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Microsoft acquires Zenimax/Bethesda

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Skyrim sold 30 million in 2016. There, you've shown it dwarfs the other Sony IPs(and not included any sales since then, including Switch, VR or the tail of Special Edition). Its wide multiplatform appeal itself shows the force behind it. Using Gran Turismo Sport is sad, as GT used to sell about 17-18 million before, so a shadow of its former self. "Look selling 8 million is comparable to this sales number cause of.... it being added with tons of titles adds up for what the others lack".
Also, I'm doubtful about your Fallout 4 sales claim, as I can't find any data on it, other than at launch (first 3 days) 12 million shipping and 1.3 million sales on Steam. I'm pretty sure Fallout 4 should be higher unless you have some info I don't.
Add The Elder Scrolls Online with 15 million sold btw. Also why did you use Uncharted 4 sales and not Lost Legacy? How much did the previous title Uncharted 3 sell? Are you sure that Skyrim is the outlier and not GoW and Uncharted 4? Personally I view them more as a part of the success of PS4 than somehow being "big franchises", because they weren't really that big before, other than Gran Turismo.
Maybe you'd have me with "Sony has good studios", which I definitely would agree with. Then again, I definitely wouldn't say "the studios made it sell that much" or "the ip made them sell that much". It's likely a mix, including the fact that PS4 had way more units out in hands than Xbox One. Twice the amount.

Hyperbole? No, it's an acknowledgment of just how defining Bethesda has been in the WRPG scene. Even Oblivion sold like 10 million in its time. And back then 10 million was pretty fucking huge.
Can you find any consistent 10+ million sellers for Sony?

Bethesda is huge. No need to undersell just how big an accomplishment selling 30+ million is by trying to stack up lesser selling titles. That could equally be done about those titles as well with lesser selling ones. "Look this publisher has a total of x sales if we stack these titles". That's not to say that the Sony titles aren't selling well, but they are definitely not in Elder Scrolls territory.
However, as shown with Fallout 76, even if you've got a really big IP, if you produce crap, then expect that the golden egg can easily turn out bad. And Sony does have an advantage, not in their IP, but in their position in other markets than the US. And in their dedication to taking some risks with smaller titles.

You're missing the point of why i posted that comparison. If Sony lost Bethesda support they still have a massive catalog of ip's across numerous genres that sell millions if not tens of millions to fall back on. Sony isn't losing 30 Million customers to Xbox because of Bethesda dropping support. Bethesda isn't this sales giant for Sony where losing them throws the company into chaos. Its a loss, but its a small piece of a much larger pie.

The internet is 100% talking out of its ass regarding this acquisition. Yes, Bethesda is huge. Microsoft paying 7+ Billion reflects that. But Playstation is a massive WORLDWIDE brand coming off a generation of selling 100+ Million consoles with multiple best sellers (none of which came from Bethesda). This idea that Microsoft just murdered Sony is console war nonsense.
 
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RafterXL

Member
Who remembers how big of a deal was when Microsoft bought Rare 20 years ago? Turned out great didnt it?

Im sure Bethesda will be better, but ya'll should calm down with the early celebrations
Lol. Rare is a single developer. Zenimax has multiple development studios and dozens of IPs, including:

Elder Scrolls
Fallout
Starfield
ESO
Wolfenstein
Doom
Quake
Dishonored
Prey
The Evil Within

This and Rare aren't even remotely comparable.
 

Hezekiah

Banned
Did you just really say Nintendo rips off its fans a week after $69.99?

Pot meet kettle.
Are we talking about the future now, comparing next gen to current-gen?

And not only that but the development costs of Switch games are almost certainly lower than their rivals are, but those savings are not passed on to the consumer, but pocketed by Nintendo - not that many Nintendo fans seem to mind :messenger_beaming:.
 

Guilty_AI

Member
Well that was unexpected on so many levels.

I'm not sure what to think of it because this has so many implications to all the affected studios, to MS output and ecosystem, to console wars and the industry as a whole.

Is Sony going to retaliate somehow? Was FFXVI their ace in the hole or do they have more up their sleeve? I wonder if Sony heard this was coming which may explain the pre-order shitshow drop last week. Was MS waiting for Sony to show FF and price to reveal this?

