJW stuff it's a total eyeroll.gif and the latest Purge movie was full of this and annoying. A recent movie that did this in a subtle and smart way was Widows.

 

[#Phonepunk#]

it doesn't bother me that more diverse people are on screen (which is debatable) it bothers me that it is used as a smokescreen deflecting all critical thought, including the practical (rather than marketed) treatment of minorities. the press, guided by the film studios, perpetuates these "toxic fan" narratives in order to distract from looking at the actual texts. if anything, the minorities of Star Wars and Ghostbusters have been grossly under-served by the material.

it is the corporate co-opting of social causes that truly disgusts me. even if they are good causes, they are tainted simply by association. even moreso, in fact, as they are psychic vampires, consuming activist energy that would otherwise be put towards making IRL better for minorities and putting that towards promoting capitalist clap trap propaganda instead

 

[KillCleanEat]

I didn't really notice it until I read about complaints on the internet. Trying to cut back my time on social media has brought me back to not really caring. Until this thread made me realize it by pointing it out lol.

Honestly, as long as the actors are good I don't care. And if the representation makes someone else's day better, that's a good thing.

 

[Husky]

I mean I am a minority, and when I grew up, I had very few friends outside my race. And I didn't date anyone outside my race. And this held true for 95% of other people in my high school and college. From what I observed, asians hung out with asians, blacks hung out with blacks, etc. There is very little cross-race social activity in the real world. So when I see Peter Parker hanging out with all these minorities, it feels strange and unnatural, and a bit unbelievable. He would be the 5% unusual case, not the norm. And note that I did grow up in very diverse societies, not unlike New York City where Spiderman is. So I know how things are even in "diverse" places.

Really?
Maybe it's because of where I grew up, but as a kid some of the people I hung out with most were black, hispanic, and asian. In college, I think more than half of the people I hung out with weren't white. You sure you're not projecting?

Plus, as others have said, it's NYC man.

 

[Doom85]

I'd say maybe realize your personal experience doesn't reflect reality? I've got a good amount of friends through the years who haven't been white (or straight for that matter). Heck, quite a few of my closest friends through the years have been women and lord knows parts of the Internet act like platonic friendships with the opposite gender are some sort of impossible feat. Now I've never dated anyone outside of my race but I've never dated period due to my anxiety/insecurity but of the two women who I found out after the fact were interested in me one was black and I (who's white just to be clear) certainly have found various black/Hispanic/Asian/etc. women attractive, heck my biggest MCU crush is Shuri. In 2018 USA, this really isn't some uncommon weirdness and it's likely to become even less uncommon as the decades go on.

 

[Deleted member 1235]

I get infuriated when fictional movies about fantastic things portray something that doesnt match reality yeah

 

[highrider]

You think there's characters of different races in movies to "encourage" minority kids to strive for better?

Not entirely but it’s a big part of it imo. Black Panther and Wonderwoman are two recent examples. I big part of the marketing was inclusivity and finally a film for us type narratives. You had so many people saying how inspirational it was to see x do x and how apparently this was impossible before I saw this Marvel/DC film. Like there was never a black or female badass portrayal in film before this monumental day.

 

[Shai-Tan]

I mean this is getting more obvious everyday, but the latest Spiderman trailer really hit it home for me.
So in this Hollywood reality, a white teenage has a best friend who is Asian, a rival who is Indian, and 2 girlfriends who are black.
The only white person he seems to interact with in his life regularly is his aunt.

I mean this is just an example, but stuff like this is pretty common now in every "mainstream" Hollywood movie. A hero must have XX percentage of minority/female friends/associates/enemies/etc.

So I know what their agenda is, but don't people find it strangely unsettling, or even annoying, when the agenda is so transparent and forced these days and worst of all, does not really depict reality but instead if trying to push a certain type of "desired" reality?

I mean I am a minority, and when I grew up, I had very few friends outside my race. And I didn't date anyone outside my race. And this held true for 95% of other people in my high school and college. From what I observed, asians hung out with asians, blacks hung out with blacks, etc. There is very little cross-race social activity in the real world. So when I see Peter Parker hanging out with all these minorities, it feels strange and unnatural, and a bit unbelievable. He would be the 5% unusual case, not the norm. And note that I did grow up in very diverse societies, not unlike New York City where Spiderman is. So I know how things are even in "diverse" places.

If it's in New York I can see it being plausible. In suburbs of Toronto at the time I went to high school only 40% Max was "white". My best friends in middle school were an Indian and an Asian (all three of us recent immigrants). Probably more reflective of affluent places but Peter Parker is a gifted science student too changing the makeup of people he might run into

When I attended university I was surprised by the level of self segration into ethnic groups both in and out of classes unlike high school where you get assigned to a home room. It felt really weird the first time I was in a philosophy class to see everyone all white (apparently philosophy is like hockey - what white people like). And the most diverse classes were all required credits. There was still a lot of mixing but there were many people who seem to have an affinity towards like groups. A bit of a mismatch with how media presents it sometimes but for me a more cosmopolitan representation is more ideal.

 

[Xiaoki]

I was shocked at how little diversity was in The Ballad of Buster Briggs, I would assume Netflix has a quota you must meet but damn, that movie is as white as a ghost.

I was shocked at how much The Ballad of Buster Scruggs didn't reflect reality as well.

Must cowboys in the "Wild West" were not white, most were Mexican. Then you also had a lot that were Black slaves, Black run away slaves, and Chinese after they built the Transcontinental Railroad.