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[Ass of Can Whooping]

I can give you one very good reason they won't do it for free. Money. Either the players will pay a small fee or Microsoft/Sony will. It makes no sense to work for free.

Publishers don't just look short term monetary gain. If it was as black and white as that they'd charge money for everything. Reality is they don't. They consider the PR, the player retention, the longevity of their games.

The other big difference this time around compared to last-gen is my copy of AC will work on the PS5 regardless. I don't need to fork out any money to play it on next-gen consoles.

From their point of view, how will they get me back to playing it again? Give me a free PS5 upgrade to entice me back in and maybe I'll even purchase DLC they released.

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

TSMC is Taiwan, and Taiwan is fairly normal, so starting APU silicon will be for both consoles on 300 mm.

Its all the other stuff that is questionable.

Yeah I've figured out that the SoC is assembled and packaged at TF AMD in Malaysia and the console assembled in Suzhou, China (One X was at least). The insider at Era has had their info verified so I assume this stuff has been checked out? The TF AMD plant seems to be in full running order according to a video showing their Covid-19 precautions on their website FWIW.

 

[Metroiddarks]

Who used FP16 again? What benefit did that provide?

Some games like Far Cry 5, that help mainly in shader performance.

 

[ksdixon]

I'm behind on everything.

Is there any new confirmations on PS5?

I phrase in that way, because last time I looked-in the thread it was xbox fans trying to dispel anything positive about PS5 (no rdna2, no VRS, no hw raytracing etc), despite devs/Sony saying otherwise.

 

[44alltheway]

I'm behind on everything.

Is there any new confirmations on PS5?

I phrase in that way, because last time I looked-in the thread it was xbox fans trying to dispel anything positive about PS5 (no rdna2, no VRS, no hw raytracing etc), despite devs/Sony saying otherwise.

Nothing new has been announced since Cerny’s talk a while ago. Well other than the DualSense.

 

[TBiddy]

Publishers don't just look short term monetary gain. If it was as black and white as that they'd charge money for everything. Reality is they don't. They consider the PR, the player retention, the longevity of their games.

The other big difference this time around compared to last-gen is my copy of AC will work on the PS5 regardless. I don't need to fork out any money to play it on next-gen consoles.

From their point of view, how will they get me back to playing it again? Give me a free PS5 upgrade to entice me back in and maybe I'll even purchase DLC they released.

That's true, but they are still companies. And companies exists to make money. It makes no sense to give away free games/updates, if they can charge for it.

I assume that both Cyberpunkt and Valhalla will work on the PS5 - just like that, with some upgrades, like the mid-gen refreshes we've seen. But I also assume, that if you want a true next gen experience of your Cyberpunk/Valhalla game, you need to fork out extra cash to. Unless Sony decides to do so.

I firmly believe that Microsoft is paying both Ubisoft and CDPR an undisclosed amount of money per upgrade.

 

[SenjutsuSage]

I think this gen devs were allowed to using 4.5 and later on it was 5.5GB of RAM. I do not see any reason why programmer should be limited to use only 10GB this time around ? SSD will help and in anycase PS5 has a big advantage in that regards.



According to the author of this blog Xbox RAM setup is not ideal and he thinks PS5 has advantage in spite of little slower GPU
https://hole-in-my-head.blogspot.com/2020/03/analyse-this-next-gen-consoles-part-9.html

He also wrote another article:
http://hole-in-my-head.blogspot.com/2020/04/analyse-this-next-gen-consoles-part-10_11.html

PS5 has the raw SSD speed advantage, I'm not nearly as willing to give them the implementation advantage just yet. Microsoft is doing some work around the usage of that SSD that are very impressive and that I feel many aren't appreciating. They've created a new I/O system specifically for gaming, they've designed a technique with custom texture filter hardware (not standard in RDNA2) around better utilization of textures of and physical RAM, the SSD is used like virtual RAM with 100GB instantly accessible by developers, they created a new compression systems specifically for gpu textures.

