Fuck outta here with this nonsense. Third parties aren't touching halo, uncharted, forza/horizon, the last of us, infamous, and gears either.Probably has more to do with the fact that software quality is better on Nintendo's platforms and it's harder to sell "AAA" games.
What?
3rd parties didn't "prop up" Sony. They had a mounted investment in the platform due to the insane success of the PS2 and the fact that it established the Playstation platform as a place where third parties could make a ton of money.
3rd Parties continued supporting PS3 through the weak launch because they'd already placed their bets and resources on the platform (and even then, Sony lost a ton of exclusives during this period). This is a completely different situation than Nintendo - who never had that level of investment from 3rd parties to begin with.
A small userbase perhaps isn't, but some of the incredibly low sales of games on Wii U certainly don't paint a very positive future for the platform for 3rd parties, especially knowing the past. PS4 & Xbone still at least have the POTENTIAL to be more viable platforms, especially for 3rd parties.
Bingo.
It's not a conspiracy. Nintendo just struck out with this console.
Because we hear all the time the reasons for shafting Wii U are because of low sales and low installed base, not because of third-parties's bets and investments.
Why does it have to be either/or? I think it's a multi-pronged issue.
I agree Nintendo can be blamed for this situation, but third-parties aren't helping either. Both sides have their issues.
360 and PS3 don't have DRM though.
There are no sides here.
Nintendo fans waste too much time treating Nintendo's relationship with 3rd parties as co-dependent, as though the issue can be framed as, "yeah, well maybe Nintendo's not perfect...but neither are you, 3rd parties! Compromise!"
That's not how this works.
It's ain't the 90s anymore. 3rd parties are the prized hens here. They hold all of the cards. They can choose to support Nintendo and, if they choose not to, there other platforms waiting to cater to their every need.
Nintendo's the one with the issues, and it's solely on NINTENDO to address them. Expecting 3rd parties to accept some of the responsibility will just result in what we're seeing now: 3rd parties going elsewhere.
Probably has more to do with the fact that software quality is better on Nintendo's platforms and it's harder to sell "AAA" games.
PS4 and Xbox One are supposed to replace 360 and PS3.
yet MH3U the best game on the system by a country mile completely bombed. Just because something is quality software doesn't mean it will sell on Wii U. I assume this is why Namco has ignored Wii U for DARK SOULS 2.
Were all the people swallowing this conspiracy born last November?Support was weak before the console even launched though.
Only if you look at third parties as some monolithic entity. The big boys did alright last gen but there were a ton of studio closures. Not saying that everybody should've jumped on the Wii train and rode it to prosperity but there was undoubtedly money left on the table by everybody in the aftermath of the Wii success.It's ain't the 90s anymore. 3rd parties are the prized hens here. They hold all of the cards. They can choose to support Nintendo and, if they choose not to, there other platforms waiting to cater to their every need.
Nintendo's the one with the issues, and it's solely on NINTENDO to address them. Expecting 3rd parties to accept some of the responsibility will just result in what we're seeing now: 3rd parties going elsewhere.
There are no sides here.
Nintendo fans waste too much time treating Nintendo's relationship with 3rd parties as co-dependent, as though the issue can be framed as, "yeah, well maybe Nintendo's not perfect...but neither are you, 3rd parties! Compromise!"
That's not how this works.
It's ain't the 90s anymore. 3rd parties are the prized hens here. They hold all of the cards. They can choose to support Nintendo and, if they choose not to, there other platforms waiting to cater to their every need.
Nintendo's the one with the issues, and it's solely on NINTENDO to address them. Expecting 3rd parties to accept some of the responsibility will just result in what we're seeing now: 3rd parties going elsewhere.
There are no sides here.
Nintendo fans waste too much time treating Nintendo's relationship with 3rd parties as co-dependent, as though the issue can be framed as, "yeah, well maybe Nintendo's not perfect...but neither are you, 3rd parties! Compromise!"
That's not how this works.
It's ain't the 90s anymore. 3rd parties are the prized hens here. They hold all of the cards. They can choose to support Nintendo and, if they choose not to, there other platforms waiting to cater to their every need.
Nintendo's the one with the issues, and it's solely on NINTENDO to address them. Expecting 3rd parties to accept some of the responsibility will just result in what we're seeing now: 3rd parties going elsewhere.
Probably has more to do with the fact that software quality is better on Nintendo's platforms and it's harder to sell "AAA" games.
It's not exactly Nintendo's fault if playing to their strengths scare off 3rd parties.
It's completely third-parties's fault if they bring lame, late and feature missing ports for Nintendo consoles and later blame Nintendo for their failures. If they actually tried and yet failed, then their reason for shafting it would be unquestionable. Now trying to get away from their mistakes using Nintendo as scapegoat is ridiculous.
