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Wii U Community Thread

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EatChildren

Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
Realistic physical motion and interaction in a game environment is not a case of 'laziness'. It requires processing power, and when highly detailed a lot of processing power. The reason we haven't seen many games use realistic physics and interactive detail is because it is an expensive thing to simulate, and still arguably 'new' technology.

And this is, once again, another element of interactive world building that takes great advantage of complex processing and powerful hardware.
 

D-e-f-

Banned
Haha, we'll have to agree to disagree then. The whole thing looked like a casual-core gamer's yawn fest.

you have seen the tiny section of the demo that featured shooting and missed the other parts completely, I guess?!

Go watch WATCH DOGS and understand why i am getting this game.

Finally a game where the clothes are moving in a realistic way. tree's moving in a realistic way and allot more happening. people focus too much on how it looks. but for me these things matter more. Makes the game more alive. these things have been neglected for years. it's not that it can't be done on this gen, it's just because devs are lazy and focus too much on graphics, cause that's the only thing people talk about. The same is happening here.

how about dev add these things first then we talk about "how good things should look on Next-gen."

there is still allot to be done on this gen!

and yes Next-gen will be awesome. it's what devs make of it.

you know that's nonsense. you know full well they don't sit there and say "ah, noo I'm too lazy to do that" ... it's a matter of how much time until you have to put the game out and some things take priority. in some cases it takes resources away from doing more important things.

a game not having something doesn't mean the devs were lazy. that's just ... no.
 

D-e-f-

Banned
Just the E3 presentation. If that was their showcase for the game, it was enough to send me to sleep and lose all interest.

so the action part shown during the MS conference? the one that highlighted the action bits for the MS audience? there is so much more to that game.
 

Pineconn

Member
Just the E3 presentation. If that was their showcase for the game, it was enough to send me to sleep and lose all interest.

This really is a poor argument. Hopefully people didn't watch just the E3 presentation of Skyward Sword and think that the controls were hopelessly broken.

(In before the controls are still hopelessly broken. They're not.)
 

EatChildren

Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
Tomb Raider, for me, is all talk no show at this point. Everything they've shown has been heavily inspired by Uncharted, but they keep arguing the game is something else. I hope it is, but they should get around to showing it, like they did in face of the Hitman criticisms.
 
Tomb Raider, for me, is all talk no show at this point. Everything they've shown has been heavily inspired by Uncharted, but they keep arguing the game is something else. I hope it is, but they should get around to showing it, like they did in face of the Hitman criticisms.

We agree on something. This is a new feeling for me. I'm not sure I like it.
 
I would not mind seeing ZombieU slip into next year if it means a better game no need to rush it out but serious the game seems to be WiiU's flagship exclusive

if only P-100 was getting as much facetime
 

Ryoku

Member
On the subject of Global illumination, Crytek was able to do this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B-_pnqXLIg4

In DX9 and with a GTX 280. Do you think they could pull it off on the WiiU? I mean, they are working with Nintendo.

DX11 global illumination technique is much better (though, to the untrained eye, it can be hard to spot the differences). Nintendo Land seems to have a really nice lighting technique going on, as does the Zelda tech demo on underclocked alpha devkits from E3 2011.

On the subject of the next thread being moved to Gaming, let's have everyone chime in on it. Who wants the next thread to be in Community, and who wants it to be in Gaming?

I prefer that the next thread stay in Community. The Wii U lauch OT could be made in Gaming, with the community counterpart being locked at that point in time.
 
I would not mind seeing ZombieU slip into next year if it means a better game no need to rush it out but serious the game seems to be WiiU's flagship exclusive

if only P-100 was getting as much facetime

That would derail some of Wii U's launch. There's several ppl planning on picking up the Wii U based on playing Zombi U this year


They likely meant "this holiday season" instead. I can swear the main ZombiU PR chick with Ubisoft has been pretty adamant about it being a launch game.

Thought both ZombiU and NSMBU were going to be available on launch day? Pikmin 3 is launch window...
 
Lol. What was wrong with Tomb Raider, you referring to the graphical/code side of things?

The E3 demo looked great visually, but like a totally boring Gears/Uncharted clone duebro fest

The graphics itself were fine, even if not very impressive, my problem with TR were manyfold. In fact it was the worst game I've seen/played this Gamescom. I'm just Quoting my Impressions that I've been writing for my personal Site.

