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EA Plotting Patch for Dead Space PS5 Remake's Bugged Graphics

DenchDeckard

Moderated wildly
Isnt the whole point of vrs is its off to the side and edges, where you wouldn't normally be looking. So surely if you are looking for faults around the screen space you will spot tell tale issues, but your focus point should be looking great? In theory?

I'm sure it will get there.
 

Riky

$MSFT
Isnt the whole point of vrs is its off to the side and edges, where you wouldn't normally be looking. So surely if you are looking for faults around the screen space you will spot tell tale issues, but your focus point should be looking great? In theory?

I'm sure it will get there.

Yes it's used on dark areas and screen edges, it's dynamic frame to frame. So still screen shots with the brightness ramped up are pretty useless because people don't play that way. Which is why when done well like in Gears 5 and Doom Eternal it's unnoticeable during gameplay.
 

TGO

Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
PS5 after update - note I do have grain enabled
18604ee7ca6100-screen1ic6t.png
 

TrebleShot

Member
It’s slightly better i was just playing it. It still looks low res and blurry but certainly better than it was.

I’m not seeing anything here that couldn’t be done on PS4
 
Did they uncap frame rate again in non perf mode? It’s smoother after today. Feels like 40s. I tried non per mode and first and it was slide show city.
 

01011001

Banned
Did they uncap frame rate again in non perf mode? It’s smoother after today. Feels like 40s. I tried non per mode and first and it was slide show city.

well hopefully they uncapped it and implemented a setting to cap it if you want.

capped 30fps without an option to change the cap should never be a thing on modern consoles
 
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What a post....lol

"Probably"

Then the xbox patch gets released and here we go again!

We need actual proof from trusted sources, not a probably.
John from DF confirmed they disabled VRS on PC and PS5. So yeah currently the IQ is better on PS5 as XSX still hasn't being patched. Hopefully they'll disable it on Series consoles too.
 
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DenchDeckard

Moderated wildly
Honestly, If I was Digital Foundry I would be so annoyed with Devs, Or you just get used to it and your pipeline improves and you get more hits from follow up VIDS. the problem is you get issues with a narrative being made of how bad a game is on one platform and then its ultimately fixed with patches.

THat PS5 version before patch was just terrible and should have been spotted from a mile away. Glad theyve fixed it quickly.
 
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TrebleShot

Member
DF are great guys and get too much stick, can imagine their jobs are v difficult with the swarths of fanboys baying for blood.

Try and get a comparison out to get the number vs wait for the patch to compare things.
All in all i think they do a great job Alex included.

Of course they can lean certain ways or miss details but they aren't infallible and they seem like nice enough guys passionate about what they do.

Looking forward to the comparison on consoles just to get my head around what I see, I was kind of expecting to be blown away even on perf mode but its just good.
 

ToTTenTranz

Banned
So it was just a bug as predicted, and it's been solved.

Am I the only one noticing how EA as a publisher and their studios are slowly becoming actually good? In less than 2 months we're getting no less than 3 good-looking single-player experiences without play2win mechanics or microtransactions.
And if they're all like this game, save for a couple of quickly quashed bugs they're properly optimized on all platforms on release.
This is pretty cool IMO.



We actually saw in Doom Eternal that Tier 2 VRS gave a significant advantage. It's a good job that The Coalition are actually involved in UE5 development as it will be used more and more in the future and gives nice performance increases.

73MLuIU.png

Uninformed people reading those "33% speed up!" might think this is the best special sauce they've ever seen and the Series X iS gOiNg tO kIlL tHe PlAyStAtIoN.

In reality, informed people will know that in today's typical ~25ms frametime (40FPS Quality modes) those 0.36ms of difference actually mean that the framerate will go from 40 FPS all the way up to 40.6 FPS.
And this is just comparing "Hardware VRS" to "No VRS". Throw in Software VRS for comparison and the difference will become even harder to measure.