Moving on, they are far from limited to just 10GB. It's 13.5GB available to games. People are treating RAM as if everything is 100% dedicated to graphics processing. It isn't. Not every part of a game requires the highest speed access to memory. Many parts of a game that go into RAM on these consoles will also be the basic stuff that just makes the title work outside of just graphics processing. The gameplay systems, animations, enemy behaviors, combat mechanics and systems etc etc. And, again, Sampler Feedback Streaming for the visual part of titles literally changes the dynamic of how textures are loaded into memory. For games that utilize it, and I'm sure it will be more as time goes on, only the specific sections of a texture that's actually visible in the game will ever actually be loaded into physical RAM. So traditionally if 4GB or 6GB worth of RAM would be filled up with textures, Xbox Series X with SFS (Sampler Feedback Streaming) has the ability to cut that potential memory usage down to 2GB and 3GB respectively. As Microsoft said, it leads to a 2-3x multiplier in how physical RAM is used. In other words, Xbox Series X will have no issue with RAM, and there are games right out the gate at launch that will prove just that.

People think that it's the launch games that will be the easiest on the platform and the later titles where the memory setup will prove to be an issue? Wrong. Any issue, if any exists, will be on earlier titles since they won't necessarily all be designed to take advantage of SFS unless Microsoft somehow finds a way to make it automatic without developers having to code or modify their engine for it. The Xbox RAM setup is far from "not ideal." Any apparent issue is oversold on that front. Xbox will have absolutely no limitation for games this gen in that area. People who believe there will be an issue don't understand how it will actually work for devs. Am I saying that I do? Nope. But I know enough to know that people are going to be disappointed if they actually think this is going to hold Xbox Series X back in any meaningful way.

Take a PC title like Assassin's Creed Odyssey. It goes up to 6GB of VRAM usage at 4K at max quality settings. Gears 5 was hitting north of 5GB at 4K ultra quality on PC, and that is one of the most impressive titles on PC out there.

Here are some more examples.

How much VRAM do you need at 1080p, 1440p and 4K with AA enabled?

How much VRAM do you need when anti-aliasing is applied at 1080p, 1440p and 4K?

www.tweaktown.com

Far Cry 4 4K Ultra with AA enabled 5.7GB VRAM
Witcher 3 4K Ultra with AA 3.2GB VRAM
Battlefield 4 4K Ultra with AA 2.9GB VRAM
Shadow of Mordor 4K Ultra with AA 5.4GB VRAM
GTA5 4K Ultra with AA 6.3GB VRAM

Some of these games are older, but don't think for a second that they didn't bring it on texture quality on their PC versions. We will only now be approaching what some of these older PC games did with VRAM on PC with these consoles. It's why I cited Assassin's Creed Odyssey in there, to reference a newer game. And the VRAM needs haven't changed drastically in newer titles. In fact, in specific cases, the texture usage is down on some more impressive titles. . Even the Resident Evil remakes VRAM requirements, while high, are exaggerated.

 

[Metroiddarks]

Well, at this point I can say a no-brainer. The PSVRC must share characteristics with the DS.

Also, personal doubt, I am not clear that the controls are going to be sold together with the headset (in time or in a package). I repeat, my guess. No confirmation.

As Cerny put many effort in use normal headphones is probably they prefer to sold separately so in this way they can save some money, almost all user already have a headphones.

 

[gullideckel]

I don't think it makes any sense to compare a mid-gen refresh with a next-gen release of new consoles. Why would Ubisoft or CDPR willingly give up the opportunity to sell their games twice, if they aren't getting paid by either Sony/Microsoft or the players?

So your saying MS is paying for exclusive next-gen patches. How shameful.
Series X pre order cancelled!!

 

[TBiddy]

So your saying MS is paying for exclusive next-gen patches. How shameful.
Series X pre order cancelled!!

I have no idea how to respond to this. I'm baffled that was your conclusion.

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

That's true, but they are still companies. And companies exists to make money. It makes no sense to give away free games/updates, if they can charge for it.

I assume that both Cyberpunkt and Valhalla will work on the PS5 - just like that, with some upgrades, like the mid-gen refreshes we've seen. But I also assume, that if you want a true next gen experience of your Cyberpunk/Valhalla game, you need to fork out extra cash to. Unless Sony decides to do so.

