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Graphical Fidelity I Expect This Gen

So what do you UE5 disciples think of this one:


I mean, it looks good, but in the same vein as Spider-Man 2 that it didn’t drop my jaw any inch and I’m still perfectly seated in my chair.

Must take some serious bad talent to botch that up with using the holy spirit known as UE5, right?


Dude- didn't we already establish that Unreal 5 isn't a magic bullet for next gen visuals? Secondly, this is an AA studio with a fraction of the budget and size of Sony backed Insomniac. If anything your statement is an indictment on Insomniac, not Lords of the Fallen. Lastly- the graphics look pretty damn good. Better than most of the ps5/sx exclusives we've started getting as releases.

Seems like a overly negative post.
 
Let’s see how hellblade looks tomorrow. I really think we won’t be blown away the remainder of this gen… would love to be proven wrong.

I don't see how that's possible when we sorta have a good idea for what these consoles are capable of now. Graphically demanding games, esp ones with large environments and ray tracing repeatedly come up against walls of low native res or 30 fps
 

hinch7

Member
So what do you UE5 disciples think of this one:


I mean, it looks good, but in the same vein as Spider-Man 2 that it didn’t drop my jaw any inch and I’m still perfectly seated in my chair.

Must take some serious bad talent to botch that up with using the holy spirit known as UE5, right?

It does look pretty. Not the best looking game but for a souls-like one of the better ones atm.

Shame its derivative of Miyazaki's work. In both art and gameplay.
 
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CGNoire

Member
Game looks really good, the level of detail is impressive and the lighting was also very good.
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Looks cool and all but the fidelity between cutscenes and gameplay is too large. Pretty big cuts for gameplay. The enviroment is blockier and the Character looks way flatter and no its not just the lack of a 3 point light setup. There is definitely more cut than that.
 
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PeteBull

Member
If only the game actually looked like that:

fmaZU3m.jpg
Maybe on ps6, bro, definitely not on ps5pr0, so around 2028-2030.
We did reach/surpassed many bullshot trailers/screens after jump to next gen so there is hope spiderman 4 looks somehow similar( spidey3 will probably be end of ps5 or ps5/ps6 crossgen so no chance ;p).
 

PeteBull

Member
Matrix was running real-time on ps5 my man. Every cutscene save for one shot of trinity multiplying was rendered in real-time..
Thats a lie, there were some cutscenes in the matrix demo that werent real time, stated by DF too, but tbh if cutsene is running in real time or not, doesnt matter, whats most impressive is how gameplay looked, not cutscenes, not even that on rails gameplay but actual open world driving(fps dipped below 20 then tho :p ).
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
Thats a lie, there were some cutscenes in the matrix demo that werent real time, stated by DF too, but tbh if cutsene is running in real time or not, doesnt matter, whats most impressive is how gameplay looked, not cutscenes, not even that on rails gameplay but actual open world driving(fps dipped below 20 then tho :p ).
I know that’s Df video, they specifically pointed out the Trinity scene as the only thing that wasn’t real-time. The finale explosion was real-time but captured and played back due to some outside factors. Or maybe it was the other way around and the Trinity scene was real-time and captured in advance. Regardless , 99.9% of the cutscenes in that demo are real-time.

Gameplay dips were due to the poor cpu utilization and could be mitigated by turning down the traffic and npc density. You can test this yourself. The game is cpu bound on PC and likely the cause of those drops during driving. There are no slowdowns while walking. My 3080 couldn’t hit 60 fps no matter how low i went with resolution.
 

PeteBull

Member
I know that’s Df video, they specifically pointed out the Trinity scene as the only thing that wasn’t real-time. The finale explosion was real-time but captured and played back due to some outside factors. Or maybe it was the other way around and the Trinity scene was real-time and captured in advance. Regardless , 99.9% of the cutscenes in that demo are real-time.