I was completely ready to drop the MS ecosystem forever but this changes things...
I think Sony just grew too arrogant due to their success this past gen, while MS is clearly learning from their mistakes.
"We have no games? Lets buy more studios and give them more creative freedom. Is the Xbox ecosystems not big enough? Lets include the PC one which we have a large stake in. People don't like buying in our store? Lets put our games on steam (and force xlive accounts on them)"
 
All the hurt butts. I love how everyone here thinks that they are a better judge of investments than some of the more intelligent people at Microsoft. Not to mention all the merchandising and licensing they can do with all the well known IP.
Hexen
Quake
Doom
Wolfenstein
Fallout
The Elder Scrolls
Starfield
Dishonored

All of these franchises are top notch and most have a lineage. I noticed a lot of people talking about Vulkan in here, but that’s made by the guys that created Open GL.

this is a big move here.
 
Well tell you what, this proves Xbox are not fucking around this coming generation. I think they really got hurt last gen and they are very serious about giving Sony a run for their money.

I think it's a very aggressive move and Sony really need to take note and have an equally big response. Buying Square Enix I think is the right move to make here. Also to be even more aggressive I'd throw in buying From Software as well as Square Enix.

Ultimately whatever happens it's a great deal for gamers. Having Bethesda and their Studio games all on Gamepass is actually insane.

It's certainly made me plan to get an Xbox Series S as a Gamepass/Bethesda machine which I'll get in 2022 because realistically I think that's when we are going to really see this buy out come into proper action.

Buying into Gamepass and their systems is exactly what MS want so good moves Team Xbox, good moves.

Sony, your turn next.
 
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quest

Not Banned from OT
This is what happens when the best first party studios can produce is Craig. Memes doin gods work.
Actually I'm betting craig put the deal over the top. So the Sony warriors helped make this happen lol. They turned the internet on Microsoft so they used this for good will to the fan base.
 

Compsiox

Banned
After reading the press release, I don't know for sure if games that don't already have deals will become exclusive to PC and Xbox. It appears Zenimax will still act as the publisher as well?
 

BlackM1st

Banned
ah yes, finally someone with some common sense.

This is exactly what I meant from my post that was quoted by the user you’re replying to.

Only thing worrying now is if both Sony and MS decide to buy up everyone, 1 by 1, what does that mean for the future?? 🤷🏽‍♂️
I was always a PC & PS guy.For me future will not change anything hah. I mean I hope that MS will stick with their PC=XBOX formula :D

So my advice is that everyone should buy a PC instead of XBOX as a 2nd console.
 

RafterXL

Member
Are we talking about the future now, comparing next gen to current-gen?

And not only that but the development costs of Switch games are almost certainly lower than their rivals are, but those savings are not passed on to the consumer, but pocketed by Nintendo - not that many Nintendo fans seem to mind :messenger_beaming:.

Oh trust me, my eyes roll back in my head every time a Nintendo fan utters the word "evergreen". Nintendo price fixing is real and they suck for it.

But $70 for next gen games is also bullshit. Games have never sold better and never been more profitable. There's not a single valid excuse for the hike except the fact they know people will pay it.

Well tell you what, this proves Xbox are not fucking around this coming generation. I think they really got hurt last gen and they are very serious about giving Sony a run for their money.

Agreed, and just a few days ago we had people seriously acting like Microsoft was doomed and would get run out of the business. Microsoft came to play and aren't going anywhere.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
Well tell you what, this proves Xbox are not fucking around this coming generation. I think they really got hurt last gen and they are very serious about giving Sony a run for their money.

I think it's a very aggressive move and Sony really need to take note and have an equally big response. Buying Square Enix I think is the right move to make here. Also to be even more aggressive I'd throw in buying From Software as well as Square Enix.

Ultimately whatever happens it's a great deal for gamers. Having Bethesda and their Studio games all on Gamepass is actually insane.

It's certainly made me plan to get an Xbox Series S as a Gamepass/Bethesda machine which I'll get in 2022 because realistically I think that's when we are going to really see this buy out come into proper action.

