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[FrankWza]

I guess i'm just pessimistic then.

I was saying the other day if my current setup doesn’t work I may get the platinum because I think their build quality nice and they have 50mm drivers. No info on pulse 3d size yet. Platinum will work with 3d audio.

Yeah but I need the mixamp because the headset is 80ohm, so I hope 3D sound can be delivered through USB.

I’ve thought about this too. I think they have to have considered this and hopefully made the dualsense able to drive any headphones. May use more battery than lower needing cans. Based on the adapter Astro released, I don’t think it will be a problem using their mixamp though.Like you said, may just need to turn off their processing and/or a PS5 setting.

 

[Gamerasi]

With Sennheiser tv headphones rs 175, what quality sound can I get on the Playstation 5 tempest engine with the headphone connected to the Lg oled tv optical output?

 

[GymWolf]

I was saying the other day if my current setup doesn’t work I may get the platinum because I think their build quality nice and they have 50mm drivers. No info on pulse 3d size yet. Platinum will work with 3d audio.



I’ve thought about this too. I think they have to have considered this and hopefully made the dualsense able to drive any headphones. May use more battery than lower needing cans. Based on the adapter Astro released, I don’t think it will be a problem using their mixamp though.Like you said, may just need to turn off their processing and/or a PS5 setting.

Platinum are okay, really not more than that.

They are not very comfortable after a while because of that rubber arc they have.

The gold were a little bit more comfy.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

I guess i'm just pessimistic then.

Yes, and should work with all headsets as it seems. Capcom comment is interesting:

“Audio is a key feature to really push the next-gen experience with PS5. It’s almost as if 3D Audiotech was made specifically with horror games in mind. It used to be that in order to get that spatial audio, players would have to invest a lot of their own time and money. Now, just putting on a headset, they can get a full 3D audio experience.”— Jun Takeuchi // Executive Producer for Resident Evil Village

Others:

“Our game worlds have been 3D for generations now, but for audio we typically have been limited to 2D surround sound. When Iron Man is destroying a turret positioned above you, or Hulk roars as he takes on the enemies below you, you want to hear the sound coming from those directions. We can just take the actual positions of the audio and ensure we get them to the PS5 3D Audiotech engine and significantly improve your sense of being in the world. And all that is just with your headphones, without needing complex surround stereo systems.”— Jurjen Katsman // Studio Head at Nixxes, developers for Marvel’s Avengers

“Now with the PS5 console’s Tempest 3D AudioTech sound engine we’ll be able to play sounds in such a way that players will be able to locate the machines around them with greater ease, which is great for situations in which you find yourself surrounded or just want to sneak on machines.”— Mathijs de Jonge // Game Director, Guerrilla

“The ability to layer the music even more deeply with dozens of different states reacting to areas and enemy levels make for an environment that’s even more lush and mesmerizing. The players can use these cues to prepare accordingly in the hopes that they might live another day.”— Julian Maroda // Creative Director and CEO, Norsfell

“3D Audio is exciting because it can create a more convincing and accurate soundscape for players, and a stronger sense of place.… in a fast-paced action game with lots of verticality like Returnal, it can also help with the player’s situational awareness, and make it more intuitive for players to pinpoint the locations of nearby enemies or incoming projectiles in the heat of combat.”— Harry Krueger // Game Director, Returnal

Devs speak: How PS5 console’s ultra-high speed SSD and Tempest 3D AudioTech engine will enhance the future of gaming

Devs share initial thoughts on two distinguishing PS5 console features.

blog.playstation.com

 

[Bo_Hazem]

With Sennheiser tv headphones rs 175, what quality sound can I get on the Playstation 5 tempest engine with the headphone connected to the Lg oled tv optical output?

No need for people to complicate things. Just plug it through the DualSense 3.5 jack or if it supports Bluetooth then pair it to the system and should work perfectly. We would love to hear more about your experience in PS5 with those.

