Support NeoGAF

[Topher]

What if MS upped the amount to $85 Billion and took out the language that the CMA had to approve it?

Then they would have a never-ending legal battle on their hands with the UK assuming MS tried to close.

 

[mckmas8808]

yes

Wow!!!

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

Wow!!!

And with both Sarah & Lulu: pretty to look at, annoying to listen to.

Less so in Sarah's case. In both cases due to them toting the corporate line, but Lulu also likes posting cringe memes and is obsessed with PlayStation exclusives because TLOU having a good TV show should let MS buy ABK.

 

[Kilau]

The way Google ran Stadia is clear evidence they didn’t understand what market they were in. The testimony is just verbal confirmation they still don’t get it. Fat frogs aside, nobody wants to pay full price for a game that can only be streamed and can vanish at any moment. Download is bad enough but a cloud, streaming only “console” isn’t going to work while other options exist.

Yes they went to a subscription later but the brand was too far gone.

 

[FUBARx89]

Learn to spell Satya properly or @adamsapple might get upset.

Fine, don't even know where I got that botched spelling from

Besides, it's Phils cock down his throat. He doesn't care for Satya.

 

[Sneakysnake]

Maybe ill informed...why do you say prideful though?

Seriously asking, I just know they said no because of da cloud.

Oh I'm saying it's prideful bc they actually think they alone can stop this merger. Everyone else has said yes, but the little ole CMA is gunna stop it just to flex. Mark my words, after MS wins in court this week, they WILL close this deal with or without the tiny and insignificant CMA/UK. The UK just is not a big enough market to matter when it comes to this $70 billion dollar deal.

 

[Dick Jones]

He should come back.

To reality? Yes

To GAF? Not a hope

 

[DarkBatman]

Oh I'm saying it's prideful bc they actually think they alone can stop this merger. Everyone else has said yes, but the little ole CMA is gunna stop it just to flex. Mark my words, after MS wins in court this week, they WILL close this deal with or without the tiny and insignificant CMA/UK. The UK just is not a big enough market to matter when it comes to this $70 billion dollar deal.

All other countries are completely unimportant.
MS and ABK have defined four countries/institutions in their deal contract that must confirm this deal in order for it to go through.
Two of them are currently blocking it.

Also, I thought we were long past that silly "UK is so small and unimportant" thing?
It is the second largest market for MS. How can you call that tiny and insignificant?

 

[DeepEnigma]

All other countries are completely unimportant.
MS and ABK have defined four countries/institutions in their deal contract that must confirm this deal in order for it to go through.
Two of them are currently blocking it.

Also, I thought we were long past that silly "UK is so small and unimportant" thing?
It is the second largest market for MS. How can you call that tiny and insignificant?

6th largest GDP in the world as well,

Countries by GDP Ranking 2024

Economically countries are ranked as per the GDP. This article lists the top countries by GDP in the world by 2024, are United States, China, Germany, Japan, India, United Kingdom, France, Italy.

www.populationu.com

 

[Danwan224]

The most despised industries in the US are also

 

[The Pleasure]

All other countries are completely unimportant.
MS and ABK have defined four countries/institutions in their deal contract that must confirm this deal in order for it to go through.
Two of them are currently blocking it.

Also, I thought we were long past that silly "UK is so small and unimportant" thing?
It is the second largest market for MS. How can you call that tiny and insignificant?

Because AMERICA. FUCK YEAH. COMING AGAIN TO SAVE THE MOTHER FUCKING DAY YEAH! Language isn't something he needs. He only needs to know three letters. USA and maybe CMA bad.

 

[Bernardougf]

Which sony fans were banned because of the cma?

It was sarcasm ... the meltdowns, bans , alt bans and just bsr shit crazy ....until now came only from one side

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

https://www.tweaktown.com/news/9209...sivity-tactics-against-playstation/index.html

Xbox's Phil Spencer says he wouldn't use Sony's own exclusivity tactics against PlayStation

In a recent federal court hearing, Xbox gaming CEO Phil Spencer says that he has no interest in using Sony's own exclusivity practices against PlayStation.

The recent FTC v Microsoft evidentiary hearing has unearthed lots of interesting details about Xbox, PlayStation, and the games industry in general. Based on key info and testimony presented in the case, we've surmised that Sony and Microsoft are very likely to sign a publishing agreement for Call of Duty on a post-merger basis.