I firmly believe that Microsoft is paying both Ubisoft and CDPR an undisclosed amount of money per upgrade.

They are making money though. They're just not making money directly from the patches. Same way free to play games indirectly make money from free content updates.

 

[TBiddy]

They are making money though. They're just not making money directly from the patches. Same way free to play games indirectly make money from free content updates.

How? Do you expect them to introduce MTX or release paid DLC to cover the expenses?

 

[B_Boss]

I forgot about physical media, but yes, it's not a big deal for the system to recognize the disc and add the crossbuy option to the account, be it a current gen or next gen disc.

I wonder though....would it be easy to gain a free digital title using a friends disc?

It makes no sense to give away free games/updates, if they can charge for it.

I’d wager that it definitely makes sense if you want to retain your customers, encourage trust, gain new customers, etc. We could probably come up with a number of reasons why it makes perfect sense to not charge for it. The fact that they can charge does not necessarily mean that they will charge. Probably depends on a number of factors.

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

How? Do you expect them to introduce MTX or release paid DLC to cover the expenses?

Yes? The entire point is to expose as many people to your paid expansions, dlc microtransactions, or whatever. In order to that do that you have to get them back in the game first.

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

PS5 has the raw SSD speed advantage, I'm not nearly as willing to give them the implementation advantage just yet. Microsoft is doing some work around the usage of that SSD that are very impressive and that I feel many aren't appreciating. They've created a new I/O system specifically for gaming, they've designed a technique with custom texture filter hardware (not standard in RDNA2) around better utilization of textures of and physical RAM, the SSD is used like virtual RAM with 100GB instantly accessible by developers, they created a new compression systems specifically for gpu textures.

Moving on, they are far from limited to just 10GB. It's 13.5GB available to games. People are treating RAM as if everything is 100% dedicated to graphics processing. It isn't. Not every part of a game requires the highest speed access to memory. Many parts of a game that go into RAM on these consoles will also be the basic stuff that just makes the title work outside of just graphics processing. The gameplay systems, animations, enemy behaviors, combat mechanics and systems etc etc. And, again, Sampler Feedback Streaming for the visual part of titles literally changes the dynamic of how textures are loaded into memory. For games that utilize it, and I'm sure it will be more as time goes on, only the specific sections of a texture that's actually visible in the game will ever actually be loaded into physical RAM. So traditionally if 4GB or 6GB worth of RAM would be filled up with textures, Xbox Series X with SFS (Sampler Feedback Streaming) has the ability to cut that potential memory usage down to 2GB and 3GB respectively. As Microsoft said, it leads to a 2-3x multiplier in how physical RAM is used. In other words, Xbox Series X will have no issue with RAM, and there are games right out the gate at launch that will prove just that.

People think that it's the launch games that will be the easiest on the platform and the later titles where the memory setup will prove to be an issue? Wrong. Any issue, if any exists, will be on earlier titles since they won't necessarily all be designed to take advantage of SFS unless Microsoft somehow finds a way to make it automatic without developers having to code or modify their engine for it. The Xbox RAM setup is far from "not ideal." Any apparent issue is oversold on that front. Xbox will have absolutely no limitation for games this gen in that area. People who believe there will be an issue don't understand how it will actually work for devs. Am I saying that I do? Nope. But I know enough to know that people are going to be disappointed if they actually think this is going to hold Xbox Series X back in any meaningful way.

Take a PC title like Assassin's Creed Odyssey. It goes up to 6GB of VRAM usage at 4K at max quality settings. Gears 5 was hitting north of 5GB at 4K ultra quality on PC, and that is one of the most impressive titles on PC out there.

Here are some more examples.

How much VRAM do you need at 1080p, 1440p and 4K with AA enabled?