Despite Microsoft's heavy marketing on the SeriesX's specs, real world results on 3rd party games show that both consoles are showing identical results.
Both consoles having performance parity is obviously a good thing for nearly everyone as 3rd-party developers need to spend less time designing for different performance targets.
Though I guess those who drank too much kool-aid from 2020's marketing campaign will need more than 2 years of coping.
 
Am I the only one noticing how EA as a publisher and their studios are slowly becoming actually good?

You are the only one. NFS was shit, their sports games are still shitty and addictive. It Takes Two was the only unique ip that was good in the last many years EA published. Dead Space was already an established and good game and so was Mass Effect, their remakes/remaster dont count
 
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DenchDeckard

Moderated wildly
You can clearly see the VRS being used at the edges of the screen where it should be used on the update. VRS seems to be working correctly now.

Great news, cant believe how bad it looked at first.
 

Vick

Member
You can clearly see the VRS being used at the edges of the screen where it should be used on the update. VRS seems to be working correctly now.

Great news, cant believe how bad it looked at first.
Not sure what you're clearly seeing, because VRS is entirely disabled now on PS5.

It's not "working correctly", it's just not there at all.





 

aries_71

Junior Member
Not sure what you're clearly seeing, because VRS is entirely disabled now on PS5.

It's not "working correctly", it's just not there at all.






Wow. So they didn’t fix anything, just disabled it. Unbelievable. And here the people celebrating EA agile performance and responsiveness 😂

If they disabled it entirely there’s no doubt that performance will take a hit, and that means lower frame rate, lower resolution due to DRS or both. Great.
 
Yay! Yesterday's patch finally fixed the broken (i.e. invisible) blue locator navigation line for me in the PC version as well as allowing VRS to be toggled in the Graphics menu (where it disabled by default). Good that the developers released this patch so quickly but it is a shame that no-one noticed the VRS issue on PC and PS5 in time to fix it for launch. Did the reviewers of the PS5 version not notice the terrible image quality?
 

Vick

Member
Wow. So they didn’t fix anything, just disabled it. Unbelievable. And here the people celebrating EA agile performance and responsiveness 😂

If they disabled it entirely there’s no doubt that performance will take a hit, and that means lower frame rate, lower resolution due to DRS or both. Great.
John already said there's no Performance nor Resolution hit.
I've personally read hundreds of comments on Reddit, Reee and foreign (my own Country) Forums, no reports whatsoever of worse performances nor anything like that.

No need for more concern™.
 

aries_71

Junior Member
John already said there's no Performance nor Resolution hit.
I've personally read hundreds of comments on Reddit, Reee and foreign (my own Country) Forums, no reports whatsoever of worse performances nor anything like that.

No need for more concern™.
Sorry, but that’s hard to believe. Engineers don’t do things that aren’t necessary just in case they are. If VRS was there in the first place was to alleviate performance issues under load or stress. John’s comment that maybe wasn’t necessary anymore is just grasping for an answer. I hope VRS is fixed and NOT disabled.
 
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Vick

Member
Sorry, but that’s hard to believe. Engineers don’t do things that aren’t necessary just in case they are. If VRS was there in the first place was to alleviate performance issues under load or stress. John’s comment that maybe wasn’t necessary anymore is just grasping for an answer.
I have a wild theory as to why it shipped in this state, kinda related to Callisto Protocol, but I'll keep it for myself.

I hope VRS is fixed and NOT disabled.
I personally hope it's disabled, because it's an awful "technology" that simply sucks 90% of the time imo.

This game shouldn't have any reason whatsoever to look the way it does and not run well on the same machine running TLOU Part I at stable 60fps with dynamic GI.
Lighting tech in this Dead Space Remake is technically legit inferior to TLOU on PS3 since that game already featured dynamic light bounce ten years ago.








Using Uncharted 4 here because it's easier to show, but it's the same tech in all ND games since 2013.