Other revelations include Microsoft's view on Sony's exclusivity practices. According to the Xbox CEO, there's two sides to Microsoft's relationship with Sony. There's the cordial, lucrative, and mutually-beneficial side where big Xbox games like Minecraft see the two companies joining together in a strong symbiotic publishing agreement. Then there's the side that gets publicized the most, the one where Sony snaps up third-party exclusivity deals to further detrimentally impact Xbox. This behavior has made Microsoft see Sony as a "hostile and aggressive" competitor.

Interestingly enough, Microsoft's Phil Spencer doesn't plan to use this tactic against Sony, especially on a post-merger basis. If the $68.7 billion Microsoft-Activision merger goes through, Xbox intends to mostly utilize the publisher to expand its presence in the fast-growing mobile market. Activision's asset value exceeds $70 billion, the price that Microsoft is willing to pay, and the FTC is wary that Microsoft will use Activision's asset value as a means of offsetting the negative financial impact of withholding content from rival platforms--an effect that shows signals of anti-competitive practices and as such is justification to block the merger with Activision.

In fact, Microsoft doesn't expect its Xbox console segment to grow as a result of the deal.

During the hearing, Xbox gaming CEO Phil Spencer gave the following testimony about Microsoft using similar exclusivity tactics as Sony does in order to affect the PlayStation business.

Q If you had the financial ability to have a developer skip PlayStation any time you wanted, would you do it?

I would not

Q If you had the ability to to deprecate a game on PlayStation, would you do it?

Not in practice, no, it's not something I would do.

Note that this is almost assuredly in reference to third-party games. Microsoft has indeed made first-party games exclusive to Xbox, even those that had been multi-platform before an acquisition was made and then were made first-party exclusives following a buyout. That being said, existing games that had released on PlayStation had stayed on PlayStation, including Minecraft, The Elder Scrolls Online, and Fallout 76 among a smattering of other ZeniMax titles.

Examples of multi-platform games becoming first-party exclusives on a post-acquisition basis includes MachineGames' new Indiana Jones project, and apparently Starfield. There were rumors that Sony was about to purchase some sort of timed exclusivity for Starfield, perhaps 6-month or 12-month, and keep Bethesda's biggest new RPG off of Xbox.

The specter of Sony purchasing Starfield exclusivity for PlayStation was one of the main impetuses, or reasons, why Microsoft purchased ZeniMax for $7.5 billion. These games were both made exclusive to Xbox consoles and PC once they become first-party titles.

Elsewhere in the testimony, Spencer also confirms that Microsoft has to pay a lot more to secure any kind of third-party exclusivity deals, timed or otherwise.

Q You can't afford to make those kinds of upfront payments to make those exclusive deals, right?

Yes, it is more expensive for us to pay somebody to not ship on PlayStation than for Sony to not ship on Xbox.

This is because Xbox is in third place. Sony uses its market-leading position to negotiate lucrative and mutually-beneficial deals with third-party publishers, the same kind of deals that it negotiated with ZeniMax for titles like Ghostwire Tokyo and Deathloop.

These are realities of the video games industry and it behooves both platform-holders and developers to make and accept these deals; platform-holders secure content to hopefully maintain, or grow, their ecosystem, and developers receive critical boosts like upfront payments, marketing budgets, and perhaps the most important benefit of significantly reducing the time it takes to ship a product onto the market.

In Day 1 of the evidentiary hearing proceedings, ZeniMax head of publishing Pete Hines outlined some of the major benefits of signing exclusivity deals.

"You go to fewer platforms, your development gets more streamlined. It just needs to run as well as possible on one box, on PC--you know, a narrow focus always helps," Hines said.

Hines also commented on why Indiana Jones was previously a multi-platform game.

"The primary one in my view is what I said about reducing risk and trying to get to a degree of certainty. You're dealing with a licensor who's going to have a ton of feedback on what you're making, add a lot of time to your schedule, you're required to provide a release window. You immediately have a clock that's ticking.

"Before acquisition, we were a small independent publisher. We are not somebody who can afford misses or failures. Being independent and fighting publishers that are multiple times larger than you, we can't afford to miss. We have to stack the deck in our favor."