It's completely third-parties's fault if they bring lame, late and feature missing ports for Nintendo consoles and later blame Nintendo for their failures. If they actually tried and yet failed, then their reason for shafting it would be unquestionable. Now trying to get away from their mistakes using Nintendo as scapegoat is ridiculous.
Nintendo's system isn't selling and thus third parties don't have a wide audience to hock their wares to, quality or not so quality. This is directly Nintendo's fault. No-one elses.
What you and so many other people are doing right now is expecting 3rd parties to bring AAA teams, budgets and games to Nintendo hardware without Nintendo doing any of the work to prove that their platforms are a viable place for it.
Nintendo's system isn't selling and thus third parties don't have a wide audience to hock their wares to, quality or not so quality. This is directly Nintendo's fault. No-one elses.
This is no excuse for feature missing/late ports bombing being blamed at Nintendo.
This is no excuse for feature missing/late ports bombing being blamed at Nintendo.
That's a nice "chicken or egg" argument if I've ever seen one. Nintendo's strategy for the Wii U is a mess right now but it seemed like most 3rd parties made up their minds not to invest heavily before the system was ever unveiled.Nintendo's system isn't selling and thus third parties don't have a wide audience to hock their wares to, quality or not so quality. This is directly Nintendo's fault. No-one elses.
Its very convenient to try and spin the recent DRM stuff as some sinister anti-Nintendo agenda conspiracy. But the reality is its selling like shit and was before all of this hullabaloo anyway.
That's a nice "chicken or egg" argument if I've ever seen one. Nintendo's strategy for the Wii U is a mess right now but it seemed like most 3rd parties made up their minds not to invest heavily before the system was ever unveiled.
I don't believe that I've ever seen a system launch with so few real new, exclusive 3rd party games. Even the Wii had more.
Makes sense.
Of course Nintendo haters will deny it at all costs.
That's a nice "chicken or egg" argument if I've ever seen one. Nintendo's strategy for the Wii U is a mess right now but it seemed like most 3rd parties made up their minds not to invest heavily before the system was ever unveiled.
I don't believe that I've ever seen a system launch with so few real new, exclusive 3rd party games. Even the Wii had more.
If you want third party exclusives, you have to pay these days. Nintendo didn't pay. Also the WiiU launch had a pretty impressive third party line-up for a Nintendo console to be honest. Ubisoft support pretty heavy, EA trialling with some of its biggest franchises, and Acti giving it the full Codblops treatment.
Of course when all sold like absolute shit, the brakes on everything and anything else were promptly slammed. The Rayman Legends fiasco is pretty much a symbol of precisely what happened and third party's reaction to sales.
Ah yes, the ol' one two of "its late" or "missing features" because the WiiU audience is collectively a group of ultra-clued in NeoGAF forum members only. Need For Speed Most Wanted WiiU is the definitive version yet sells worse than the lesser able Vita version. Spin that.
The only thing I would consider to be a bigger factor than the lack of compelling software would be Nintendo's piss poor marketing. The ilk of consumers who would buy a console near launch are certainly going to notice the shoddy/late ports, especially if they can get the superior SKU without throwing down a couple hundred bucks on a new system. Strip away the late/shoddy ports and how many games does the Wii U have?Shoddy/late ports have very little to do with the current state of the Wii U.
Ah yes, the ol' one two of "its late" or "missing features" because the WiiU audience is collectively a group of ultra-clued in NeoGAF forum members only. Need For Speed Most Wanted WiiU is the definitive version yet sells worse than the lesser able Vita version. Spin that.
If you want third party exclusives, you have to pay these days. Nintendo didn't pay. Also the WiiU launch had a pretty impressive third party line-up for a Nintendo console to be honest. Ubisoft support pretty heavy, EA trialling with some of its biggest franchises, and Acti giving it the full Codblops treatment.
Of course when all sold like absolute shit, the brakes on everything and anything else were promptly slammed. The Rayman Legends fiasco is pretty much a symbol of precisely what happened and third party's reaction to sales.
Nintendo also didn't help matters by making a system thats problematic to easily port to, supply finalised dev tools for, and more. Nintendo has plenty of blame to heap onto its shoulders here, unlike the virgin innocent some would have them appear.
Fun fact, its also hella late and available on two other platforms wii u owners likely have for much cheaper.
I appreciate Criterion's effort, but EA couldn't have expected good numbers by any stretch.
Fun fact, its also hella late and available on two other platforms wii u owners likely have for much cheaper.
