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[DieH@rd]

Digital Foundry became famous because it gave us FACTS, hard numbers of framerate, resolution, texture quality, effect density, description of console architectures, and interviews with the developers who talked at lenght about their engine's interaction with the hardware.

And what was this article? Almost unnecessary history lesson with few notable data, thousand words about balance, zero attention to the 1st hand impressions about console differences, and a really sad way to start their "The Secret Developers" line of articles. Hopefully next time DF will find somebody that will talk about some more serious things that plague gaming industry [off-sourcing, crunch times, exclusive content ransom by retailers, publisher-developer relations, in-depth nextgen console hardware breakdowns and differences in production, etc.].

 

[SymbiantXenos]

When should be expect the first DF face offs for next gen?

 

[Vizzeh]

Current Gen CPU's faster than last gen (but could have jumped in the same powergap as the GPU's did)
altho, surely because they dont know how to use GPGPU yet to offload some tasks (on PS4)

 

[Green Yoshi]

Really? Do you have the magazine? What does it say exactly...does it say anything else?

They mostly complain about the textures. It looks like a 360-game. Only some effects and the charakter models looks quite nice.

 

[shinra-bansho]

Especially with such statements:

What I find remarkable with this faked emphasis on "balance" is that it silently assumes that the PS4 is "unbalanced" and that its advantage in GPU resources will effectively be nullified by some bottleneck which remains unspecified. The PS4 not only has more raw GPU processing power, it also has a better performing memory architecture, and more performance across the entire GPU pipeline to match the advantage in raw processing power. Which bottleneck can they possibly mean? Apparently, the GPU advantage transforms nicely into higher resolutions across virtually every game that we are getting news about. So where is that bottleneck that the XBO's "balanced" architecture seems to lack? (An ironic thing to say given that the XBO actually has a bottleck in the the size limitation of its eSRAM.)

This article follows the subtextual narrative of the XBO's architecture articles and the Crytek interview perfectly. So I cannot be blamed for being skeptical about the "purpose" of that "secret" developer's statements.

That's the whole point though isn't it. To imply. To insinuate.

It's the magic of PR and semantics when trying to frame an opposing position, or in this case product. I am pro-life, therefore you are anti-life. I am fiscally prudent, therefore you are fiscally irresponsible. I am balanced, therefore you are unbalanced.

 

[chadskin]

When should be expect the first DF face offs for next gen?

If the Xbox One embargo ends on November 12th, then ... November 12th.

 

[Steroyd]

I don't think it will be unusual to see many third party 1080p 30fps for next gen but I'm not so sure about 1080p 60 unless the scope isn't that big, like sports titles and fighting games.

It seems that to chase COD dollars FPS' are now going to be 60FPS, I think this is the first time I've said something positive on COD's influence on the industry and it only took a whole generation.

 

[Crisco]

Wow, dude was getting the benefit of the doubt before, but this is just pure PR. It belongs in OXM or an email from Live, not a supposedly unbiased website. Shameful.

 

[scandisk_]

May the balance be with you DF.

 

[Prince Vultan]

The Leadbetter crusade still trying to bring the good word to the unbelievers.

Secret sauce.

Secret resolutions.

Secret developers.

What a miserable little box of secrets this console is.

 

[Dr. Kaos]

Wow, so much suspicion in this thread.

My take from the article is that, just like today, most games will play the same and mostly look the same on both platforms because they are developed with the lowest common denominators of each console in mind.

He doesn't really go out of his way to praise either PS4 or Xbone and doesn't really join that fight, which is what most people are really interested in and some take it as him telling half-truths.

 

[Thrakier]

Especially with such statements:



What I find remarkable with this faked emphasis on "balance" is that it silently assumes that the PS4 is "unbalanced" and that its advantage in GPU resources will effectively be nullified by some bottleneck which remains unspecified. The PS4 not only has more raw GPU processing power, it also has a better performing memory architecture, and more performance across the entire GPU pipeline to match the advantage in raw processing power. Which bottleneck can they possibly mean? Apparently, the GPU advantage transforms nicely into higher resolutions across virtually every game that we are getting news about. So where is that bottleneck that the XBO's "balanced" architecture seems to lack? (An ironic thing to say given that the XBO actually has a bottleck in the the size limitation of its eSRAM.)

