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Just how did 11 babies contract herpes through circumcision?

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M

Mr_Zombie

Member
Mrs. Manky said:
Do they know if all the boys had the same mohel? That would hopefully narrow down the suspects. And the ultra Orthodox community isn't so large that people wouldn't know who was done by whom, right?
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From the article:
In two of those cases (involving the same mohel who circumcised two brothers three years apart), parents declined to reveal the identify of the practitioner, so it’s not clear whether he was the same mohel involved in any of the other cases.
Click to expand...

Stupid parents are stupid.

I'm not gonna judge anybody about their religion and traditions (although allowing some old guy to suck your kids' cock is really disturbing). But when you know that the mohel who circumcised your kid might have a STD and thus is capable of transmitting it to other kids and you still protect the fucker for some reason... I have no words then.
 
GraveRobberX

GraveRobberX

Platinum Trophy: Learned to Shit While Upright Again.
You would think someone must have gone wait he sucks the blood?, isn't that hazardous all by in itself

Never mind doing it on a baby penis, first I'm concerned about the health issues

How many more must have gone unclaimed or hidden away =/
 
S

SystemShock2

Member
First of all, that's really sad, and second of all people need to realize that having tradition for tradition's sake is absolutely pointless in so many cases.

also, I was half expecting a punchline in the message body.
 
S

Stinkles

Clothed, sober, cooperative
Hix said:
It's not a part of halacha (Jewish law) but is what we call a minhag (custom/tradition). It's practiced in some parts of the hareidi tzibur (ultra-orthodox community) but most either don't at all or drain the blood with a sterile tube or similar.

It's fairly uncommon, hence why you've got 11 babies over the course of 11 years, accounting for less than 0.001% of Jewish males born in NYC over the period.
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11 reported. Some of those parents refused to identify the mohel. No need to sweep this under the rug. This shit needs daylight. Making excuses for barbarism is enabling it.
 
A

Arcteryx

Member
Oh man. Please keep it up Religion. Never change.

2_apae88atdi8.gif
 
Neko Mimi Mode

Neko Mimi Mode

Member
Stinkles said:
11 reported. Some of those parents refused to identify the mohel. No need to sweep this under the rug. This shit needs daylight. Making excuses for barbarism is enabling it.
Click to expand...

I don't disagree, was pointing out that the practice is extremely uncommon even within the ultra-orthodox world, not that it's somehow not a health risk.

And yes, it really needs to stop.
 
GraveRobberX

GraveRobberX

Platinum Trophy: Learned to Shit While Upright Again.
Maleficence said:
That's not even a remotely Islamic custom.
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Go ask those so called clerics in west rural Pakistan and most of Afghanistan, this isn't some west bumblefuck area where this is practiced

Some even do mental gymnastics and say the Koran never said we couldn't do this, only against "Men", not boys

As much it may not be super prevalent, it's there, and Islam is used to blanket cover the problem
 
O

Orayn

Member
jdogmoney said:
Can't wait to hear from the "oh look GAF hivemind is bashing religion for no reason" crowd on this one.
Click to expand...

If it happens, it's gonna be a good one. We've got a potential religious debate front-loaded into a potential circumcision debate!
 
Neko Mimi Mode

Neko Mimi Mode

Member
jdogmoney said:
Can't wait to hear from the "oh look GAF hivemind is bashing religion for no reason" crowd on this one.
Click to expand...

To be fair (and I know some people have already bashed religion as a whole on this one) this actually has little to do with religion at all and is a tradition. It's not even a religious tradition, it carries no religious connotations at all. It's just something a small group of people, who happen to be religious, are doing cause their parents did.
 
J

johnsmith

remember me
This is the community that won't talk to the police about child molesters in their community, so it's not surprising they wouldn't say who was the guy that gave these babies herpes. These people are fucked up.
 
M

Maleficence

Member
GraveRobberX said:
Go ask those so called clerics in west rural Pakistan and most of Afghanistan, this isn't some west bumblefuck area where this is practiced

Some even do mental gymnastics and say the Koran never said we couldn't do this, only against "Men", not boys

As much it may not be super prevalent, it's there, and Islam is used to blanket cover the problem
Click to expand...

It's still not an Islamic custom. It may be justified as ok to do using religious doctrine, and may be practised by those of a particular religion but it's more entwined with local culture than it is with religion.

Just because the Qu'ran doesn't ban it specifically doesn't mean the practice is Islamic. That's very tangential thinking.
 