Tomb Raider

The new Tomb Raider game is the latest “re-imagined” attempt at reviving this once prestigious series. After years of complete irrelevance, this game wants to tell the origin story of a more realistic Lara Croft, with a more mature tone and themes... at least that's what the PR line is.
The reality is that the new Tomb Raider game is an uninspired mess of current gaming tropes, and one of the most damning examples of the lack of sophisticated and mature story telling in games.
Lara Croft is now a 21 year old female Nathan Drake who survives crazy situation that are so over the top that the claimed realistic approach to her character gets thrown out of the window pretty fast. Outside of surviving scripted events that beat her up in ways no human being would be able to withstand, her new advertised survival gameplay is nothing more than a thinly veiled health pack distribution.
The game comes off as highly pretentious. It wants to be seen as mature, by having Lara almost raped in one scene, but completely betrays this aspect by having her stand up like Duke Nukem after having killed her rapist, posing for the camera. All it needed was some Jets flying overhead and some Rock music to finish the scene. Furthermore the game wants to depict Lara as someone who isn't a Killer by her own choice, but is rather forced to kill to survive. A nice aspiration, but when your main gameplay consists of killing enemies in the hundreds with brutal finishing moves and absolutely no emotional impact on Lara as a character, then why not just drop the pretense?
The gratuitous shots of her cleavage and wet bottom aren't helping the developers claims about a more mature approach to her character either.
After the painful presentation that made me question the presenters mental health more than once, the demo stations really revealed that this new game is nothing more than a desperate attempt at getting this dead series back into the headlines by pandering to modern gaming tropes and a shallow main character with a tendency to show her breasts for the camera.
 

test_account

XP-39C²
In order for the next generation to have to same huge leap that we had this gen, you're talking about 7950 GPU's WITH CPU's that won't bottleneck that, meaning CPU's with pretty high clock speeds. Even without the Cell and Blu-Ray costs, you'd still be looking at a very expensive machine.

Now sure they could sell it at a lost, but that's the thing, Sony really can't afford to do that right now. I'd LOVE if the 720 and PS4 were ultra powerful, but for Sony's sake, I hope they don't make the foolish mistake of going high-end cause it's really not in the cards for them right now.

And by next gen will be like last gen, I was saying that the consoles will have noticeable differences in power but all 3 will still easily share multiplats.
I still think that a big leap at around $400 is possible. It is also the question if they can afford to make it "underpowered". If the Xbox 720 is much more powerful, and cost about the same, that could be a threat to the net income. But we'll see what happens. I also hope for Sony's sake that they wont take i.e a $200 loss on each PS4, i agree to that.
 

D-e-f-

Banned
The graphics itself were fine, even if not very impressive, my problem with TR were manyfold. In fact it was the worst game I've seen/played this Gamescom. I'm just Quoting my Impressions that I've been writing for my personal Site.

most of that sounds like you're writing a review of the full game based on a pre-release demo, though.
 
most of that sounds like you're writing a review of the full game based on a pre-release demo, though.

No I'm keeping to what they've shown. They explicitly showed two stages (first "survival" then action) but honestly even during the survival segment it looked like one of the poorest game designs I've seen in years. The deers running around completely ignore the rabbid wolves that also roam the same area. They are little more than reskinned health packs.

The camera allways makes sure that you can look into Laras cleavage, serious injuries (getting caught in a bear trap for example) have no impact whatsoever on the gameplay.

Then I didn't even get to the fact that you get XP for walking. And I'm not joking here, you get XP for literally walking across the stage. Finished an overly dramatic choreography that consists of about 1 button press and holding the left stick to the right, here, have 100xp, challenge complete.

The best/scariest part of the game was though: After Lara stood up all macho like after crying for 3 seconds while her assailant lied on the ground choking on his own blood with a blown up forehead, the presenter came on stage and I'm quoting (obviously translated from german) here:

"it didn't look good for Lara there for a moment, but in the end she managed to blow this guys brains out. Thats how we know and love our Lara, right?"

The look on most peoples faces at that point was a mix of disbelieve, embarassment and outright anger (especially from a good friend of mine. she was so pissed off by this)

Anyway enough off topic.

Back to Batman WiiU. The demo literally was the worst blunder I've played on the WiiU and it reeked lazy rushed portjob from the title screen on.

