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[RurouniZel]

Why can't we be friends? Why can't we be friends? Why can't we be friends?

 

[Froli]

Why the Anti-consumer?

 

[Risette]

People were hoping it would be Microsoft's turnaround back to playing games or at least an equal balance of games and Other Things. Probably the main reason for disappointment.

Also it was really bad as a conference, just like all of their conferences of recent years, but it was a downright clown show (or horror show for others) as a new product reveal. The product philosophy seems to be something akin to a pricy TV box that serves as the graveyard for Microsoft's knock off gee-whiz tech, all while chasing a relic of the 90s, "the livingroom." Which is actually very Microsoft, so perhaps your point holds true: what did people expect? Personally, I think people usually had more faith in the Xbox division than the rest of the Microsoft -- the 360 was very... un-Microsoft like in ambition and design at launch despite having some nickel-and-diming schemes. The talented leaders that made the Xbox 360 are gone now, however. The Xbox division is now a regular part of Microsoft in the worst way possible.

 

[pje122]

Arthur Gies, is that you?

LOL I like you, junior...

 

[nib95]

A few of the reasons...

- Forced online activation for all games
- Complex used games system that is anti consumer
- Charged fee for playing used games on non linked profile
- Console that needs to be connected to internet every 24 hours to play games
- Very few games shown at the event
- Massive emphasis on TV, services and non game related stuff
- Rumoured (relatively weak) hardware confirmed
- DDR3 confirmed instead of GDDR5
- No self publishing for games
- Epic PR disaster with conflicting reports from Microsoft and it's heads
- Xbox support on twitter going AWOL
- Microsoft's failed attempts to correct PR with contradicting FAQ's, vague responses, misinformation, lies etc
- Kinect needed to be plugged in for Xbox One to function
- Over emphasis on Kinect
- Always watching and on Kinect is a tad creepy
- Xbox One having non-replaceable Hard Drive's
- COD Ghosts not looking that great (and the only game that had actual direct gameplay shown)
- Xbox One not being backwards compatible with the 360
- Xbox One being called Xbox One...
- And more...

 

[Deleted member 1235]

I enjoyed the hardware reveal and OS discussion.

I did not enjoy the lack of follow up of games.... it would have been a great launch if they showed software afterwards.

and now the used games shit, I only want to read terrible news about MS now and hope they choke on their shitty plan.

 

[GoofsterStud]

The Pre-E3 Olympic medal for biggest fanboy goes to ZERATUL PL who represents the state of delusion.

 

[MarkusRJR]

1. Fees for playing a used game meaning resale value of your games will plummet. It also remains unknown what will happen to your games 8-10 years from now once the game activation servers are down.
2. 24 hour online DRM.
3. No backwards compatibility.
4. No compelling games announced (personally).
5. Kinect required. Not specified whether Kinect 2.0 will work in small places at all. Kinect 2.0 being included is bound to increase the price of the console dramatically.
6. No launch price or launch date.
7. Only HDMI for output, leaving people unable to use composite or component cables.
8. Less than impressive specs.
9. Ads taking up the entire right side of the dashboard. Ads were bad on the 360 but never this bad.
10. Focus more on TV, sports, "social", and less on actual games.
11. MS is pushing indies away (no self publishing and seemingly no interest in getting dev support)
12. Bulky, boring design reminiscent of old VHS/Betamax players.
13. Installs now required before every game, making you wait before you can play your games (installs were bad on PS3, but these will be worse since it'll be the entire game being installed).
14. Most of the services announced or existing will not work outside of the United States. Pathetic.
15. Online still costs money for basic services (internet browser, YouTube, Netflix, Skype, etc).

There are a ton of reasons for the hate. I wanted a gaming machine with media/social features, not a media/social machine that happens to also play games.

 

[ThoughtsOfSpeaking]

Can we please stop equating Dissenting opinion/Criticism/Disappointment with Hate?

Yes, there are many that are being hyperbolic but if you cannot see why someone would be not in favour of one of the most cynical devices in the history of this industry, I dont know what to tell you.

You are still excited? Great stuff. No one is trying to take that away from you.


But to pretend that this is just some outpouring of hate is stifling of discussion and highly disingenuous.