Tweaktown article from Derek; posted it in a quote in case some of you don't want to give them a click and boost their traffic (I would've rather not myself, but already had the link open so might as well have looked through it).

 

[DeepEnigma]

https://www.tweaktown.com/news/9209...sivity-tactics-against-playstation/index.html



Tweaktown article from Derek; posted it in a quote in case some of you don't want to give them a click and boost their traffic (I would've rather not myself, but already had the link open so might as well have looked through it).

But they already have been though. Even said they want to yank Minecraft, but can't get around it.

 

[Banjo64]

 

[Varteras]

What if MS upped the amount to $85 Billion and took out the language that the CMA had to approve it?

Yeah. As DeepEnigma said, changing the language to remove the CMA wouldn't matter because the deal is still technically illegal to UK authorities. The renegotiation would be to extend the deadline so that the appeal process with the CAT can proceed. However, as a successful appeal doesn't mean the decision changes, the new deal would have to take into account the often long process of arguing with the CMA. It ultimately took two years from the time the CMA told Meta to divest Giphy to the point where the CMA said no again and Meta conceded.

It could be shorter than that, but both MS and ABK would have to consider that they have no idea how long it would take, and that two years could very well be the case. There is far from any guarantee the CAT would even agree to the appeal in the first place. The new deal would almost certainly be far pricier than the current one, with a higher likelihood of failure than success. Keep in mind that MS and ABK did not believe the deal would be blocked for pretty much the entire time. There was probably little consideration given to that possibility. Quite possibly reflected in the timelines the deal afforded them.

https://www.tweaktown.com/news/9209...sivity-tactics-against-playstation/index.html



Tweaktown article from Derek; posted it in a quote in case some of you don't want to give them a click and boost their traffic (I would've rather not myself, but already had the link open so might as well have looked through it).

"Microsoft won't do what they've been doing the whole time until they found themselves paying more to do it, because of their own fuckups, so they decided to do something even costlier and permanent by just buying the big companies".

 

[mckmas8808]

Yeah. As DeepEnigma said, changing the language to remove the CMA wouldn't matter because the deal is still technically illegal to UK authorities. The renegotiation would be to extend the deadline so that the appeal process with the CAT can proceed. However, as a successful appeal doesn't mean the decision changes, the new deal would have to take into account the often long process of arguing with the CMA. It ultimately took two years from the time the CMA told Meta to divest Giphy to the point where the CMA said no again and Meta conceded.

It could be shorter than that, but both MS and ABK would have to consider that they have no idea how long it would take, and that two years could very well be the case. There is far from any guarantee the CAT would even agree to the appeal in the first place. The new deal would almost certainly be far pricier than the current one, with a higher likelihood of failure than success. Keep in mind that MS and ABK did not believe the deal would be blocked for pretty much the entire time. There was probably little consideration given to that possibility. Quite possibly reflected in the timelines the deal afforded them.

sometimes I wish I could take quotes like yours and others on Neogaf and make the video game's media read them and then answer them. 90% of the video game's media are still saying that it's a done deal and MS will acquire ABK (with or without the CMA).

 

[Topher]

https://www.tweaktown.com/news/9209...sivity-tactics-against-playstation/index.html



Tweaktown article from Derek; posted it in a quote in case some of you don't want to give them a click and boost their traffic (I would've rather not myself, but already had the link open so might as well have looked through it).

These two Q&As go hand in hand....


Q If you had the financial ability to have a developer skip PlayStation any time you wanted, would you do it?

I would not

Q You can't afford to make those kinds of upfront payments to make those exclusive deals, right?

Yes, it is more expensive for us to pay somebody to not ship on PlayStation than for Sony to not ship on Xbox.

 

[Thick Thighs Save Lives]

Oh I'm saying it's prideful bc they actually think they alone can stop this merger. Everyone else has said yes, but the little ole CMA is gunna stop it just to flex. Mark my words, after MS wins in court this week, they WILL close this deal with or without the tiny and insignificant CMA/UK. The UK just is not a big enough market to matter when it comes to this $70 billion dollar deal.

I believe there's 5 markets where they absolutely need to close in order for the acquisition to go through. These are US, EU, UK, Japan and China. Someone correct me if I'm wrong on this.

 

[Topher]

I believe there's 5 markets where they absolutely need to close in order for the acquisition to go through. These are US, EU, UK, Japan and China. Someone correct me if I'm wrong on this.

