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[REMEMBER CITADEL]

I don't know why the concept of bullshots is so hard to grasp for some. If a screen or a video is passing itself for something you are able to see in the game, tech-wise, yet you are not (or you are, but a photo mode screen is being presented as a gameplay screen, for instance), it's a bullshot. No ifs or buts. It doesn't matter if it's just extra anti-aliasing or filtering, it's a bullshot.

 

[Dachande]

Okay, wait, is this the consensus? If I'm just operating under a false assumption of what a bullshot is, then I apologize.

I was definitely thinking that any shot that demonstrated in-game image quality that was impossible on the console it was being demonstrated for would be considered a "bullshot."

Urbandictionary just says:

That's definitely what I was operating under but I'll gladly bow out if I am wrong.

I don't think any grand consensus really exists, but the Penny Arcade strip in the second post of the thread is what coined the term and used the infamous "next-gen Madden". That Urban Dictionary definition seems a bit too open for my liking - that any kind of filtering makes it a "bullshot", where in reality screenshots do need to be touched up to before being sent out because magazines need them in enormous resolutions to be suitable for print, or the people making the game are too busy making the game to get the lighting settings to release quality when there are more important things for them to be getting on with.

So, taking a picture from the framebuffer on a devkit at an obscene resolution the stock machine couldn't do, or maybe adjusting the contrast of the overall image to make it look a bit better? That's fine, I have no problems with that and I think it's over the top to complain about it. It's not a grand fabrication, especially if it's just minor edits to a genuine in-game screenshot. It is indicative of the actual game.

Where it strays into the "bullshot" area is when things start getting added that aren't ever going to be in the game and never were, such as the lens-flare on the Amped screenshot, or complete draw-overs, or overly-detailed models added into the scene of a game as though they're functional elements - more ridiculous, the worse it is. I don't think any that applies to the SOTC screenshot at all, which is why it getting posted annoyed me.

True, 100%, unforgivable bullshots are ones like Madden shots, or the GRID picture that was posted earlier, or the faked S3&K picture that had Sonic completely composited in, or the Operation Flashpoint shots that had to have just been a render target made in Max and maybe exported to the game engine or something.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

I don't know why the concept of bullshots is so hard to grasp for some. If a screen or a video is passing itself for something you are able to see in the game, tech-wise, yet you are not (or you are, but a photo mode screen is being presented as a gameplay screen, for instance), it's a bullshot. No ifs or buts. It doesn't matter if it's just extra anti-aliasing or filtering, it's a bullshot.

Exactly.

Now, extra AA or filtering and higher resolution for print magazines aren't terrible. Things like that don't belong in a thread about greatest bullshots. When you get into lighting, textures, and models that you wouldn't see in that way under normal gameplay that's annoying. When it just looks nothing like the final product in terms of image quality, that's bad.


People are complaining about CG movies being unfairly posted, but the only one that really fits that is Motorstorm. Almost every other CG video/screencap posted in here is something that was hoisted up as something running on the machine or even made to look like an actual game with HUD elements or gameplay-like camera angles. Those are bullshots just like the rest.

 

[Hawkian]

Exactly.

Now, extra AA or filtering and higher resolution for print magazines aren't terrible.

Bumping up the resolution to show a shot in print is definitely par for the course, but I have been burned so many damn times by shots of console games with zero jaggies that ended up having no AA in reality at all... :'(

Things like that don't belong in a thread about greatest bullshots.

Now this we can all get behind.

 

[Seagoon]

So many of these bullshots could pass for actual screens in the High Resolution PC gaming thread.

 

[REMEMBER CITADEL]

So many of these bullshots could pass for actual screens in the High Resolution PC gaming thread.

No shit. So many of these older bullshots could pass for actual screens in any current gen console graphics thread as well. That's not the point.

 

[Anton Sugar]

So many of these bullshots could pass for actual screens in the High Resolution PC gaming thread.

Let's play a game! Choose a bullshot and a pic from that thread, and try to decide which is which!

Could make a fun thread.

 

[Evolved1]

I think determining what constitutes a "bullshot" comes down to perceived developer/publisher intent.

Are they taking something unrealistically enhanced (or completely fucking fabricated from thin air) and trying to pass it off as the game... is it false advertising... that's the metric I use.

If they're honest from the beginning about a CGI trailer or whatever... I don't particularly see the point of that shit, but I don't find it offensive. What I consider "bullshots" are screens/trailers companies use to create false impression of quality that really isn't representative of their final product. That shit offends me... it's an unscrupulous practice and demonstrates a lack of respect toward those interested in their product.

 

[John Rabbit]

itt: people confuse concept renders with screenshots.

 

[Mr. B Natural]

I think determining what constitutes a "bullshot" comes down to perceived developer/publisher intent.

Agree completely - intent is the major factor.
Also, I appreciate the posters that show the before AND after in the same post.