The graphics were just downright pathethic. The time it took from the demo starting and the final layer of textures and effects to load in was between 20 to 40 seconds. It looked absolutely ghastly. The controls worked fine when it came to movement, but the second you used the Gamepad everything was off. They basically took the sensitivity of the analog stick input (which sucks ass) and used it for the gyro controls. So you have huuuge dead zones that usually would cope for the craptastic accuracy of the analog stick aiming, but with the gyro it really throws you off because the initial movement is completely ignored and then the acceleration kicks in way too fast.
Steering that Batarang through the gate, with inverted aiming (turning the gamepad left made the Batarang fly right) was horrible.
It's game breaking for me to be honest.

I hope the final game isn't anywhere near as bad as the turd they decided to show off.
 

MDX

Member
The graphics itself were fine, even if not very impressive, my problem with TR were manyfold. In fact it was the worst game I've seen/played this Gamescom. I'm just Quoting my Impressions that I've been writing for my personal Site.


Ouch. Yeah this has been the problem with movies ever since Star Wars.
Infantilizing films for 15 year olds. Looks like the game industry is following suit pretty quick.
 

Stewox

Banned
In DX9 and with a GTX 280. Do you think they will pull it off on the WiiU? I mean they are working with Nintendo.

Pushing the hardware to it's limits has nothing to do with nintendo and how they work as a company.

Nintendo provides API updates and other SDK stuff to make interaction with hardware easier, faster to work with and other things, API alone cannot make games any better so developers bypass the API and write their own code in many cases, they combine stuff.

Nintendo keeps fixing bugs and improving devkits, there may be furture devkits post release which are only to improve development and unlock other unfinished parts of the feature set.

What the hardware supports at shipping, that's the features that can be used in games.

Ofcourse there are some things which the vendor locks down, the 2 DRC 30FPS limit is most certainly hardcoded.

Unless stuff is hard locked then developers can use that and write necessary code to make it work regardless of API support, deeper level programming is possible that's why consoles exist, performance would be unacceptable if consoles wound't have this advantage over windows PC.

With linux gaming would be significantly superior on PCs. With windows 8 being another vista patch, looks like the push with Steam to linux may just finally be a breakaway from these awful limitations in PC gaming.

For example 3D is possible on WiiU as the hardware has that capability, nintendo won't focus on that so there won't be much of SDK API support for that so developers would need to implement that them selfs.
 
The graphics were just downright pathethic. The time it took from the demo starting and the final layer of textures and effects to load in was between 20 to 40 seconds. It looked absolutely ghastly. The controls worked fine when it came to movement, but the second you used the Gamepad everything was off. They basically took the sensitivity of the analog stick input (which sucks ass) and used it for the gyro controls. So you have huuuge dead zones that usually would cope for the craptastic accuracy of the analog stick aiming, but with the gyro it really throws you off because the initial movement is completely ignored and then the acceleration kicks in way too fast.
Steering that Batarang through the gate, with inverted aiming (turning the gamepad left made the Batarang fly right) was horrible.
It's game breaking for me to be honest.

I hope the final game isn't anywhere near as bad as the turd they decided to show off.

HAHA, there's just no way a game will launch like that, no way man!! Are they any games in the wild as bad as this anyone know? I know there's quite a few PS360 games with texture pop, but 20-40 seconds bad? No way man... if it launches like that it will be Far Cry GameCube port bad.
 

Sheroking

Member
HAHA, there's just no way a game will launch like that, no way man!! Are they any games in the wild as bad as this anyone know? I know there's quite a few PS360 games with texture pop, but 20-40 seconds bad? No way man... if it launches like that it will be Far Cry GameCube port bad.

The best game I can think of with ridiculous pop-in is Mass Effect. 5+ seconds, both while you're playing and in cutscenes.
 

Enlil

Member
Realistic physical motion and interaction in a game environment is not a case of 'laziness'. It requires processing power, and when highly detailed a lot of processing power. The reason we haven't seen many games use realistic physics and interactive detail is because it is an expensive thing to simulate, and still arguably 'new' technology.

And this is, once again, another element of interactive world building that takes great advantage of complex processing and powerful hardware.

Yes, I know, but it is happening right now! WATCH DOGS is a good example. Ubisoft did a fine job making it possible on these console.
 