 

[Chuck Norris]

I really don't get all this hate on the internet. Yea, Microsoft's press conference sucked, but it sucked since Kinect was revealed during E32009. Since then, Microsoft's business strategy changed and was directed more towards moving the console out of the bedroom and putting it into the living room. We all heard today the same stuff we've been hearing for the past 4 years... "you are the controller", "put the user in the center of experience"... they just added new ones, such as connected or kinected experience and other bs. The company is clearly not focusing on hardcore gamers since 2009 and GAF is acting all surprised.

I'm not trying to defend Xbox One because with 360 I don't really use kinect, IE, last fm, apps and other crap but we should all at least wait until E3. I mean Microsoft's press conference will suck no matter what but if they will be able to show some good games then who cares... worst case scenario everybody on GAF will buy either Wii U or PS4.

The real problem with the new generation consoles is lack of innovation in the games. Forget stupid Wii U tablet or whatever that thing is... where is the innovation? I know so far only few games have been showed but none of them shows new cool features. I don't want Sony and Microsoft forcing developers to focus their attention on gameplay recording, smartglass, and other useless crap. I want developers to use their time to drive innovation in the games.
In past years we all noticed that innovative gameplay drifted away from retail games to Indie and smartphone games. I think this is the real problem not a console because it has cable dvr box features. It's like hating apple or samsung for releasing phone that allows to browse internet or play games.

And about the "no use game" policy or whatever Microsoft is trying to do... they are probably shifting to cloud service so no hardware and discs are necessary in the near future. With good promotional prices (steam) or by granting gamers ability to sell games it can be done right. I hate Gamestop prices and if Microsoft will introduce smart alternative that will allow to eliminate the middle man why the heck no?

I'm confused... You ask why all the hate and then list all the reasons why?

 

[Toa TAK]

A few of the reasons...

- Forced online activation for all games
- Complex used games system that is anti consumer
- Charged fee for playing used games on non linked profile
- Console that needs to be connected to internet every 24 hours to play games
- Very few games shown at the event
- Massive emphasis on TV, services and non game related stuff
- Rumoured (relatively weak) hardware confirmed
- DDR3 confirmed instead of GDDR5
- No self publishing for games
- Epic PR disaster with conflicting reports from Microsoft and it's heads
- Xbox support on twitter going AWOL
- Microsoft's failed attempts to correct PR with contradicting FAQ's, vague responses, misinformation, lies etc
- Kinect needed to be plugged in for Xbox One to function
- Over emphasis on Kinect
- Always watching and on Kinect is a tad creepy
- Xbox One having non-replaceable Hard Drive's
- COD Ghosts not looking that great (and the only game that had actual direct gameplay shown)
- Xbox One not being backwards compatible with the 360
- Xbox One being called Xbox One...
- And more...

Thanks for compiling a list. I can't believe this even exists.

PS4 here I come!

 

[freddy]

It was a shit reveal that focused on everything but games. Get over it.

 

[Jomjom]

The hate is mostly from fanboys, so I would just ignore it. The Xbox One looks like a lock to be the market leader to me.

 

[Officerrob]

A few of the reasons...

- Forced online activation for all games
- Complex used games system that is anti consumer
- Charged fee for playing used games on non linked profile
- Console that needs to be connected to internet every 24 hours to play games
- Very few games shown at the event
- Massive emphasis on TV, services and non game related stuff
- Rumoured (relatively weak) hardware confirmed
- DDR3 confirmed instead of GDDR5
- No self publishing for games
- Epic PR disaster with conflicting reports from Microsoft and it's heads
- Xbox support on twitter going AWOL
- Microsoft's failed attempts to correct PR with contradicting FAQ's, vague responses, misinformation, lies etc
- Kinect needed to be plugged in for Xbox One to function
- Over emphasis on Kinect
- Always watching and on Kinect is a tad creepy
- Xbox One having non-replaceable Hard Drive's
- COD Ghosts not looking that great (and the only game that had actual direct gameplay shown)
- Xbox One not being backwards compatible with the 360
- Xbox One being called Xbox One...
- And more...

I agree with damn near everything you said, but who cares about the non-replaceable hard drive? They already said you can add an external hard drive through USB

 

[zroid]

karma

 

[Evolved1]

My takeaway from that presentation is that:

1. I am not included in the demographics MS is targeting
2. They are going even further down the anti-consumer rabbit hole.

That really sucks.

 

[Samyy]

I agree with damn near everything you said, but who cares about the non-replaceable hard drive? They already said you can add an external hard drive through USB

If yours dies I am pretty sure you'll have to send it back no? With the PS3 I just swapped back in my stock drive after my new one died.

