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[IntentionalPun]

As I was trying to allude to previously, I'm pretty sure an initial non-DL-based temporal image reconstruction using past image data isn't strictly part of DLSS.

Traditional temporal reconstruction techniques will produce a softer image. Applying a DL image upcale model on that will likely not produce the sharpest end result. You want the sharpest possible native image to feed into your DL model as a general principle.

I don't think you are correct here; I watched the nVidia presentation on DLSS 2.0 and it explained it pretty well. Their PR explains it as well (while being a bit tricky with words here or there.) They train on a non game specific model though now; and then they do temporal upscaling first, and then run some ML against the result to refine it.

 

[oldergamer]

Good article with Andrew Gossen. Microsoft research is spending a lot of time in the ML arena. It will be interesting to see what they do with it.

The big Xbox Series S interview: why Microsoft made an entry-level next-gen console

We knew it was in development, we even got to see it during our visit to the Microsoft campus back in March - but today…

www.eurogamer.net

 

[carloseduardocd]

I've seen no evidence of this on PS5. saying it can do it, I'll give that I'm wrong on that. Even still my old GTX 770 could also do it. However, its an order of a magnitude slower then the current Nvidia cards.

Xbox is already applying HDR to backwards compatible games without impacting the framerate. I'd go out on a limb and say there is a bit more to it then the people that are playing it down

Xbox Series X Gets Ray Tracing & Machine Learning Specs, Boasting 3-10X Performance Improvement

Microsoft did a system deep dive for the Xbox Series X architecture at the Hot Chips virtual conference, revealing some juicy tidbits.

wccftech.com

Again I've seen no proof that PS5 has the exact same setup of Xbox when it comes to machine learning. They revealed certain information at hotchips

I think there are 2 points here.


First, about Machine Learning on PS5: as you know, Machine Learning tasks are software implementations, it's not a question if exists or not exists in a specific platform. Microsoft has DirectML API, Vulkan has their own ML API, and obvious Sony would adapt for the PS5. PS5 should have int4 and int8 operators. Even PS4 Pro has FP16 operators, and these integer operators exists since RDNA 1. The white paper is available to read about. I cannot confirm about PS5, MS did a better job in hardware marketing than Sony, but PS5 without int8 could be big surprise.


Second, about Xbox Series X power to run Machine Learning. As you know, I can write ML code to my game and do the matrix net calculations in CPU, GPU, whatever. But for gaming i need performance in real time. I can have this ML performance in your GTX 770, but maybe in PS2 game graphics. The point is, XSX has 97 TOPs to use int4 low precision operators, but this number is unreal, because if i use 97 TOPs to ML, there is no shader left to render the game. Of course if remains 30 TOPs int4 to ML, it's better than nothing, but too far away the tensor cores performance. As i said, ML/DL will have interesting improvements in consoles, but i don't believe in miracles.

 

[SynTha1]

LOL
I suppose you don't support any big company then

Well I know how marketing works but damn at least most of the companies I chose to support actually puts in the work to try to earn my money what exactly has Microsoft done to earn my money cause I don't see it and I have watched them since the original Xbox they haven't done anything but throw money around and try to buy success without putting in the work. It's fine to talk up your product but if your not going to back that up with action why should they be supported?

 

[Dave_at_Home]

Well I know how marketing works but damn at least most of the companies I chose to support actually puts in the work to try to earn my money what exactly has Microsoft done to earn my money cause I don't see it and I have watched them since the original Xbox they haven't done anything but throw money around and try to buy success without putting in the work. It's fine to talk up your product but if your not going to back that up with action why should they be supported?

Microsoft this time around seems to be much more serious in their efforts for first-party. Double Fines' Tim Schafer, talked about Microsoft's hands off approach just giving them money and letting the developers almost do what they want. Hopefully this results in much better products for them. I still don't have any plans on getting a Series X at this point. By the time any of those AAA Microsoft games come out I'll be prepared with a brand new PC build. This really seems to be Microsoft last chance to get this right. PS5 and PC going forward.

