-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Jimquisition: Dragon's Frown
- Thread starter dmr87
- Start date
Stuff like that and the reaction to the dragon's crown review make me hope the game is awful when I finally get around to it because fuck those people.
GoldandBlue
Member
I never understand how people get so up in arms when that kinda stuff happens. Whenever that time rolls around again, I think to myself "I'm sure people won't overreact again." But nope, proven wrong every time.
Another silly video from Jim Sterling.
It's completely fair and warranted for gamers to criticize a review (especially when the review is as completely silly as this one, heavily based on an element that should weigh almost zero in a review). Critics need to learn to take it as they dish it, and polygon quite obviously didn't learn that yet looking at their reactions.
Of course Jim Sterling has to defend the wrong side, as usual
It's completely fair and warranted for gamers to criticize a review (especially when the review is as completely silly as this one, heavily based on an element that should weigh almost zero in a review). Critics need to learn to take it as they dish it, and polygon quite obviously didn't learn that yet looking at their reactions.
Of course Jim Sterling has to defend the wrong side, as usual
OniBarubary
Banned
I agree with him to a point.
I definitely think that people spewing hate and vitriol to an extent against reviewers who lambast things they like doesn't much help the side of argument. Then again, if these people feel there is something genuinely misdone or detrimental to the success of a game such as spreading misinformation or attacking it or bringing up points they feel are decidedly unfair than I do think people need to speak out against said reviewer so that something is done about it.
The problem arises in that being passionate about something can also make you very angry about it. Especially when someone is saying that thing you enjoy is bad, or even worse, HARMFUL to people/games/society/whatever. It is a defensive reaction. I've said it before, but when someone attacks something you legitimately enjoy because of that you are going to feel your hair stand on end because 1. there's no way the quality of something you can enjoy can be bad (though objectively this is certainly possible, most don't want to hear it) and 2. because I truly believe most people aren't terrible people, when someone claims something is sexist/racist/misgoynistic/harmful/bad for people the reaction is going to be ten times stronger because these people aren't that and are angered that someone is trying to say something they enjoy is those things.
It's a real hard line and it's not black and white like a lot of people think.
I definitely think that people spewing hate and vitriol to an extent against reviewers who lambast things they like doesn't much help the side of argument. Then again, if these people feel there is something genuinely misdone or detrimental to the success of a game such as spreading misinformation or attacking it or bringing up points they feel are decidedly unfair than I do think people need to speak out against said reviewer so that something is done about it.
The problem arises in that being passionate about something can also make you very angry about it. Especially when someone is saying that thing you enjoy is bad, or even worse, HARMFUL to people/games/society/whatever. It is a defensive reaction. I've said it before, but when someone attacks something you legitimately enjoy because of that you are going to feel your hair stand on end because 1. there's no way the quality of something you can enjoy can be bad (though objectively this is certainly possible, most don't want to hear it) and 2. because I truly believe most people aren't terrible people, when someone claims something is sexist/racist/misgoynistic/harmful/bad for people the reaction is going to be ten times stronger because these people aren't that and are angered that someone is trying to say something they enjoy is those things.
It's a real hard line and it's not black and white like a lot of people think.
Omegasquash
Member
I mean...dude has a point. Everyone getting up in arms about a bad review is sort of a waste of time.
So you'd prefer to play an awful game just to spit in the faces of random prudes? Seems just like something said prudes would do.
Fantastic video from Jim Sterling, really enjoyed it, he's quickly becoming one of my favorite, if not my entirely favorite, games journalist.
I disagree with much of his overall premise. It's perfectly cool to flip out about a game review that you think fucking sucks, like say... Polygon's Dragon's Crown review, or Polygon's The Last of Us review.
I don't think there's anything wrong with shaming them for their silly opinion.
I disagree with much of his overall premise. It's perfectly cool to flip out about a game review that you think fucking sucks, like say... Polygon's Dragon's Crown review, or Polygon's The Last of Us review.
I don't think there's anything wrong with shaming them for their silly opinion.
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
Stop focusing on shitty reviews so much it drowns out any positive talk about a game.