Thats the only potential negative but I agree with you its not that big of a deal.

 

[GoofsterStud]

If yours dies I am pretty sure you'll have to send it back no? With the PS3 I just swapped back in my stock drive after my new one died.

Thats the only potential negative but I agree with you its not that big of a deal.

Generally I would agree.... However, if I want a faster bigger hard drive to load my rpgs or mmo's then I should be able to.

 

[CSampson]

The hate is mostly from fanboys, so I would just ignore it. The Xbox One looks like a lock to be the market leader to me.

Yup. And I don't even want one.

Remember, vote with your wallet and don't be a hypocrite!

 

[Courage]

I agree with damn near everything you said, but who cares about the non-replaceable hard drive? They already said you can add an external hard drive through USB

link?

 

[Samyy]

Generally I would agree.... However, if I want a faster bigger hard drive to load my rpgs or mmo's then I should be able to.

Im not saying its an ideal situation by any means lol
In the grand scheme of what happened today its not the biggest thing to be disappointed about.

 

[GulAtiCa]

The hate is mostly from fanboys, so I would just ignore it. The Xbox One looks like a lock to be the market leader to me.

What? I think you mean normal gamers.. used game fees and have to be connected once per day turn me off from wanting it..

 

[Man-is-Obsolete]

Because what's to love?

 

[Fewr]

And about the "no use game" policy or whatever Microsoft is trying to do... they are probably shifting to cloud service so no hardware and discs are necessary in the near future. With good promotional prices (steam) or by granting gamers ability to sell games it can be done right.

Microsoft doing Steam-like sales? That would be a sight to behold.

 

[Alchemy]

It gets hate because its pedigree is that of gaming, and for that the Xbox One conference was total shit. Every anti-consumer rumor that has been floating around is more or less true, and there isn't amazing piece of gaming software to temper the negativity.

It isn't rocket science.

 

[Venfayth]

People were hoping it would be Microsoft's turnaround back to playing games or at least an equal balance of games and Other Things. Probably the main reason for disappointment.

Also it was really bad as a conference, just like all of their conferences of recent years, but it was a downright clown show (or horror show for others) as a new product reveal. The product philosophy seems to be something akin to a pricy TV box that serves as the graveyard for Microsoft's knock off gee-whiz tech, all while chasing a relic of the 90s, "the livingroom." Which is actually very Microsoft, so perhaps your point holds true: what did people expect? Personally, I think people usually had more faith in the Xbox division than the rest of the Microsoft -- the 360 was very... un-Microsoft like in ambition and design at launch despite having some nickel-and-diming schemes. The talent leaders that made the Xbox 360 are gone now, however. The Xbox division is now a regular part of Microsoft in the worst way possible.

This is definitely what it felt like to me. The whole presentation was a really loosely strung together aimless display of a bunch of random features.

 

[IrishNinja]

okay one more time i swear

 

[RMI]

My takeaway from that presentation is that:

1. I am not included in the demographics MS is targeting
2. They are going even further down the anti-consumer rabbit hole.

That really sucks.

yup! whatever this thing is, it's not the machine for me. Hell, the 360 hasn't been the machine for me for years now, and I haven't missed it much.

I didn't really have much expectation for their show today, but it was even worse than I could have imagined. Secretly I was hoping to be just a little bit intrigued by something they were showing today, but it never happened. If this is the future of video games, I'm done. DONE. At this point, there are enough great games I haven't played yet on existing platforms to last me the rest of my life, so honestly I wouldn't care too much. Here's hoping that Sony and Nintendo don't go down the same rabbit hole that MS went down today.

 

[ThoughtsOfSpeaking]

all while chasing a relic of the 90s, "the livingroom."

I think with all these discussions, this is probably one of the most important things being missed by EVERYONE

Does the Nuclear family sitting around a television set for any real length of time exist any more, least in anywhere close to the numbers it used to? I cant speak for the states but its basically non existant in the UK.

A typical household nowadays :-

Mom watches her Soaps and reality T.V on her Ipad in the kitchen while cooking..She only has a few hours spare as she works and is a full time mom. She cant sit down because there is way too much to do.

Dad is on his company BB, answering emails and the like. He has been working till 9pm and is shattered, he may flick on some sports, but he is more skimming than watching. There is a good chance he will fall asleep on the couch.