Buying into Gamepass and their systems is exactly what MS want so good moves Team Xbox, good moves.

Sony, your turn next.
New gen allows MS to start over fresh and blast the new PR as a hook.

Xbox One was never going to come close to PS4, so not any point trying to do all this crazy stuff in 2016 and 2017 hoping the trend will rebound by now. Might as well start new and put Xbox One, One X and One S to the graveyard. When generations reset, things can swing wildly.

It's no surprise MS is trying to get gamers buy into the most powerful console, then do Bethesda, EA Play in GP, big promo about All Access financing etc....

It's like a tennis match, if a player is down 2-5 in a set, does he burn himself out hoping to miraculously win the set 7-6? Maybe. And sometimes it happens. But probably better to conserve energy and go for the next set new.
 

Piku_Ringo

Banned
This announcement bringing out peoples true colors. What a pathetic video.

It never ceases to amaze me how many people these days appear to make their living off of being whiny fanboys on YouTube.

ZMYADuX.gif
 
Agreed, and just a few days ago we had people seriously acting like Microsoft was doomed and would get run out of the business. Microsoft came to play and aren't going anywhere.

To be quite honest after their poor reveals on both occasions I think people had good reason to be very worried about the future of Xbox. Myself included.

This acquisition absolutely changes all of that.
 

Kerotan

Member
Companies usually don't make multi billion dollar acquisitions using cash. Sony would use credit since they have good rating from Moodys and S&P.

Only reason MLB The Show is multiplatform is because MLB reached a deal with Sony where Sony SD is the only company making MLB games now. In order to do so they'd have to release the game on other platforms.
Yes but Sony were obviously happy to do so. Likewise WWE, MBA etc would be much more viable as multiplaform. I believe Sony would keep them as so.
 
New gen allows MS to start over fresh and blast the new PR as a hook.

Xbox One was never going to come close to PS4, so not any point trying to do all this crazy stuff in 2016 and 2017 hoping the trend will rebound by now. Might as well start new and put Xbox One, One X and One S to the graveyard. When generations reset, things can swing wildly.

It's no surprise MS is trying to get gamers buy into the most powerful console, then do Bethesda, EA Play in GP, big promo about All Access financing etc....

It's like a tennis match, if a player is down 2-5 in a set, does he burn himself out hoping to miraculously win the set 7-6? Maybe. And sometimes it happens. But probably better to conserve energy and go for the next set new.

Oh 100% and I think everyone knew or at least hoped that was going to be the play. They did falter with their last two reveals but this has completely changed things.

Sony can get very arrogant when they are on top, just look at the PS3 reveal. It took them a while to recover that market share and Xbox 360 was the winner of that generation.

Sony should take note with what's happening here or they may just start to find themselves in trouble.
 

Hezekiah

Banned
Oh trust me, my eyes roll back in my head every time a Nintendo fan utters the word "evergreen". Nintendo price fixing is real and they suck for it.

But $70 for next gen games is also bullshit. Games have never sold better and never been more profitable. There's not a single valid excuse for the hike except the fact they know people will pay it.



Agreed, and just a few days ago we had people seriously acting like Microsoft was doomed and would get run out of the business. Microsoft came to play and aren't going anywhere.
I think a price increase was coming. However if it's $70 it needs to be €70.

On Microsoft I don't think anyone really thought they were doomed - but I do think you can expect some heavy price increases on GamePass soon. They're in it for the money like everyone else is, and they've just dropped a ton of it yesterday and shareholders will want a ROI.
 

Sejan

Member
It’s a big purchase. Hopefully it’s a good for them. Bethesda has a ton of potential, but some of their games have really suffered in recent years. Maybe MS will light a fire under them that gets them back in gear.
 

tryDEATH

Member
Like i said ill avatar bet you that not only do they sell more hardware, but also sell more software and have more critically acclaimed games. Their strategy has been the same as nintendos because it works and its successfull. Animal crossing sold over 20 million units, what was the mast ms exclusive that sold over even 10 with actual figures. Xbox and their fans want to goal post move all the time "well its an old strategy, it wont work this gen" same people said that last gen when sony went traditional again and they mopped the floor with MS and their services, online connectivity etc.