EatChildren

Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
Yes, I know, but it is happening right now! WATCH DOGS is a good example. Ubisoft did a fine job making it possible on these console.

Watch_Dogs will be on current generation systems, but the E3 demo and everything we've seen has been running on superior PC hardware. We haven't seen how the 360/PS3 builds are shaping up.
 

D-e-f-

Banned
Watch_Dogs will be on current generation systems, but the E3 demo and everything we've seen has been running on superior PC hardware. We haven't seen how the 360/PS3 builds are shaping up.

I think this right here is a good indicator of in what way those versions will differ:
http://www.joystiq.com/2012/08/16/borderlands-2-bundled-with-geforce-gtx-660-ti-nvidias-cheapest/
(obviously I'm not talking about this exact feature implementation but what kinds of changes there will be)
 
HAHA, there's just no way a game will launch like that, no way man!! Are they any games in the wild as bad as this anyone know? I know there's quite a few PS360 games with texture pop, but 20-40 seconds bad? No way man... if it launches like that it will be Far Cry GameCube port bad.

To name a few:

Mass Effect 1 360 Vanilla (pre patch 2) Sometimes textures would take up to 20 or more seconds to load, with the Citadel being the worst offender
Bioshock 1 PS3 Vanilla not quite as bad but sometimes textures would pop in randomly, while some textures were reduced in resolution to a pixelated mess.

Even if the final game will be able to reduce texture loading to less than 5 seconds, it will still be the inferior version as the game has to load new areas quite often.

Given that the game is a launch title and their otherwise horrible implementation of the Gamepad specific controls it doesn't instill me with any hope that the final game will be any better.
 
Oh man. I remember plopping that in for Majora's Mask and being blown away. Dat motion blur, dat Clock Town... I think I played until the beginning of Great Bay in one sitting.

Majora's Mask is awesome.

I love it, too, but that goddamn creepy pasta scared me away. I know it's fake and all, but what the fuck. Amazing game, though, getting the Fierce Deity mask felt really rewarding.
 
Do the first and third quotes imply ease in portability between next generation platforms - i.e. the point about supreme scalability - or does it imply the Wii U will likely require bespoke solutions if ever a developer is using UE4 and targeting the other platforms - i.e. the part about targeting DX11 and letting customers decide? Or both.

From a technical standpoint it shouldn't be that much of an issue. It's whether or not they want to bother doing so. Most likely they will wonder if the game will sell. But I wouldn't be surprised if some just refuse to release it for other non-technical reasons.

Could the WiiU GPU look similar to one of the AMD's 7000M series GPU? Perhaps the 7700M?

Most likely none.


:O

node-mind-blown.gif



Or it 24? Think about that for a moment.

I still think that a big leap at around $400 is possible. It is also the question if they can afford to make it "underpowered". If the Xbox 720 is much more powerful, and cost about the same, that could be a threat to the net income. But we'll see what happens. I also hope for Sony's sake that they wont take i.e a $200 loss on each PS4, i agree to that.

I think PS4 is shaping up to be a very good balance of cost and power. And their cost should scale really well this time making it easier to profit off of the hardware early.

All it needed was some Jets flying overhead and some Rock music to finish the scene.

XD

Watch_Dogs will be on current generation systems, but the E3 demo and everything we've seen has been running on superior PC hardware. We haven't seen how the 360/PS3 builds are shaping up.

If they are even (still) in development to shape up.
 
Why is that?

The GCN architecture is on a 28nm process and a compute unit is a 16-wide ALU SIMD (4-SIMDs per CU) with other additions to enhance the GPGPU capabilities since that was apparently the primary goal. I would expect that Nintendo took their own route when it comes to how the GPU handles general processing. Just having the same amount of ALUs, ROPs, or TMUs (if that happens) wouldn't be enough to suggest that they are similar.
 

D-e-f-

Banned
Or it 24? Think about that for a moment.

Half Life 3 for Wii U confirmed!

42 is the answer to life and universe . 24 is almost half that. Obviously a hint at Half Life coming to Wii U. Since it's not exactly half, that means it's either a prequel or a spin-off or "only" the Orange Box incl. Episode 3.
 

Meelow

Banned
I think PS4 is shaping up to be a very good balance of cost and power. And their cost should scale really well this time making it easier to profit off of the hardware early.

