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[Dory16]

There will be at least 2 ways of defining winning and losing in the console market from next generation on:

1. Selling the most consoles: this has been the traditional success barometer until this generation. It may be a legitimate one in many regards but I think that Microsoft is defining a business model that will make this count irrelevant. With xcloud not requiring a console and Game Pass being accessible also on PC, with Game Pass itself receiving more an more games from publishers at increasing frequency, Microsoft has multiplied the revenue streams way beyond the cash received in exchange for a box sold. Combined with the fact that mid-gen refreshes now happen every 3 years, backwards compatibility becomes more important than ever to make sure that the count doesn't reset and the subscriptions just keep adding up. My main point here is that MS seems to have put itself in position to leverage ecosystem adoption in a way that comfortably mitigates selling fewer consoles than other manufacturers. You don't need to buy their box to be their customer. They will find you where you like to play. Chances are it includes your PC or your phone or tablet. You're Sony only? Wanna try Hellblade 2 with your dualshock 5 controller on your laptop screen when you're bored of Godfall? How about a gamepass/xcloud trial for a week? No, you're not dreaming. Those 100 other AAA games from the last 3 generations are available to you too. If you subscribe at the end of your trial for 14$ a month. On the go or on your 65'' inch "playstation only" gaming TV. And every future Xbox game studios exclusive comes day one for free from then on.
2. Being the most ubiquitous gaming brand. The brand that other gaming companies have to partner with in order to stay up to date with their customers expectations in terms of services (cloud infrastructure). The brand that game publishers have to come to in order to maximise the value of their IPs beyond what would have otherwise been their natural lifecycle (FF, Kingdom hearts and Yakuza on game pass anyone?). The brand that the most hardcore gamers who can't or refuse to spend over 800 bucks on a gaming machine but still expect the best gaming technology that money can buy have to come to. A brand capable of competing with any other company in terms of providing the "best" exclusive games (best will always be a matter of taste, they just have to keep this one close and cover all tastes ).

I declare myself impressed by Microsoft's transformation since the botched XboxOne launch and the replacement of Mattrick. They could have confined themselves to damage control and touted how they were still selling at a faster rate than the 360 (they did for a little while), which had already been unanimously acclaimed as a success. I commend Phil's guts to change course as drastically and quickly as he did. It took balls and humility to not just drop the DRM limitations but to take the kinect out of a product that had based the legitimacy of its price on it. To accept to take the ridicule and flak due to that admitted failure for years in order to build the foundation for better days. Xbox have never been this respected a gaming brand, even after having just "lost" a generation. The live crowd reactions at the game awards reveal were very telling, given that this wasn't a Microsoft event with a pre-conquered audience and nobody had expected their presence on stage. Even the stock of Ninja's theory name has already skyrocketed beyond what it's ever been, partially through their association with Microsoft. People weren't screaming just at the mention of the NT brand when they were still independent and making multiplats.

In sum, provided that MS's now obvious targets for the next generation (which they are well on track to meet) are in fact met:

• having the (more or less clearly) most powerful console
• Releasing a minimum of 3 AAA exclusive games A YEAR, only one of them being either Halo, Gears or Forza
• Rolling out xcloud at the same or comparable quality as stadia but with the power of game pass behind it for a low subscription fee
• seamless backwards compatibility all the way back to the xbox 360
• More smart and tactical marketing decisions such as the game awards reveal going forward
• Ensuring that every mid-gen refresh maintains the "most powerful" advantage

Provided those 6 things all happen, I can't envision Microsoft "losing" the next generation.

Give me your thoughts. Fanboys allowed but tone it down, thanks

 

[Filthy Casual]

How much you willing to bet on it?

 

[mejin]

MS is doing better this time, but it'll take much more to restore xbox brand outside US and UK.

New Xbox disappeared from worldwide top twitter trending in less than day.

Sony generates more buzz with much less.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

Im starting to think that MS isn't paying you guys enough to do this level of blatant shilling.