You can disagree with it, but don't flip the fuck out and go ape shit about it as it does the game a disservice
Ah, so it's IGN God Hand all over again. Who gave the shitty Dragon's Crown review? Polygon?
njean777
Member
I like Jim, but disagree with him on this video. If you are a game critic then you should be able to take criticism of your own reviews. Polygon has shown every single time that the whole crew has to go on twitter and call everybody fucking stupid that disagrees with them, I mean sure some of the people that criticized the review took it way to far, but when I see Arthur, Justin and the whole crew going on twitter and acting like smug assholes after somebody criticizes them then I have to ask, why the fuck are you a games critic if you cannot take any criticism yourself?
Ingueferroque
Banned
What?
peanutbutterlatte
Member
I might not always agree with Jim's opinion, but man I was on his side when Cliffy B was being a little bitch about GoW3's 8. Came off like the ultimate tool because he "knew" the game was better than GoW1 or 2. How arrogant can you get?
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
Yeah the Polygon review was pretty much bad and incomplete.
They are fun games on the hardest settings imo
PirateKing
Junior Member
I'm sorry what? Why do you hope for a game to be awful because a few people had their own opinion about Dragon's Crown? I could care less about both party debating about their opinion against each other.
My copy will arrive in a few days and my body has never been ready since Odin Sphere (Still haven't got Muramasa because no EU release).
Seraphis Cain
bad gameplay lol
He's not specifically saying that people SHOULDN'T criticize the review, he's saying that taking all the focus off the positive reviews and positive aspects of the game to focus entirely on one negative review does the game a disservice, and I agree with that. It's perfectly okay to disagree with Polygon's review (and I definitely do), but when that's literally all you do, at the expense of talking about why Dragon's Crown is a good game, that's no good. Jim's not defending Polygon here. The same review could have come from any other site and I suspect he'd have made this same Jimquisition.
It's basically the Uncharted 3 8.0 fiasco all over again. Or the Twilight Princess 8.8 fiasco.
Plenty of people do.
A reviewer can take into consideration whatever the fuck they want to take into consideration as long as they state what it is.
The polygon review was the best one for me buying advice wise because I didn't realize beyond the disgusting sorceress/amazon designs (I'm fine with sexy, but not creepy disgusting grotesque designs like that. If you are good for you.) I had no idea before the review all the other cringeworthy gross shit like the spread eagle knight which looks like a horrible deviant art hentai drawing.
ReturnOfTheRAT
Member
Treat trolls like Armond White, laugh at the silliness they perpetuate or refrain from paying attention to them.
Or, big or, stop letting other reviewers opinions dictate what you do and don't like.
Or, big or, stop letting other reviewers opinions dictate what you do and don't like.
Sterling's come a long way since Destructoid.
And yes, I will never understand why people want to waste so much time focusing on people who don't like the things they do, or vice versa. If you really don't like Polygon or their review methods or their methods in how they cover games, stop reading it.
It really is that simple.
When gamepro essentially stopped being a magazine of quality in the mid 2000's and started being a cookie cutter formula of old game coverage and reviews that had little bearing of actual game content, I stopped reading it.
And yes, I will never understand why people want to waste so much time focusing on people who don't like the things they do, or vice versa. If you really don't like Polygon or their review methods or their methods in how they cover games, stop reading it.
It really is that simple.
When gamepro essentially stopped being a magazine of quality in the mid 2000's and started being a cookie cutter formula of old game coverage and reviews that had little bearing of actual game content, I stopped reading it.
ShockingAlberto
Member
The Uncharted 3 thing was great in retrospect because 8.0 was really generous.
#realtalk
Of course.
Website who got 750,000 from Microsoft continues to give low ratings to Sony exclusive games. What a surprise.
Seraphis Cain
bad gameplay lol
Well, he's still at Destructoid. But I do get what you're saying. :lol
Truth. It's easily the weakest of the three.
Palette Swap
Member
The best part about that UC3 review is that in retrospect, half the people you'll ask are hyperbolic the other way around and will totally disown the game.
When I finally played the game long after the dust has settled, an 8 is probably what the game was in my book.
The Grim Heaper
Member
I think it was more about the awful comments and the general vibe in the review than the actual score itself.
Which is a strawman argument to create a topic where there's none, as I seriously doubt there are many that do nothing but (rightfullgy) shitting on polygon's ignorant and politically colored review.