I bet you this gen sony mops them again.

Xbox is going all in with GamePass that already has 15Mil subscribers. Sony strategy worked before because there wasn't any innovative alternative like there is now with GamePass. It is very similar to Blockbuster/Netflix in that one stayed committed to traditional means when it came to consuming movies and the other was a disruptive approach that offered convenience and unmatched value.

You can spin it as much as you want that is the reality. The merger with EA Play and this humoungous aquisition of ZeniMax/Bethesda cements Xbox GamePass as the game service in gaming.
 

quest

Not Banned from OT
Xbox is going all in with GamePass that already has 15Mil subscribers. Sony strategy worked before because there wasn't any innovative alternative like there is now with GamePass. It is very similar to Blockbuster/Netflix in that one stayed committed to traditional means when it came to consuming movies and the other was a disruptive approach that offered convenience and unmatched value.

You can spin it as much as you want that is the reality. The merger with EA Play and this humoungous aquisition of ZeniMax/Bethesda cements Xbox GamePass as the game service in gaming.
I think Sony is good for 3 years but once the new studios are cranking out content on gamepass there will be a big spotlight on Sony about value.
 
Here's the clever thing when it comes to Gamepass VS £70 games. The average Joe on the street will take one look at Gamepass versus Sony not having a competitive service and just go straight for Gamepass and Xbox. Buying Bethesda is telling the core gamer audience that you don't need to go out and drop a crazy amount of money for the latest Bethesda game, just sub to Gamepass!

Put it this way, I'm definitely buying into the Xbox eco system just for that. Before this news I was gonna skip xbox this coming gen and stick with my PS5. Not anymore. I just don't think it's enough now for the core gamer to only have a PS5.
 
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BRZBlue

Member
It’s a big purchase. Hopefully it’s a good for them. Bethesda has a ton of potential, but some of their games have really suffered in recent years. Maybe MS will light a fire under them that gets them back in gear.

I'm actually not sure, whether given MS's track record, if it'll help or hinder.
I think Sony is good for 3 years but once the new studios are cranking out content on gamepass there will be a big spotlight on Sony about value.

And MS better hope that they can run the new studios better than they run 343i. Otherwise that's a lot of money wasted on more craig.
 

GiJoint

Member
This is the Microsoft I want to see, enough of the apologies for the Xbox One disaster and winning hearts and minds they have done that and Sony has been running rings around them with exclusivity bits and pieces and first party games. Microsoft have money to burn they’re far bigger than Sony and this is a huge flex. Good on em.
 

zellend

Neo Member
Having had gamepass on pc for just over a month I honestly don't see what the big deal is. I spent more time looking at the selection than actually playing them just like Netflix.

Regarding the acquisition, as far as I am aware both starfield n tes6 are 2022 at the earliest so best thing for Sony to do is just focus on maybe expanding their current studios to 2 teams if they don't already have them and maybe buy a few more studios so they have a constant stream of exclusives.

Most of the big games from ubi/ea/Activision/take2 will all be multiplat so it makes no sense to spend billions when you can spend millions to sure up your line up.
 

Maxwell Jacob Friedman

leads to fear. Fear leads to xbox.
Xbox is going all in with GamePass that already has 15Mil subscribers. Sony strategy worked before because there wasn't any innovative alternative like there is now with GamePass. It is very similar to Blockbuster/Netflix in that one stayed committed to traditional means when it came to consuming movies and the other was a disruptive approach that offered convenience and unmatched value.

You can spin it as much as you want that is the reality. The merger with EA Play and this humoungous aquisition of ZeniMax/Bethesda cements Xbox GamePass as the game service in gaming.
What good is 15 mill subs when you can sell 10 mill of one game son which give you more money then your sub in the first place. I can see your cocky but not confident in Ms since your aint taking any bets messing your are even doubting their own plan, lol Sony and nintendo will mop ms again this gen
 
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tryDEATH

Member
I think Sony is good for 3 years but once the new studios are cranking out content on gamepass there will be a big spotlight on Sony about value.