I am beyond sick of all the praise for MS without them actually delivering anything that is game changing. The only thing MS has won, is making noise and convincing certain people that noise means winning.

Im glad that we have people that believe that MS has next gen in the bag, but let's see them deliver something first.

 

[Husky]

the real measure of who's winning is whose face buttons are the default for gameplay trailers

 

[Gavin Stevens]

The PS4 had a blue bar, but the xbox one didn't, and I don't know about you, but that's disgusting, and I think the next generation has already been won by sony, because blue bar means win in Japanese.

Or some other bollocks. Just play the bloody games you tits. Its all the same, both companies are arses at the best of times.

 

[Dory16]

Just play the bloody games you tits. Its all the same, both companies are arses at the best of times.

One doesn't exclude the other. Thanks O'dium.

 

[Mista]

All of this doesn’t really matter. Playstation as a brand name already is winning as I have said before, a casual player or a family willing to get a console will probably get a Nintendo product but mostly they’ll go for a playstation. Taking an example of all the people around me that aren’t gamers, they all went with playstation and when I asked why almost all of them had the similar answer “Its playstation” or “thats we always had since we were kids” but to be fair, thats a great observation by you OP. As for me what matters to me isn’t who’s winning or losing. I always own all platforms, so I’m here for the experiences everyone has to offer. I’ll never stick with one platform no matter what. But again, thats a great observation by you and you better get ready for all the “you’re a fanboy” posts

 

[Gavin Stevens]

What pc do you have? If it’s windows, they already won.

True story. You own a windows gaming platform.

They couldn’t care less if you game on windows or Xbox, as long as you game with them, they thats a plus for them.

And I have to say... I kind of agree. Granted everybody thinks it’s all about consoles sold, but business doesn’t work like that. Sony as a business isn’t doing too great, and it’s gaming division is what keeps them floating. MS on the other hand have multiple hugely successful areas, and yes, one of those is Xbox.

It’s like you think the Xbox flopped or something, and it makes me laugh. I wish I had a product line like Xbox that flopped, because bloody hell, I would be over the moon.

You want to talk flop, let’s talk the google labia.

 

[ethomaz]

I can’t understand if your OP is saying MS will lose or win with these arguments.

Seems like it will lose again? Well I agree.

 

[TBiddy]

Says a lot about gamers that a poster that actually has arguments backing up their opinion gets accused of being a shill.

 

[Dory16]

How much you willing to bet on it?

No too much, believe it or not

 

[Dory16]

Says a lot about gamers that a poster that actually has arguments backing up their opinion gets accused of being a shill.

What a world, TBiddy

 

[thelastword]

What is going on?

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

Microsoft has made it their mission to redefine what "generation" means since they plan to exit the traditional "console" market anyway. Arguably, the traditional console market is entering a decline, so it's not as though I blame them.

What is going on?

Don't worry, we won't let the new astroturfers outshine you.

 

[pr0cs]

Says a lot about gamers that a poster that actually has arguments backing up their opinion gets accused of being a shill.

Its easily the most frustrating part of discussing gaming, no matter how civil and well thought out your opinion is some asshat will come in with the usual drive-by because they feel a need to defend their giant faceless company

 

[Ivellios]

Says a lot about gamers that a poster that actually has arguments backing up their opinion gets accused of being a shill.

Its just that nothing of what he said automatically makes MS the winner of next gen.

In the end a lot of people will still get PS5 because of exclusives alone, and wont have money or time to invest in a second console or PC to play ms games.

Though i truly hope XsX is a sucess to keep competition alive.

 

[Aion002]

I hope she is successful! More competition from MS means better games from Sony and Nintendo.

Just wanna say that maybe in USA MS will get ahead, but in the rest of the world... well... it's gonna be really hard.

 

[TBiddy]

Its just that nothing of what he said automatically makes MS the winner of next gen.

In the end a lot of people will still get PS5 because of exclusives alone, and wont have money or time to invest in a second console or PC to play ms games.

Though i truly hope XsX is a sucess to keep competition alive.