 

[oldergamer]

I think there are 2 points here.


First, about Machine Learning on PS5: as you know, Machine Learning tasks are software implementations, it's not a question if exists or not exists in a specific platform. Microsoft has DirectML API, Vulkan has their own ML API, and obvious Sony would adapt for the PS5. PS5 should have int4 and int8 operators. Even PS4 Pro has FP16 operators, and these integer operators exists since RDNA 1. The white paper is available to read about. I cannot confirm about PS5, MS did a better job in hardware marketing than Sony, but PS5 without int8 could be big surprise.


Second, about Xbox Series X power to run Machine Learning. As you know, I can write ML code to my game and do the matrix net calculations in CPU, GPU, whatever. But for gaming i need performance in real time. I can have this ML performance in your GTX 770, but maybe in PS2 game graphics. The point is, XSX has 97 TOPs to use int4 low precision operators, but this number is unreal, because if i use 97 TOPs to ML, there is no shader left to render the game. Of course if remains 30 TOPs int4 to ML, it's better than nothing, but too far away the tensor cores performance. As i said, ML/DL will have interesting improvements in consoles, but i don't believe in miracles.

Fair points. Well GTC 770 is capable of the same things you can do today, just slower and/or in a lower resolution. I'm not going to make any illusions on this as I don't know to what extent the plans are regarding xbox. As always its a tradeoff in performance as you mention. Totally agree there. The changes they made to the shaders is interesting and I'd like to see how it all plays out.

 

[TheThreadsThatBindUs]

I don't think you are correct here; I watched the nVidia presentation on DLSS 2.0 and it explained it pretty well. Their PR explains it as well (while being a bit tricky with words here or there.) They train on a non game specific model though now; and then they do temporal upscaling first, and then run some ML against the result to refine it.

If it's integrated to the API call and part of the DLSS 2.0 pipeline then fair enough. But even then are you sure it's not possible at all for devs to disable the initial temporal reconstruction and just use the DL NN-based upscale?

I can certainly see instances where devs might prefer to roll their own bespoke upfront temporal reconstruction algorithm to feed the NN-based upscale. Restricting it to a single method in the API seems way too restrictive for devs.

It's been a while since I looked into the specifics of the DLSS 2.0 implementation.

 

[Vtecomega]

Everyone talking about performance and I'm here baffled as to why Bungie reduced the particle effects below PS4 pro levels.

 

[Panajev2001a]

As I was trying to allude to previously, I'm pretty sure an initial non-DL-based temporal image reconstruction using past image data isn't strictly part of DLSS.

Traditional temporal reconstruction techniques will produce a softer image. Applying a DL image upcale model on that will likely not produce the sharpest end result. You want the sharpest possible native image to feed into your DL model as a general principle.

One thing, that does not massively change things (running AI operation in separate cores tuned for it like Tensor Cores or something like Google’s TPU vs just using the shader ALU’s and thus eating up rendering and async compute resources and still getting a lot less out of it).

Compared to regular RPM for FP16 operations, all INT8/INT4 Ops seem mixed precision ones (returning INT32 ops).

Quick Reference paper I found: https://core.ac.uk/reader/233059220

This describe a multiple precision FMA architecture (lower precision multiplication and higher precision accumulation) optimised to improve deep learning operations which could explain why AMD implemented rapid packed math mixed precision instructions for INT4/INT8 types (low precision inputs, high precision output).

Not calling myself an expert on this subject area, so please let me know if I am way off base here.

 

[TheThreadsThatBindUs]

One thing, that does not massively change things (running AI operation in separate cores tuned for it like Tensor Cores or something like Google’s TPU vs just using the shader ALU’s and thus eating up rendering and async compute resources and still getting a lot less out of it).

Compared to regular RPM for FP16 operations, all INT8/INT4 Ops seem mixed precision ones (returning INT32 ops).