This article follows the subtextual narrative of the XBO's architecture articles and the Crytek interview perfectly. So I cannot be blamed for being skeptical about the "purpose" of that "secret" developer's statements.

What is even more remarkable is that they a) write one console MIGHT have a GPU advantage, albeit PS4 clearly has the stronger GPU and b) that they don't name the fucing console. The correct sentence would be: PS4 has a stronger GPU than the X1, how this will show in games is yet to be seen. Also, they are speculating on bottlenecks instead of just naming them. Why? If there is a weak point to PS4s architecture in comparison to X1, well, go ahead, name it. Would be just fair.

 

[qa_engineer]

Not clicking on the article. This is a clear attempt to garner page views and or spin the power difference between the consoles until there is no longer a performance gap.

They should have just included Microsoft store and Xbox one ads and called this sponsored content. Because that's what it is.

 

[BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO]

Pure damage control

Balanced around disappointment..

:lol

 

[spuit*11]

Wonder how much they got paid for it. Or perhaps they just pay Leadbetter directly.

 

[pooch]

The dev is not crediting that as a plus point for Xbox One.

He's talking about balance in a different, more nuanced context than Microsoft did.

He's talking about software demands being balanced wrt hardware capability. That makes sense.

Talking about hardware in isolation being balanced vs another is meaningless. He's not giving credit to MS's attempt to paint that picture vs PS4, he's taking taking a different tack than the implication in MS's comments.

I see, thanks for the clarification. However, I still get the overall impression of the article straining to defend the less powerful hardware, even if not in the way I originally thought. Looks like many others here did as well.

 

[GoofsterStud]

With pleasure. Have a look at this picture:

The smaller guy has a more balanced size ratio between his head and his body, hence he is beating the shit out of that muscle freak.

Then after launch...

Reality sets in.

 

[Coxy]

"I'm currently working on a major next-gen title"

wouldnt happen to be a microsoft funded xbox exclusive would it?

I'm pretty sure its insomniac, they've been swinging that 35 million figure around for quite a while http://www.insomniacgames.com/insomniac-games-selects-ea-partners-for-new-publishing-agreement/

 

[Nightengale]

I see, thanks for the clarification. However, I still get the overall impression of the article straining to defend the less powerful hardware, even if not in the way I originally thought. Looks like many others here did as well.

The article, as much as it tried to portray a neutral stance, definitely had a slant of bias to it, through very mild insinuations that one console was less balanced than the other.

Aside from that, meh. The article was fun, but for an article supposedly coming from a secret developer, it was very safe and boring.

 

[EGM1966]

Good grief that really is a cunning piece of spin. Really pushing the concept (unstated y heavily implied throughout) that the XB1 will be fine as it's balanced, developers don't use all the power of most powerful console anyway, etc. etc.

The site is really losing any sense of credibility in my eyes as it's very clearly slanting its coverage at the moment.

 

[Ding-Ding]

Why is it whenever I see another RL article about balance, it causes an imbalance in my bowel's?

 

[El-Suave]

Pure damage control

Preemptive, too - even if you can argue about the extent of the damage.

 

[Unknown One]

My prediction for DF next gen comparison is that he would go on and on about how Xbone can do the same resolution or have the same graphical capabilities as the PS4. I predict another FFXIII.

 

[Mung]

I would love to have been at the meeting where MS decided that they are going to push the 'balanced' angle from now on. They must think the public is so unintelligent.

 

[Caronte]

This sounds like Microsoft PR.

 

[shinra-bansho]

"I'm currently working on a major next-gen title"

wouldnt happen to be a microsoft funded xbox exclusive would it?

I'm pretty sure its insomniac, they've been swinging that 35 million figure around for quite a while http://www.insomniacgames.com/insomniac-games-selects-ea-partners-for-new-publishing-agreement/

Nah. Can't be. They've never made an Xbox OG game. I just noticed the person lists "Wii U" in their "look at this stuff that makes me platform-agnostic" list.

Third party developer that's worked on the Wii U certainly narrows it down, lol.

 

[iamvin22]

- balance
- downplaying PS4's massive GPU advantage
- quoting Carmack and not getting that he meant architecture and not performance
- lots of general / basic stuff (which is uninteresting) to make it sound authentic
- several spinning attempts

I doubt that's from a multiplatform developer or from a developer at all.

.

 

[Raist]

Nah. Can't be. They've never made an Xbox OG game. I just noticed the person lists "Wii U" in their "look at this stuff that makes me platform-agnostic" list.

