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Halo |OT11| Forward Unto Dong

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S

Swarmerr

Member
Duji said:
Where did he state this? This is an obvious straw man fallacy and it makes my brain hurt.

What he wants Halo to have:
- Fast kill times (0.4-1.0 second minimum kill times)
- Difficult aiming (unlike H2)
- A skillful melee system (like CE)
- A good strafe & crouch (preferably an insta-strafe & insta-crouch)
- A game not based on who-sees-who-first (like CoD)
- No random BS (H3 BR spread)
- No OP equipment (regen)
- No OP AAs (armour lock)
- Gametypes & maps that are fair AND promote movement (CTF: yes, Regicide: no)
- A big skill gap (Quake: yes, CoD: no)

You know, it's possible to fulfill all of the above and make a game that is completely different from CE? See: Wolfenstein: Enemy Territory. BigShow just believes that those core concepts should remain intact and that we should expand on them. Expanding should be done by upgrading forge, creating weapons that add to the sandbox, creating AAs/equipment that make the game more competitive, creating new gametypes, having an MM experience where people of similar skill are matched up, adding a spectator mode, upping the graphics (not marginally like CoD), adding a custom games finder, etc.

The list at the top actually used to be the core principles of of Halo back in the day, but so much has been changed. Like, imagine a CoD game where every weapon kill time was upped by 1 second. The original fans would be in an outrage and CoD wouldn't be CoD anymore. Their anger would be justified since the developers just gave their original audience -- who helped bring success to the franchise -- the shaft.

I lose a few brain cells whenever someone says BigShow wants a CE clone.
Click to expand...

Would love the bolded to happen in halo, one day, one day.
 
R

Ramirez

Member
Ryaaan14 said:
Cocamola why wasn't I invited to your secret Halo 4 stream? :_(
Click to expand...

spongebob-shame.gif
 
R

Raide

Member
Duji said:
Where did he state this? This is an obvious straw man fallacy and it makes my brain hurt.

What he wants Halo to have:
- Fast kill times (0.4-1.0 second minimum kill times)
- Difficult aiming (unlike H2)
- A skillful melee system (like CE)
- A good strafe & crouch (preferably an insta-strafe & insta-crouch)
- A game not based on who-sees-who-first (like CoD)
- No random BS (H3 BR spread)
- No OP equipment (regen)
- No OP AAs (armour lock)
- Gametypes & maps that are fair AND promote movement (CTF: yes, Regicide: no)
- A big skill gap (Quake: yes, CoD: no)
Click to expand...

These two suggestions seem to be opposed to each other.
If you want faster kill times, it will result in more cases of "Who sees first, wins.
 
R

Redford

aka Cabbie
Trey said:
That film grain being removed makes the game look so much better.
Click to expand...

I'm still trying to find a certain video of Reach with it turned off. It did a world of difference. Apparently it helps up resolution or something but Halo 4 seems like it's doing okay. Except maybe the ground textures...

(I don't know anything about this stuff though)

V Nice catch.
 
V

ViewtifulJC

Banned
I stopped playing CoD regularly around MW2. I'm watching this guy's BO video, and shit is flying on the screen every 3 seconds telling you how awesome you are, and how many points you got, and the guy you killed had a girl in a skirt mooning you in his banner, and he got seven kills in a row and suddenly he's in a damn helicopter raining down on people with a chain gun.

What in the hell is this game?
 
M

MrBig

Member
There are people that want shorter kill times in Halo? The longer engagements give skilled players a chance to overtake someone who gets the first shot off, unlike most other games. If that's the way you want to play keep it to custom games.

ncsuDuncan said:
Concept art looks amazing, but where have I seen that asteroid belt before?
Click to expand...

That's how sparth Oaksford(?) usually works, sourcing textures to speed up iteration time and spend less time on smaller details that will be changed based on need anyway.
 
R

Raide

Member
Tha Robbertster said:
Not if a skilled player can evade the shots and turn encounter in his favor.
Click to expand...

The range most of the Halo combat seems to happen at usually results in death before you can react. Make the kill times shorter and people will be getting donged all over the place!

Skill in most modern FPS games seems to be 'who can cap the person in the head quickest' not the old-school Doom/Quake style which was learn the map layout and use that to win.
 
T

Trey

Member
Duji said:
Where did he state this? This is an obvious straw man fallacy and it makes my brain hurt.