How much VRAM do you need when anti-aliasing is applied at 1080p, 1440p and 4K?

www.tweaktown.com

Far Cry 4 4K Ultra with AA enabled 5.7GB VRAM
Witcher 3 4K Ultra with AA 3.2GB VRAM
Battlefield 4 4K Ultra with AA 2.9GB VRAM
Shadow of Mordor 4K Ultra with AA 5.4GB VRAM
GTA5 4K Ultra with AA 6.3GB VRAM

Some of these games are older, but don't think for a second that they didn't bring it on texture quality on their PC versions. We will only now be approaching what some of these older PC games did with VRAM on PC with these consoles. It's why I cited Assassin's Creed Odyssey in there, to reference a newer game. And the VRAM needs haven't changed drastically in newer titles. In fact, in specific cases, the texture usage is down on some more impressive titles. . Even the Resident Evil remakes VRAM requirements, while high, are exaggerated.

PS5 has both the advantage in RAW speeds and compressed speeds. The steps Microsoft took to reduce the gap with the velocity architecture doesn't change that, especially considering Sony also took those steps.

 

[Metroiddarks]

PS5’s Tempest Engine Is Hardware Accelerated, Will Be A Huge Boost To CPU – Hellpoint Dev

gamingbolt.com

“3D audio has been around for a long while,” Jutras said. “You could have it running on existing consoles easily… but not a lot of game do, because it pretty much takes too much CPU time. Until now, it had to run software.”


“But now it’s hardware accelerated,” he continued. “It means there’s no reason not to use it. For us, it will most likely mean PS5 might sound better with the flick of a switch. Assuming you have the audio system to handle that. Also means we could have a CPU thread freed from heavy audio computation! Even if both consoles had exactly the same CPU, having a specific task being hardware accelerated can be a huge boost for the CPU.”

I am still expecting PS5 use a faster memory than only 448 GB/s, Cerny says the devs needs be careful when work with tempeste engine as this can eat a big part of the bandwidth 20%,
so a game with complex shaders and huge textures will be very hard to use it to its 100% or even not possible.


I know not all the game should use it but at least I want they give more probabilities to see in action to all its potential.

 

[TBiddy]

Yes? The entire point is to expose as many people to your paid expansions, dlc microtransactions, or whatever. In order to that do that you have to get them back in the game first.

I think it would piss of consumers more if companies introduced MTX than if they charged a small fee to upgrade your game to a true next-gen experience.

Nonetheless - it's going to be interesting to see how things turn out.

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

I think it would piss of consumers more if companies introduced MTX than if they charged a small fee to upgrade your game to a true next-gen experience.

Nonetheless - it's going to be interesting to see how things turn out.

They're not selling the microtransactions to cover the cost of developing a patch. The microtransactions are going to be there regardless if there are any. The amount of work it'd take in the first place is pocket change to them.

They're not developing patches to make money of them. They're developing patches to give their games more longevity.

 

[TBiddy]

They're not selling the microtransactions to cover the cost of developing a patch. The microtransactions are going to be there regardless if there are any.

I was talking about introducing MTX if the game doesn't have it, since you mentioned it as a way of paying for the upgrade.

I still think it would be a bad business case to release your patch for free.

 

[Metroiddarks]

I was talking about introducing MTX if the game doesn't have it, since you mentioned it as a way of paying for the upgrade.

I still think it would be a bad business case to release your patch for free.

I am also think Xbox pay for that free patch but I am not sure how good this gonna works since the ratio of sells of a third party
between Xbox vs PC vs PS5 so I cannot think in any case where a third party sells more in Xbox side (yes I know this can change in a couple of years).

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

I was talking about introducing MTX if the game doesn't have it, since you mentioned it as a way of paying for the upgrade.

I still think it would be a bad business case to release your patch for free.

No publisher is going to introduce microtransaction just because they released a PS5 patch for free

 

[MasterCornholio]

PS5 has both the advantage in RAW speeds and compressed speeds. The steps Microsoft took to reduce the gap with the velocity architecture doesn't change that, especially considering Sony also took those steps.

Removing all the software implantations and just looking at the hardware.

There's nothing that Microsoft can do to beat Sonys I/O solution because of the way they designed their SSD. And the same goes to the GPUs CU as well when it comes to Sony.

This is just something that everyone has to accept.

They each have their advantages and nothing that people will say on a forum will change that.