 

[Evolved1]

itt: people confuse concept renders with screenshots.

The phrases "target render" and "proof of concept" didn't become common language in videogame advertising/PR until these companies started getting called out for trying to pass off unrealistically enhanced media as representative of their actual products.

When enough people finally started to go "Hey wtf assholes" the publishers and developers fell back on "Uhm hey guys these are just renders...we werent trying to trick anyone... yeah

Spoiler

psst...it really is real time we promise--i mean would we lie!?

".

 

[MMaRsu]

Forza 2:

"Hey guys, this is totally 100% in-game engine!"

What you play:

Forza 3:

What you play:

Sigh there's a difference between something being in-engine ( which is probably what they said about the replays ) and in-game. I doubt they said 'in-game-engine'.

 

[MMaRsu]

If that's really 3rd Strike online in the background....

Where is that photo from?? Is that really 3rd Strike online in the background?

 

[Diablohead]

Forza 2 was going to have volumetric grass and 12 player races but it was all cut, even che came here and said/posted about it briefly in the forza 2 thread.

Forza 3's cockpits are great if you change the FOV a little bit to see more of the interior, some cars are better then others.

 

[somesang]

I don't really know how the game ended up, but I love the contrast.

Perfect Dark Zero

 

[Buckethead]

your memory has a lot of anti aliassing and and great scaler.

This this this a million times this.

 

[Rocwell]

Not exactly a bullshot per se, but certainly a trailer that will be remembered infamously.

MGS2 E3 2001
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C14upMsuEFI&NR=1#t=3m22s

Kinda

Spoiler

really

late to the post but I caught some flack for this one, just wanted to clarify I was talking about the Snake/Raiden switch not the quality of the graphics. As far as trailers go it was one of the greats but still noteworthy for the degree Kojima went to mislead and lay red herrings for the fans.

 

[Why For?]

Pre-emptive

 

[MMaRsu]

I don't really know how the game ended up, but I love the contrast.

Perfect Dark Zero

The first one is pretty close to how the game looks, and the second one is an early MP pic I think.

 

[Hawkian]

I think PDZ's graphics hold up remarkably well considering it was a launch game in 2005. Damn... the 360 came out over 5 years ago.

 

[EnjoyIncubus]

Hybrid Heaven ( N64)

Actuall game

Hahaha, holy shit. I remember being so excited for this game when I was a kid. Saw a preview in Nintendo Power or something, thought it looked awesome, and rented it when it came out. Game is garbage.

 

[Ajemsuhgao]

That moment always ghosts for me. And if you sit and look at the Falcon flying next to you at the beginning without moving the camera, it does the same. It's fine for the most part, but there's definately some odd standout moments of ghosting, mostly when stuff in in front of your face in those stationary first person sequences.

But the opening cinematic shot compared the announce trailer are very close.

Isn't that caused by the weird way Bungie fakes AA?

 

[Violater]

Part one of the trilogy
lol

 

[Epcott]

This video of The Bouncer...

I remember seeing this and really really wanting this game.
lolz @ the matrix slo mo shots

 

[Empyrean Heaven]

/thread.

 

[Game2Death]

Haze

Can't believe I bought this game. :/

 

[Mikazuki]

 

[M°°nblade]

I don't really know how the game ended up, but I love the contrast.

Perfect Dark Zero

 

[Melchiah]

Raven "Two to Tango" (Xbox unveiling tech demo)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-FGeqomYUyU

 

[Shaneus]

My favourite... this is how the boxart looked in Australia:

Hint: Screenshot on the left-hand side in the middle. I can't find a better scan, but it's a screen from the SNES version on the back of the Megadrive boxart.
Edit: Probably not so much a bullshot as a misprint. Clearly it's supposed to be a fatality-type screen, not the double ice backfire.

 

[BloodySinner]

The first one is pretty close to how the game looks, and the second one is an early MP pic I think.

Pretty close? HA! It's a real screenshot taken from the single player campaign.

 

[_Alkaline_]

http://xbox360media.ign.com/xbox360/image/article/614/614217/perfect-dark-zero-20050514085006513.jpg[IMG][/QUOTE]

That was real. Joanna got a fair few redesigns during the game's development.

The environment itself appears to be day variant of Urban, but it's difficult to tell.

 

[DSN2K]

PES 2006, these were first ingame shots lol

the final game!

 

[The Bookerman]

Yes this shit's more than 10 years old. but it was one hell of a bullshot.

 

[Lagspike_exe]

PES won't look like that even next gen.

