Crytek knows.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
VGLeaks: PlayStation 4 "Orbis" Roadmap
- Thread starter Baki
- Start date
Crytek knows.
Cool.
Can Crusher
Banned
That would mean both know about both consoles and their final specs, "secret" DSPs, etc. and I personally think that at least one of them knows absolutely nothing
Of course, it could all be bullshit. But when enough "sources" start pointing to a similar message...well it becomes hard to not start taking the message a bit more seriously.
Of course 3rd parties know. At least the big ones.
Well for me, the important message to take away from it isn't that one is more powerful than the other, but that it probably really is true that we are only get half the picture on Durango. Or two thirds of the picture.
IIRC that's no different than what Sony and MS do with their current OS. While in the dash, all the memory and processing is used, but while running a game, the cost goes down to their current cost.
It's too early to claim either is more powerful. There have been enough conflicting reports that it may just suggest both are about the same and have different strengths.
lol 3rd party devs know what is expected in both systems. They know the targetted performance and designs, they have to know.
I don't remember that slide, but it sounds interesting. Everything else I've seen seems to be pretty heavy on 'scalability.'Rösti;46471175 said:
It's just really weird looking at the 720 we think we know. Trying to bring what we know with other rumors has my mind bouncing between 'that seems too cheap' and 'that seems too expensive.'
*Shakes head* If the app block is running heavy games by itself then that would be graphically comparable to the PS4 while still completely free to run apps (system block) at 0 cost....
systemfehler
Member
The problem is what starts as a suggestion, idea, rumour on another forum becomes a "fact" here and the more users contributing to that - the more real this becomes.
As an example the secret DSP rumour, it seems some users now know for a fact that there will be a blitter in the 720 - originally an idea at the B3D forums. Where is the real confirmation not just a user post saying "hey a blitter might be a good idea".
That particular patent was filed by SCE = Playstation business.
Dark_AnNiaLatOr
Member
But the new proposal is that even the in game dash uses 1gb of memory, because as soon as its pulled up 1gb of ram is transferred from the game's use to the in game dash. This has got to be done super fast, and I don't know how the heck one would do it.
gundamkyoukai
Member
I mean no offense to anyone but saying which system is more powerfully base on few posters seem to be crazy .
Aegies already said he hardly Knows anything about PS4 same for Karak .
Then there Proelite who says not judge stuff but all of sudden he is ?
Also do people really think that only MS going to customize there GPU and not Sony .
I expect both of them to add stuff to it , Sony even customize Vita GPU .
Aegies already said he hardly Knows anything about PS4 same for Karak .
Then there Proelite who says not judge stuff but all of sudden he is ?
Also do people really think that only MS going to customize there GPU and not Sony .
I expect both of them to add stuff to it , Sony even customize Vita GPU .
Proelite has been throwing information and disinformation to avoid leaks going back to the "blah blah" source. It's all in fun for the discussion.
What if these "sources" are using info from a faulty source? And then other sources get info from those sources and so on?
Can Crusher
Banned
I've said this before, and I'll say it again....it's about context. It's about who's saying what, and not how many people are wishing for X or Y.
If confirmed insiders are converging to one message, then it starts to add up. You just have to use your common sense to browse through all the rumors, through all the predictions, through all the bullshit and where it comes from and go simple and logical. This won't give you the full list of the specs in the final kit, but you will find enough to make the speculation game worth it if you are on THE HYPE TRAIN EXPRESSO
Then what's the point of any thread regarding Ps4 and Xbox 720 specs? What are the points of leaks? etc etc
Anybody expecting something completely new, different, never heard of, never speculated on, never hinted at, with info about it having never leaked aren't living in the real world.
Of course both will customize to their needs and goals. But they won't end up with the same design, they won't have the same constraints when making decisions. For example, you can consider when did MS started working with AMD, when Sony did, what AMD's stance is on the projects, etc etc etc
Nintendo got an AMD gpu too. But there were different goals, different design philosophies, different kind of money being spent. A different relationship
gundamkyoukai
Member
I agree it's all fun but when rumors starts turning into fact from other rumors it make things harder to see .
polyh3dron
Banned
From a layperson's view, this definitely looks like a reverse of the 360/PS3 power dynamic. Looks like Durango is the one that is more powerful but in order to exploit that increased power it will take a lot of work akin to Naughty Dog's work on the Uncharted games. So basically MS's first party exclusives will look better than anything Sony has to offer, but most multiplatform games will be roughly the same in terms of performance.