Gameplay dips were due to the poor cpu utilization and could be mitigated by turning down the traffic and npc density. You can test this yourself. The game is cpu bound on PC and likely the cause of those drops during driving. There are no slowdowns while walking. My 3080 couldn’t hit 60 fps no matter how low i went with resolution.
Think of this- ur pc with much stronger cpu cant hit 60 fps, ps5/xsx drop below 20 with high traffic, and u expecting actual games to look as good yet perform 50% higher at least, cpu wise(20 to 30fps is +50% performance).
Putting aside pc that matrix demo wasnt really optimised for, console wise game with similar looks needs 50% more oomph vs ps5/xsx to even hold stable 30, so maybe ps5pr0/xbox midgen upgrade could give us that.

The less impressive cinematics that run in real time didnt run in 30fps either, but 24fps, but again, fk cinematics, real gameplay is true showcase, it shows things can get much better and competetent devs with big budget + no devtime restrains can get things done, but only if we get much stronger hardware, both cpu and gpu wise.

If devs of the matrix demo were sure that few more weeks of "optimisation work" would make any difference and game(well, the demo;p) would look just as good but run w/o dips, they would get those few more weeks and we would simply see the demo bit later, its not like the demo had hard launch date and was in some danger of not meeting it, hell we would get performance patch by now fixing those nasty dips under 20fps.

I on the other hand believe, that was max they could realisitically take out of current gen consoles.

Hence my conclusion, if u want to have matrix demo quality in game, that holds solid 30(not 24fps in cutscenes, and not under 20fps in real gameplay, but solid 30 stable), u need to wait for ps5pr0/xbox midgen upgrade.
 

01011001

Banned
face the truth. without competent Raytracing hardware, there won't be any graphical wow moments in video games going forward.
 
So with the Xbox Showcase tonight and the last hope of seeing something graphically next generation, I decided to play one of last generations graphics kings TLOU2 again. Well it's not quite as impressive anymore but is still world class in some areas.

Cutscenes are pretty much still up there at the top. Animations are as good as I've seen (along with RDR2). Materials, physics, effects all top drawer. It's not all as impressive anymore though. First of all there is a noticable drop in fidelity in character models in game from the cutscenes. Lighting engine can look very flat and dated in some areas and great in others (I also think this is a reason why the models in gameplay looked far less detailed as well). The point is we should really be seeing significantly better looking games by now and I don't think we have yet. Hopefully that changes later.
 

E-Cat

Member

I don’t know why a perfectly nice video has to be spoiled with an over-zealous, ADHD record scratch presentation style.

Maybe he thinks the audience is too dumb to think this stuff is awesome on its own merits without being told so in the most cringe way possible? For me, it took me out of the video (case in point).

Edit: The asshat even talks over the deformation ASMR
 
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alloush

Member
Maybe on ps6, bro, definitely not on ps5pr0, so around 2028-2030.
We did reach/surpassed many bullshot trailers/screens after jump to next gen so there is hope spiderman 4 looks somehow similar( spidey3 will probably be end of ps5 or ps5/ps6 crossgen so no chance ;p).
Kinda sad that we have to wait for the PS6 in 2030 to get visuals like the screenshot in my post. That's some depressing shit right there, lol. Having said that, I don't think Insomniac will release Spidey 3 on the PS5, I mean they will but it will come out on the PS6 and be a cross-gen title coming out on the PS5 as well, but I don't think they will release another Spidey title before the PS6 comes out; that's my hunch. Let's not forget they are working on that Wolverine game as well, and they might also release another Ratchet game, so.
 

Edder1

Member
I’m shocked you boys aren’t talking more about Space Marines 2 on here. Kinda slipped under the radar.

Correct me if I’m wrong but seems like a straight up AAA $70 very next Gen looking game in a sea of cross Gen looking garbage. (Lookin at you spiderman)
I mentioned it as did couple of other people, but yes it's getting overlooked because it appeals to a smaller crowd and isn't coming from one of the console makers. I just saw Digital Foundry's review of Summer Game Fest and it was the game they've been impressed by the most. It's also impressive to see a game that isn't Unreal look that good. There were folks here making excuses for other devs saying it takes too long to overhaul an engine and yet here we have a smaller team with less budget achieve impressive visuals.
 
