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Phil Spencer refers to a $500 console + $70 For Games as a "Heavy Investment" for casual gamers
- Thread starter Rolla
- Start date
Casual gamers play FIFA, Fortnite and COD. They buy one or two games they are interested each year. Game pass or PSNow don’t have value for those casual gamers, because they like to play one game again and again. Subscription service is for hardcore gamers who can’t spend much money or people who want check many games
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They also delayed pre orders 12 weeks invited more scalpers with a later more valuable pre order. So 12 weeks of demand and fighting scalpers of course people felt the need to do it asap. So that metric is meaningless. Next summer will give us a test of demand of both devices.
Dr.Morris79
Member
$70 isnt too bad, if that game warrants it.
A $70 game like Ark to me is worth it. You can play that game for hundreds of hours and still probably not see it all, gamer depending..
A $70 game like Resident evil 3 remake takes the absolute piss.
A $70 game like Ark to me is worth it. You can play that game for hundreds of hours and still probably not see it all, gamer depending..
A $70 game like Resident evil 3 remake takes the absolute piss.
Silent Viper
Banned
im on GP baby all the way...
me0wish
Member
The responses to this thread has been weird, it will be funny to see how everyone on this thread will praise Sony's gamepass as the second coming of Jesus.
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Bo_Hazem
Banned
Well, other platforms have PS Now with 700+ games and cheaper price. He just can't stop whining about PlayStation.
Also, you can't resell your $120/year gamepass, nor you can play online without gold/ultimate with gamepass alone. You don't need PS Plus to play online games on PS Now, nor you need PS Plus to play fortnite and free2play games on PS4/5. That's why PS4/5 is where casuals heading, to be able to play free games for free.
Also, you can't resell your $120/year gamepass, nor you can play online without gold/ultimate with gamepass alone. You don't need PS Plus to play online games on PS Now, nor you need PS Plus to play fortnite and free2play games on PS4/5. That's why PS4/5 is where casuals heading, to be able to play free games for free.
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sublimit
Banned
It's his job to act as if sales aren't a thing.
It's his job to act as if used games aren't a thing. It's his job to act as if BC isn't a thing (oh the irony) while someone can wait for price drops. He is a salesman after all (although ultimately that's all he is).
What i find hilarious however are the fanboys and the astroturfers who are cheering like sheep to every dumb thing he says always saying "well he's right" lol.
SkylineRKR
Member
Spencer is right though.
Its really expensive if you buy games, and quite a few of them you play for like a weekend. I think GP is seriously good value for money, for all those games you likely finish once and put away. Its what got me into Xbox again, next to the PS5 I mainly buy for exclusives this time around. I am aware you can resell and I did, but you still lose out or have to put up with no shows or take a huge loss at a store.
Its really expensive if you buy games, and quite a few of them you play for like a weekend. I think GP is seriously good value for money, for all those games you likely finish once and put away. Its what got me into Xbox again, next to the PS5 I mainly buy for exclusives this time around. I am aware you can resell and I did, but you still lose out or have to put up with no shows or take a huge loss at a store.
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Considering the fact Phil is bringing to market a $500 console and allowing third party to charge $70 for games I found this quote interesting.
"You know, gaming can be an expensive hobby. I see certain platforms going to, in the US pricing, $70 for games. The consoles are $500 in US pricing," he said. "I think that's a heavy investment for people who aren't every day playing videogames ... the more casual player or a family that's balancing many things."
Head of Xbox Implies PS5 Is 'Heavy Investment' Compared to Series X
Xbox Boss Phil Spencer shares his thoughts on the pricing models for next-generation consoles, and how Xbox Game Pass adds value.gamerant.com
For him is expensive i don't buy games at $60 or $70 anymore. I wait 6 month or 1 year to play the game. I don't care about playing a game at launch anymore. It has to he something that i love and must play at launch.
XGon'GiveItToYa
Banned
Phil is a PHILosopher!
It was the case before Covid and it is even more now. There's countries that have gone back into full lockdown. Put that together with the majority of gamers being casual and the most important factor is money. Definitely not performance although games might still have a bit of a sway but paying €80 for Demon's Souls; I only see hardcore gamers doing that. The rest will wait for that retail price reduction or 50%+ sale.
Now a console that costs £250 + Gamepass must be really appealing. Instead of paying €80 for Demon's Souls you can pay for a year of Gamepass current games + all games added to it during that year...
It was the case before Covid and it is even more now. There's countries that have gone back into full lockdown. Put that together with the majority of gamers being casual and the most important factor is money. Definitely not performance although games might still have a bit of a sway but paying €80 for Demon's Souls; I only see hardcore gamers doing that. The rest will wait for that retail price reduction or 50%+ sale.