Hey, I agree. But at least he made an effort to present an informed opinion. A lot of people could learn from that.. and still, there's several posters accusing him of being a shill.

 

[Mista]

Says a lot about gamers that a poster that actually has arguments backing up their opinion gets accused of being a shill.

Because how dare you have a different opinion than me. Good thing GAF doesn’t have lots of those garbage

 

[LokusAbriss]

Im starting to think that MS isn't paying you guys enough to do this level of blatant shilling.

I am beyond sick of all the praise for MS without them actually delivering anything that is game changing. The only thing MS has won, is making noise and convincing certain people that noise means winning.

Im glad that we have people that believe that MS has next gen in the bag, but let's see them deliver something first.

Nearly nobody is saying that Xbox will win next-gen. Nore does anybody wish that. We all want good hard- and software. No matter the company.

MS proved a lot with the One X, Game Pass, first party games and how Flight Siumlator shapes up, that they know what they are doing. Many like what they see and play. Why are so many people so angry? I like what is on the horizon and will probably buy their product.

And most here went with multiple consoles of different companies for the lest gens anyway. That won't change in the future.

I am sorry, that you might be another one, who won't be ablte to fit the Series X into your tv stand.

 

[Psykodad]

MS is doing better this time, but it'll take much more to restore xbox brand outside US and UK.

New Xbox disappeared from worldwide top twitter trending in less than day.

Sony generates more buzz with much less.

Some fans need to realize this.

Most of the world doesn't care about xbox at all.
It's mostly some die-hards fans and self-proclaimed "real gamers" on forums and youtube that think otherwise.

 

[HeresJohnny]

Microsoft doesn't seem to have a clear sense of what winning means anymore. They are on record as saying hardware sales don't matter, when they clearly do. That's the first thing they need to do: stop all the mythical horseshit posturing acting like they've transcended the market. The market is fine; the current leader is going to sell well beyond a hundred million consoles. It's never been better. Microsoft's reluctance to accept the norms of the market show that they've no contrition for their actions over the last 6 years; that they blame the market for the loss instead of themselves. The first step they need to make is one of contrition and knowledge seeking regarding the space they so clearly wish to dominate but don't seem to know how. Only when they've done that will they be able to take Sony on.

 

[CuteFaceJay]

That new xbox looks nice, Heck I'm gonna need a new GPU when that releases or it'll be more powerful than my 980Ti

 

[Musky_Cheese]

Xbox hasn’t “fixed” it’s main problem. The one that has plagued them since before the 360 ended.

First Party/Exclusive Games

Hope they do tho.

 

[DonF]

Your first point kinda contradicts midway. Youre talking about selling the most consoles then jump to "you don't have to buy the console, its enough if you pay MS a month of gamepass a year to play their games"

Second point I think its going to be key, but I already see the xbox brand greatly diminished in this way. If playstation announces that your library of ps4 games are going to be enhanced on ps5, xbox is doomed. I mean, over 100 mill people will already have a feet on the PlayStation camp.

In the end of the day you need a product that has a value according to price, determined by the consumer.

Ms was pushing inferior specs with a unwanted camera and a TV focused console for a higher price this gen, a very hard sell compared to the ps4 with its promise of ease of development, great games and a non restrictive used game policy.

I think that its hard for xbox to turn this gen around next gen, unless Sony royally fucks up.

 

[Dory16]

Its just that nothing of what he said automatically makes MS the winner of next gen.

In the end a lot of people will still get PS5 because of exclusives alone, and wont have money or time to invest in a second console or PC to play ms games.

Though i truly hope XsX is a sucess to keep competition alive.

Thanks for replying without name calling. You may be slightly missing my second point, which is that MS aims to win by winning even when you buy another console and never theirs. As long as you have an internet connection and some sort of controller, you're fair game. All I'm saying is that they are coming close to making that type of "winning" achievable.