Teenage boy Is up in his room playing COD, He only comes out his room when he gets kicked out a lobby and walks into the kitchen to make a snack. He hasn't sat down in the living room more than 30 mins in over a year.

Teenage girl is a bit of a gamer too, but she is glued to her DS. She willl sometimes sit in the kitchen with mom, but its mostly to chat and ask to borrow money. Mom tell her to ask her father who by now is konked out in front of the television.

Honestly, from what I see the only families that tend to be together in a communal room for any length of time tend to be the unemployed:- People who cant afford a Xbox one at launch.

The whole thing is silly.

 

[indigo-cyclops]

Again, not hate, I just don't think Microsoft really cares about providing quality gaming to people that really love gaming. I've no interest in the other features of the system.

 

[Uncle Rupee]

"Xbox Entertainment Studios"

Not Xbox Game Studios or Microsoft Game Studios... "Entertainment Studios"

Says it all, really

 

[PsihoPerihelion]

It has been an awful day for people who have genuine interest on the console. Between the Sony fanboys (like 95% of gaf) mocking the console thread after thread and MS misinformation (the fuck, Phil Harrison) is better to stay out of the forum until things calm down.

 

[Ra1den]

The hate is mostly from fanboys, so I would just ignore it. The Xbox One looks like a lock to be the market leader to me.

I wonder who the real fanboy is here.

Can we please stop equating Dissenting opinion/Criticism/Disappointment with Hate?

Yes, there are many that are being hyperbolic but if you cannot see why someone would be not in favour of one of the most cynical devices in the history of this industry, I dont know what to tell you.

You are still excited? Great stuff. No one is trying to take that away from you.


But to pretend that this is just some outpouring of hate is stifling of discussion and highly disingenuous.

Seriously, this is the most irksome thing ever in discussions.

 

[NullPointer]

I hate Gamestop prices and if Microsoft will introduce smart alternative that will allow to eliminate the middle man why the heck no?

Why the hate? You can't be surprised - they've been doing it for years. Its been their plan all along.

So again, why the hate?

 

[Ahasverus]

A few of the reasons...

- Forced online activation for all games
- Complex used games system that is anti consumer
- Charged fee for playing used games on non linked profile
- Console that needs to be connected to internet every 24 hours to play games
- Very few games shown at the event
- Massive emphasis on TV, services and non game related stuff
- Rumoured (relatively weak) hardware confirmed
- DDR3 confirmed instead of GDDR5
- No self publishing for games
- Epic PR disaster with conflicting reports from Microsoft and it's heads
- Xbox support on twitter going AWOL
- Microsoft's failed attempts to correct PR with contradicting FAQ's, vague responses, misinformation, lies etc
- Kinect needed to be plugged in for Xbox One to function
- Over emphasis on Kinect
- Always watching and on Kinect is a tad creepy
- Xbox One having non-replaceable Hard Drive's
- COD Ghosts not looking that great (and the only game that had actual direct gameplay shown)
- Xbox One not being backwards compatible with the 360
- Xbox One being called Xbox One...
- And more...

Don't forget: TV service recquires additional hardware sold separately, still behind a paywall.

 

[DryvBy]

I'm a PC gamer fan that loves the PS3 and dabbles in the 3DS. I actually was telling my friend today how much I hope Microsoft doesn't botch it up. I want Microsoft to succeed for the sake of Sony. If Sony is king, they'll possibly pull this same crap next generation. I don't want my games to be tied to an account. I like my physical stuff with everything on the disc so I can preserve it all. That being said, again, I wanted Microsoft to pull something awesome up to make Sony work hard for my business. But MS failed at that. I felt they were pushing a media center that plays games rather than a console that's just fun.

I honestly cannot figure out how anyone can defend this product. People need to quit riding the coat tails of corporations. I'm a PS3 fan but if the PS4 were to pull this exact same crap, I'd make fun of it myself. I have enough back catalog to keep me busy for years. This isn't about fanboyism to me. It's about Xbox fans being screwed. A "so bad it's funny but not really" attitude is what I have.

 

[Marleyman]

1. It was held in a tent ffs..
2. SPORT SPORT SPORT MURICA SPORT KINECT SPORT AMERICA SPORT
3. The console is hideous and looks like a 'House of Next Tuesday' VCR from 1984
4. SPORT HERP DERP SPORTY SPORT
5. Bullshit TV features that have little interest to 90% of gamers outside MURICA
6. "Here's some gameplay!" (cue: 3 minutes of cut scenes)

But.. more disappointed than hatin'. The mo-cap dog was the highlight for me, and I'm not even joking

This attitude is so fucking lame. Sports, Murica...so what? A shit ton of people enjoy sports and like shooting people in a video game. I am not going to go at other genres as that is a quick ticket to being banned however I find it fascinating that sports games, America and "dude bro" shit talking is tolerated around here.