Edit:




I stand corrected, there is bounce lighting in Dead Space Remake! I'm installing the game right now, looking forward to see if it's actually disabled when using dynamic flashlight, because in every video I saw there wasn't any noticeable bounce light whatsoever.

Edit 2:

Well, I was sort of right before, what is here is not worthy of being called dynamic light bounce at all. Flashlight bounce is super limited to a few shaders at a time and really feeble in intensity, it's nonexistent basically., it's nonexistent basically. Aside from ND, Alien: Isolation also did a much more impressive job in this regard almost ten years ago.

Oh my bad. No idea what I thought I was looking at in the lower left hand corner of the picture then. must just be some shitter looking textures on the roof then. 😆
Probably also because these screenshots are brightened.

I'm playing in quality mode on ps5 and maybe it's just imagination but it feels kinda more sluggish now post patch.
I've read more than one people saying it's no longer capped at 30fps in Quality Mode.
No official confirmation as far as I know, but it would explain what you're seeing.
 
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Hugare

Member
I have a wild theory as to why it shipped in this state, kinda related to Callisto Protocol, but I'll keep it for myself.


I personally hope it's disabled, because it's an awful "technology" that simply sucks 90% of the time imo.

This game shouldn't have any reason whatsoever to look the way it does and not run well on the same machine running TLOU Part I at stable 60fps with dynamic GI.
Lighting tech in this Dead Space Remake is technically legit inferior to TLOU on PS3 since that game already featured dynamic light bounce ten years ago.








Using Uncharted 4 here because it's easier to show, but it's the same tech in all ND games since 2013.


Probably also because these screenshots are brightened.


I've read more than one people saying it's no longer capped at 30fps in Quality Mode.
No official confirmation as far as I know, but it would explain what you're seeing.

lol, 1 dynamic light bounce every light source having dynamic bounce

As if that's the only thing that differs Dead Space lighting engine to TLOU and Uncharted 4

Comparing features from different games, different engines and different scopes is idiotic. Please, dont.

Judge it for what its doing, which is impressive
 
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Vick

Member
lol, 1 dynamic light bounce every light source having dynamic bounce

Comparing features from different games, different engines and different scopes is idiotic. Please, dont.

Judge it for what its doing, which is impressive
Flashlight (1 dynamic light source) is extremely prominent in Dead Space Remake, considerably more than the original.

Real time bounce lighting (already achieved on PS3 in 2013, or Alien: Isolation in 2014 if you want to use a more similar game) would have added an awful lot to this game presentation.

And it would have been extremely taxing, reason why I cited Part I as an example because if that game, or the much wider/more complex Part II PS4 version, can run at a stable 60fps, so should this Dead Space.
VRS or not.

Edit:




I stand corrected Hugare Hugare , there is bounce lighting in Dead Space Remake! I'm installing the game right now, looking forward to see if it's actually disabled when using dynamic flashlight because in every video I saw there wasn't any noticeable bounce light whatsoever.

Edit 2:

Well, I was sort of right before, what is here is not worthy of being called dynamic light bounce at all. Flashlight bounce is super limited to a few shaders at a time and really feeble in intensity, it's nonexistent basically. Aside from ND, Alien: Isolation also did a much more impressive job in this regard almost ten years ago.

As if that's the only thing that differs Dead Space lighting engine to TLOU and Uncharted 4



I don't think there's a single lighting feature present in Dead Space Remake that wasn't in Uncharted 4/The Last of Us. Please, enlighten me if I'm wrong. Even volumetric lighting doesn't look more advanced at all than what was done in 2016.
 
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Riky

$MSFT
Uninformed people reading those "33% speed up!" might think this is the best special sauce they've ever seen and the Series X iS gOiNg tO kIlL tHe PlAyStAtIoN.