 

[-Troid-]

I think they'll do better this time than with the Xbox One. It seems that they're focusing on hardware and games more and trying to do their own thing with Gamepass. I guess we'll see how it goes in a year or two, but for now I think it's hard to tell without more info on the PS5, amongst other factors.

I just hope this gen we finally have all 3 console makers in a state of mind where they won't fuck up because of their hubris from past wins. Sony fudged the PS3 reveal after rising high on the PS2, Nintendo fucked up with the WiiU after the popular Wii, and Microsoft botched the Xbox One out of the gate after being succesful with the 360.

If history repeats itself, Sony could be cocky going in to the PS5 and do something dumb with it's reveal. Who knows.

 

[Daphnes Nohansen Hyrule]

Not having the kinect and the always connected talk this time around will obviously help a lot this time.
It all comes down to the pricing again.

 

[Dory16]

Your first point kinda contradicts midway. Youre talking about selling the most consoles then jump to "you don't have to buy the console, its enough if you pay MS a month of gamepass a year to play their games"

I was merely explaining how "wining" has traditionally been understood in the console space, in order to demonstrate that Microsoft is striking at the very semantics of the concept with its current strategy.
I also acknowledge that the "console sales number" barometer is legitimate and I expect many observers to simply stick to it no matter how many other segments MS conquers.

 

[thelastword]

OP, how about this...….

How about winning on both console hardware, streaming your games to many devices and pushing games on VR…...So in essence, many methods of game delivery, with VR bringing a new perspective with it's own hardware sales and dedicated software houses for it , where it's doing pretty well and growing too......

So you may want to isolate MS as seeing the bigger picture and going for the big pie, but yet they are not leaders on any front, not hardware sales, not streaming on multiple devices, not VR......So your arguments are based on what MS would like to see happen, that everybody come crowding to the Xcloud streaming service in Netflix fashion, but that plan is certainly not a reality yet, it's only a plan......With so many stakeholders in the streaming game of late, you have no idea who is going to be the huge leader in streaming, yet at this moment it's certainly not MS, they have not even launched their streaming service yet....

Remember when Google announced Stadia, people said Sony was in trouble, same was said when MS spoke of Xcloud, they said Sony can't hang because these companies are too big and would crush PSNOW.....Big lumbering giant vs a David.....Stadia has has launched with it's huge purse and Jupiter's c*ck and we all know how that went down.....

I'll say this OP, what we will streaming is where people get the best games, that's who will win...….It does not matter how big your wallets, it's what games are most attractive to the buying crowd......That's what gives you returns on your investment in the gaming space atm...….I think right now Sony is poised for next gen as they have a commanding stake in hardware and software sales and they were the first to offer console streaming and are also the leaders in VR, they are leading on all fronts and pulling in the money that's available in these three game delivery methods.....Bare in mind one thing, they are offering the best games in all forms of game delivery.....on PS4 hardware, in streaming and in VR......

If you see great things for MS, great.....I'd like to see how things develop from here on out, but at this point it has little to do with seeing a big picture as opposed to creating the big picture......MS has to do rather than say right now......We have to see it happen before we announce it as a viable thing/accomplishment.....

 

[DonF]

I was merely explaining how "wining" has traditionally been understood in the console space, in order to demonstrate that Microsoft is striking at the very semantics of the concept with its current strategy.
I also acknowledge that the "console sales number" barometer is legitimate and I expect many observers to simply stick to it no matter how many other segments MS conquers.

oh agreed.
The thing is that MS's strategy now seems like they dont want to sell consoles (with many games being released on pc and xcloud). And even with that strategy, it looks like they dont even want to sell subscriptions or get much money from subs. I honestly see myself getting gamepass for a month at the end of every year to play all the exclusives I might have missed 'cause A) i dont have an xbox or b) im not a pc gamer, so my pc is always behind consoles, so I might try xcloud for a couple of games.

That would make me a costumer that spends like $10 a year on they ecosystem. I don't see much value there for them.

 

[mckmas8808]

Anybody that tells you selling hardware doesn't matter, is coming up with BS reasons to give Microsoft a pass.