Third party developer that's worked on the Wii U certainly narrows it down, lol.

He, as a dev, might have been working on all these platforms. That doesn't mean that the studio he's currently working for has.

 

[DragonSworne]

The article, as much as it tried to portray a neutral stance, definitely had a slant of bias to it, through very mild insinuations that one console was less balanced than the other.

Aside from that, meh. The article was fun, but for an article supposedly coming from a secret developer, it was very safe and boring.

it's safe and boring becuase Leadbetter has an agenda that nearly all developers won't fall for.

Leadbetter's narrowminded and obsessent cursade to convince everyone Xbox One is somehow more powerful than PS4 squandered a potentially brilliant concept for a series of articles. He had free reign to ask these developers all sorts of questions to get answers and opinions on the questionable business practices of the industry, and he goes on about hardware balance nonsense. What a dissapointing wasts of time.

 

[Giant Panda]

If anything the PS4 is more balanced than the Xbox one. It has a better ratio of memory bandwidth, ROPs, GPU compute resources, etc.

 

[Ashes]

"I'm currently working on a major next-gen title"

wouldnt happen to be a microsoft funded xbox exclusive would it?

I'm pretty sure its insomniac, they've been swinging that 35 million figure around for quite a while http://www.insomniacgames.com/insomniac-games-selects-ea-partners-for-new-publishing-agreement/

I doubt it. That 35m figure is for insomniac games, which had until recently been exclusive to Playstation consoles.

All the listed platforms suggests they worked for somebody bigger such as EA.

There is something bothersome here though. This is the most er balance oriented analysis we have seen, so who are they worried about pissing off?

It's like a go to PR sheet addressing xb1 performance concerns, mitigating them, almost entirely. So why the anonymity?

 

[Raist]

I doubt it. That 35m figure is for insomniac games, which had until recently been exclusive to Playstation consoles.

All the listed platforms suggests they worked for somebody like EA.

There is something bothersome here though. This is the most er balance oriented analysis we have seen, so who are they worried about pissing off?

It's like a go to PR sheet addressing xb1 performance concerns.

Well... EA published Fuse, didn't they?

 

[Eknots]

If anything the PS4 is more balanced than the Xbox one. It has a better ratio of memory bandwidth, ROPs, GPU compute resources, etc.

but does it have the secret sauce?

 

[Ashes]

Well... EA published Fuse, didn't they?

I've worked on PlayStation 2, Xbox, PlayStation 3, Xbox 360, PC, PS Vita, Nintendo DS, iPhone, Wii U, PlayStation 4 and Xbox One

Fuse was HD consoles. It's entirely possible that this dev has moved around. Daft of them to cite the 35m figure. That much is true. Only half concerned about anonymity I guess.

 

[Eknots]

I've worked on PlayStation 2, Xbox, PlayStation 3, Xbox 360, PC, PS Vita, Nintendo DS, iPhone, Wii U, PlayStation 4 and Xbox One

This is just as bad as the people that were claiming they're not biased towards ps4/xb1 because they pre-ordered the other console

 

[shinra-bansho]

Actually, on further thought, the strange thing is how much whoever the "secret developer" is walks on eggshells.

If someone was really giving a candid assessment, with no fear of reprisal, I'd expect much more brutal honesty.

The concept itself isn't bad for a series of interviews, but it really does strike me as nothing more than a PR exercise given the execution and output.

He, as a dev, might have been working on all these platforms. That doesn't mean that the studio he's currently working for has.

True. But the Wii U comment really does narrow it down a bit I think. There really aren't that many 3rd party development studios that have worked on the system by my recollection. Could be someone from Tiburon or something. Or Criterion maybe. Etc.

 

[dogmaan]

I was curious as to who wrote this article, as it was light on detail to me, a programmer, so I ran a stylometric analysis to try to find out whose writing style the author of this article is most similar to.

Each item on the following diagram is one article from a known tech site, each item starts with the authors name, then the name of the website, and then the name of the article.

The diagram is a cluster analysis, the application I have used attempts to group the authors it thinks are similar close together.

The diagram seems to suggest that, whoever wrote the article in the op, is stylistically similar to Richard Leadbetter, that does not necessarily mean the author is Leadbetter.

 

[iamshadowlark]

I really don't get the point of this article.