What exactly do you know about the PS4?, how does it really compare with Wii U and Xbox 720?.
 

Stewox

Banned
The GCN architecture is on a 28nm process and a compute unit is a 16-wide ALU SIMD (4-SIMDs per CU) with other additions to enhance the GPGPU capabilities since that was apparently the primary goal. I would expect that Nintendo took their own route when it comes to how the GPU handles general processing. Just having the same amount of ALUs, ROPs, or TMUs (if that happens) wouldn't be enough to suggest that they are similar.

There wasn't any proof afaik that WiiU GPU will use GCN, but the reason for a lower than 40nm process lies in nintendo historically always made them efficient and the most obvious way is a die shrink, I do not belive it will be the same as the GPUs it's based on.
 

cand

Member
Nintendo Okie (never heard of them until now) has a 42 minute audio interview with Pwnee Studios, makers of the Wii U game Cloudberry Kingdom.

http://nintendo-okie.com/2012/08/23/pwnee-studios-audio-interview/

I can't listen at the moment, so it could be informative, could be nothing. You decide.

Basically he said:
* Will try to squeeze some more extras for the U version
*Is a great Nintendo console
*Excited more about the online marketplace than the hardware

HE DIDN'T SAY THAT THE HARDWARE SUX, he just said he is a lot more excited about how the online marketplace will work.
 

D-e-f-

Banned
Basically he said:
* Will try to squeeze some more extras for the U version
*Is a great Nintendo console
*Excited more about the online marketplace than the hardware

HE DIDN'T SAY THAT THE HARDWARE SUX, he just said he is a lot more excited about how the online marketplace will work.

haha ... I bet you could spin it that way if you wanted to.

>>Developer: "Wii U hardware not that exciting."

lol

I accept job offers for sleazy video game news reporting via PM.
 
Nintendo Okie (never heard of them until now) has a 42 minute audio interview with Pwnee Studios, makers of the Wii U game Cloudberry Kingdom.

http://nintendo-okie.com/2012/08/23/pwnee-studios-audio-interview/

I can't listen at the moment, so it could be informative, could be nothing. You decide.

Just now got hold of their Wii U kit.

excited about the on-line marketplace.

"Looks like they've taken a lot of notes from Steam and other succesful marketplaces. Seems like they get it, and they're going to nail it, I think.

"They realise that digital is the future and they are getting their acts together with that, definitely."
 

Meelow

Banned
Basically he said:
* Will try to squeeze some more extras for the U version
*Is a great Nintendo console
*Excited more about the online marketplace than the hardware

HE DIDN'T SAY THAT THE HARDWARE SUX, he just said he is a lot more excited about how the online marketplace will work.

Considering they are a indie developer I don't think they would be too excited for the hardware but more of the online, the offers it can bring.
 

cand

Member
Considering they are a indie developer I don't think they would be too excited for the hardware but more of the online, the offers it can bring.

You don't need to be defensive about this, I mean they loved the assymetrical gameplay idea, and even if all of the spec freaks wish with all their heart will not change what wii u already is. What's the point in fightin' over U's power if, in the end, will not change what it really is? People will see for themselves.
 
Sony is in a bit of a better condition than Sega was when they released the Dreamcast. Honestly, I'm not sure if the Dreamcast's success would have prevented their downfall.

Well, that is true, but the Dreamcast took a part in it, no?

Anyway, I'm just happy we'll still have some competition around.
 

Meelow

Banned
You don't need to be defensive about this, I mean they loved the assymetrical gameplay idea, and even if all of the spec freaks wish with all their heart will not change what wii u already is. What's the point in fightin' over U's power if, in the end, will not change what it really is? People will see for themselves.

I wasn't being defensive I was actually saying indie developers don't care as much as power as other developers but more for what the console can do, that's just how I see it though.
 

Enlil

Member
If they are even (still) in development to shape up.

This is why i stopped buying consoles. since my ps3 YLOD'd I am fed up with consoles. If this is true that WATCH DOGS will only look that good on pc then they should stop making the game for ps3 and xbox (and wii u?).

it's just something I have really hated the past few years. Clothes being glued on the skin....

I hope we get beautiful games on pc now AMD/NVIDIA have brought us awesome cards. Wii u should just focus on their first party games.
 
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