 

[Max_Po]

The only place Xbox will succeeded is US and may be the UK.

 

[Dory16]

OP, how about this...….

How about winning on both console hardware, streaming your games to many devices and pushing games on VR…...So in essence, many methods of game delivery, with VR bringing a new perspective with it's own hardware sales and dedicated software houses for it , where it's doing pretty well and growing too......

So you may want to isolate MS as seeing the bigger picture and going for the big pie, but yet they are not leaders on any front, not hardware sales, not streaming on multiple devices, not VR......So your arguments are based on what MS would like to see happen, that everybody come crowding to the Xcloud streaming service in Netflix fashion, but that plan is certainly not a reality yet, it's only a plan......With so many stakeholders in the streaming game of late, you have no idea who is going to be the huge leader in streaming, yet at this moment it's certainly not MS, they have not even launched their streaming service yet....

Remember when Google announced Stadia, people said Sony was in trouble, same was said when MS spoke of Xcloud, they said Sony can't hang because these companies are too big and would crush PSNOW.....Big lumbering giant vs a David.....Stadia has has launched with it's huge purse and Jupiter's c*ck and we all know how that went down.....

I'll say this OP, what we will streaming is where people get the best games, that's who will win...….It does not matter how big your wallets, it's what games are most attractive to the buying crowd......That's what gives you returns on your investment in the gaming space atm...….I think right now Sony is poised for next gen as they have a commanding stake in hardware and software sales and they were the first to offer console streaming and are also the leaders in VR, they are leading on all fronts and pulling in the money that's available in these three game delivery methods.....Bare in mind one thing, they are offering the best games in all forms of game delivery.....on PS4 hardware, in streaming and in VR......

If you see great things for MS, great.....I'd like to see how things develop from here on out, but at this point it has little to do with seeing a big picture as opposed to creating the big picture......MS has to do rather than say right now......We have to see it happen before we announce it as a viable thing/accomplishment.....

I hear you. VR is not negligible just because MS has opted to sit it out. I own a PSVR helmet and although I haven't used it often, I wouldn't exchange the emotions I got when playing FairPoint for the first time (although I had to give up at a certain point because it was seriously testing my arachnophobia). All competitors have something essential to bring to gamers going forward. And I'm not counting Sony out by any stretch of the imagination. They always do great even when others do their best. I just think we have rarely seen a turn around in perception as swift and impressive as the one Ms is in the process od completing. They went from being the anti-consumer gaming company at the start of the generation to being the company which wallets gamers worry about more than their own, because of how easily accessible to everyone they make their best franchises.

 

[DS_Joost]

It's the games bruh. Always the games... And with Microsoft it always seems to be about anything BUT the games.

Sony wins next gen. They already have. Just give it up unless Microsoft pulls at least ten successful IP's out of their hat that aren't Halo, Gears or Forza.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

MS proved a lot with the One X, Game Pass, first party games and how Flight Siumlator shapes up, that they know what they are doing. Many like what they see and play. Why are so many people so angry? I like what is on the horizon and will probably buy their product.

Wrong. They haven't proven but two things:

Jack and shit. And jack already left town.

They are experimenting with things, but those things have a LONG way to go before they can be proven winners. I have big time reservations about the long term viability of Game Pass, but time will tell. Scarlett looks pretty good and I suspect I will have one on or close to release day.

They're talking a big game like they always do. But I am tired of talk.

 

[Dory16]

oh agreed.
The thing is that MS's strategy now seems like they dont want to sell consoles (with many games being released on pc and xcloud). And even with that strategy, it looks like they dont even want to sell subscriptions or get much money from subs. I honestly see myself getting gamepass for a month at the end of every year to play all the exclusives I might have missed 'cause A) i dont have an xbox or b) im not a pc gamer, so my pc is always behind consoles, so I might try xcloud for a couple of games.

That would make me a costumer that spends like $10 a year on they ecosystem. I don't see much value there for them.