Not Japan, but the others, yes.

 

[bitbydeath]

The Google witness claimed that Stadia viewed Xbox/PlayStation consoles as competition. This in theory means that cloud should not be separated as its own market (the very thing the CMA is arguing)

Different technologies though. It’s like trains and planes. They compete but they’re still different markets.

 

[BattleScar]

https://www.tweaktown.com/news/9209...sivity-tactics-against-playstation/index.html



Tweaktown article from Derek; posted it in a quote in case some of you don't want to give them a click and boost their traffic (I would've rather not myself, but already had the link open so might as well have looked through it).

Too expensive for them to make deals. Not too expensive for them to spunk $77 billion.

 

[Varteras]

sometimes I wish I could take quotes like yours and others on Neogaf and make the video game's media read them and then answer them. 90% of the video game's media are still saying that it's a done deal and MS will acquire ABK (with or without the CMA).

Lol I appreciate what I assume was a compliment. Honestly, though, video game journalism has been an incredibly low bar for quite some time now. Objectivity is increasingly rare to find. Sticking to the actual facts seems to be an impossibility. Everyone wants to inject their own speculation and pass it off as fact. Either because they don't like what the reality is or because they don't like knowing that they don't actually know. It's a pathetic attempt at validation. There is very little legitimate journalism going on these days. Most who wear the title didn't actually do anything to earn it. They're little more than glorified bloggers who managed to land a job in a largely useless part of the industry that is predominantly found among the worst echo chambers of regions of whatever country they're from.

 

[Mozza]

Too expensive for them to make deals. Not too expensive for them to spunk $77 billion.

It's not about the money, this was always more of a statement by Microsoft, more than anything else.

 

[Varteras]

It's not about the money, this was always more of a statement by Microsoft, more than anything else.

"We fucked up too much, for too long, and we refuse to take the long way back. So we're buying the industry".

 

[Mozza]

"We fucked up too much, for too long, and we refuse to take the long way back. So we're buying the industry".

It was always a case if when, rather than if.

Although they did pretty well with the 360, compared to where they were in the previous generation.

 

[Varteras]

It was always a case if when, rather than if.

Although they did pretty well with the 360, compared to where they were in the previous generation.

Microsoft was fantastic and on point with the 360. Right up until they decided to focus on niche fads and less on core gaming with Kinect. They've mostly just made one poor decision after another since then.

 

[Mozza]

Microsoft was fantastic and on point with the 360. Right up until they decided to focus on niche fads and less on core gaming with Kinect. They've mostly just made one poor decision after another since then.

You have to blame Nintendo a little for that, the Wii made it look far too easy.

 

[Topher]

Microsoft was fantastic and on point with the 360. Right up until they decided to focus on niche fads and less on core gaming with Kinect. They've mostly just made one poor decision after another since then.

Yep. They caught up to PlayStation with their second console and then fucked it all up.

 

[PharaoTutAnchAmun]

Lol I appreciate what I assume was a compliment. Honestly, though, video game journalism has been an incredibly low bar for quite some time now. Objectivity is increasingly rare to find. Sticking to the actual facts seems to be an impossibility. Everyone wants to inject their own speculation and pass it off as fact. Either because they don't like what the reality is or because they don't like knowing that they don't actually know. It's a pathetic attempt at validation. There is very little legitimate journalism going on these days. Most who wear the title didn't actually do anything to earn it. They're little more than glorified bloggers who managed to land a job in a largely useless part of the industry that is predominantly found among the worst echo chambers of regions of whatever country they're from.

the "gamingjournalist" thrive on the consolewars, they took a side it and run with it. Thats biased reporting, a journalist must searching for the truth and reporting with facts, not pick on side and stick with it no matter what.... Eventualy it will bite them in the ass...

 

[PaintTinJr]

These two Q&As go hand in hand....


Q If you had the financial ability to have a developer skip PlayStation any time you wanted, would you do it?

I would not

Q You can't afford to make those kinds of upfront payments to make those exclusive deals, right?

Yes, it is more expensive for us to pay somebody to not ship on PlayStation than for Sony to not ship on Xbox.

Great work framing the contradiction.