Now a console that costs £250 + Gamepass must be really appealing. Instead of paying €80 for Demon's Souls you can pay for a year of Gamepass current games + all games added to it during that year...
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I Love Rock 'n' Roll
Member
The one that bought Wii (250$) and Wii Feet (150$) to play it 2 months? 
mikefrails
Banned
The $70 price mark is no joke without the option of a service or piracy, so he’s right there. But poor people blow $500 they don’t have every quarter of the year; as someone who was gaming when I was financially not that well off, I know it’s a real thing for people to buy expensive consoles without a second thought.
A part of me wants Sony to return as the luxury choice though. It seems people want the PlayStation to be too many things at once when those consoles always thrived as the higher end alternative for people who had the sick audio system, tv, etc. It wasn’t until the rebrand on the PS3 where Sony was occupying all sides of the power/value proposition. I’m willing to bet PS5 adjusts itself back into the luxury category because Xbox has the value proposition taken care of.
A part of me wants Sony to return as the luxury choice though. It seems people want the PlayStation to be too many things at once when those consoles always thrived as the higher end alternative for people who had the sick audio system, tv, etc. It wasn’t until the rebrand on the PS3 where Sony was occupying all sides of the power/value proposition. I’m willing to bet PS5 adjusts itself back into the luxury category because Xbox has the value proposition taken care of.
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AphexTwunt
Member
bitcheatingcrackers.jpg the thread.
reinking
Gold Member
This is so stupid. I am not sure why people are still arguing about it. Both companies are here to extract money from customers. Game Pass has value but so does giving away a free game with every PS5 sold. So does F2P games being actually free to play without a subscription. Both companies have some consumer friendly policies and both have some not so friendly ones.
For what? To buy 1, 2 or 3 years games that will never lower the price? To buy old games at full price just because is the switch version?
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michaelius
Banned
Microsoft inventing solution to not existing problem - casuals don't buy $500 consoles. They buy $200-300 discounted models 2-3 years into generation when Fifa or Madden needs it.
michaelius
Banned
Phil is a PHILosopher!
It was the case before Covid and it is even more now. There's countries that have gone back into full lockdown. Put that together with the majority of gamers being casual and the most important factor is money. Definitely not performance although games might still have a bit of a sway but paying €80 for Demon's Souls; I only see hardcore gamers doing that. The rest will wait for that retail price reduction or 50%+ sale.
That's completly wrong - people are buying expensive electronics in masses on a scale never seen before because of Covid. Due to lockdowns people are sitting on ton of unspent cash and with other forms or entertainment heavily restricted gaming is receiving major boost.
ReBurn
Gold Member
I feel like maybe you're missing the point. Casuals not buying new games is the problem Microsoft is trying to solve with the Series S. This is a play at getting them to buy in to gamepass via an inexpensive console upgrade instead of waiting years to spend any money. Pushing those folks into recurring revenue streams like Xbox Live and gamepass is the strategy. Not selling the most hardware units.
XGon'GiveItToYa
Banned
The people you're talking about are the minority. There was a huge increase in Gamepass subscriptions in like 3 months most likely because of lockdown and its price. Now couple casuals being casuals + having less money to spend on items you don't need to live + Gamepass value and a £250 console and there is no reason for them to spend £450 + possible TV upgrade + £70 games.
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Slings and Arrows
Banned
Don't talk shit.
What year is this?
The casual gamer is no longer some old biddy or 'soccer mom' playing a Wii. A casual gamer is someone sinking $100's in to fortnite, fifa and COD.
Yes they can afford and yes they will pay, the full price of consoles. Does Phil honestly think that the 5 million+ launch day buyers of consoles are hardcore fans only?
idiot.
What year is this?
The casual gamer is no longer some old biddy or 'soccer mom' playing a Wii. A casual gamer is someone sinking $100's in to fortnite, fifa and COD.
Yes they can afford and yes they will pay, the full price of consoles. Does Phil honestly think that the 5 million+ launch day buyers of consoles are hardcore fans only?
idiot.
ReBurn
Gold Member
Do you seriosly think people are going to fight to get a $500 console on day 1 because they're super excited to play Fortnite on it? You're joking, right? Are they also lining up to buy 3080's for their high end Fortnite rigs?
The bulk of launch day buyers are people who would consider themselves hardcore. The FIFA and COD folks buy new consoles when their friends upgrade because that's the only way they get to keep playing. They're not out there in mass on day 1 and they never have been. If they can buy Series S and continue to play with their friends playing on Series X that's what many of them are going to do, especially if they're playing in 1080p TV's
Slings and Arrows
Banned
I disagree
If people are too poor to buy a $500 machine, then why would they waste $300 on an upgrade that they don't need? If they can still play next gen games on their One or X, why wouldn't they do that vs wasting this valuable money?