 

[xIFreddy]

Watch: Sony Reveals Research On Next-Gen Finger-Tracked VR Controllers

Past patents have suggested that Sony is working on finger-tracking for a new VR motion controller, possibly PlayStation Move 2, to be paired with an unannounced PSVR 2 headset. Now a new video from Sony researchers gives us a much more solid look at that work. The video accompanies a

uploadvr.com

 

[Physiognomonics]

I am still expecting PS5 use a faster memory than only 448 GB/s, Cerny says the devs needs be careful when work with tempeste engine as this can eat a big part of the bandwidth 20%,
so a game with complex shaders and huge textures will be very hard to use it to its 100% or even not possible.


I know not all the game should use it but at least I want they give more probabilities to see in action to all its potential.

Up to 20GB/s (if they ever use 100% of the audio CU, but that probably won't happen), not 20%.

 

[Metroiddarks]

Up to 20GB/s (if they ever use 100% of the audio CU, but that probably won't happen), not 20%.

The quote of Cerny said 20% of total bandwidth, I know this will be weird to happen but even before know this we already
think 448 GB/s maybe was not enough.

 

[Neo Blaster]

I firmly believe that Microsoft is paying both Ubisoft and CDPR an undisclosed amount of money per upgrade.

They already paid for marketing exclusivity, really doubt about crossbuy exclusivity.

 

[Aceofspades]

PS5 has both the advantage in RAW speeds and compressed speeds. The steps Microsoft took to reduce the gap with the velocity architecture doesn't change that, especially considering Sony also took those steps.

Lets not forget that PS5 is using Kraken which is more efficient than Zlib used in Series X.

 

[Lunatic_Gamer]

PS5’s Tempest Engine Is Hardware Accelerated, Will Be A Huge Boost To CPU – Hellpoint Dev

“3D audio has been around for a long while,” Jutras said. “You could have it running on existing consoles easily… but not a lot of game do, because it pretty much takes too much CPU time. Until now, it had to run software.”

“But now it’s hardware accelerated,” he continued. “It means there’s no reason not to use it. For us, it will most likely mean PS5 might sound better with the flick of a switch. Assuming you have the audio system to handle that. Also means we could have a CPU thread freed from heavy audio computation! Even if both consoles had exactly the same CPU, having a specific task being hardware accelerated can be a huge boost for the CPU.”

PS5’s Tempest Engine Is Hardware Accelerated, Will Be A Huge Boost To CPU – Hellpoint Dev

gamingbolt.com

 

[Physiognomonics]

The quote of Cerny said 20% of total bandwidth, I know this will be weird to happen but even before know this we already
think 448 GB/s maybe was not enough.

They misquoted him. It's not possible with only one CU to take that much bandwidth.

 

[Andodalf]

PS5’s Tempest Engine Is Hardware Accelerated, Will Be A Huge Boost To CPU – Hellpoint Dev

“3D audio has been around for a long while,” Jutras said. “You could have it running on existing consoles easily… but not a lot of game do, because it pretty much takes too much CPU time. Until now, it had to run software.”

“But now it’s hardware accelerated,” he continued. “It means there’s no reason not to use it. For us, it will most likely mean PS5 might sound better with the flick of a switch. Assuming you have the audio system to handle that. Also means we could have a CPU thread freed from heavy audio computation! Even if both consoles had exactly the same CPU, having a specific task being hardware accelerated can be a huge boost for the CPU.”

PS5’s Tempest Engine Is Hardware Accelerated, Will Be A Huge Boost To CPU – Hellpoint Dev

gamingbolt.com

We've known about dedicated hardware blocks for Audio for a long time? For both consoles? How is this news? Why do we care about hellpoint speculating about one having it and on not when we've it that both have it for months? Why do we care about anything they say?

 

[Aceofspades]

They misquoted him. It's not possible with only one CU to take that much bandwidth.

What makes you say that TE is only one CU? How can it be more powerful than entire Jaguar CPU by simply be one repurposed CU core?

 

[Vaztu]

I think it would piss of consumers more if companies introduced MTX than if they charged a small fee to upgrade your game to a true next-gen experience.

Nonetheless - it's going to be interesting to see how things turn out.

Have MS confirmed both versions of Cyberpunk will be free ?

First version is enhanced BC mode of Cyberpunk that you can play right away. Second version is a true next-gen experience which will come later on (probably 2021).