You can also add in the 3rd place quote, because those two questions and answers also show that to be BS, when you ask how much would Nintendo have needed to pay to get Starfield exclusive on Switch? And how many 3rd party high-end AAA games can they ever make exclusive to Switch, taking them away from PS5 and Series?

No amount of money can buy the exclusive, to achieve folding a new 3rd party IP needing a 4-12TF hardware into a 300GFlop handheld console, and make it successful on the strategy by which the high-end AAA gaming market sells games on graphics.

 

[Gameplay Gods Bless]

Oh I'm saying it's prideful bc they actually think they alone can stop this merger. Everyone else has said yes, but the little ole CMA is gunna stop it just to flex. Mark my words, after MS wins in court this week, they WILL close this deal with or without the tiny and insignificant CMA/UK. The UK just is not a big enough market to matter when it comes to this $70 billion dollar deal.

They might not close yet but getting the FTC to file the PI accelerated the trial to the point where this will be settled this week. If MS wins then they now have US, Chinese and EU approval to close. That's 3 of the big 4 regulators, no other country has tried to stop MS from closing which means the whole world has found the CMA conclusions wrong. This will provide ammo for the CAT appeal, closing could affect the CAT appeal in a negative way.


But if MS finds getting a favorable extension deal from ABK challenging then they may just close over the CMA as that will be the only reasonable choice left. It'll come at a cost in the UK in terms of fees and even relocating ABK but such a move could be less costly than bad extension terms or abandoning the deal. That and the CMA isn't the UK parliament has not looked at the CMA fondly this year so the political ability for the CMA to slam its hammer may be stunted.

 

[Gameplay Gods Bless]

All other countries are completely unimportant.
MS and ABK have defined four countries/institutions in their deal contract that must confirm this deal in order for it to go through.
Two of them are currently blocking it.

Also, I thought we were long past that silly "UK is so small and unimportant" thing?
It is the second largest market for MS. How can you call that tiny and insignificant?

The contract is between MS and ABK, no one else. This contract can be amended at any moment.

 

[Slicker than your average]

https://www.tweaktown.com/news/9209...sivity-tactics-against-playstation/index.html



Tweaktown article from Derek; posted it in a quote in case some of you don't want to give them a click and boost their traffic (I would've rather not myself, but already had the link open so might as well have looked through it).

The man never stops contradicting himself.
Lie dispenser indeed.

The best part is how the defence force always ignore it. Looking forward to the this is normal, Sony made ms do this etc.

 

[The Pleasure]

Yep. They caught up to PlayStation with their second console and then fucked it all up.

Yup. Launching over a year earlier, cheaper hardware, easier to develop for and the ability to be an asshole online was a glorious moment in time for xbox.

 

[reksveks]

files.cand.uscourts.gov - /files/23-cv-02880_FTC_v_Microsoft/

ChorizoPicozo the source of the files.

PX1065 - Bunch of stuff around priorities and how sega would operate (2020)
PX1114 - Some transcript
PX1145 - Email about Xbox console volumes and holiday comparisons (2020)
PX1142 - Booty talking moat re GP (2019)
PX1754 - Hines asking why ABK was treated differently (2022)
PX1850 - Some Zenimax and Xbox meeting (2021)
PX1851 - MS talking about the announce of Zenimax being largely about Xbox (2021)
PX1852 - Some Zenimax and Xbox meeting (2021)
PX1859 - SLT update in 2022
PX1897 - F76 on PSNow convo (2021)
PX1898 - Dungeons on Xbox/PC (2019)
PX4351 - Bethesda on GFN/Boosteriod (2021)
PX4352 - BOOTY EMAIL (2019)
PX4391 - Relic and Platforms (2021)
PX4406 - Hines asking why ABK was treated differently (2022)
PX4408 - Hines asking why ABK was treated differently over Skype/Teams (2022)
PX9186 - Transcript of the Pete and Tamoor interview
PX1093 - No strategy on Mobile, talk about the purpose of Xcloud also there was talkig about turning Gold = XGP (2019)
PX1125 - Growing XGP beyond Console and on Mobile (2020)
PX1141 - Slides on the Gaming M&A in April 2021 - got the final watchlist
PX1147 - COD growth vs MS growth and mobile (2022)
RX5044 - MS website on GP
RX5045 - MS games on PS
RX5046 - US Weekly sales numbers (2021)

Quick summary.