People are out in droves buying the new consoles. The XSX and PS5 will be sold out for a long time. The XSS will be purchased by those forced to, because of lack of stock of the other consoles.
Like i said, the 'casuals' are not the 'casuals' of the Wii era. The casuals today are more like pop-gamers. They do it because it's popular, they have the new Iphone, Nikes and cars, because it's popular. So it gaming.
longdi
Banned
Imo casuals dont buy consoles because the price of games and subscription are too high.
Its not about the $500 but the $70s and $60s upkeep cost.
If Phil can change this model to provide casuals with more bang for their bucks, then instead of great success at just 100m console sold, we could see double triple of that.
TGO
Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
I paid with my hard earned cash thank you very much!
or you could buy it whilst having a gamepass subscription for 10-20% less, options are a good thing
ReBurn
Gold Member
Who said people were too poor to pay $500 for a new console? Is it somehow an issue of prestige?
Not everyone lives on the middle school playground where having the best toys matters. Nobody will ever be forced to buy a Series S. There is literally no scenario where someone will have to make that decision.
Slings and Arrows
Banned
Come on buddy, personal views on this subject to one side for a second, 90% of the population still lives in the middle school playground. They might be old, have houses and a job, but they're still that popular or bullied kid in school who wants to relive that era or get revenge on it.
I think the XSS will be collecting dust. The XSX and PS5 will fly off the shelves and continue to do so. We will see more consoles sold in the first 6 months of this gen, than any other gen, doubled.
Remember, hardcore gamers aren't made anymore, we are a solid number that is decreasing, not increasing. There's just casual and pop and some crusty old-timers like us, clinging on to the wonder years.
IDKFA
I am Become Bilbo Baggins
or you could buy it whilst having a gamepass subscription for 10-20% less, options are a good thing
True, but then I'm also paying for Gamepass. I'll only pay for Gamepass once all AAA third party exclusives are there day one and stay on there forever.
Aion002
Member
He has a point and the Series S + Game Pass is an amazing thing for casuals.
For parents looking to buy a new console for their kids, casuals and low budget gamers, the Series S has an exceptional value.
Now for the rest... Not really, since the best exclusives are on Playstation and Nintendo.
For parents looking to buy a new console for their kids, casuals and low budget gamers, the Series S has an exceptional value.
Now for the rest... Not really, since the best exclusives are on Playstation and Nintendo.
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AJUMP23
Member
What is controversial about this statement? It is a big ask to expect a lot of families to spend $500 on a console and $70 a game. I think with an average US salary of $50k (est) that taking a piece of that to buy games or any leisure activities. is a big ask for a lot of families. Looking at the uncertainty inn the future with the way COVID and elections are going right now I would think people would be saving more due to uncertain times.
I am a fortunate person I can afford both consoles, but I have ordered neither.
I am a fortunate person I can afford both consoles, but I have ordered neither.
Not sure that's going to happen but okay.
Men_in_Boxes
Snake Oil Salesman
I'll give it a go.
Who cares? If you don't value the extra weapon and armor at $20 don't spend your money. I don't get pissed at the ice cream shop when they sell their XL Hot Fudge Sunday for $9.00.
Though, I'm trying to see if I'd care if a game I cared about did this...
I wouldn't.
michaelius
Banned
I don't know about America but in Europe you can usually buy whatever electronics you want in 10-20-30-40-50 month payment plan. And those are usualy 0% rate credit due to retailers running promotions all the time.
Also Microsoft offer is 120-180$ annual subscription for people who normally buy Fifa and play it for few years before moving to next instalment.
"Casual" gamers play on mobile devices more than anything else. These are the same people who shell out $1,200 for a new iPhone to play Among Us.
People have limited self-control. A one-time $500 investment for 7+ years of entertainment should not be a big investment if you manage your money properly.
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MiguelItUp
Member
He's not wrong. I know folks made comments about casual gamers not buying launch consoles, which I wouldn't normally question. However with how fomo has played out it's possible things can be a bit different these days.
He's not wrong and has the data to prove it.
A few million fucks dropping $500+ on videogame consoles during a pandemic says absolutely nothing about the casual gamer... besides that millions of us are financially irresponsible, or well off and probably really really bored.
A few million fucks dropping $500+ on videogame consoles during a pandemic says absolutely nothing about the casual gamer... besides that millions of us are financially irresponsible, or well off and probably really really bored.
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