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Kikorin

Member
I've the impression Fable is still far far away, and write "in-game" will going to create insane expectations on how the game will looks. I definitely anticipate a Killzone on PS3 situation when the game eventually come out in 20xx.
 

CGNoire

Member
I've the impression Fable is still far far away, and write "in-game" will going to create insane expectations on how the game will looks. I definitely anticipate a Killzone on PS3 situation when the game eventually come out in 20xx.
Yah I dont buy that "In game" BS simply because there is no way MS would ever provide a budget capaple of that fidelity for an entire RPG.....Just No fucking way.
 

Edder1

Member
Overall Xbox Showcase was much more impressive as a showcase of current gen graphics, but it wasn't that impressive as a show and I expected to see more. We also didn't see any proper gameplay slices. I think something like Gears 6 would have stolen the show, but at least we now getting an idea what these consoles are capable of. Forza looks much better than last time around and was probably the best looking game of the show. Starfield has also improved visually by quite a bit.
 
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Schmendrick

Member
You can't do RPG of that scale with those visuals on last gen systems, so yet it's next gen. Some aspects are a bit dated though, like animations and facial detail and shading.
We already know that the game handles its environments like seperate levels, it`s not seamless like a Star Citizen and has to live with the comparison to all the other open/half.open world games, and it can`t even touch a cross gen game like HFW in regards to visual fidelity.

I have been saying this since it was first revealed and especially when they showed the vistas last year. the lighting is a cut above other games this gen for sure. some of the environmental details and character models can be better but that lighting holy shit.
Judging the lighting system of a game from a few PR bullshots

Danger Lets Get Dangerous GIF by MOODMAN
 
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SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
Hence my conclusion, if u want to have matrix demo quality in game, that holds solid 30(not 24fps in cutscenes, and not under 20fps in real gameplay, but solid 30 stable), u need to wait for ps5pr0/xbox midgen upgrade.
By that logic, star wars jedi survivor which drops to 15-20 fps regularly on the ps5 while looking last gen is too much for the ps5 to handle?

I told you the matrix is single threaded. you can see it really hits that one thread really hard while everything else just sits there in the 20s and 30s. lets say if they cant figure it out and the game has poor cpu performance, well then they can simply reduce the traffic and npc count by 50% and get a locked 30 fps you get when you are walking around. I told you, go download it again and try to reduce both settings, you will get a locked 30 fps. The game has like 50k cars and 35k pedastrians. Even with half off, its still very impressive. the chase sequence ran at pretty much a locked 30 fps with only a few drops to 28 fps on the xsx which led Alex to mockingly declare ps5 the winner because it only dropped to 29 fps in that one comparison. regardless, that was the most impressive part of the demo and ran at 1404p to 1620p.

Most games on UE5 wont have these pedestrians and traffic pegging the CPU. The graphics, the level of detail, the lighting, the reflections, and asset quality will look just as good.

Cutscenes running at 24 fps dont bother me. ive been watching 24 fps letterboxed movies my entire life. honestly, this looks and moves so good at 24 fps, who cares if it isnt 30 fps?

fCP9vIg.gif


EG6Cscb.gif
 

Edder1

Member
We already know that the game handles its environments like seperate levels, it`s not seamless like a Star Citizen and has to live with the comparison to all the other open/half.open world games, and it can`t even touch a cross gen game like HFW in regards to visual fidelity.
That doesn't really matter since the scope of the game is so massive. If you are expecting visuals like what you get in scripted linear story driven games then you're being very unrealistic. If you can show me any other RPG that is on the scale of Starfield and looks even close to it then I'll gladly take your point. I don't think Starfield looks mind-blowing, but it looks better than anything in its genre. It also had a nice visual upgrade since it was last shown, so perhaps it will look even better on release. The scope, draw distance, amount of detail and geometry in this game is next gen without a doubt.
 
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Avowed - Disappointed. Visually, it looks awful.

Fable - Disappointed. Visually, it looks awful.