 

[Cato]

Why wouldn't ALL stereo headphones support it? That's the entire point, it's just stereo audio "shaped" in a way that makes it appear to come from more directions.

We actually only ever hear in stereo - we have just 2 ears - but the way the sound is distorted by our ear shape makes us able to distinguish more directions than just left/right. That's what this tech is trying to simulate. It's has nothing to do with "surround/3D audio headphones".

I'm doubtful they'll be able to make this work very well with stereo SPEAKERS though. They can't control how the sound waves look when entering your ear nearly as much in that case. But we'll see.

No you are right. It will not work at all for normal stereo speakers. ONLY earphones for exactly the reasons you list.
But it should work with almost any earphones. I remember trying it some 10 years ago and it worked very well for proper earphones that cover your ear and it worked surprisingly well for el-cheapo 5$ no-name earplugs.
The problem then was processing power so you could never expect to do this processing in real-time. You would have your audio sources, then run a program that would take hours/days and end up with a 30 second mp3 that would have 3d sound when you played it.

What is different now is we have accurate enough psycho-accoustic models as well as processing power to do this in real-time.
I have said it before but this is actually the single feature in next gen I am most excited about!

 

[Hakiroto]

Thanks for sharing. I'm happy to see my SteelSeries Arctis Pro Wireless (used between my PC and PS4 Pro) will not only be compatible with PS5 but it'll get a firmware update for the base station.

 

[FrankWza]

No need for people to complicate things. Just plug it through the DualSense 3.5 jack or if it supports Bluetooth then pair it to the system and should work perfectly. We would love to hear more about your experience in PS5 with those.

I think those use a base station and send the signal to the headphones. Needs optical input for sound

 

[Cato]

You better have the hardware to actually experience the sound as well as the space to accurately reproduce it. If you think you will get true 3D audio from headphones, then you've bought into hype. You're better off just getting quality headphones that dont market this nonsense.

Yes you actually will. I tried this technology about 10 years ago first time and it does work exceptionally well.
Mostly, the accoustic models were more primitive then and I remember the more popular coders had trouble with encoding audio that were supposed to be above and in front of you.
Anything to the sides or behind, above or below, you could "pinpoint" the audio with very accurate precision (well, where you thought the audio came from.)
but the models then could not well encode audio that came from above and in front of you.

When you could hear a guitar slightly to the left behind you and a bass directly behind you and the drums slightly to the right behind and the singer was behind you but above it was epic. Sadly at the time the models were much more accurate for positioning behind you than in front of you so most all samples had the audio coming from behind :-(

That was 10+ years ago. And listening on it with no-name 5$ ear plugs.
Aside from incomplete model 10 years ago, the drawback was it required enormous resources to process audio sources to become "3d".
Today we can do it in real time.

 

[Cato]

It's more likely that the mix didn't get tested on different scenarios. It's one of the crucial steps of a mix, listening to it on different equipment. I hear all of my mixes in multiple devices before I qualify it as finished. Gotta try it on headphones, smartphone, laptop, TV and a car at the very least.

Sorry to dissapoint you but this will not work on anything else than what is basically any kind of cheap cheap to expensive headsets/earplugs.
(i.e. it will ONLY work on the 5$ noname earplugs you got or the expensive headsets, mostly equally well as far as the 3d effect goes.)
But it will NEVER work for the speakers of a smartphone, a laptop or the speakers in the car. Never will work. At least not this technique.

The whole idea is to pre-process the audio to add the frequency shifts and the frequency delays for audio that is generated and played directly in front of your ear canal to have such features that your brain will filter it and think that different sources came from different locations in 3d space. This only works if you have the speaker membranes basically directly attached to your ear canal.
It can never work for any of the other use cases you list. Sorry.

 

[FrankWza]

No you are right. It will not work at all for normal stereo speakers. ONLY earphones for exactly the reasons you list.

it will. Not as well, but it will. They’re releasing tempest for tv, soundbar and surround systems too. If it can work for sound bar, it will work for a 2.0 or 2.1 system.