So they are saying 1GB used by the game is transferred to the dash when prompted?
Not sure how this would work, that game data needs to be stored somewhere. Even if this were possible, which I don't think it is, it would require loading to and from the dash since the data would need to be flushed, then filled with the dashboard, then flushed again so the game can be re-loaded back into memory.
If I'm understanding this correctly, it sounds very slow and inefficient which doesn't seem like what they intend. Maybe they have 1GB reserved and set aside to use while you're in the game?
People with knowledge.
Proelite
Member
AgentP
Thinks mods influence posters politics. Promoted to QAnon Editor.
They know rough targets. Early dev kits are not the final hardware, unless you think the G5 PCs with ATI X800 fully represented the Xbox 360 and it custom eDRAM GPU? 1st party gets the latest dev kits first, followed by 3rd party. I don't know what is in the wild now, but I suspect 3rd do not have final dev kits.
The reason I say Crytek is deep in the know because of Ryse. The 8GB comment is no coincidence.
Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew
Banned
GAF Interpol.
Just like this gen, it will come down to the design of the game and the art that carry the majority of the look. There really is no power dynamic this gen, just different strengths and weaknesses. May be the same next gen as well, just to a smaller degree.
There was a large gap in power between the PS2 and xbox but GT4 still looked better than Forza, showing how much great art and experience can pay off.
I would pay more attention to the 3rd party developers if I were Sony or MS. Their 1st party studios will have to work on whatever they are given, but 3rd party studios will have other options, making their opinions more valuable IMO. It's unlikely either system would be left out entirely, but catering to the 3rd party studios with both the hardware and tools may help your system become the lead platform for development.
Well he is simply guessing, basing everything on that leaked PowerPoint from 2008.
gundamkyoukai
Member
Proelite seem to be the only one that know something about Sony .
Both Aegies and Karak said they don't know what going on with them .
Unless that change in last few days .
I don't know why some gaffers can't comprehend the impossibilty of Sony to compete on a hardware leve. Not only is the state of their finances a hindrance, especially compared to the much richer adversary, but the latter has proven its ability to design more balanced and effective architectures. I would be shocked if Sony could come up with something as edgy as the expeted Durango, honestly. But the reality of it is that they do not need to; just make sure the difference is minimal and concentrate on improving OS, libraries and tools. The great first party team will take care of the rest!
Developer skill and power still plays a role though. Rallisport Challenge 2 was made by DICE and looked better (And a bit more advanced) than both Forza 1 and GT4 while running in 60fps at the time.
ThisWreckage
Banned
Exclusives will look roughly the same even if the PS4 is weaker because Sony's studios are notorious tech wizards. GG, Polyphony, Santa Monica, and Naughty Dog are all incredibly talented at getting the most out of hardware.
Of course, but I was just commentating on Xbox Vs. PS2.
Can Crusher
Banned
I agree that we honestly have nothing to worry about. Both systems will deliver.
They know exact targets actually. I never said the hardware they have is final, but developers know what to expect in these systems.
So no, I don't think the G5 PCs were an accurate representation of the 360, but devs knew in June of 2004 that the target specs were three 3.5GHz OoO cores, they knew how much memory to expect (at the time 256MB), they knew it would have a 500MHz GPU with unified shaders and 10MB of eDRAM, they knew the expected bandwidth, and more. Again this was in June of 2004, a whole 19 months before the system launched.
So while they don't have final hardware, they know full well what to expect from the final product (pending changes of course).
systemfehler
Member
According to Proelite - they will be a quantum leap better and both use 8xxx GPus ;-)
gundamkyoukai
Member
I don't know why some gaffers can't comprehend the impossibilty of Sony to compete on a hardware leve. Not only is the state of their finances a hindrance, especially compared to the much richer adversary, but the latter has proven its ability to design more balanced and effective architectures. I would be shocked if Sony could come up with something as edgy as the expeted Durango, honestly. But the reality of it is that they do not need to; just make sure the difference is minimal and concentrate on improving OS, libraries and tools. The great first party team will take care of the rest!
Sony finances don't mean they can't make a system as edgy as Durango but as you said it will be if they want to .
The enemy of these system is Size and TDP more than money to tell the truth .