What he wants Halo to have:
- Fast kill times (0.4-1.0 second minimum kill times)
- Difficult aiming (unlike H2)
- A skillful melee system (like CE)
- A good strafe & crouch (preferably an insta-strafe & insta-crouch)
- A game not based on who-sees-who-first (like CoD)
- No random BS (H3 BR spread)
- No OP equipment (regen)
- No OP AAs (armour lock)
- Gametypes & maps that are fair AND promote movement (CTF: yes, Regicide: no)
- A big skill gap (Quake: yes, CoD: no)
Click to expand...

I would love a better melee system, but CE isn't quite the answer for me. I also feel movement shouldn't be instant. You should have to be smart about how and when you move and the onus is better put on the player rather than the map design. Aiming should be slightly more difficult, and defensive options (player traits) should be heightened.
 
O

Overdoziz

Banned
MrBig said:
There are people that want shorter kill times in Halo? The longer engagements give skilled players a chance to overtake someone who gets the first shot off, unlike most other games. If that's the way you want to play keep it to custom games.
Click to expand...
There's a big difference in kill time between Halo 1/2 and Halo Reach. Some people (including me) want faster killtimes than what Reach and Halo 3 have. It's not like you can only have kill times on either side of the spectrum.
 
D

Duji

Member
daedalius said:
I lose a few brain cells whenever I see BigShow's posts.

Thankfully I have him on ignore.
Click to expand...

In what way are BigShow's posts stupid? He usually backs his opinions up with sufficient reasoning and examples from Halo history of what worked and what didn't. Do you ignore everyone who has a dissenting opinion? There are loads of people on this forum who I disagree with and find irritating, but I choose not to ignore them since everyone does add something to the discussion at some point.

And I will be impressed if you actually choose to answer the question instead of quoting the question and responding with a GIF.

Raide said:
These two suggestions seem to be opposed to each other.
If you want faster kill times, it will result in more cases of "Who sees first, wins.
Click to expand...
This is a very common misconception, and I completely understand why one would think this.

Did you miss the points of difficult aiming and responsive movement (insta-strafe)? Those are HUGE factors that affect the average kill time of the game by a ton. Fast base movement speed is also huge. (Thanks for reminding me about that btw, I added it to my original post.)

Basically you want a low minimum kill time, but you want it to be extremely difficult to land perfect shots. This is done by making the movement faster/crisper and reducing the aim assist & bullet magnetism.

And I can tell that you obviously have never LANed Halo: CE or played a game like W:ET.
 
N

ncsuDuncan

Member
Zeouterlimits said:
Concept art was clearly put together quite quickly, so I wouldn't read into that.
Which you've probably considered, but anyway. Also, podcast. Por favor.
Click to expand...

Oh, I know. Just being cheeky, nothing wrong with reusing good art to speed up the process. I only recognized the original because it's one of my rotating desktop backgrounds.

Podcast uploading now. Took forever because I had to listen through multiple times to make absolutely sure Tashi didn't spill the beans on the surprise MechaJohnson reveal halfway through the game er, stuff.
 
G

Garrett 2U

Member
Duji said:
In what way are BigShow's posts stupid? He usually backs his opinions up with sufficient reasoning and examples from Halo history of what worked and what didn't. Do you ignore everyone who has a dissenting opinion? There are loads of people on this forum who I disagree with and find irritating, but I choose not to ignore them since everyone does add something to the discussion at some point.

And I will be impressed if you actually choose to answer the question instead of quoting the question and responding with a GIF.
Click to expand...

How about I answer the questions with a GIF?
CG4jT.gif
 
D

daedalius

Member
Duji said:
In what way are BigShow's posts stupid? He usually backs his opinions up with sufficient reasoning and examples from Halo history of what worked and what didn't. Do you ignore everyone who has a dissenting opinion? There are loads of people on this forum who I disagree with and find irritating, but I choose not to ignore them since everyone does add something to the discussion at some point.

And I will be impressed if you actually choose to answer the question instead of quoting the question and responding with a GIF.
Click to expand...

mind_blown.gif
 
D

Duji

Member
And to reiterate...

CoD has very short minimum kill times but it becomes a game of who-sees-who-first due to the slow base movement speed, nonexistent strafing, and the ridiculous amounts of aim assist. CoD and CE share the short minimum kill time, but CE is not a game of who-sees-who-first.
 
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