 

[Gameplay Gods Bless]

MoffettNathanson Raises Activision Blizzard's PT to $91 From $86, Says FTC Might Struggle to Get Injunction to Block Microsoft from Closing Deal; Keeps Outperform Rating


https://www.marketscreener.com/quot...-Says-FTC-Might-Struggle-to-Get-Inj-44186768/

Things are looking up for the closing of the acquisition, a lot of positive analysis and press since the FTC trial started.

 

[Topher]

MoffettNathanson Raises Activision Blizzard's PT to $91 From $86, Says FTC Might Struggle to Get Injunction to Block Microsoft from Closing Deal; Keeps Outperform Rating


https://www.marketscreener.com/quot...-Says-FTC-Might-Struggle-to-Get-Inj-44186768/

Things are looking up for the closing of the acquisition, a lot of positive analysis and press since the FTC trial started.

Looking up for not getting the PI, but that's about it. And looks to me like ABK shareholders may want to renegotiate that sale price.

 

[GHG]

files.cand.uscourts.gov - /files/23-cv-02880_FTC_v_Microsoft/

ChorizoPicozo the source of the files.

Trouble in paradise.

 

[zapper]

is this new? Did the ftc ask about booty ? I do not remember

 

[mckmas8808]

These two Q&As go hand in hand....


Q If you had the financial ability to have a developer skip PlayStation any time you wanted, would you do it?

I would not

Q You can't afford to make those kinds of upfront payments to make those exclusive deals, right?

Yes, it is more expensive for us to pay somebody to not ship on PlayStation than for Sony to not ship on Xbox.

This is such a BS way of looking at getting 3rd or 2nd party exclusives. It's basically a lie, but not a total lie. Does the exclusive mean the other team doesn't get the game day one or at all? Yes. But that's not the only reason why a deal like that is done.

But Phil knows this, because they've done it before. They ARE DOING IT RIGHT NOW WITH STALKER 2!!!

 

[Unknown Soldier]

Plenty of entertainment today even with the trial in recess today lol

 

[Thick Thighs Save Lives]

What I'm getting from one of these email chains is that apparently Phil doesn't know how to read and understand a quarterly financial report lol.

https://files.cand.uscourts.gov/files/23-cv-02880_FTC_v_Microsoft/RX1147.pdf

 

[zapper]

What I'm getting from one of these email chains is that apparently Phil doesn't know how to read and understand a quarterly financial report lol.

https://files.cand.uscourts.gov/files/23-cv-02880_FTC_v_Microsoft/RX1147.pdf

lol does activision make the the majority of revenues on consoles and not on mobile as spencer testified?

 

[GHG]

What I'm getting from one of these email chains is that apparently Phil doesn't know how to read and understand a quarterly financial report lol.

https://files.cand.uscourts.gov/files/23-cv-02880_FTC_v_Microsoft/RX1147.pdf

Sarah Bond has her pronouns in her email name.

 

[zapper]

Microsoft sacrificed Xbox Series X sales for “long term ambition” in the cloud

Microsoft has used custom Xbox Series X hardware for its cloud.

www.theverge.com

spencer preferred to focus on the cloud (which microsoft now declare as failing and continually try to downplay). why was the ftc so light on him and booty? good material for the cma but i don't understand why the ftc didn't press last week

 

[GHG]

Microsoft sacrificed Xbox Series X sales for “long term ambition” in the cloud

Microsoft has used custom Xbox Series X hardware for its cloud.

www.theverge.com

spencer preferred to focus on the cloud (which microsoft now declare as failing and continually try to downplay). why was the ftc so light on him and booty? good material for the cma but i don't understand why the ftc didn't press last week

They will most likely be covering the cloud side of things this week.

 

[Astray]

One of the funniest things to me is watching these internal emails out that barely mention Nintendo at all.

 

[Varteras]

One of the funniest things to me is watching these internal emails out that barely mention Nintendo at all.

Nintendo watching all this, being used or dropped when convenient:

 

[tmlDan]

One of the funniest things to me is watching these internal emails out that barely mention Nintendo at all.

they openly admitted to selectively using Nintendo in certain situations to create biased data for the public.

They only consider nintendo when they have to, aka console sales totals - not revenue (which is most important)

"we're in third place" - Phil