Will players get to play both versions for the price of one ?

 

[LittleBigGamer]

Why bringing Drake in the convertation?

 

[TBiddy]

No publisher is going to introduce microtransaction just because they released a PS5 patch for free

You said so yourself. Or at least, you answered "Yes" to my question if you expected them to introduce MTX or release paid DLC to cover the expenses:

How? Do you expect them to introduce MTX or release paid DLC to cover the expenses?

Yes? The entire point is to expose as many people to your paid expansions, dlc microtransactions, or whatever. In order to that do that you have to get them back in the game first.

They already paid for marketing exclusivity, really doubt about crossbuy exclusivity.

I'm not talking about exclusivity. I'm talking about Microsoft paying CDPR to release a free (for the end consumer, at least) version of the game to existing customers, who upgrade to the XSX.

 

[geordiemp]

What makes you say that TE is only one CU? How can it be more powerful than entire Jaguar CPU by simply be one repurposed CU core?

Its only more powerful in the frequency domain, FFT stuff specific to audio.

NO its not measured in Terrafloppies.

Some processors are good at logic, some at graphics and calculations, some at sounds and frequencies.

 

[Neo Blaster]

I'm not talking about exclusivity. I'm talking about Microsoft paying CDPR to release a free (for the end consumer, at least) version of the game to existing customers, who upgrade to the XSX.

Anyway, I don't think they're paying CDPR twice.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

That they've made (logical) customizations means they've made enough customizations to efficiently harness the power of their beast? I can assure you that I have not seen money from anyone for making my statements. But I am sure that large companies do collect sales with theirs. Another thing is what you find at home after buying your products. That's then where you will really see what the FUD is (you know that I have not bothered to look for what FUD means but because of the tone it should not be a good thing, if I am wrong receive my cordial apologies).

Regarding VR, I have tried pretty well what Microsoft was up to, and what do you want me to tell you? No wonder it ended up in the trash (which is where it is now). When things are delayed and plans change, it is not precisely because they are going well. There are also two statements from Microsoft that went strangely unnoticed (oh what a coincidence). In one they said that they had no intention of maintaining an open war with Sony in this generation. In the other they said that VR was not important to them. Who knows, maybe it's because they knew things that users sometimes miss.

The day they present something interesting about it I will be the first of my company to promote development for that system, as I have always done, even with the "HorrorLens" (don't get me wrong, it is my opinion, I think that AR / VR is the future applied to a contact lens, and everything that we are living now, victories and failures, is necessary to reach that goal, I only hope that they improve it as soon as possible the better to be able to enjoy it before I die.

I don't forget nothing (forget? Forgot?). For the last few weeks I have been fighting for my life against Covid and I have buried about family and friends (well, legally it has not yet been allowed to officiate the funeral), but I have had a long time to be well informed of everything that happens in my sector in my long bed's days. And I can assure you that if I respond to your replies it is not out of offense, but out of courtesy and politeness, because honestly I will sleep just as calm, whether you believe my statements or not. There are more important things in this life and if one thing I have learned is that you cannot make everyone happy. I only hope that my information does not lead you to make a wrong decision.

Thank you for your time, dear brother. You are from the very rare devs surviving around that still feed us some real, first hand experience. All contributes are welcome and great indeed, but you know what you are talking about and still under NDA.

My condolences for your losses, and I hope for you and your beloved ones to be healthy and happy.

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

You said so yourself. Or at least, you answered "Yes" to my question if you expected them to introduce MTX or release paid DLC to cover the expenses:

Misinterepred what you meant then, my bad.

No. They won't introduce microtransactions to cover the expenses of a patch. The microtransactions., or whatever they have in place to generate income pays for it just like it pays for all the continued support of the games.

What they value more than having every behind a price barrier is an active player base, and the best way to have an active player base is free content and updates.

 

[Bonsaibäumchen]

You said so yourself. Or at least, you answered "Yes" to my question if you expected them to introduce MTX or release paid DLC to cover the expenses:






I'm not talking about exclusivity. I'm talking about Microsoft paying CDPR to release a free (for the end consumer, at least) version of the game to existing customers, who upgrade to the XSX.