Hellblade 2 - Disappointed. It doesn't look awful. In fact, it looks great. But there's a very noticeable downgrade running on the Series X, and it's just not what I expected visually. It's still my most anticipated game though.

Starfield - This genuinely blew me away. Not the character renders, but the scope of the game, landscape visuals and vistas, lighting, gunplay/combat and environmental/space suit details. Starfield is an absolute showstopper!
 

PeteBull

Member
By that logic, star wars jedi survivor which drops to 15-20 fps regularly on the ps5 while looking last gen is too much for the ps5 to handle?
DF praised JS for looking much better than last gen, and i agree here, back then first part looked much worse and was only running in 1080p30 fps on ps4
The problem JS faces is- it requires so much more oomph for its upgrade in visuals, both consoles and pc.
DF even has 1to1 comparision shots vs console fallen order, imho its big improvement, and ofc imho JS graphics looks 9/10, problem is low resolution/framerate.

Edit thats how JS looks patched on pc with 4090, aka no hardware restrains definitely well above anything from ps4/xbox one imho
 
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Edder1

Member
Fable - Disappointed. Visually, it looks awful.
I thought purely from a graphical fidelity point of view Fable looked as next gen as they come, but I think these visuals aren't that surprising given the fact that it was cutscene cinematics. I would expect some downgrade in gameplay though (as is case with all games when it comes to cutscenes vs gameplay). Where Fable didn't impress me and actually put me off it was the direction they're going in. I have no interest in this Zoomer take on Victorian era with cringe hairstyles, humour and characters.
 
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DF praised JS for looking much better than last gen, and i agree here, back then first part looked much worse and was only running in 1080p30 fps on ps4
The problem JS faces is- it requires so much more oomph for its upgrade in visuals, both consoles and pc.
DF even has 1to1 comparision shots vs console fallen order, imho its big improvement, and ofc imho JS graphics looks 9/10, problem is low resolution/framerate.

Edit thats how JS looks patched on pc with 4090, aka no hardware restrains definitely well above anything from ps4/xbox one imho


Jedi is definitely a looker
 

icerock

Member
Fable looked incredible, I still want to see gameplay before I judge any of these graphical showcases. More often than not they get a downgrade, in many cases a significant one. I don't know what to make of HellBlade II, it's just so dimly lit it's difficult to see. I think it'll be really pretty but farcry from the original reveal back in 2019.

Also, Starfield was a massive disappointment. AI, animations, character models are so outdated. The gun combat looked to be improved from last showing but I'm not convinced. Something isn't clicking.

I have been saying this since it was first revealed and especially when they showed the vistas last year. the lighting is a cut above other games this gen for sure. some of the environmental details and character models can be better but that lighting holy shit.

I thought you'd be shitting all over it so this is a surprise. I thought they overused the pale/brown/shitty dust-storm filter on a lot of planets. Considering the whole premise of exploration of a planet is tied to a star, I thought the outlook of each planet would vary upon the distance from star and it's rotation. But, I didn't see it.

Overall, when it comes to visuals. This gen has been underwhelming. I don't expect to see UE5 demo/Matrix demo graphics until late gen honestly (if even that due to budget constraints) The pipeline has to be completely rebuilt which means overhauling the engine, and I just don't see devs wasting years on it when the old code runs fine on new machine. Ratchet to me is still the best showcase of new gen but that released 2 years ago. We'll have to wait for likes of Naughty Dog and SSM to show their next project to get a glimpse on how big a jump is possible.
 
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SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
Fable looked incredible, I still want to see gameplay before I judge any of these graphical showcases. More often than not they get a downgrade, in many cases a significant one. I don't know what to make of HellBlade II, it's just so dimly lit it's difficult to see. I think it'll be really pretty but farcry from the original reveal back in 2019.

Also, Starfield was a massive disappointment. AI, animations, character models are so outdated. The gun combat looked to be improved from last showing but I'm not convinced. Something isn't clicking.



I thought you'd be shitting all over it so this is a surprise. I thought they overused the pale/brown/shitty dust-storm filter on a lot of planets. Considering the whole premise of exploration of a planet is tied to a star, I thought the outlook of each planet would vary upon the distance from star and it's rotation. But, I didn't see it.