Quick Reference paper I found: https://core.ac.uk/reader/233059220

This describe a multiple precision FMA architecture (lower precision multiplication and higher precision accumulation) optimised to improve deep learning operations which could explain why AMD implemented rapid packed math mixed precision instructions for INT4/INT8 types (low precision inputs, high precision output).

Not calling myself an expert on this subject area, so please let me know if I am way off base here.

Yes, the mixed precision packed math functionality was added with RDNA 2 I believe.

It all helps by improving flexibility and thus offering optimisation opportunities to reduce operation latency (i.e. the latency in num of clock cycles it takes to perform an operation, e.g. 32x32 matrix multiplication). That said you're still only talking single digit percentage performance improvements overall.

It doesn't really close the gap between general GPU compute and dedicated hardware like Tensor Cores.

 

[RaySoft]

They train the model offline, but the inferencing is done at runtime on the Tensor Cores.

Yup, the "brain" is downloaded every time it "matures".
In a way it's the "new" virtual ASIC "chip" in that all the off-line training would result in better and evolved gatearrays. But it's just software at this point still.
Imagine that, an AI manipulating it's own hardware as well as software. The future, love it or be very afraid of it.

 

[Valued Gamer]

Ok let’s clear up here before it become a “thing”.

EA when asked specifically about PS5 GPU:

“More generally, we’re seeing the GPU be able to power machine learning for all sorts of really interesting advancements in the gameplay and other tools.”

People keep falling on MS PR Marketing.

No people are referring to Sony's own engineer that said the PS5 doesn't have ML.
And he would above any one on this forum.

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

No people are referring to Sony's own engineer that said the PS5 doesn't have ML.
And he would above any one on this forum.

He said he was only stating public info, which was PS5 is navi based it therefore doesn't have ML, which makes no sense.

Frankly I'll just assume he was another developer at Sony that was left in the dark about the PS5, because yeah, they were that secretive.

 

[3liteDragon]

Although the consoles obviously don’t have DLSS equivalent hardware for DL, as long as high-quality temporal reconstruction techniques are being used that provide a clean image which exactly looks like native 4K with no artifacts, I’ll take that over native 4K any day (Which is what I think we’re gonna see in 2-3 years when games are being built specifically for current-gen hardware). There’s a decent amount of GPU horsepower you’re saving on just by using upsampling techniques and rendering at a lower internal resolution.

 

[ethomaz]

No people are referring to Sony's own engineer that said the PS5 doesn't have ML.
And he would above any one on this forum.

Who? When?

There is no Sony’s own engineer saying PS5 has no ML.
There is one that said PS5’s is unique... it is based in RDNA 2 with more features and, he thinks, one less.

Now how people reached the PS5 has no ML is out of my mind.

 

[3liteDragon]

 

[SynTha1]

I find it really funny and sad that I ask a simple question and not one Xbox fan can give me a honest question but they can give laughing or triggered emojis. I guess they just like throwing money away with no thought put into it but u know a fool and his money and all that.

 

[New Yorks Finest]

I find it really funny and sad that I ask a simple question and not one Xbox fan can give me a honest question but they can give laughing or triggered emojis. I guess they just like throwing money away with no thought put into it but u know a fool and his money and all that.

Ma dude you can't be serious ?! What You Mean?! I play mutha @#$%& games on it. Rocking CyberPunk with no crashes and enjoying this GOAT the shit out off..icing on the cake and my fav part about S|X, whenever I boot the system with quick resume takes less then 5sec to continue my gm where I left off.

Did I mention is silent AF, it could be ON for hours in the heavy taxing game and I had to literally get up and see if the fan was spinning or cooling system in general was functioning ..dead..silent, at any given moment. A Technical Marvel of achievement by MS as a whole designing this little jewel, Now...HOLD that!!

Y'all buggin out, what type of question is that?..ENJOY WHAT YOU GOT in your media center, folks like/prefer different things in life and that's that.