 

[omonimo]

I missed the point of the whole article. I'm serious. Well, to be honest I have the impression it's the same concept repeated again & again in defense of the xbone hardware specs, but I'm too much paranoic lately toward DF.

 

[Yoday]

Doesn't the inclusion of GPGPU somewhat disrupt this CPU/GPU "balance"? If the CPU is underpowered, but a decent amount of work that is done on the CPU is shifting to the overpowered GPU, then isn't the "balance" rather overstated?

While the PS4 GPU is likely to produce higher resolutions and such, could the massive GPGPU advantage it has prove to be far more important in a few years? And doesn't that pretty much contradict the "balance" argument of this article?

 

[Mung]

I was curious as to who wrote this article, as it was light on detail to me, a programmer, so I ran a stylometric analysis to try to find out whose writing style the author of this article is most similar to.

Each item on the following diagram is one article from a known tech site, each item starts with the authors name, then the name of the website, and then the name of the article.

The diagram is a cluster analysis, the application I have used attempts to group the authors it thinks are similar close together.

The diagram seems to suggest that, whoever wrote the article in the op, is stylistically similar to Richard Leadbetter, that does not necessarily mean the author is Leadbetter.

It probably comes up similar to Leadbetter due the number of times it has 'balance' in it.

 

[MesserWolf]

I was curious as to who wrote this article, as it was light on detail to me, a programmer, so I ran a stylometric analysis to try to find out whose writing style the author of this article is most similar to.

Each item on the following diagram is one article from a known tech site, each item starts with the authors name, then the name of the website, and then the name of the article.

The diagram is a cluster analysis, the application I have used attempts to group the authors it thinks are similar close together.

The diagram seems to suggest that, whoever wrote the article in the op, is stylistically similar to Richard Leadbetter, that does not necessarily mean the author is Leadbetter.

how does this work, and what is the scale ?

 

[ElTorro]

I was curious as to who wrote this article, as it was light on detail to me, a programmer, so I ran a stylometric analysis to try to find out whose writing style the author of this article is most similar to.

CSI-Gaf.

 

[boredandlazy]

I almost vomited a little in my mouth every time the word 'balance' was used. What a joke.

 

[kevlar35]

how does this work, and what is the scale ?

My confirmation bias detector is ringing off the scale.

 

[Coxy]

I was curious as to who wrote this article, as it was light on detail to me, a programmer, so I ran a stylometric analysis to try to find out whose writing style the author of this article is most similar to.

Each item on the following diagram is one article from a known tech site, each item starts with the authors name, then the name of the website, and then the name of the article.

The diagram is a cluster analysis, the application I have used attempts to group the authors it thinks are similar close together.

The diagram seems to suggest that, whoever wrote the article in the op, is stylistically similar to Richard Leadbetter, that does not necessarily mean the author is Leadbetter.

neat, that's awesome, your CSI beats my columbo

 

[Oppo]

The Leadbetter crusade still trying to bring the good word to the unbelievers.

Secret sauce.

Secret resolutions.

Secret developers.

What a miserable little box of secrets this console is.

Wow, I just shivered a little, on account of this post being so fucking cold.

On the "secret developers" thing – why would developers now have any sort of extra incentive to speak up, and break all sorts of NDAs and potentially ruin their careers, at this point? I'm a little suspicious of the frame of this. Plus, yes, it did sort of read like "guys, I know it seems like there isn't anything bad about the PS4 right now, but trust me, it's there.. somewhere".

 

[Yoday]

Why is the author anonymous when it lacks any detail and remains incredibly neutral? I mean, if you are going to write an article without giving your name, wouldn't the point be to deliver unknown details?

Published like an insider piece, written like a PR piece. I don't get it.

 

[Aizu_Itsuko]

I really don't get the point of this article.

What's DF's business?

 

[alr1ght]

I was curious as to who wrote this article, as it was light on detail to me, a programmer, so I ran a stylometric analysis to try to find out whose writing style the author of this article is most similar to.

Each item on the following diagram is one article from a known tech site, each item starts with the authors name, then the name of the website, and then the name of the article.

The diagram is a cluster analysis, the application I have used attempts to group the authors it thinks are similar close together.

The diagram seems to suggest that, whoever wrote the article in the op, is stylistically similar to Richard Leadbetter, that does not necessarily mean the author is Leadbetter.

Can't wait to see which games have better "balance" in the coming months.