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[Ghost of Caelid]

Often you hear people complain about movies, comics, games etc about forcing diversity into the medium...but it seems like a boogey man that doesn't exist. I can't think of a single game where forced diversity was the sole reason for the game being bad...usually its a bad script, acting, writing or gameplay. Never just "if this character was white the game would have been good." So if someone can enlighten me on a game that was hampered by forced diversity i wouldn't mind hearing.

 

[Guilty_AI]

i wouldn't say it ruins it by itself, its just a red flag, mainly for the story.

 

[tpieman2029]

Pokemon:

Every game has a quota. Must have 1 grass, 1 water and 1 fire starter. F this affirmative action. Pokemon should be chosen on merit and not on type. If that means 3 water starters so be it.

 

[remember_spinal]

Im sure it has for some people.

 

[Rykan]

Gears of War 5.

Plot is literally about a new recruit female soldier that gets to yell at superiors, disobey orders and go AWOL just so she could "Find herself" during the middle of a war. After doing that, shes given the leadership position over her group despite every other member having more experience and even higher rank than her.

Its such a dumb plot to justify a strong female lead.

 

[Artistic]

Can't think of any personally.

 

[Craig of War]

TLOU2

 

[Ghost of Caelid]

TLOU2

Didn't people hate that game cause of a straight white woman not the two lesbians?

 

[Guilty_AI]

Didn't people hate that game cause of a straight white woman not the two lesbians?

no, they hated it because the plot and characters are total crap

 

[Craig of War]

Didn't people hate that game cause of a straight white woman not the two lesbians?

I can't speak for other people but it was the lesbians for me lol

 

[SatansReverence]

Battlefield V thread?

Battlefield V thread!

 

[lukilladog]

Cyberpunk.

 

[daveonezero]

It was never the sole reason but it usually makes other things bad as it isn’t a cooperative thing and it is a forced message.

 

[KyoZz]

We should be able to see the "original plan" for that hypothetic game to know if it was ruined.

Better question would be: Has a single game ever been bad because of "forced diversity"?

 

[Ghost of Caelid]

We should be able to see the "original plan" for that hypothetic game to know if it was ruined.

Better question would be: Has a single game ever been bad because of "forced diversity"?

I think every game people point to being bad for forced diversity was bad for other reasons and forced diversity was their red herring.

 

[BigBooper]

Psychonauts 2 imo. The diversity agenda caused them to hire woke writers who wrote a much worse sequel than the original.

 

[DaGwaphics]

I have some personal favorites where the characters were basically cartoon animals, it really isn't a big deal to me at all. As long as the rats are green, I'm good.

 

[KyoZz]

I think every game people point to being bad for forced diversity was bad for other reasons and forced diversity was their red herring.

Mmmmh I don't know, while I agree people are over reacting 90% of the time, things can get touchy with games like ME Andromeda.
Having a character telling you he is transgender, completely out of nowhere just for the sake of it, this is forced and here just to check the box "transidentity". And it cannibalizes resources that should have been spent elsewhere as this is just one example but the game is filled with this kind of things.

And I'm not sure, other than the usual trolls, that people call these games bad just for that.

 

[elliot5]

Psychonauts 2 imo. The diversity agenda caused them to hire woke writers who wrote a much worse sequel than the original.

unequivocally false. It was written solely by Tim Schafer. They didn't "hire woke writers". The sequel is perfection

 

[Plantoid]

Psychonauts 2 imo. The diversity agenda caused them to hire woke writers who wrote a much worse sequel than the original.

U crazy bro?

 

[Platinumstorm]

Often you hear people complain about movies, comics, games etc about forcing diversity into the medium...but it seems like a boogey man that doesn't exist. I can't think of a single game where forced diversity was the sole reason for the game being bad...usually its a bad script, acting, writing or gameplay. Never just "if this character was white the game would have been good." So if someone can enlighten me on a game that was hampered by forced diversity i wouldn't mind hearing.

I have some issues with a disproportionate amount of women in Battlefield 1 and I think V had that too. It's not that big of an issue, but it is an issue. Battlefield 2042 can have as many women as it wants, because it makes a lot of sense.

To me the game with the biggest issue is Star Wars Squadrons. For the Empire, white people look like Nazis, which is very true to the movies. I support the diversification of Star Wars because the original was way too white, but the non-white people of the Empire look like people you would want to be friends with. This makes no sense. There is no comparison in the movies, to my knowledge, to what a non-white Empire member would look like, which is its own problem, but by and large, "friendly" is not the word I would use to describe what I would expect. Thrawn, from Star Wars Rebels, would be a inspirational choice in my opinion from a stylistic perspective for human characters. He's a brilliant mind who carries himself with dignity and authority. IMO, he is possibly the best Empire character of the entire series.

On the other side, I'm not even sure it's possible to make a white rebel. While I wouldn't have a problem with this in most games, it's just not very true to the source material. Star Wars has been an overwhelmingly white series, so just eliminating white people from the Rebels was an odd decision.