 

[DeltaPolarBear]

Ma dude you can't be serious ?! What You Mean?! I play mutha @#$%& games on it. Rocking CyberPunk with no crashes and enjoying this GOAT the shit out off..icing on the cake and my fav part about S|X, whenever I boot the system with quick resume takes less then 5sec to continue my gm where I left off.

Did I mention is silent AF, it could be ON for hours in the heavy taxing game and I had to literally get up and see if the fan was spinning or cooling system in general was functioning ..dead..silent, at any given moment. A Technical Marvel of achievement by MS as a whole designing this little jewel, Now...HOLD that!!

Y'all buggin out, what type of question is that?..ENJOY WHAT YOU GOT in your media center, folks like/prefer different things in life and that's that.

"Just enjoy games" is entirely different from the "OMG Sony fans are triggered lololol" vibe from before. Look, you are just fooling yourself, we all know everything that was written down in the last year, we have not forgotten. Regardless, you got what you deserved. The rest of us would definuitely be having fun with our games, though I am not sure how you are suppose to enjoy yourselves when you seem to live off triggered emojis.

 

[SynTha1]

Ma dude you can't be serious ?! What You Mean?! I play mutha @#$%& games on it. Rocking CyberPunk with no crashes and enjoying this GOAT the shit out off..icing on the cake and my fav part about S|X, whenever I boot the system with quick resume takes less then 5sec to continue my gm where I left off.

Did I mention is silent AF, it could be ON for hours in the heavy taxing game and I had to literally get up and see if the fan was spinning or cooling system in general was functioning ..dead..silent, at any given moment. A Technical Marvel of achievement by MS as a whole designing this little jewel, Now...HOLD that!!

Y'all buggin out, what type of question is that?..ENJOY WHAT YOU GOT in your media center, folks like/prefer different things in life and that's that.

So I ask why your a Xbox fan and u answer with a 3rd party game that is also on Playstation so u can't list anything that Microsoft has actually done over the years to keep u as a customer great deep answer there bruh smdh

 

[Dolomite]

 

[DarkMage619]

So I ask why your a Xbox fan and u answer with a 3rd party game that is also on Playstation so u can't list anything that Microsoft has actually done over the years to keep u as a customer great deep answer there bruh smdh

Why waste the energy? You don't like MS or Xbox and you don't have to. Xbox offers plenty of great games, services, and hardware and people who aren't emotionally against MS can see that. You love PlayStation enjoy it man. Pretty sure MS will survive without your patronage.

 

[SynTha1]

Why waste the energy? You don't like MS or Xbox and you don't have to. Xbox offers plenty of great games, services, and hardware and people who aren't emotionally against MS can see that. You love PlayStation enjoy it man. Pretty sure MS will survive without your patronage.

I ask questions to get answers and I can't ever get one if anyone asks me why I stick with Playstation I can give a honest and clear answer its not hard at all but for some unapparent reason not one Xbox fan can answer the question. I understand that everyone on this planet is different and I just like debating different views on different subjects but if it's too hard to come up with the reasons why u like Xbox even after all the bullshit they have done over the years thats fine too just say u don't have any reason and just buy it just because then I would have to accept it just don't say it's a waste of energy these forums was supposed to be about discussions and debates at least thats what I thought but if it's too much for u thats fine ✌

 

[THEAP99]

i just noticed, hold in the dualsense mic mute button and it mutes the mic and sound at the same time

 

[New Yorks Finest]

So I ask why your a Xbox fan and u answer with a 3rd party game that is also on Playstation so u can't list anything that Microsoft has actually done over the years to keep u as a customer great deep answer there bruh smdh

I just said to you why I enjoy S|X and how they keep me as a customer plus the whole eco system, console, GP, etc..ohh, and I play goddamn gms on it..Hol' ON !! Are you blind or somethin, can you read?

Ima say this one more time..I don't give a @#$% if it's a 1st, 3rd or 5th party, if the games got my attention and they look tight..im rocking it!!. Point, blank, period.