Overall, when it comes to visuals. This gen has been underwhelming. I don't expect to see UE5 demo/Matrix demo graphics until late gen honestly (if even that due to budget constraints) The pipeline has to be completely rebuilt which means overhauling the engine, and I just don't see devs wasting years on it when the old code runs fine on new machine. Ratchet to me is still the best showcase of new gen but that released 2 years ago. We'll have to wait for likes of Naughty Dog and SSM to show their next project to get a glimpse on how big a jump is possible.
nah, ive always been high on it especially since the last showcase which featured several different color palettes. its not the same UE3 dust brown filter on every planet.

All these gifs are from last year.

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IpEyFxe.gif


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Schmendrick

Member
That doesn't really matter since the scope of the game is so massive. If you are expecting visuals like what you get in scripted linear story driven games then you're being very unrealistic. If you can show me any other RPG that is on the scale of Starfield and looks even close to it then I'll gladly take your point. I don't think Starfield looks mind-blowing, but it looks better than anything in its genre. It also had a nice visual upgrade since it was last shown, so perhaps it will look even better on release. The scope, draw distance, amount of detail and geometry in this game is next gen without a doubt.
Absolutely nothing we've seen so far had anything next gen worthy in it. I can look to the horizon and go there, too, in a Horizon game, and it looks better than what we've seen of SF so far. In fact the indoor areas and the characters looked downright bad.
The argument "it's probably bigger so it's natural that it looks worse" doesn't count as we simply don't know the scope of the game outside of "it has planets and most of them are procedurally generated".... And what the heck is that "linear scripted games" argument when we've got the comparison with Horizon......
 
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The sky boxes and landscapes in Starfield are super impressive but it's so inconsistent the character rendering is last gen quality while the outdoor lighting looks incredible the interior lighting looks flat. The ships are super high poly as well as some of the creatures it's just a really weird graphical showcase because some aspects do in fact look next gen while other parts of the game looks woefully last gen. Nevertheless I'm excited to do some exploration!
 
Hellblade 2 trailer SUCKED! People saying downgrade but I can't see it b3cause they didn't show anything.

That was a nothingburger of a trailer that taught us what? To maybe lower our expectations for what to expect? A possible downgrade (it's hard to tell because everything was in shadow) and no gameplay.

This was the trailer that should've showed us what's actually improved combat/traversal wise! Now I'm wondering if there are any improvements at all.

Seriously hope it's not downgraded because we've already had to lower our expectations on this game once.
 

analog_future

Resident Crybaby
  • Fable
  • Hellblade II
  • Forza Motorsport
  • Flight Simulator 2024
  • Starfield

All look phenomenal visually and beyond anything possible on PS4/Xbox One.

Next gen is finally around the corner as far as I'm concerned.
 
That doesn't really matter since the scope of the game is so massive. If you are expecting visuals like what you get in scripted linear story driven games then you're being very unrealistic. If you can show me any other RPG that is on the scale of Starfield and looks even close to it then I'll gladly take your point. I don't think Starfield looks mind-blowing, but it looks better than anything in its genre. It also had a nice visual upgrade since it was last shown, so perhaps it will look even better on release. The scope, draw distance, amount of detail and geometry in this game is next gen without a doubt.
Forbidden West?
 

Edder1

Member
Absolutely nothing we've seen so far had anything next gen worthy in it. I can look to the horizon and go there, too, in a Horizon game, and it looks better than what we've seen of SF so far. In fact the indoor areas and the characters looked downright bad.
The argument "it's probably bigger so it's natural that it looks worse" doesn't count as we simply don't know the scope of the game outside of "it has planets and most of them are procedurally generated".... And what the heck is that "linear scripted games" argument when we've got the comparison with Horizon......
Horizon doesn't have 10% of the scope of Starfield so your comparing the two is just plain wrong. Horizon takes place on one map while Starfield has multiple worlds to explore and much deeper RPG mechanics. Horizon is also way more linear experience.
 
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