And readers are just as free consider him a completely unprofessional and biased illiterate that shouldn't even review a fruit kiosk for that.
You get what you deserve.
Hero_of_the_Day
Member
I appreciate the Final Fantasy 7 music. So, I already agree with him 30 seconds into the video.
I dunno, back in the day when I was big into destructoid and the Burches and Aaron Linde and Sports Saarkar and Brad Nicklestone and Sterling were all doing the weekly podcast, he came off as being the one with the unpopular opinion but seemed really misinformed almost 100% of the time due to his inability to properly articulate his opinions, and often descending into a bunch of loosely related swear words. Now, much later, Sterling seems to be able to get his point a cross in a much clearer way while still retaining his style. It's a massive improvement.
You clearly weren't around during the Simcity stuff.
SolidSnakex
Member
His point is that the game did receive universal praise with the exception of maybe one or two reviews. So if they general consensus is that the game is good or great, then why worry/get upset about the one or two reviews that may have not cared about it? Especially in the case of Polygon which many people say that they don't care about anyway.
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
Exactly this
faceless007
Member
The debacle over Polygon's Last of Us review was a goddamn embarrassment for this forum and he's absolutely right to criticize that sort of pathetic fanboyism.
Not a matter of being upset. It's a matter of criticizing and ridiculing where entirely due.
There's no need to be upset to do that. It's time for game journos to learn that they can be on the receiving end of criticism as well. It's an educational experience.
QuiteUndead
Neo Member
Jim makin' sense again.
Didn't Atlus actually comment on the Polygon review?
Didn't Atlus actually comment on the Polygon review?
I thought his use of that was exceptional and worth mention, yes.
Naw, you do. Siskle and Ebert took a disproportionate amount of flak for a lot of their reviews. Same thing with Rob Redford, to the point where certain shows like MST3K and SNL would make skits based on it.
People have this reaction because the people writing these reviews are higher profile. No one gives a fuck about what SonicFan.org gives Sonic Colors. The people working at IGN and Gamespot and whatever else are more in the public eye, they're supposed to be the universal voices of reason, so it's easy to see why people flip out when the voice of reason of the video game world, this world that people like me and them spend so much time and effort dwelling within, says something they like is wrong. The Polygon review is especially egregious because not only is it saying that they didn't like the game, but that if you did like the game, you are a bad person and you need to get your life sorted out.
? Do you think game reviewers aren't keenly aware that they can be criticized for their reviews? Do you think this is a recent phenomena?
Relaxed Muscle
Member
When you stop considering the gameplay of a game (a good game given the review itself) and enter into the territory of way more subjective things that barely has to do with the game itself, I consider the reviewer is doing a poor job.
And when people does a poor job they should be called for it. Is a very distinct case when reviewers analyzed a game and didn't thought it was a good game and rabbid fans raged about people having different taste than theirs...
I wonder why God of War dosn't get the flack when all females are there to either be killed or fucked or they just get killed by someone else...
#truthfact
And when people does a poor job they should be called for it. Is a very distinct case when reviewers analyzed a game and didn't thought it was a good game and rabbid fans raged about people having different taste than theirs...
I wonder why God of War dosn't get the flack when all females are there to either be killed or fucked or they just get killed by someone else...
#truthfact
Sure, if you say so.
Phil Kollar played The Last of Us wrong and his review is bad, I would never recommend anyone that has any interest in the game at all to ever read it.
And if they were to read it, I would advise them not to take it seriously and seek out every other opinion that they could find instead.
VanillaCakeIsBurning
Member
I can't disagree with any of his points.
It was kind of annoying seeing so many people perpetuating the same negative cycle over and over again instead of talking about the game.
The game talk will probably increase tomorrow when it's released in NA.
I didn't read the Polygon review so I can't really comment on it. I actually haven't looked at any reviews for this game. At most I'll read comments from people on forums but that's about it.
Really looking forward to playing it tomorrow now.
It was kind of annoying seeing so many people perpetuating the same negative cycle over and over again instead of talking about the game.
The game talk will probably increase tomorrow when it's released in NA.
I didn't read the Polygon review so I can't really comment on it. I actually haven't looked at any reviews for this game. At most I'll read comments from people on forums but that's about it.
Really looking forward to playing it tomorrow now.