Don't act stupid or play dummy like there's no games, or there's nothin on the Horizon from the recent $7bill drop.

I ain't Fallin for that warring bs you neckbeards happen to ripp eachother apart on here, that's all I see in almost every thread, it is a lifeline for yall On GAF..stay in your lane, you come off too desperate for attention.

 

[Classicrockfan]

Ugh bought watchdogs 2 gold for 17 hoping it will look better on series x and it still looks like poo oh well .

 

[Valued Gamer]

Who? When?

There is no Sony’s own engineer saying PS5 has no ML.
There is one that said PS5’s is unique... it is based in RDNA 2 with more features and, he thinks, one less.

Now how people reached the PS5 has no ML is out of my mind.

I'm sorry you didn't read what he wrote about the PS5.
See below for you own satisfaction.
Yes he is a Sony PS5 graphics engineer.
Yes he said it doesn't have ML on it.
And yes he would know more than any of us on here about the matter.

 

[ethomaz]

I'm sorry you didn't read what he wrote about the PS5.
See below for you own satisfaction.
Yes he is a Sony PS5 graphics engineer.
Yes he said it doesn't have ML on it.
And yes he would know more than any of us on here about the matter.

There is no hardware specific ML unit in any RDNA 2 GPU... it is done in the CUs with the lower int and/or float precision.

That doesn’t means there isn’t ML because all RDNA 2 GPUs supports ML.

 

[TheAssist]

So the past few weeks I was busy playing games instead of following rumors (crazy I know, sorry ). But since people seems to be disassembling their PS 5's left and right, have we seen a die shot by now? Is there any news about the rumored unified cache on the CPU?

Sorry if this is a repeated question, gotta go to work ( preparing those Covid vaccines all day long now) and dont have the time to look through the thread.

 

[SynTha1]

I just said to you why I enjoy S|X and how they keep me as a customer plus the whole eco system, console, GP, etc..ohh, and I play goddamn gms on it..Hol' ON !! Are you blind or somethin, can you read?

Ima say this one more time..I don't give a @#$% if it's a 1st, 3rd or 5th party, if the games got my attention and they look tight..im rocking it!!. Point, blank, period.

Don't act stupid or play dummy like there's no games, or there's nothin on the Horizon from the recent $7bill drop.

I ain't Fallin for that warring bs you neckbeards happen to ripp eachother apart on here, that's all I see in almost every thread, it is a lifeline for yall On GAF..stay in your lane, you come off too desperate for attention.

So all u had to say is u want to play 3rd party games on a Microsoft console all that other nonsense was uncalled for especially the name calling like I said I asked a honest question just wanted a honest answer I barely even post cause people can't have a serious and mature discussion so if that's your answer then I will accept it and move on sheesh such immature people in the world smdh.

 

[MastaKiiLA]

what the fuck is microsoft gonna call the next xbox ?

Xbox Infinity

I'm not even trolling, that seems like the logical next step in their progression. The Xbone was not numbered, as the number was spelled out as a word. I don't think MS is going to go with a 2, when the PS will be on 6. That's even worse than the 3 to 2 comparison that spurred the 360 suffix. So, Xbox Infinity makes sense to me.

 

[Valued Gamer]

There is no hardware specific ML unit in any RDNA 2 GPU... it is done in the CUs with the lower int and/or float precision.

That doesn’t means there isn’t ML because all RDNA 2 GPUs supports ML.

PS5 doesn't have the ability to do lower INT calculations like the XSX or Nvidia GPUs do.
If all ML could be done on a normal FP32 GPU and didn't need the lower precision calcs to increase its potential, then they would have been doing it on the PS4 and Xbox One.
Reality is that to get ML of any real ability you require hardware alterations to tap into INT 8 and INT 4.
Don't take my word for it, take David Gage from QD who said the XSX is way more suited for ML than the PS5 is.
It is what it is.

 

[Snowdonhoffen]

No people are referring to Sony's own engineer that said the PS5 doesn't have ML.
And he would above any one on this forum.