 

[Cato]

it will. Not as well, but it will. They’re releasing tempest for tv, soundbar and surround systems too. If it can work for sound bar, it will work for a 2.0 or 2.1 system.

Hmm. I want to see that before I belive it.
Unless they have a very liberal definition of "works".

(I am a mathematician and I understand the transformations they need to do. I will be very surprised, pleasanty surprised, but very surprised nevertheless if they can get 3d audio to work in any meaningful way beyond the surround sound of soundbars on things like normal stereo speakers or soundbars.)
Never say never but I want to see it before I buy into it being other than marketing talk.

 

[FrankWza]

Hmm. I want to see that before I belive it.
Unless they have a very liberal definition of "works".

(I am a mathematician and I understand the transformations they need to do. I will be very surprised, pleasanty surprised, but very surprised nevertheless if they can get 3d audio to work in any meaningful way beyond the surround sound of soundbars on things like normal stereo speakers or soundbars.)
Never say never but I want to see it before I buy into it being other than marketing talk.

there’s already atmos soundbars that do this. With all audio, there’s going to be compromises. And no 2 delivery methods for sound will be the same. Even if you and I have the exact same system in our homes, our homes will be different acoustically. Soundbars can work well in smaller spaces. I think that’s why Sony is focusing on headphones first and making tempest as available as possible. They know almost everyone has a set they like that are comfortable and sound good to them. It’s the best delivery method for their tempesttechnology.
You’re going to see a move away from “gaming “ headsets once the mic compatibility is sorted out because the sound quality will always be better. Once that’s sorted, they’ll have profiles designed to take advantage of different audio systems. Then maybe, a way to measure your room and a system that calibrates sound for you like audyssey.

 

[TrebleShot]

3d Tempest Audio will work on ANY stereo headset. This is known and has been for some time.

The PULSE 3D headset is just an updated, redesigned normal PS wireless stereo headset. It may have some useless features such as VSS or extended bass response but those are for the most part EQ presets and phsycho-acoustic adjustments based on phase polarity and phantom imaging...neither of which will be that effective in these headsets.

3D audio will work on your £3 stereo jack headphones plugged into your dualsense.

The quality of the audio from daulsense will be dependant on the technology used to connect wirelessly to the console, if it uses 2.4ghz wireless then happy days, the quality will almost be top grade. If it uses Bluetooth standard so not the new BT spec it will be noticeably lossy compared to the 2.4ghz or higher.

Incidentally thats what your USB dongle does on PS4 its a 2.4ghz audio transmitter.

Its unknown if the controller on PS5 supports higher bandwidth than the PS4 did, I would assume so.

The likes of steel series 7x, 9 etc will support the higher frequency through their respective dongles and wireless systems.

What isnt known is if you connect say your super pricy wired headphones you will get high res audio but 3D Audio will be supported.

I have Pulse 3D pre ordered and already own the gold headset, I'm hoping for some increased functionality or sound reproduction from the cans themselves (bigger drivers, higher quality material).

But I am also considering the Steel Series or Audeze.

 

[FrankWza]

The pulse 3d has tapered earpads. Just noticed in the unboxing video.That’s a nice little feature. They look deep too. I need to know the driver size. Can someone post if they find it please?

 

[Gamerasi]

No need for people to complicate things. Just plug it through the DualSense 3.5 jack or if it supports Bluetooth then pair it to the system and should work perfectly. We would love to hear more about your experience in PS5 with those.

The Dolby atmos experience on Xbox one X was satisfying. I'll write about the Playstation 5 experience here.

 

[FrankWza]

The PULSE 3D headset is just an updated, redesigned normal PS wireless stereo headset. It may have some useless features such as VSS or extended bass response but those are for the most part EQ presets and phsycho-acoustic adjustments based on phase polarity and phantom imaging...neither of which will be that effective in these headsets.

I have Pulse 3D pre ordered and already own the gold headset, I'm hoping for some increased functionality or sound reproduction from the cans themselves (bigger drivers, higher quality material).