I don't know, Sony's development cycles are very long. I don't think they will be able to compete in 2022, 2021 is the only year where they probably will offer comparable quality before being blown away completely for the rest of the generation. And even in 2021 you still got Hellblade, Halo, and Forza coming out that will be able to match anything Sony has got up their sleeve.
 

quest

Not Banned from OT
Having had gamepass on pc for just over a month I honestly don't see what the big deal is. I spent more time looking at the selection than actually playing them just like Netflix.

Regarding the acquisition, as far as I am aware both starfield n tes6 are 2022 at the earliest so best thing for Sony to do is just focus on maybe expanding their current studios to 2 teams if they don't already have them and maybe buy a few more studios so they have a constant stream of exclusives.

Most of the big games from ubi/ea/Activision/take2 will all be multiplat so it makes no sense to spend billions when you can spend millions to sure up your line up.
Gamespass is not for you the PC has got 3-4 highly rated releases since August. Including 2 hitting 90 plus meta critc.
 
Jim Ryan: We bought exclusive rights to the Boy Band Party Game called Final Fantasy 16 for PlayStation 5!!!

Phil Spencer: We bought Bethesda.

But seriously, this is great for all XBox Gamers and will massively increase the Value of Game Pass!!!

Awesome, great Job by Phil Spencer :)
 
I don't know, Sony's development cycles are very long. I don't think they will be able to compete in 2022, 2021 is the only year where they probably will offer comparable quality before being blown away completely for the rest of the generation. And even in 2021 you still got Hellblade, Halo, and Forza coming out that will be able to match anything Sony has got up their sleeve.

the concern trolling is strong with you 👍🏽

what are MS going to do in 2022 that Sony won’t be able to complete anymore??
 

tryDEATH

Member
What good is 15 mill subs when you can sell 10 mill of one game son which give you more money then your sub in the first place. I can see your cocky but not confident in Ms since your aint taking any bets messing your are even doubting their own plan, lol Sony and nintendo will mop ms again this gen

You didn't do the math right my guy 15Mil to 20Mil+ subs at $10 every month vs. 1 or 2 games that might hit 10Mil at $70

Also I am extremely confident, I just don't make bets where there isn't going to be a definite outcome as the figures won't be released.

The only think Sony will mop is Xbox's hallways next generation. Logic isn't really a fanboy thing and you are a prime example.
 
What good is 15 mill subs when you can sell 10 mill of one game son which give you more money then your sub in the first place. I can see your cocky but not confident in Ms since your aint taking any bets messing your are even doubting their own plan, lol Sony and nintendo will mop ms again this gen

I'll take that bet. No doubt in my mind that MS will steamroll the Playstation.
 
You're missing the point of why i posted that comparison. If Sony lost Bethesda support they still have a massive catalog of ip's across numerous genres that sell millions if not tens of millions to fall back on. Sony isn't losing 30 Million customers to Xbox because of Bethesda dropping support. Its a loss, but its a small piece of a much larger pie.

The internet is 100% talking out of its ass regarding this acquisition. Yes, Bethesda is huge. Microsoft paying 7+ Billion reflects that. But Playstation is a massive WORLDWIDE brand coming off a generation of selling 100+ Million consoles with multiple best sellers. This idea that Microsoft just murdered Sony is console war nonsense.

<- Never owned an Xbox. Ever. Owned all Playstation consoles since PS1. It's definitely not just "console war nonsense".

Again, those Sony titles are dependent on the console sales, as evidenced by said franchises sales historically. It's a one off thing. Are you saying that Uncharted is an IP that constantly sells 10+ mill? Of course not, sales reflect that. The massive catalog of IPs is pointless, because most of it is unused and they lack the studios to produce them. That their titles sell millions, I would hope. Otherwise they'd be Grim Fandango levels of failure. But most games sell millions.
What Sony managed to do last generation was levying their marketing expertise, their mindshare globally, profitting off the competitors' mistakes and establish a few notable exclusives to get enthusiasts. Like the first 2 years or so of PS4 was basically dead in terms of noteworthy exclusives. Infamous Second Son was the worst in the series even. Killzone was worse than 3. If it wasn't for Bloodborne and Until Dawn (and the console features), those 2+ years would've been horrible. However, Sony often burns really slowly, but they were saved because third party means a lot more than people think, as well as thinking globally. So by 2016 Sony's studios were ready with their more noteworthy productions. in 2016, when they've already reached a dominance compared to Xbox One, selling double last time I checked. It's not because of "muh first party IPs". Because honestly, Sony's first party output is varying. Their strength is their focus on studios and in a broad portfolio, not just focusing on the big sellers, but having a broad appeal.