Exclusive: A Deeper Look at the PlayStation 5

Now that the name is official, we've got more details about Sony's next-gen console—from the haptics-packed controller to UI improvements.

www.wired.com

"I could be really specific and talk about experimenting with ambient occlusion techniques, or the examination of ray-traced shadows," says Laura Miele, chief studio officer for EA. "More generally, we’re seeing the GPU be able to power machine learning for all sorts of really interesting advancements in the gameplay and other tools."

Hmmmmm

 

[Empire Strikes Back]

At this point I’m pretty sure Sony is sending ninjas to kill anyone who tries to x-ray the die.

 

[Valued Gamer]

Exclusive: A Deeper Look at the PlayStation 5

Now that the name is official, we've got more details about Sony's next-gen console—from the haptics-packed controller to UI improvements.

www.wired.com

Hmmmmm

I will take the word of an actual Sony Engineer that most likely helped design the thing than some non technical PR person.
I would also take the word of David Gage over a PR person.

 

[onesvenus]

So all u had to say is u want to play 3rd party games on a Microsoft console all that other nonsense was uncalled for especially the name calling like I said I asked a honest question just wanted a honest answer I barely even post cause people can't have a serious and mature discussion so if that's your answer then I will accept it and move on sheesh such immature people in the world smdh.

What did you expect when you treated everybody who answered your question honestly dismissing their opinions?

I answered that the reasons for me to buy the XSX were their licenses (and gave you two examples of it) and Gamepass, which allows me to play a lot of games I wouldn't have played otherwise.
You answered with this

So that's your reason those 2 games thats it well if that's all it takes then have fun good sir. It's just not enough for me to just forget all the lies and manipulation they do I value my money,time and self respect a lil more than that.

Are you sure what you want to do is debate? Or only feed your opinion into others?

 

[Snowdonhoffen]

I will take the word of an actual Sony Engineer that most likely helped design the thing than some non technical PR person.
I would also take the word of David Gage over a PR person.

I mean, literally every feature mentioned in that article is present in the console, why should ML be any different?
I'd say we'll just have to wait and see.

 

[Riky]

I find it really funny and sad that I ask a simple question and not one Xbox fan can give me a honest question but they can give laughing or triggered emojis. I guess they just like throwing money away with no thought put into it but u know a fool and his money and all that.

I'll explain why if you can keep it civil.

Firstly the controller, I have always found the PS controller totally inferior, the stick placement, the size and the build quality. The Xbox controller has bee continually refined with no gimmicks like Sixaxis basically from the original Xbox S controller, I'm incredibly comfortable with it.

My games library carrying forward, not every game but I can put a lot of my 360 games into my 360, Xbox One, Xbox One X and Xbox Series X and even my digital versions in Series S and they work, I put my Killzone disc into PS5, nothing. Not only do they work but they have been updated sometimes several times FOR FREE. Red Dead Redemption in 4k is still stunning, even none updated games like GTA IV now run so much better than when released, GTA IV on PS? The likes of Oblivion and Fallout New Vegas are still played regularly in my house.

So my games library both digital and disc based has been better served by Microsoft and it's all been for free.

Games. Unlike some people Sony's output since Killzone Shadow Fall has been of little interest to me personally, I'm into online shooters and arcade racers. Sony release a lot of third person story driven games that I don't find overly interesting and for that sort of thing I have RDR2 or Witcher 3 if I do want to play that sort of thing. Forza Horizon, Gears and Halo are franchises I don't want to be without.

After having all PS systems from launch previously the PS5 is the first one I feel I don't need yet, I played Demons Souls a decade ago and it's not my thing, I can get Spiderman on my PS4 Pro and there isn't anything on the horizon that makes me want one coming. If they bring back Killzone or Resistance I'd bite straight away but they seem now to have a formula and they are sticking to it as it sells games, it's just not for me personally.

So those are some reasons why, all just my personal opinion but you wanted an explanation.