In reality, informed people will know that in today's typical ~25ms frametime (40FPS Quality modes) those 0.36ms of difference actually mean that the framerate will go from 40 FPS all the way up to 40.6 FPS.
And this is just comparing "Hardware VRS" to "No VRS". Throw in Software VRS for comparison and the difference will become even harder to measure.


Despite Microsoft's heavy marketing on the SeriesX's specs, real world results on 3rd party games show that both consoles are showing identical results.
Both consoles having performance parity is obviously a good thing for nearly everyone as 3rd-party developers need to spend less time designing for different performance targets.
Though I guess those who drank too much kool-aid from 2020's marketing campaign will need more than 2 years of coping.

Not really identical, I used the example of Doom Eternal, it runs at a higher resolution on Series X and id said they wished every platform had hardware VRS. Like a lot of games, the DRS normally have higher bounds on Series X. Hitman 3 is another example with a huge gulf.
That was only one area of VRS in the slide, it has gains throughout the pipeline and as noted by The Coalition can give gains up to 14% which is substantial.


"The team saw similarly large perf gains from VRS Tier 2 – up to 14%! – this time with no noticeable visual impact"

"However, Software-Based VRS also has some trade-offs including implementation complexity and the overhead of a de-blocking pass. One possibility is to use a hybrid of both techniques, switching between VRS techniques based on the characteristics of the rendering pass."

Since then additional work has been done taking the savings even further,



goBfQF4.jpg


I'll take the word of respected developers thank you.
 

sinnergy

Member
Not really identical, I used the example of Doom Eternal, it runs at a higher resolution on Series X and id said they wished every platform had hardware VRS. Like a lot of games, the DRS normally have higher bounds on Series X. Hitman 3 is another example with a huge gulf.
That was only one area of VRS in the slide, it has gains throughout the pipeline and as noted by The Coalition can give gains up to 14% which is substantial.

[/URL][/URL]

"The team saw similarly large perf gains from VRS Tier 2 – up to 14%! – this time with no noticeable visual impact"

"However, Software-Based VRS also has some trade-offs including implementation complexity and the overhead of a de-blocking pass. One possibility is to use a hybrid of both techniques, switching between VRS techniques based on the characteristics of the rendering pass."

Since then additional work has been done taking the savings even further,



goBfQF4.jpg


I'll take the word of respected developers thank you.

People who made up their mind can’t be reasoned with ..

Xbox patch also live ??
 
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Heisenberg007

Gold Journalism
We actually saw in Doom Eternal that Tier 2 VRS gave a significant advantage. It's a good job that The Coalition are actually involved in UE5 development as it will be used more and more in the future and gives nice performance increases.

73MLuIU.png
And that VRS advantage came at the cost of visual quality on XSX because of Tier-2 VRS. The XSX version of Doom Eternal looks awful in comparison to PS5 because of low IQ and visual artificats, despite higher avg. res. Paint the full picture.

Here is an example of poor IQ on XSX.

Here is an example visual artificats on XSX because of VRS. There is none on PS5.

UB3VdDH.jpg

U7Elbp1.jpg


All in all, VRS is an awful tech as of now that almost always leads to poor quality image and visual issues. As we just saw with Dead Space.

Now the PS5 version look amazing without VRS, and there is no hit on performance whatsoever. This is how the game should have launched -- without VRS. And the XSX version, with VRS, looks worse now in comparison, further proving that VRS (tier 1 or tier 2, software or hardware) is just bad.
 

Riky

$MSFT
And that VRS advantage came at the cost of visual quality on XSX because of Tier-2 VRS. The XSX version of Doom Eternal looks awful in comparison to PS5 because of low IQ and visual artificats, despite higher avg. res. Paint the full picture.

Here is an example of poor IQ on XSX.


Here is an example visual artificats on XSX because of VRS. There is none on PS5.

UB3VdDH.jpg

U7Elbp1.jpg


All in all, VRS is an awful tech as of now that almost always leads to poor quality image and visual issues. As we just saw with Dead Space.