I appreciate Criterion's effort, but EA couldn't have expected good numbers by any stretch.
3rd party support could also have just this little bit to do with....you know....DRM practices?
Shoddy/late ports have very little to do with the current state of the Wii U.
Ah yes, the ol' one two of "its late" or "missing features" because the WiiU audience is collectively a group of ultra-clued in NeoGAF forum members only. Need For Speed Most Wanted WiiU is the definitive version yet sells worse than the lesser able Vita version. Spin that.
Also, I'm tired of the mentality that the Big 3 have to kiss 3rd party ass, as if they are the gods that control the market.
Microsoft seems to have taken this route, and we have ended up with an Xbox One.
Could Nintendo take steps to make their systems more approachable for 3rd parties? I actually don't know. But what I do know is that Nintendo playing to their strengths seems to scare them off, and Nintendo frankly doesn't care much because of the fact that they can sustain themselves.
Stop trying to get Nintendo to be more like the other two, it won't work, it can't work. They make batshit crazy decisions, but it seems to me that them trailblazing on their own has kept them alive for this long, third parties or no third parties.
Something I've noticed a lot that unlike Sony or Microsoft fans, Nintendo fans seem to have a much more reactionary approach to their consoles criticism and a much poorer ability to self reflect on the failings of their favorite console maker.This is no excuse for feature missing/late ports bombing being blamed at Nintendo.
Don't misunderstand as I'm not suggesting that Nintendo is in any way blameless for the current state of things but my overarching point is that 3rd parties aren't abandoning the Wii U because of sales. Next week at E3 I can guarantee you that you won't be seeing an endless string of current gen up ports for the Ps4 and Xbox One. They'll definitely be some but most of the games that you'll see for those platforms will be new games for a new generation.If you want third party exclusives, you have to pay these days. Nintendo didn't pay. Also the WiiU launch had a pretty impressive third party line-up for a Nintendo console to be honest. Ubisoft support pretty heavy, EA trialling with some of its biggest franchises, and Acti giving it the full Codblops treatment.
Of course when all sold like absolute shit, the brakes on everything and anything else were promptly slammed. The Rayman Legends fiasco is pretty much a symbol of precisely what happened and third party's reaction to sales.
Nintendo also didn't help matters by making a system thats problematic to easily port to, supply finalised dev tools for, and more. Nintendo has plenty of blame to heap onto its shoulders here, unlike the virgin innocent some would have them appear.
I agree with your example with this game. Very awesome game and I enjoyed it. (though you could make a case of it being $60 6-month late game, but even then it's still the best version). Honestly, I'm not surprised it did badly, sad to say. Only reason I have it is due to that $30 EA sale.
But you can't just dismiss that claim of some devs being lazy. Yes, saying that is a cliche these days, but some really do seem lazy. Some games like Sniper Elite V2 are a year old and barely have any feature of the original game. The only thing that game has in common with the original is the single player. Saying it's Nintendo fault for that game selling horribly is just wrong.
my overarching point is that 3rd parties aren't abandoning the Wii U because of sales. Next week at E3 I can guarantee you that you won't be seeing an endless string of current gen up ports for the Ps4 and Xbox One.
The only thing I would consider to be a bigger factor than the lack of compelling software would be Nintendo's piss poor marketing. The ilk of consumers who would buy a console near launch are certainly going to notice the shoddy/late ports, especially if they can get the superior SKU without throwing down a couple hundred bucks on a new system. Strip away the late/shoddy ports and how many games does the Wii U have?even with them, it has no games, mirite?
This is no excuse for feature missing/late ports bombing being blamed at Nintendo.
And how do you expect WiiU's sales to suddenly increase if no quality games are being made for it? Your argument is contradictory.
Don't misunderstand as I'm not suggesting that Nintendo is in any way blameless for the current state of things but my overarching point is that 3rd parties aren't abandoning the Wii U because of sales. Next week at E3 I can guarantee you that you won't be seeing an endless string of current gen up ports for the Ps4 and Xbox One. They'll definitely be some but most of the games that you'll see for those platforms will be new games for a new generation.
The fact that 90% of the Wii U's 3rd party launch titles were games that could be played better on cheaper platforms at lower game prices basically tells you all that you need to know about how much 3rd parties cared about the platform's launch. There were a lot of titles to choose from but the lack of investment was obvious to everyone, especially consumers.
Something close to software parity to the PS360? Maybe the Wii U struggles just as badly even with equivalent third party support. Maybe not.I don't really get what people want from third parties in this thread? To have supported the WiiU with exclusive and totally new titles in the biggest financial risk this industry has ever seen and then have all potentially imploded when people didnt give as much a shit about the GamePad as they did waggle?