R

replicashooter

Banned
Can any Orthodox Hebraic members elucidate us further on the origin (and perpetuation) of this custom? It just seems quite disturbing to someone viewing from the outside without the background info to back it up.
 
M

Mudkips

Banned
LQX said:
I really have to wonder at the sick fuck that came up with that practice of sucking away the blood from a child's penis. Like what was the thought process of that, even hundreds of years ago. Mind boggling.
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I really have to wonder at the sick fuck that came up with that practice of cutting the foreskin off a child's penis. Like what was the thought process of that, even thousands of years ago. Mind boggling.
 
Lamel

Lamel

Banned
I have never heard of this. I always assumed a DOCTOR did circumcision under sterile conditions. So gross and wrong.
 
Neko Mimi Mode

Neko Mimi Mode

Member
replicashooter said:
Can any Orthodox Hebraic members elucidate us further on the origin (and perpetuation) of this custom? It just seems quite disturbing to someone viewing from the outside without the background info to back it up.
Click to expand...

It's a bastardization of a tradition from the Talmud tractate Shabbat (codified about 1600 years ago) which mentions the method of "mezizah". This process involved squeezing a small amount of blood from the wound of the circumcision for health reasons. It was believed by the Rabbis at the time to help fight infection. Traditionally this was done via a wet sponge, or damp cloth.

Some time hundreds of years later, a small group of ashkenazi Jews in Europe evolved this into the tradition of mezizah b'peh (oral mezizah). This was greatly frowned on even in the early 1800s as it became clear that it presented a health risk which was against the intentions of the practice of mezizah in the first place.

It should be noted that Jewish law places high value on the sanctity of life and if circumcision in any way endangers the infant, then it is forbidden to have them circumcised at all. Mezizah b'peh not only presents a clear health risk, it is outright disgusting. I will stress it is incredibly marginalized and as a hareidi (ultra-orthodox) Jew I have never seen, nor even heard, of the practice outside the internet.
 
R

RiverBed

Banned
over %70 have herpes?! WTF?! It isn't the 70's anymore. Seriously; WTF?!
I'm not sharing a joint with ANYONE anymore.
 
O

Orayn

Member
RiverBed said:
over %70 have herpes?! WTF?! It isn't the 70's anymore. Seriously; WTF?!
I'm not sharing a joint with ANYONE anymore.
Click to expand...

Well, a lot of people have oral herpes without experiencing any symptoms, or get cold sores for a short time then have it go completely dormant.
 
B

Bombadil

Banned
How can you stand by and watch an old man suck on your baby's penis right in front of you and then defend this man when you're told he's given several kids herpes and has killed them?
 
R

replicashooter

Banned
Hix said:
It's a bastardization of a tradition from the Talmud tractate Shabbat (codified about 1600 years ago) which mentions the method of "mezizah". This process involved squeezing a small amount of blood from the wound of the circumcision for health reasons. It was believed by the Rabbis at the time to help fight infection. Traditionally this was done via a wet sponge, or damp cloth.

Some time hundreds of years later, a small group of ashkenazi Jews in Europe evolved this into the tradition of mezizah b'peh (oral mezizah). This was greatly frowned on even in the early 1800s as it became clear that it presented a health risk which was against the intentions of the practice of mezizah in the first place.

It should be noted that Jewish law places high value on the sanctity of life and if circumcision in any way endangers the infant, then it is forbidden to have them circumcised at all. Mezizah b'peh not only presents a clear health risk, it is outright disgusting. I will stress it is incredibly marginalized and as a hareidi (ultra-orthodox) Jew I have never seen, nor even heard, of the practice outside the internet.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the clarification, I had a feeling it was something that was tacked on and not part of the core teachings.
 
M

Mr_Zombie

Member
Hix said:
Some time hundreds of years later, a small group of ashkenazi Jews in Europe evolved this into the tradition of mezizah b'peh (oral mezizah). This was greatly frowned on even in the early 1800s as it became clear that it presented a health risk which was against the intentions of the practice of mezizah in the first place.
Click to expand...

Was it ever explained why they choose to do this orally instead of using wet cloth/sponge like before?
 
R

RiverBed

Banned
Bombadil said:
How can you stand by and watch an old man suck on your baby's penis right in front of you and then defend this man when you're told he's given several kids herpes and has killed them?
Click to expand...

Religion is a fucked-up nightmare. The police should interrogate the stupid parents. You basically have a serial killer/ disease infecting weirdo loose in public.
 
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