I expect if one system more powerfully it will be small compare to each other .
Can Crusher
Banned
More importantly, Remedy has said next gen will be a quantum leap (always open to interpretation of course, what it means to us and what it means to them will vary), and we all know they are working at least on one of the consoles. But it doesn't matter if they are working on one and not the other, because even if there is a difference, going from a 200KPH(now) car to a 400KPH(then) car, always means the same in the end. It's a big difference.
That's more like it.
I don't know why some gaffers can't comprehend the impossibilty of Sony to compete on a hardware leve. Not only is the state of their finances a hindrance, especially compared to the much richer adversary, but the latter has proven its ability to design more balanced and effective architectures. I would be shocked if Sony could come up with something as edgy as the expeted Durango, honestly. But the reality of it is that they do not need to; just make sure the difference is minimal and concentrate on improving OS, libraries and tools. The great first party team will take care of the rest!
My reason is because it isn't impossible.
A company with financial issues in some areas of the business should not be pulling punches in one of the area where it is strong. If they put out a weak system it will get killed in Europe and the US and they might as well just not bother launching. They need to be competitive.
MS don't have a bottomless pit of money either. At some point the gaming unit will be required to provide a return on the investments made in it.
Yet they are releasing powerful and feature-rich smartphones, TVs and cameras. I think they are going to use less complex and expensive hardware (ie RSX. Cell) to produce high performance as opposed to this gen. Just look at Vita (tech-wise).
Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew
Banned
http://www.vgleaks.com/orbis-roadmap/
Get it while you can!
EDIT: It's back lol. It was stated that they are pumping their webpage up for the big spec reveals.
Agreed, which is why I used Forza and GT4 as examples. PD was already on their second game on the PS2 while Turn 10 were on their first for the xbox. PD had more experience to design more efficient assets and to figure out how to work around the efficiencies in the ps2. Priorities also makes a difference, and that can be seen with both Forza and GT on the current gen.
How good the studio is will absolutely make a difference next gen.
Bigger size or TDP leads to higher cost though. The more customization would lead to more expense as well.
How much Sony is willing, or able to, fund into the PS4 project compared to MS with Durango will make a difference. There's no question in that.
sweetvar26
Member
I just like discussions. I shared in the past threads what I have, now I'm sharing stuff what others did. Anything technical so we can have a discussion. :LOL
New console launch is always exciting. However, I wasn't excited for Wii U as I normally would for a launch.
On another note, didn't I give some information in the past saying how there could be two GPU's, one like a dedicated card and one as in APU solution? Now it looks like we have one big APU? I'm as confused as you guys are...
Those documents of the specifications that I had hold on in the past are as confusing as they can ever be. Then again, I'm not technical, so that explains.
If only it is that simple brother.
iamvin22
Industry Verified
He's reliable. Looking through his tweets now. Looks like he's planning on creating a google handout for Durango if people are interested. Hopefully he releases that soon.
zomgbbqftw
Banned
Specs look interesting. I think having dedicated audio hardware is a good idea, it will free up a CPU thread and I think uncompressed audio on games is going to be less common next gen so that's good.
Also having video encoder/decoder hardware may mean that Sony are shunting their media operations for PS4 onto dedicated hardware rather than using precious CPU cycles. Since AV decoders and encoders can be bought for a few dollars I think Sony are being sensible. I hope the video hardware is compatible with HEVC/H.265 and XAVC (Sony's own 4k codec).
Also having video encoder/decoder hardware may mean that Sony are shunting their media operations for PS4 onto dedicated hardware rather than using precious CPU cycles. Since AV decoders and encoders can be bought for a few dollars I think Sony are being sensible. I hope the video hardware is compatible with HEVC/H.265 and XAVC (Sony's own 4k codec).
Can Crusher
Banned
It rarely ever is. Zone of the Enders 2 wouldn't be possible on a Xbox 1.
I suspect that the systems will be more distinguished by their online services than by their hardware. I'm curious how gaikai fits into that for the PS4.
I realize this is a douchey take for a specs thread, but if you consider the current generation, the difference between Xbox Live and the PSN has really been the defining difference between the two systems, other than price and peripherals.
I realize this is a douchey take for a specs thread, but if you consider the current generation, the difference between Xbox Live and the PSN has really been the defining difference between the two systems, other than price and peripherals.