You have obviously no Idea how CDPR operates. They'll release next-gen patches for free either way if its possible. They've always been pro consumer.
No need to pay them...

They misquoted him. It's not possible with only one CU to take that much bandwidth.

Thats right they misquoted him because he said the tempest engine might take up to 20GB/s bandwith if not handled carefully.

Watch: Sony Reveals Research On Next-Gen Finger-Tracked VR Controllers

Past patents have suggested that Sony is working on finger-tracking for a new VR motion controller, possibly PlayStation Move 2, to be paired with an unannounced PSVR 2 headset. Now a new video from Sony researchers gives us a much more solid look at that work. The video accompanies a

uploadvr.com

This is actually HUGE and BG already reacted to it which might be a clue of what to expect.

But Sony already mentioned they won't release PSVR with the console as far as I know. The rumor was they don't want consumers to see the whole pricetag for everything together.
They'll release PSVR2 later down the road. Maybe a year later maybe even later around the time of PS5Pro? Remember PSVR pricetag was about 400$€. I would expect PSVR2 to cost the same, probably even more.

 

[Killer Sakoman]

Dang. Anyways I can always upgrade my GPU to an RTX series once the 3000 series drops the price of those GPUs.

The mid range 3000 series will cheaper and faster than high end 2000 series.

 

[geordiemp]

Misinterepred what you meant then, my bad.

No. They won't introduce microtransactions to cover the expenses of a patch. The microtransactions., or whatever they have in place to generate income pays for it just like it pays for all the continued support of the games.

What they value more than having every behind a price barrier is an active player base, and the best way to have an active player base is free content and updates.

If a game publisher does not say upfront that their game is cross gen, then many of the big spenders who buy consoles month 1 will simply delay buying that game.

agree no way will people double dip this year.

 

[Bonsaibäumchen]

The quote of Cerny said 20% of total bandwidth, I know this will be weird to happen but even before know this we already
think 448 GB/s maybe was not enough.

See here with link to the interview and cernys quote:

Cerny already mentioned that using the tempest engine developers will have to be careful otherwise it may take up to 20GB/s of bandwidth.

PlayStation 5 uncovered: the Mark Cerny tech deep dive

On March 18th, Sony finally broke cover with in-depth information on the technical make-up of PlayStation 5. Expanding …

www.eurogamer.net

"GPUs process hundreds or even thousands of wavefronts; the Tempest engine supports two," explains Mark Cerny. "One wavefront is for the 3D audio and other system functionality, and one is for the game. Bandwidth-wise, the Tempest engine can use over 20GB/s, but we have to be a little careful because we don't want the audio to take a notch out of the graphics processing."

 

[rntongo]

As someone that doesn't pretend to understand all the tech stuff I feel I do understand what Mark Cerny was explaining in the Road to PS5 video (after repeat viewings!).

That is removing the I/O bottlenecks and allowing devs to take advantage of it automatically or with minimal effort via the dev tools/software. It is all about efficiency throughout the pipeline.

That is how I'm understanding it. Comparing systems shouldn't be the takeaway here....

True, but some use the fact that PS5 removed I/O bottlenecks as proof that XSX did not. Which is not true. Both systems virtually eliminate bottlenecks.

 

[Killer Sakoman]

If @BGs did some FUD you did as well with all those wall text. Nobody is forced to believe in these guys. Believe whoever wants. I find super bizarre that Odium did the same shit over the thread posting and teasing with those silly leaks, info... and in end he post asking for hunting down everyone who lied? I mean, wtf?

His wall of text is really thicc. I cannot judge him however because I don't have the time to read all that text thiccness

 

[Metroiddarks]

See here with link to the interview and cernys quote:



"GPUs process hundreds or even thousands of wavefronts; the Tempest engine supports two," explains Mark Cerny. "One wavefront is for the 3D audio and other system functionality, and one is for the game. Bandwidth-wise, the Tempest engine can use over 20GB/s, but we have to be a little careful because we don't want the audio to take a notch out of the graphics processing."

Ok so one source is wrong, I expect is the video because 20% is a lot, thank you for that.