Now the PS5 version look amazing without VRS, and there is no hit on performance whatsoever. This is how the game should have launched -- without VRS. And the XSX version, with VRS, looks worse now in comparison, further proving that VRS (tier 1 or tier 2, software or hardware) is just bad.

Totally untrue and backed up by DF who said the PS5 version looked "visibly blurrier"

As my last slide said, VRS can increase overall resolution giving better picture quality.

No player zooms in 400% in gameplay on a still screen to look for a double pixel width, totally disingenuous as usual. Everyone can see the whole image at all time being blurrier during play.
 
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DenchDeckard

Moderated wildly
And that VRS advantage came at the cost of visual quality on XSX because of Tier-2 VRS. The XSX version of Doom Eternal looks awful in comparison to PS5 because of low IQ and visual artificats, despite higher avg. res. Paint the full picture.

Here is an example of poor IQ on XSX.


Here is an example visual artificats on XSX because of VRS. There is none on PS5.

UB3VdDH.jpg

U7Elbp1.jpg


All in all, VRS is an awful tech as of now that almost always leads to poor quality image and visual issues. As we just saw with Dead Space.

Now the PS5 version look amazing without VRS, and there is no hit on performance whatsoever. This is how the game should have launched -- without VRS. And the XSX version, with VRS, looks worse now in comparison, further proving that VRS (tier 1 or tier 2, software or hardware) is just bad.
This was proven to be incorrect, and let's wait for a proper comparison between both patched versions before we make a final assessment. There are those saying that dead space isn't performing as well and feels more sluggish since the patch on quality mode. I have no idea if this is true or not?

I personally would rather take a crisper higher res image through the whole playthrough of the game than one blurry light in a reflection that I would literally have to scour the screen to notice, anyway.

We need a proper analysis.
 
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Heisenberg007

Gold Journalism
This was proven to be incorrect, and let's wait for a proper comparison between both patched versions before we make a final assessment. There are those saying that dead space isn't performing as well and feels more sluggish since the patch on quality mode. I have no idea if this is true or not?

I personally would rather take a crisper higher res image through the whole playthrough of the game than one blurry light in a reflection that I would literally have to scour the screen to notice, anyway.

We need a proper analysis.
John's tweet on performance after the VRS-removal patch:



I can't find even a single complaint on Reddit, and there are hundreds of comments. Searched for keywords like "performance," "stutter," and "frames." There are stutter issues on PC but not on PS5.

lVFFZf7.jpg


 

Heisenberg007

Gold Journalism
Totally untrue and backed up by DF who said the PS5 version looked "visibly blurrier"

As my last slide said, VRS can increase overall resolution giving better picture quality.

No player zooms in 400% in gameplay on a still screen to look for a double pixel width, totally disingenuous as usual. Everyone can see the whole image at all time being blurrier during play.
lol nobody zooms in 400% but everybody pauses and counts pixels on the screen to calculate the average resolution? 😄 lmao.

PS5 had better IQ and image quality because of VRS in Doom Eternal.

In Dead Space, the PS5 version looks better because it doesn't use VRS anymore. Devs will be patching out VRS on XSX as well. If tier-2 VRS didn't create any issue, why would they do that?
 

Riky

$MSFT
E3

lol nobody zooms in 400% but everybody pauses and counts pixels on the screen to calculate the average resolution? 😄 lmao.

PS5 had better IQ and image quality because of VRS in Doom Eternal.

In Dead Space, the PS5 version looks better because it doesn't use VRS anymore. Devs will be patching out VRS on XSX as well. If tier-2 VRS didn't create any issue, why would they do that?
Ill take the developers and Digital Foundry's opinion above yours on Doom Eternal thanks, "visibly blurrier" is pretty clear to me no need for the player to count anything.

As for Dead Space well if it hits it's framerate target and you have a fixed resolution then you don't need VRS, even if that resolution is low. We'll see the breakdown after all the patches.
 
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