 

[MrMephistoX]

In this thread we have an OP who doesn't understand that gamers are interested in games.

If they'd shown gameplay footage from 3 of their new IPs, with somebody on stage actually playing the games there would be a lot less hate. At least people would see a potential upside to go along with the various downsides.

I'm not even convinced new IPs would do it honestly. I'm predicting, generic western RPG, new FPS franchise, new 3rd person Shooter franchise and if we're lucky new Racing Franchise!

Not that I'm convinced Sony and Japan are bringing their A-Game either mind you considering the fact that Japanese developers have essentially been developing on non-HD hardware for the last 10 years... but I have hope!

 

[Jomjom]

I wonder who the real fanboy is here.



Seriously, this is the most irksome thing ever in discussions.

Market leader is determined from sales and sales dont discriminate between hardcore gamers or casual. You are delusional if you dont think all the media features will play extremely well to the mass market. Sony is targeting way too small a market to be the market leader next gen. Hardcore gamers are a dying breed and Sony as always is a step slow in realizing what the market trends are.

 

[lantus]

I will wait to reserve judgement until the console releases, but it did not give me a good first impression.

 

[Klocker]

people didn't even hear half of what was discussed as they were too busy jumping to conclusions.


this idea is revolutionary and people just are not ready for it.


Time will show that it's not as bad as all are making it and it's a hell of a lot better than most think today

 

[Marleyman]

Market leader is determined from sales and sales dont discriminate between hardcore gamers or casual. You are delusional if you dont think all the media features will play extremely well to the mass market. Sony is targeting way too small a market to be the market leader next gen. Hardcore gamers are a dying breed and Sony as always is a step slow.

This is so true. If GAF opinions ran the gaming world there would be only Sony and Nintendo, no FPS shooters, sports games would be non-existent while indie titles, JRPGS, and mascot fighting games would be the norm. Very excited that this will never happen.

 

[MrMephistoX]

Market leader is determined from sales and sales dont discriminate between hardcore gamers or casual. You are delusional if you dont think all the media features will play extremely well to the mass market. Sony is targeting way too small a market to be the market leader next gen. Hardcore gamers are a dying breed and Sony as always is a step slow.

I hate to admit it but I agree with you to a certain extent...the Xbox One (much like Kinect) is "not for us."

 

[I NEED SCISSORS]

If I leave a shit in the toilet it's still gonna smell like shit in several days time. Probably even worse actually. Time is not always a healer. Just because something has happened at E3 2009 and continued for 4 years does not make it acceptable.

 

[indigo-cyclops]

This is so true. If GAF opinions ran the gaming world there would be only Sony and Nintendo, no FPS shooters, sports games would be non-existent while indie titles, JRPGS, and mascot fighting games would be the norm. Very excited that this will never happen.

This is fucking bullshit, all of it.

 

[Deleted member 8095]

What if their digital distribution is like Steam and they offer sales all the time. That would be cool.

 

[Marleyman]

I hate to admit it but I agree with you to a certain extent...the Xbox One (much like Kinect) is "not for us."

Who are "us?" Hardcore gamers will get their games on Xbox along with Xbox Live and all of the bells and whistles it brings. I am giving Kinect another chance this gen before writing it off, although it is on a short leash for me.

 

[Truespeed]

Whose angry? There are people at Sony celebrating right now.

 

[Nibiru]

It was a really bad press conference and is just being treated as so.

I mean even the xbox obsessed feel this way right? Forget all the wait to see what they have at E3 and trying to decipher the many explanations of whether it can play used games or is always on. Based on what we actually have SEEN how can anything positive be said from a gamer standpoint?

Maybe the E3 presentation is amazing but we haven't seen that so we really should be able to comment on what we have seen and well it was... meh.

 

[AB12]

people didn't even hear half of what was discussed as they were too busy jumping to conclusions.


this idea is revolutionary and people just are not ready for it.


Time will show that it's not as bad as all are making it and it's a hell of a lot better than most think today

Then they should have done a better job conveying their message and showing games instead, we got this Tv Tv sports sports Call of duty.