Huh?

 

[thurnishaleygw]

Sorry to dissapoint you but this will not work on anything else than what is basically any kind of cheap cheap to expensive headsets/earplugs.
(i.e. it will ONLY work on the 5$ noname earplugs you got or the expensive headsets, mostly equally well as far as the 3d effect goes.)
But it will NEVER work for the speakers of a smartphone, a laptop or the speakers in the car. Never will work. At least not this technique.

The whole idea is to pre-process the audio to add the frequency shifts and the frequency delays for audio that is generated and played directly in front of your ear canal to have such features that your brain will filter it and think that different sources came from different locations in 3d space. This only works if you have the speaker membranes basically directly attached to your ear canal.
It can never work for any of the other use cases you list. Sorry.

Yeah, I know, I wasn't talking about 3D audio on that instance. Just about mixing, in general. I was merely replying to Bo_Hazem , as he said that sometimes he feels like some songs sound good on his headphones and can sound bad on his car.

 

[Antelope]

3d pulse looks enormous and weighs over 600grams....not sure that’s going to work for me.

I’ve been looking around for a while and basically narrowed my headphone choice to the PC38X or the 58x. Tygr 300r’s also look great.

Lots of other great options, but I don’t want to spend on an amp and mixer right now. I’m just waiting for any sort of info about how the controller works with headphones. Can it drive something like the 58x?

 

[Bo_Hazem]

Regarding PS5's true 3D Audio:




We are ready to have the best audio quality/implementation in gaming, ever!

 

[THE DUCK]

I'm not sure it's fair to say the PS5 has the best audio ever, MS spent considerable time/attention on this hardware as well. A little early to give the crown to PS5. I think both will be great though!

 

[THEAP99]

Regarding PS5's true 3D Audio:




We are ready to have the best audio quality/implementation in gaming, ever!

Hope we get 3D audio impressions soon

 

[Bo_Hazem]

I'm not sure it's fair to say the PS5 has the best audio ever, MS spent considerable time/attention on this hardware as well. A little early to give the crown to PS5. I think both will be great though!

The difference is CPU-based vs GPU-based. You may search the rest as we've discussed this several times. And yes, PS5 solution is vastly superior because it's GPU-based, HRTF-based.

 

[THE DUCK]

The difference is CPU-based vs GPU-based. You may search the rest as we've discussed this several times. And yes, PS5 solution is vastly superior because it's GPU-based, HRTF-based.

The custom HRTF profile, if and when we get there, may be very effective (for those who will actually use it). However, in terms of raw processing power, if it's CPU or GPU based, they are actually very similar in the end result processing power.

Cerny:
"Where we ended up is a unit with roughly the same SIMD power and bandwidth as all eight Jaguar cores in the PS4 combined,"

MS:
"Greater SPFP HW math than all 8x CPU's in Xbox One X"

When I look back at past posts, I see you posting saying that GPU based and ray traced audio is the way to go along with some videos supporting the idea that it's good, but nothing disproving that Series X can't support the same thing too.
I don't pretend to know it all, but I don't see anything so far from a mainstream site that seems to indicate Sony has sort of significant advantage here.

Also MS is saying they have "ray traced audio" as well.

Jason Ronald, the partner director of program management Xbox, discussed Xbox Series X’s hardware-accelerated DirectX ray tracing during a podcast with Microsoft’s Larry ‘Major Nelson’ Hryb.
“Now, with the introduction of hardware accelerated ray tracing with the Xbox series X, we’re actually able to enable a whole new set of scenarios, whether that’s more realistic lighting, better reflections, we can even use it for things like spatial audio and have ray trace audio so that you feel much more immersed.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

The custom HRTF profile, if and when we get there, may be very effective (for those who will actually use it). However, in terms of raw processing power, if it's CPU or GPU based, they are actually very similar in the end result processing power.