Or you could also say "I don't ever see Sony or any other company making great gaming this accessible for so little". I will refrain from worrying about Microsoft's pockets. I trust that they can count. They got paid whether you know it or not.

 

[DeltaPolarBear]

Fundamentally, consoles make money in three ways. Selling 1st party games, getting paid 30% of all third party games sold to run on the system, and selling subscriptions. Subscriptions being a relatively new thing.

Nintendo makes money selling games, less so the other two revenue streams.

Sony makes money from all three. and it is because having a large install base means you get more of everything.

Microsoft? Microsoft is claiming they are going to have the largest install base by simply adding PCs... Except, PCs don't pay Microsoft 30% rent for third party games. (They would have on the Windows store, but that basically died.)
And subscriptions for online play doesn't exist on PC. Gamepass might seem good value now, but third party would drop out of Gamepass the second there is no longer a decent sized Xbox console install base. And if Gamepass show up on rival machines it is guaranteed to have no third party games.

Saying "you are playing on a Microsoft machine" is meaningless, if you are not in the full console ecosystem in buying games that pay Microsoft 30%, and also not paying subscription fees.

I mean, i wish Microsoft good luck and may the best console win. But right now Microsoft is pretending that the classic console business is not worth contesting, because they know they couldn't win. And pretending that consoles are dying is not going to make it come true.

Microsoft is abandoning everything that makes a game console business functional. like a stable hardware base and exclusive next gen games. We would not need to wait long to see if that was a smart idea.

 

[48086]

Anyone remember at the first of this gen when the narrative was that the ps4 didn't have any games? This has certainly been an interesting generation.

 

[Dory16]

It's the games bruh. Always the games... And with Microsoft it always seems to be about anything BUT the games.

Sony wins next gen. They already have. Just give it up unless Microsoft pulls at least ten successful IP's out of their hat that aren't Halo, Gears or Forza.

Hum.. I'm not sure that 10 is the bar. This generation it was God of War, Horizon and Uncharted 4 on my Pro (TLOU2 is not out yet). Those were the only unmissable for me and I still got a PS just for them. I played all the multiplats on the X for obvious reasons. Detroit I bought but still have to get past 2 hours played.
On the Switch I haven't gone deep into anything other than Odyssey, BOTW and Bayonetta 2.
Point being it doesn't take 10 separate critically acclaimed exclusives to make a successful console even if "games" are chosen as the only metric. If MS adds 3 more to their usual suspects they're in a good place. With 15 internal studios now, there's a good chance that's about to happen.
A lot of people come in because of 2 or 3 games that they can't find anywhere else. They add the multiplats. Then they stay because "the controller is better", "the services are cheaper and more user friendly", "my friends are on it". And may be "the exclusives are free from day one".
We'll see how this breaks out.

 

[diffusionx]

Microsoft doesn't care about generations anymore. They're not interested in the videogame console business the way it has been structured since the early 80s. I don't even think they care about selling consoles, or having the most powerful system. They want people on GamePass. That is their goal. They are trying to turn Xbox into a brand for services. I think they would be fine with a fraction of PS5 sales as long as every one of those consoles is on GamePass. The PC is just a bonus and for $5 a month the massive PC gaming userbase can get on board with that same service.

I don't know if it is going to work. But based on listening to what they say (not just Spencer, but Nadella on down), and based on their actions, this seems obvious to me. Eventually it has to work - Office 365 is not going to subsidize Xbox forever if GP and xCloud fail to turn into a profitable business. We will see.