 

[rntongo]

No ps5 is 10.3 tf. There is no 9.2 tf.

If u refer to github in early 2019 where ps5 was 2ghz , xsx was also 1.6ghz .because both were running rdna1 at the time of test. Xsx went to 1.8ghz and ps5 went to 2.25 ghz . Stop spreading bullshit about 9.2 tf. It doesnt exist.

I can just randomly say xsx clock was 1.6ghz so it is really a 10.4 tf console since in github at one point the clock was 1.6 ghz but it has been pushed so hard with zero back up for my claims .

Anyways I can see u want to do warrior bs by stating inaccurate and false info. So its the end of our discussion

But wasn't the December Github leak still 9.2tf?

 

[MasterCornholio]

But wasn't the December Github leak still 9.2tf?

It really doesn't matter if the PS5 was 7, 8 or 9TF at one time. What matters is what the final product will be. There was even a rumor that there was an extremely early build with Jaguar cores.

 

[DeepEnigma]

What makes you say that TE is only one CU? How can it be more powerful than entire Jaguar CPU by simply be one repurposed CU core?

It is basically a modified SPU like in the Cell. A modern Cell (and even the OG one) would run circles around the Jaguar in the calculations they are filling this with. Another reason the PS3 had better audio logic than the current gen machines.

 

[ANIMAL1975]

That's not fair. Fixed clocks do serve a purpose. In consoles, fixed clocks provide a very predictable platform that welcomes low level optimizations.

Their importance in modern development environments where the SDK is meant for coding for a virtualization platform, however, can be debated. As always, though, old habits die hard.

That's why ps5 devkits have fixed clocks.

why would we even care about the OS? It can run on DDR 3 for all we care.


Well, you don’t know what RDAN 3 features PS5 has or what RDNA 3 is (we don’t even fully know RDNA2 yet), so I suggest waiting until you actually know both things before trying to make fun of him

Lol and the same applies to Alex Battlefield, he should wait for things to be confirmed before jumping on people on Twitter with sarcastic remarks! Even more him, being a DF employee!

That's true, but they are still companies. And companies exists to make money. It makes no sense to give away free games/updates, if they can charge for it.

I assume that both Cyberpunkt and Valhalla will work on the PS5 - just like that, with some upgrades, like the mid-gen refreshes we've seen. But I also assume, that if you want a true next gen experience of your Cyberpunk/Valhalla game, you need to fork out extra cash to. Unless Sony decides to do so.

I firmly believe that Microsoft is paying both Ubisoft and CDPR an undisclosed amount of money per upgrade.

You know that the free upgrade announced for XSX is not the yet to be revealed, full next gen version of the game don't you?
We have a thread:

Cyberpunk 2077 may be playable on PlayStation 5 at launch, but CD Projekt Red cannot confirm anything until Sony addresses the cross-gen upgrade matters.

Speaking at a recent Q&A session, SVP of Business Development Michal Nowakowski confirmed again that the highly-anticipated role-playing game will be playable on Xbox Series X at launch thanks to Smart Delivery, which will allow the developer to release a free upgrade.


The same cannot be confirmed for Cyberpunk 2077 on PlayStation 5, as the developer is waiting for Sony to make announcements regarding cross-gen updates and they do not want to jump the gun ahead of them.


During the same Q&A, it has also been confirmed that a proper, full-blown next-gen release may come, but only at a later time.


Cyberpunk 2077 launches on PC, PlayStation 4 and Xbox One on September 17th, 2020. Despite the current pandemic, the game is still on track for the announced release date.

Cyberpunk 2077 PlayStation 5 Free Upgrade Can't Be Confirmed at the Time; Full-Blown Next-Gen Release May Come Later On

Due to Sony still have to announce some PlayStation 5 policies, CDPR cannot say if Cyberpunk 2077 will get a free next-gen upgrade

wccftech.com

 

[DaGwaphics]

You know that the free upgrade, isn't the 'real' and yet to be revealed, next gen version of the game don't you?
We have a thread:

The full "next-gen" version is probably more of a play mode that can't be discussed now for obvious reasons. That type of thing requires a bit more work altering game play mechanics and such, most of these cross-gen games won't be working that angle.