I only made it through a few levels before abandoning the game because it was slow and boring compared to Rogue Squadron, so my impressions of this could be very wrong. The red alien with a really human voice bothered me a ton, because it was like they didn't even try [the red alien was a contributor to me stopping the game].

 

[Ghost of Caelid]

unequivocally false. It was written solely by Tim Schafer. They didn't "hire woke writers". The sequel is perfection

Examples like this is why it often seems silly to me...psychonauts 2 has literally people of every color of the spectrum and the gay relationship was wholesome af. Didn't affect the experience in a negative way at all.

 

[Perrott]

The new Saint's Row game.

 

[Artistic]

The new Saint's Row game.

Can't really call it, but I feel like it's still going to be a solid release.

 

[Nickolaidas]

Often you hear people complain about movies, comics, games etc about forcing diversity into the medium...but it seems like a boogey man that doesn't exist. I can't think of a single game where forced diversity was the sole reason for the game being bad...usually its a bad script, acting, writing or gameplay. Never just "if this character was white the game would have been good." So if someone can enlighten me on a game that was hampered by forced diversity i wouldn't mind hearing.

Wouldn't say 'ruined' for games, more like 'became a bit/lots of cringe'.

Movies, shows and comics? Whoooole different story.

 

[Umbasaborne]

For racists maybe.

 

[NeonGhost]

Call of duty vanguard

 

[BigBooper]

unequivocally false. It was written solely by Tim Schafer. They didn't "hire woke writers". The sequel is perfection

U crazy bro?

Psychonauts 2 is trash.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

- TLOU2 - Abby and Lev are awful and add nothing to the game but ruin the pacing.

the game is still good, but it would have been so much better without that crap.

- Any of the recent war games that just throw in diversity for diversity’s sake

- miles morales was a great game but some of the diversity characters around him are ridiculous. No it doesn’t ruin anything but probably lessens some aspects.

the Christmas dinner scene is just kinda laughworthy…it’s like the designers were saying we’re woke y’all…we’re woke ya’ll…we’re wokety woke and we’re woke y’all

thought it was kinda funny how the only white guy in that game is the main bad guy corporate ceo of that energy company

 

[elliot5]

Psychonauts 2 is trash.

It isn't. Anita isn't a writer in the game. Try again tho.

 

[Javthusiast]

TLOU2

Like clockwork.

 

[TransTrender]

Does it straight up ruin a game for me? No.
Had it ever?
No.

When it happens I usually turn a bit cynical and assume the creators vision had been compromised and influenced by focus group corporate thinking which results in a lesser product that doesn't really do anything to the group they're pandering to because their goalposts are constantly moving.

To me the game with the biggest issue is Star Wars Squadrons. For the Empire, white people look like Nazis, which is very true to the movies. I support the diversification of Star Wars because the original was way too white, but the non-white people of the Empire look like people you would want to be friends with. This makes no sense. There is no comparison in the movies, to my knowledge, to what a non-white Empire member would look like, which is its own problem, but by and large, "friendly" is not the word I would use to describe what I would expect. Thrawn, from Star Wars Rebels, would be a inspirational choice in my opinion from a stylistic perspective for human characters. He's a brilliant mind who carries himself with dignity and authority. IMO, he is possibly the best Empire character of the entire series.

On the other side, I'm not even sure it's possible to make a white rebel. While I wouldn't have a problem with this in most games, it's just not very true to the source material. Star Wars has been an overwhelmingly white series, so just eliminating white people from the Rebels was an odd decision.

I only made it through a few levels before abandoning the game because it was slow and boring compared to Rogue Squadron, so my impressions of this could be very wrong. The red alien with a really human voice bothered me a ton, because it was like they didn't even try [the red alien was a contributor to me stopping the game].

LOL holy shit thank you for reminding me about that game. I noticed the same thing about the Empire vs Rebel crews AND I also found the voice of the red Rebel alien very unsettling. But the crew makeups were like a fucking joke, they just had to be. Literally like a test to see how far it could go before they really pissed everyone off. But then one of the space nazis turned out to be gay! And Asian! Happening during the start of the anti Asian violence wave. I was wondering if that would be the final straw before they get Twitter canceled for such a violent offense.

I love it by the way and I'm soon going to beat it again with the PS5 this time along with my old VR, and HOTAS.

But yikes the crew makeups were hilarious.

 

[CityHunter1981]

Forspoken comes to mind. If I remember correctly she looked better before.

 

[eyesabitdull]

I'd say COD Vanguard.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Forspoken comes to mind. If I remember correctly she looked better before.

jury is still out on this one.

seems a bit corny from the dialogue so far but it could grow on me

the character design is absolutely fine, writing seems a bit cringe …but Amy Hennig is writing it so I imagine it should be ok

 

[nush]

Has a single game ever been ruined by "forced diversity"?​

Not yet, and probably won't be as the pendulum is swinging back now. However, there's stuff that's been in development for a long time so it could happen.