 

[Shangounchained]

There will be at least 2 ways of defining winning and losing in the console market from next generation on:

1. Selling the most consoles: this has been the traditional success barometer until this generation. It may be a legitimate one in many regards but I think that Microsoft is defining a business model that will make this count irrelevant. With xcloud not requiring a console and Game Pass being accessible also on PC, with Game Pass itself receiving more an more games from publishers at increasing frequency, Microsoft has multiplied the revenue streams way beyond the cash received in exchange for a box sold. Combined with the fact that mid-gen refreshes now happen every 3 years, backwards compatibility becomes more important than ever to make sure that the count doesn't reset and the subscriptions just keep adding up. My main point here is that MS seems to have put itself in position to leverage ecosystem adoption in a way that comfortably mitigates selling fewer consoles than other manufacturers. You don't need to buy their box to be their customer. They will find you where you like to play. Chances are it includes your PC or your phone or tablet. You're Sony only? Wanna try Hellblade 2 with your dualshock 5 controller on your laptop screen when you're bored of Godfall? How about a gamepass/xcloud trial for a week? No, you're not dreaming. Those 100 other AAA games from the last 3 generations are available to you too. If you subscribe at the end of your trial for 14$ a month. On the go or on your 65'' inch "playstation only" gaming TV. And every future Xbox game studios exclusive comes day one for free from then on.
2. Being the most ubiquitous gaming brand. The brand that other gaming companies have to partner with in order to stay up to date with their customers expectations in terms of services (cloud infrastructure). The brand that game publishers have to come to in order to maximise the value of their IPs beyond what would have otherwise been their natural lifecycle (FF, Kingdom hearts and Yakuza on game pass anyone?). The brand that the most hardcore gamers who can't or refuse to spend over 800 bucks on a gaming machine but still expect the best gaming technology that money can buy have to come to. A brand capable of competing with any other company in terms of providing the "best" exclusive games (best will always be a matter of taste, they just have to keep this one close and cover all tastes ).

I declare myself impressed by Microsoft's transformation since the botched XboxOne launch and the replacement of Mattrick. They could have confined themselves to damage control and touted how they were still selling at a faster rate than the 360 (they did for a little while), which had already been unanimously acclaimed as a success. I commend Phil's guts to change course as drastically and quickly as he did. It took balls and humility to not just drop the DRM limitations but to take the kinect out of a product that had based the legitimacy of its price on it. To accept to take the ridicule and flak due to that admitted failure for years in order to build the foundation for better days. Xbox have never been this respected a gaming brand, even after having just "lost" a generation. The live crowd reactions at the game awards reveal were very telling, given that this wasn't a Microsoft event with a pre-conquered audience and nobody had expected their presence on stage. Even the stock of Ninja's theory name has already skyrocketed beyond what it's ever been, partially through their association with Microsoft. People weren't screaming just at the mention of the NT brand when they were still independent and making multiplats.

In sum, provided that MS's now obvious targets for the next generation (which they are well on track for meeting) are in fact met:

• having the (more or less clearly) most powerful console
• Releasing a minimum of 3 AAA exclusive games A YEAR, only one of them being either Halo, Gears or Forza
• Rolling out xcloud at the same or comparable quality as stadia but with the power of game pass behind it for a low subscription fee
• seamless backwards compatibility all the way back to the xbox 360
• More smart and tactical marketing decisions such as the game awards reveal going forward
• Ensuring that every mid-gen refresh maintains the "most powerful" advantage

Provided those 6 things all happen, I can't envision Microsoft "losing" the next generation.

Give me your thoughts. Fanboys allowed but tone it down, thanks

Microsofts problem is still the same, and they never learn "stick to basics"

1. New console should be as or more powerful than the competitions and series x seems so so check.

2. We need proper exclusives not quantum break, sea of thieves or hellblade we need a blockbuster like maxpayne, god of war and such, which they failed.

3. Presentation, weve seen 2 cinematic trailers for series x halo infinite and hellblade, no gameplay at all, big big big failure when presenting the so called most powerful console ever!

Those are my 3 basic rules!

 

[LokusAbriss]

Wrong. They haven't proven but two things:

Jack and shit. And jack already left town.

They are experimenting with things, but those things have a LONG way to go before they can be proven winners. I have big time reservations about the long term viability of Game Pass, but time will tell. Scarlett looks pretty good and I suspect I will have one on or close to release day.

They're talking a big game like they always do. But I am tired of talk.