 

[BigLee74]

So all u had to say is u want to play 3rd party games on a Microsoft console all that other nonsense was uncalled for especially the name calling like I said I asked a honest question just wanted a honest answer I barely even post cause people can't have a serious and mature discussion so if that's your answer then I will accept it and move on sheesh such immature people in the world smdh.

The guy gives you answers, and you just choose to ignore them, continuing on your crusade with a huge degree of pomposity.

People like different things for different reasons, and all reasons are valid. That's all the answer you need.

 

[Banjo64]

The guy gives you answers, and you just choose to ignore them, continuing on your crusade with a huge degree of pomposity.

People like different things for different reasons, and all reasons are valid. That's all the answer you need.

Also, if someone can’t see how Microsoft pioneered online console gaming as we know it today and laid the foundations for industry standards with things like friends lists and achievements I’d suggest that person is being deliberately obtuse, or is a genuine moron.

 

[Lunatic_Gamer]

 

[Banjo64]

And talking about maturity and self respect when you sound like an 8 year old

 

[Lunatic_Gamer]

 

[kyliethicc]

Xbox Infinity

I'm not even trolling, that seems like the logical next step in their progression. The Xbone was not numbered, as the number was spelled out as a word. I don't think MS is going to go with a 2, when the PS will be on 6. That's even worse than the 3 to 2 comparison that spurred the 360 suffix. So, Xbox Infinity makes sense to me.

"The New Xbox X Series X.. X Edition"

 

[Valued Gamer]

I mean, literally every feature mentioned in that article is present in the console, why should ML be any different?
I'd say we'll just have to wait and see.

Simply because Sony didn't make the same alterations that MS did to the GPU.
I remember Sony people saying that the PS5 had Mesh Shaders and VRS because it was a RDNA 2 feature. They found out that it wasn't the case.

 

[Neo Blaster]

I'm honestly wondering if some of that is a just a rehash of Mr Xs dual GPU theory. But instead it's about a ton of features that need to be unlocked to boost the systems performance.

I understand as developers get familiar with both the PS5 and the XSX games will get better. But the notion that the XSX has a ton of performance boosting features that need to be unlocked seems a bit absurd to me.

Xbox fans bragging about a secret feature? Coff Coff, dGPU in the power brick, DirectX 12, Powa of the cloud Coff Coff, never heard before.

 

[Neo Blaster]

Simply because Sony didn't make the same alterations that MS did to the GPU.
I remember Sony people saying that the PS5 had Mesh Shaders and VRS because it was a RDNA 2 feature. They found out that it wasn't the case.

It wasn't the case because Sony is doing the same thing in their own way with Geometry Engine. Like was said before in this thread, RDNA 2 has no dedicated hardware for ML, which means MS can be using AMD's default implementation while Sony is once again using something of their own.

 

[onesvenus]

Reading into that it seems the RDNA2 ISA doesn't expose any kind of BVH building and traversal info. So the same things said about DXRT by that Unreal Engine developer should also apply to all the RDNA2 implementations.

I remember some time ago people in this thread claiming that PS5's RT might be better than DXRT because it might be less of a black box.
If the RDNA2 ISA doesn't expose that information, Sony won't be able to expose it to developers either.

 

[Insane Metal]

Still blows my mind

Cannot even imagine their next project on PS5

Meh, I bet CP2077 have much better interaction

 

[ethomaz]

PS5 doesn't have the ability to do lower INT calculations like the XSX or Nvidia GPUs do.
If all ML could be done on a normal FP32 GPU and didn't need the lower precision calcs to increase its potential, then they would have been doing it on the PS4 and Xbox One.
Reality is that to get ML of any real ability you require hardware alterations to tap into INT 8 and INT 4.
Don't take my word for it, take David Gage from QD who said the XSX is way more suited for ML than the PS5 is.
It is what it is.

Wut?

Where is said PS5’s GPU doesn’t support INT8 or INT4?

RDNA 2 has supports INT8/INT4.