Cerny:
"Where we ended up is a unit with roughly the same SIMD power and bandwidth as all eight Jaguar cores in the PS4 combined,"

MS:
"Greater SPFP HW math than all 8x CPU's in Xbox One X"

When I look back at past posts, I see you posting saying that GPU based and ray traced audio is the way to go along with some videos supporting the idea that it's good, but nothing disproving that Series X can't support the same thing too.
I don't pretend to know it all, but I don't see anything so far from a mainstream site that seems to indicate Sony has sort of significant advantage here.

Also MS is saying they have "ray traced audio" as well.

Jason Ronald, the partner director of program management Xbox, discussed Xbox Series X’s hardware-accelerated DirectX ray tracing during a podcast with Microsoft’s Larry ‘Major Nelson’ Hryb.
“Now, with the introduction of hardware accelerated ray tracing with the Xbox series X, we’re actually able to enable a whole new set of scenarios, whether that’s more realistic lighting, better reflections, we can even use it for things like spatial audio and have ray trace audio so that you feel much more immersed.

So they will use the main GPU budget for it vs fully independent Tempest 3D audio engine?

Don't wanna derail the thread, but you can contact AMD and ask them why the CPU-Based solution can't produce accurate, raytraced audio:




This is the last post about this matter.
-------------------

 

[Bo_Hazem]

PS5 Game Titles to Support Tempest 3D Audio Tech so far:

• Spider-Man: Miles Morales
• Spider-Man Remastered
• Astros Playroom
• Gran Turismo 7
• Returnal
• Destruction AllStars
• Demon’s Souls
• Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart
• Sackboy: A Big Adventure
• Horizon Forbidden West
• Resident Evil Village

The upcoming Pulse 3D wireless headset has been engineered to take full advantage of PS5’s 3D Audio capabilities (check out a new image above). With a refined design, dual noise-cancelling microphones, and an array of easy-access controls, the Pulse 3D wireless headset offers a seamless experience for both the PS5 and PS4. We think it offers a fantastic audio experience for the PS5, but it isn’t the only way that fans can experience the increased presence and locality that we discussed in our last technical update.

On the PS5, you’ll be able to experience Tempest 3D AudioTech with the headphones that many of you already own, either through USB connection to the console, or by plugging your headphones into the DualSense wireless controller’s 3.5mm headset jack.

Headphone audio is the current gold standard for 3D Audio on PS5, as Mark Cerny mentioned in his “Road to PS5” talk in March. We’re also in the process of working on virtual surround sound through speakers that are built into TVs. Although TV speaker virtual surround sound won’t be available on launch day for PS5, it’s still a feature we are extremely excited about, and our engineers are hard at work on bringing it to PS5 in the future.

In the meantime, I’m happy to say that you’ll be able to enjoy the PS5’s Tempest 3D AudioTech through your compatible headphones in many PS5 games. Some of the PS5 games with 3D Audio features include Marvel’s Spider-Man: Miles Morales, Marvel’s Spider-Man Remastered, Astro’s Playroom, Gran Turismo 7, Returnal, Destruction AllStars, Demon’s Souls, Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart, Sackboy: A Big Adventure, Horizon Forbidden West, Resident Evil Village, and many others.

PS5's Tempest 3D AudioTech to Be Only Available Through Headphones at Launch

PS5's unique Tempest 3D AudioTech will only be available through headphones at launch, as the virtual surround sound for TV isn't ready yet.

wccftech.com

 

[THE DUCK]

So they will use the main GPU budget for it vs fully independent Tempest 3D audio engine?

Don't wanna derail the thread, but you can contact AMD and ask them why the CPU-Based solution can't produce accurate, raytraced audio:




This is the last post about this matter.
-------------------

That's fine, we can agree to disagree, I will wait and see how the rubber hits the road. At this point I'll take MS at their word that their hardware based audio solution is a good as Sony's - both teams seem to have a put a lot of time and engineering into it.

 

[MasterCornholio]

I got my Steel Series 7P. So far they seem pretty nice. Can't wait to try them out with the PS5.