When is Goodbye Volcano High getting released?

 

[BigBooper]

It isn't. Anita isn't a writer in the game. Try again tho.

Oh, was that the question asked in the topic? I guess I can't read. She claims that she submitted changes to them and they followed them. I don't care what they called her in the credits.

 

[SlimySnake]

MGS2. Kojima was chasing the gay audience and ended up designing Raiden and Vamp.

 

[TheThreadsThatBindUs]

Often you hear people complain about movies, comics, games etc about forcing diversity into the medium...but it seems like a boogey man that doesn't exist. I can't think of a single game where forced diversity was the sole reason for the game being bad...usually its a bad script, acting, writing or gameplay. Never just "if this character was white the game would have been good." So if someone can enlighten me on a game that was hampered by forced diversity i wouldn't mind hearing.

Your premise is not only backwards, it's intentionally mischaracterising the critique in question. You're basically using a shitty strawman to reframe the argument in order to try to dismiss it.

The argument is that forced diversity (or any other kind of political propaganda) being positioned front and centre of a game, as the primary focus, takes away the focus on actually delivering a good game with a great story, characters etc etc.

There are plenty of examples in media outside gaming, e.g. the new Star Wars trilogy, The Eternals, Star Trek Discovery etc etc.

In gaming, there are fewer examples (so far), but you can count the new Saint's Row (it's gonna be dogshit you can guarantee). Also, Battlefield V.

Making quality entertainment media is freaking hard.

As such, aiming towards quality must take the singular focus. The moment a creator/creative team starts to shift the focus away towards social commentary and political propaganda, is the moment the quality goal shifts so far away that it becomes a target no longer in sight... and it shows in the end product... invariably so.

Keep the things that deserve to be peripheral concerns as peripheral concerns, otherwise the ability to tell a compelling story falls well out of reach.

 

[elliot5]

Oh, was that the question asked in the topic? I guess I can't read. She claims that she submitted changes to them and they followed them. I don't care what they called her in the credits.

You keep saying false shit. You claimed they hired woke writers. False. So then you backpedal even though your original reasoning is false that it's still on topic.

Then you say she claims she submitted "changes" and they "followed" them. That's also false based on her own words. She praised how they "engaged" with her "feedback" (not followed her changes). Very different things.

 

[Saint Boot]

Often you hear people complain about movies, comics, games etc about forcing diversity into the medium...but it seems like a boogey man that doesn't exist. I can't think of a single game where forced diversity was the sole reason for the game being bad...usually its a bad script, acting, writing or gameplay. Never just "if this character was white the game would have been good." So if someone can enlighten me on a game that was hampered by forced diversity i wouldn't mind hearing.

It didn't do battlefield 5 any favors. Devs stated if you don't like it, don't buy it. Gamers said Challenge accepted, and then it was a massive flop per Wikipedia and it's listed sources.

Naughty Dog seems untouchable though as they will make serious bank no matter how many people online hate them.

Mass Effect Andromeda might also be one on account of proven bigotry from the games lead developer being an open bigot against white people on his twitter.

 

[Danjin44]

I don't know what "forced diversity" means in this context.

 

[Clear]

Its not complicated; When you see a character as a token, it sets up a barrier between you and them in the fiction.

The principle is the same as an author striving not to be overly heavy handed and obvious in their writing, because unless the work is specifically about them its a distraction from the story they are trying to tell having a non-diegtic presence constantly looming overhead.

 

[JimmyRustler]

We should be able to see the "original plan" for that hypothetic game to know if it was ruined.

Better question would be: Has a single game ever been bad because of "forced diversity"?

This. The question can‘t be answered without knowing how the game would have looked without it.

 

[jigglet]

Can't think of any yet.

However if one day they ever make a good Simpsons game, I will say before I've even played it that it has already been negatively affected by it. Apu man, he was my homie

 

[BigBooper]

You keep saying false shit. You claimed they hired woke writers. False. So then you backpedal even though your original reasoning is false that it's still on topic.

Then you say she claims she submitted "changes" and they "followed" them. That's also false based on her own words. She praised how they "engaged" with her "feedback" (not followed her changes). Very different things.

I'll forgive you not knowing, but that is a twitter thread where she said multiple things. This was the second part.

 

[haxan7]

Bait thread. Also politics.

 

[fersnake]

A couple..

 

[penguininthesun]

It didn’t ruin the game for me, but Lev’s story in TLOU2 felt like an odd choice. And he’s a character I really like. It’s just the way they shoehorned his “identity struggle” in there felt kind of inauthentic and contrived. It seemed disconnected from the rest of the world of TLOU. I’m not against the representation, just the execution. The other “diversity” characters in that game were more believable imo. With Lev, it felt like they were pandering just a bit. I do hope to see him again in some future installment, because he’s a very interesting character otherwise, and more than just his “identity.“

 

[Kagey K]

I haven't seen it yet, but I seem to be much more tolerant and forgiving for some of the bad shit in games than most around here seem to be.