Experimenting? Like delivering true 4k games with the One X? Like beeing able to play first party games on release day for a subscription named game pass, without paying 60 $/€ for a game, I wouldnt play otherwise? Sure.

Microsoft doesnt need to win shit. They are massively successfull and the Xbox brand is just some fun on the side. There is no way to beat the Sony brand. You cant turn away people from certain brands. Most people ceep buying the same brand of car, tv, phone and so on, forever. They could delivery double the power at half the price and when Fifa comes out again, people grab the Playstation.

So, nobody should be allowed to like Xbox, because some hate them so furiously, like you?

 

[Dory16]

Fundamentally, consoles make money in three ways. Selling 1st party games, getting paid 30% of all third party games sold to run on the system, and selling subscriptions. Subscriptions being a relatively new thing.

Nintendo makes money selling games, less so the other two revenue streams.

Sony makes money from all three. and it is because having a large install base means you get more of everything.

Microsoft? Microsoft is claiming they are going to have the largest install base by simply adding PCs... Except, PCs don't pay Microsoft 30% rent for third party games. (They would have on the Windows store, but that basically died.)
And subscriptions for online play doesn't exist on PC. Gamepass might seem good value now, but third party would drop out of Gamepass the second there is no longer a decent sized Xbox console install base. And if Gamepass show up on rival machines it is guaranteed to have no third party games.

Saying "you are playing on a Microsoft machine" is meaningless, if you are not in the full console ecosystem in buying games that pay Microsoft 30%, and also not paying subscription fees.

I mean, i wish Microsoft good luck and may the best console win. But right now Microsoft is pretending that the classic console business is not worth contesting, because they know they couldn't win. And pretending that consoles are dying is not going to make it come true.

Microsoft is abandoning everything that makes a game console business functional. like a stable hardware base and exclusive next gen games. We would not need to wait long to see if that was a smart idea.

I agree with most of that but how is MS abandoning "a stable hardware base" (it seems to me that "Series" indicates a dedication to producing consoles for the long term, actually more than a number increment does) or "exclusive next gen games" (it's not like the game they chose for the reveal was Madden 2021) ?

 

[Bernkastel]

Define 'lose'. The Xbox One sold 45 million and Series X will probably sell more. The only ones who lose are PlayStation fans since they ave been imagining an 'only Playstation' scenario since a decade. Thats like saying Samsung is the only good handset maker.

Im starting to think that MS isn't paying you guys enough to do this level of blatant shilling.

I am beyond sick of all the praise for MS without them actually delivering anything that is game changing. The only thing MS has won, is making noise and convincing certain people that noise means winning.

Im glad that we have people that believe that MS has next gen in the bag, but let's see them deliver something first.

I am sorry but if you keep on this blatant console war, it will be hypocritical to assume the other side will happily accept your arguments. Fanboy shilling is present in almost every tech community, but yours is the only community I have seen that cries that the other side wont happily accept their arguments and praise your product instead. No fanboy shill expects that to happen. Its like iPhone fans start crying "Why arent Android fans not saying Android sucks, they must be paid by Google to shill!".

 

[diffusionx]

Im starting to think that MS isn't paying you guys enough to do this level of blatant shilling.

I am beyond sick of all the praise for MS without them actually delivering anything that is game changing. The only thing MS has won, is making noise and convincing certain people that noise means winning.

Im glad that we have people that believe that MS has next gen in the bag, but let's see them deliver something first.

Have you used GamePass yet? I was skeptical but it is a genuinely awesome service. I'd argue that if Sony can't see what a potentially massive Netflix-type disruption it can be, they're not doing their job.

 

[nowhat]

Combined with the fact that mid-gen refreshes now happen every 3 years

 

[Dory16]

To the more experienced users of this forum: why did the "clickbait" label just appear next to "opinion" in my thread title on the main page? I haven't referenced any links whatsoever, I have just given my personal opinion about the console market. This is a gaming forum right?

 

[Codes 208]

I mean to their credit, atleast at their worst they arent the wii u.