 

[M3d10n]

So anything that isn't a direct framebuffer grab or video capture is a bullshot, heh? I believe there are four types of bullshots:

1) The "higher-res and antialiased" in-game bullshot: Pretty much every screenshot from the PS2 era was done like this. The PS2 dev kit even has a tool to take such screenshots straight from the dev hardware. Back then direct framebuffer grabs would actually look worse than the actual game played on a CRT SDTV, so this was actually a necessity (the GC didn't have a screenshot tool, and everyone said GC games looked worse than PS2 games since most screenshots were done via capture-card). I believe these are tame and acceptable when dealing with low-resolution consoles and handhelds (480p and lower). For HD games, it shouldn't be necessary.

2) The photoshop-enhanced bullshot: Marketing will take a type #1 screenshot, and enhance it by messing with contrast, adding lens flares, blur effects, shadows and even adding models and other elements that aren't there.

3) The "we're not in Kansas anymore" bullshot: Marketing will take in-game models, bring them into 3DS MAX or another 3D modeling program and render them there with different lighting, shadows and AA levels that are impossible even on a PC.

4) The "target render" bullshot: Same as #3, but with CG-grade art assets that would be impossible on the game.

Regarding the thread title ("the greatest bullshots"), I don't think types #1 and #2 fit in here. Type #2 is still lying ("we couldn't get the colors right in-game, let's user photoshop"), but it's not outrageous enough. Types #3 and #4 are the worst offenders, because they take effort and deliberation to make.

 

[EatChildren]

Red Steel is one of the best examples, not just because of the first media release being literally nothing more than a target render (which looked miles better than the game actually did), but also because when real media did start coming out they were in high resolution with tons of AA and AF. The assets might have been real, but what we were seeing was baloney.

Im pretty sure we never got proper resolution media until outlets started direct feed recording footage.

 

[dark10x]

I don't really know how the game ended up, but I love the contrast.

Perfect Dark Zero

The first shot is definitely quite real. PDZ was simply an uneven game, visually. Some areas were amazing while others were ugly as sin.

 

[M°°nblade]

That was real. Joanna got a fair few redesigns during the game's development.

If by redesigns, you mean downgrades, then yes.

 

[Cyntec]

can't believe this took about 150 posts... this was the first I'd come up with

 

[The Culture Vulture]

What game is this? I want to preorded off of the bullshot.

 

[StuBurns]

A canned Wii game called Sadness.

 

[Radogol]

A canned Wii game called Sadness.

It has to exist to be canned.

 

[CadetMahoney]

I still lol at the Killzone/Haze/Lair bullshots.

What about the Heavenly Sword ones. Motorstorm was said to be 1080p 60fps, but there was no bullshots to reference?

So anything that isn't a direct framebuffer grab or video capture is a bullshot, heh? I believe there are four types of bullshots:

1) The "higher-res and antialiased" in-game bullshot: Pretty much every screenshot from the PS2 era was done like this. The PS2 dev kit even has a tool to take such screenshots straight from the dev hardware. Back then direct framebuffer grabs would actually look worse than the actual game played on a CRT SDTV, so this was actually a necessity (the GC didn't have a screenshot tool, and everyone said GC games looked worse than PS2 games since most screenshots were done via capture-card). I believe these are tame and acceptable when dealing with low-resolution consoles and handhelds (480p and lower). For HD games, it shouldn't be necessary.

2) The photoshop-enhanced bullshot: Marketing will take a type #1 screenshot, and enhance it by messing with contrast, adding lens flares, blur effects, shadows and even adding models and other elements that aren't there.

3) The "we're not in Kansas anymore" bullshot: Marketing will take in-game models, bring them into 3DS MAX or another 3D modeling program and render them there with different lighting, shadows and AA levels that are impossible even on a PC.

4) The "target render" bullshot: Same as #3, but with CG-grade art assets that would be impossible on the game.

Regarding the thread title ("the greatest bullshots"), I don't think types #1 and #2 fit in here. Type #2 is still lying ("we couldn't get the colors right in-game, let's user photoshop"), but it's not outrageous enough. Types #3 and #4 are the worst offenders, because they take effort and deliberation to make.

Good post, saved for future reference.

 

[GavinGT]

It has to exist to be canned.

What do you call two fully modeled minecarts? Nothing?

 

[Cyntec]

It has to exist to be canned.

now wait: Sadness got canned? They just released some screenshots a few weeks ago...

Actual footage:

and now tell this game doen't exist

 

[Noisepurge]

Oi! those Dirt shots are just "Target Renders" not claimed to be screenshots.

 

[quetz67]

The new Assassins Creed shots reminded me of this Trespasser shot, one of the most beautiful bullshots of all time IMO. Already gave a glimpse of Alan Wake style graphics years earlier.

Doesn't look touched up or like it is just rendered by a CG asrtist. Looks very in-engine, just at much higher (texture) resolution and better lighting.

The difference to how the game finally turned out is rather subtile

 

[Oblivion]

Holy crap, that grass is fucking AWFUL.

What the hell happened?

 

[jmdajr]

HALO2 nowhere to be found?