Bethesda basically murdered Sony in terms of WRPG output or in terms of stable big IPs. Or do you disagree? That doesn't mean that the "console war" is over. General consumer isn't necessarily caring about any of what we enthusiasts are talking about. We love to rave about exclusives or "track records" (one of the worst things I ever hear. Kojima had a good track record until MGS4, Peace Walker and MGSV. You can't predict studio output.) or TFLOPs, but the average consumer is far more simpler than that.

For me my next-gen purchase is in limbo until Microsoft clarifies. I'm an enthusiast, so I do care if I'll be able to play Elder Scrolls, Fallout, Doom, Starfield, Dishonored and Quake. I've ever since 2013 kept my mind open of console purchases, ever since backwards compatability broke off from Playstation. In 2013 Sony was the best choice. Now in 2020? I don't know, it's hard to know what I should buy. Honestly with the much smaller next-gen leap and uncertainty in terms of what games you'll actually get, I've pretty much decided to wait and just enjoy the cross-gen time and stick to PC until something clears up.

Also, all of this is "console wars bullshit" to a degree. People working hard to defend Sony (while in a similar situation they'd have behaved the same if the shoe was on the other foot), people going hard on "s0ny is ded lol" and masturbating over a purchase we don't know what entails. However, Bethesda titles are big and pretty fucking important. That's one thing I know. Of course, they might make a huge stinker, like the mess Fallout 76 was. Microsoft might play a different game and keep things multiplatform. Microsoft might continue the asshatted way of running their studios. Perhaps Bethesda is continuing ruining good parts of the series and they all turn to shit Who knows?
 
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Maxwell Jacob Friedman

leads to fear. Fear leads to xbox.
You didn't do the math right my guy 15Mil to 20Mil+ subs at $10 every month vs. 1 or 2 games that might hit 10Mil at $70

Also I am extremely confident, I just don't make bets where there isn't going to be a definite outcome as the figures won't be released.

The only think Sony will mop is Xbox's hallways next generation. Logic isn't really a fanboy thing and you are a prime example.
Sony had will most likely have 7 games that Hit 10 mill and spiderman was at 15 mill, much like how you could say maybe these games didn't sell full price you can't guarantee allot of those suBs aren't dollar deals that people took advantage of

figure not released, we deff get world sakes and npf for console sales and i guarantee Sony cleans up
Love how you also neglect nintendo is starting traditional like Sony and ya'll calling them blockbuster lol, blockbuster...? Yep selling 20 mill of one game franchise, outpacing your competition in half the time, actually keeping exclusives on your system is deff 'blockbuster" lmao
Frauds
 
Sure so what's the bet, hardware sales, software sales, meta scores etc and what the perimeters and length of the bet, first to ten million etc.
Also I assume avatar bet

Go ahead and set the terms and I'll review how ridiculous and subjective you made them before I agree to a figure.
 

Kumomeme

Member
for future of gamepass content, this acquisition is worth their investment.

i doubt they want to go for 'exclusive' route like sony. their main goal now is expanding gamepass, and 'exclusive content' for the services is important.
 
There is no concern, I am confident they won't be able to keep up. You got Fable, Avowed, Everwild, maybe State of Decay 3, and what ever Bethesda has in store. Sony isn't matching that line up.

you do realise any new Bethesda games are easily a good 3-4 years away? And MS haven’t proved they can output good 1st party games Outside of the usual Gears, Forza.

Fable was a mere teaser when they showed it, that game I’m sure has literally started production.
 
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