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1up Dota 2 preview (Eul works at Valve, Meet the Heroes confirmed)

Archie

Second-rate Anihawk
http://www.1up.com/previews/dota-2-valve-fanboys-developers

From Warcraft III mod to Valve-developed sequel: Defense Of The Ancients is now standing on its own two feet. This new installment (simply "DOTA 2") made its public debut at Cologne's 2011 Gamescom with a huge tournment -- where historical DOTA teams that have been together for years competed for a $1.6 million prize. During the event, we asked project director Erik Johnson and Valve co-founder Gabe Newell a few questions about the game.

Valve -- explains Newell -- got into this project because several staff members were playing the original DOTA and got obsessed with it to the point that people such as Robin Walker (Team Fortress 2 guru), Adrian Finol (software developer), and Johnson actually formed a team and got into a league -- ending up badly stomped, he confesses. At some point, they decided to contact DOTA developer IceFrog under the pretense that they were game developers, but in fact it was just an excuse to send him fan mail.

It didn't take long before they started talking about how IceFrog wanted to evolve his game: By building a sequel that didn't have the constraints and limitations of continuing the development the way he had been (as a mod to an existing game). So Valve said: "Hey, we've got a great idea! Why don't you come here?"

"IceFrog was the catalyst; he's the main reason why we're making DOTA 2" -- says Johnson. "A lot of us are DOTA fans also from a game-design perspective, and at Valve we already have the original creator of DOTA, Eul." "So," continues Newell, "Adrian made sure that the Source engine could support this kind of game, and then more and more people got into the project." He notes, "It grew out of the same enthusiast fan-spirit that brought Rob Walker and John Cook to build the original Team Fortress out of their love for Quake."

Nothing was really "converted" from the previous version DOTA; this sequel has been built completely from scratch. Valve simply took all the work IceFrog had done in the original Warcraft III mod and and re-imagined it for the sequel. The game mechanics, heroes, and core gameplay are basically the same but, as Johnson emphasizes, the team is working hard on the art style -- after all, IceFrog never really had an art team.

Valve is also focusing on the experience outside of the product itself. Johnson explains their main objective is taking all of the rough edges that the original DOTA players had to deal with -- many of which were outside of the game -- and fixing them, providing the same experience but making it more easy to get into thanks to features such as spectator mode, matchmaking options allowing playing with friends, tutorials to learn the basics, bots to practice with and supportive UI for newcomers.

"Simplifying the game would have not been the right thing to do. DOTA has this perception of being very hardcore. It has millions of people ready to play a product with an annual marketing budget of zero. It's never been advertised. It's a product that propagates from player to player, from friend to friend," states Johnson. He continues, "IceFrog's been the sole builder of the project. The community has grown a lot during the time he's been working on it. DOTA 2 is a very long-term product for us, it's going to continue growing while new feature will be added."

"On top of that we're re-imagining the whole world." Newell clarifies that the approach will have more than a few things in common with TF2. As previewed in the DOTA2 trailer, Valve will release several videos similar to Team Fortress's "Meet the Team." "There are a lot of heroes in DOTA2 -- 105 so far, and we're gonna continue producing these videos. There's definitely something with this world," affirms Johnson.

When asked if he or the team had a favorite hero, Johnson replies, "It's funny, we talked about it, it's pretty hard, It's like asking someone to pick their favorite sports team. Everyone has different answers. In DOTA it's not about one hero. It's about all of them. We definitely have stories that we're going to tell in DOTA, there's even a comic that's gonna be released."

Characterization of the heroes already sounds promising. There's a huge amount of dialogue in the game and the team also added a system that allows characters to have specific dialogue, so for instance, if Crystal Maiden and Lina, who have a really natural adversarial relationship, are in opposite teams they will be bickering and saying things based on what they're doing. "We've been testing the game for quite a while and worked on characters' individuality," confirms Johnson.

"While building the game we have been working with about two or three hundred people -- including a lot of IceFrog's original testers from DOTA -- and we tried out many ideas and hero designs on them. We also added all these professional to make the game a hard place to play, but we like to bring new people in the game all the time, both DOTA experts and newbies. The tournament players, for instance, have been playing for about six weeks on a beta build. It's sort of fun and sort of terrifying to see how pro they are at the game."

Newell confirmed that DOTA 2 probably won't ship before 2012, and the business model is still being evaluated. The tournament -- known as The International -- was a critical step in the game development and tuning, and the next step, beta testing, is just starting. It's only natural to expect the game to follow his role model Team Fortress 2's steps, but no announcements in this regard will be made until the game is tuned some more, as result of the public beta test started right after the tournament ended. Valve Time, as they say.

I didn't know the original creator of DotA worked at Valve. That lends more credence to them making a DotA game. (And it would explain why his namesake is still in the game, but Guinsoo's was removed)

Also, I doubt there will be "Meet the" videos for every hero, but it is nice that we can look forward to some more videos. :)
 

markot

Banned
Hm.

Wonder if they will stick with humour or go for a darker tone with the Dota 2 setting >.>

Mind you, either way will be great, their animations and over all quality of the 'meet the...'s are brillllllllllllliant.

Also, I want the TF2 announcer... and characters as heros in the game >.< at least for a special event!
 

StuBurns

Banned
Teknopathetic said:
With Eul at Valve, can anyone really complain about calling it Dota 2 anymore?
I was just thinking that. I understood the complaints, while I didn't agree with them, I think this should end the debate for the most part.
 
No way Valve does those "Meet the..." videos themselves right? Someone please tell me they outsource/have some other studio do them please.
That's a lot of heroes... Precious time, Valve. Precious, precious time.

(but I am so stoked for dat DOTA 2... hell even the new "Meet the..." vids)
 

StuBurns

Banned
OmnipotentO said:
No way Valve does those "Meet the..." videos themselves right? Someone please tell me they outsource/have some other studio do them please.
That's a lot of heroes... Precious time, Valve. Precious, precious time.

(but I am so stoked for dat DOTA 2... hell even the new "Meet the..." vids)
They're in-house.

They can't do one for every hero at the same rate, it'd take fifty years.
 

Archie

Second-rate Anihawk
They could easily put several heroes and their adversaries into one video i.e. Lina/CM and Windrunner/Drow.

Also the dialogue will add alot of flavor to the game. During the tourney Leshrac killed Puck and there was a specific line of dialogue where he said: "Puck, we are strangers in a strange land." Also, Night Stalker killed Mirana and he said "Sorry, but the night favors me." Stuff like that blew my mind.
 

Pkaz01

Member
Teknopathetic said:
With Eul at Valve, can anyone really complain about calling it Dota 2 anymore?
Technically the DOTA they are copying is DOTA allstars and I believe that version was made by Guinsoo. So in a sense yes and no because they got the guy that made the original but they arent making a sequel to the original they are making a sequel to Guinsoo's version.

and the hero interaction dialogue sounds awesome really interested in that, so much potential with that one.
 

StuBurns

Banned
Pkaz01 said:
Technically the DOTA they are copying is DOTA allstars and I believe that version was made by Guinsoo. So in a sense yes and no because they got the guy that made the original but they arent making a sequel to the original they are making a sequel to Guinsoo's version.
What does that have to do with the name? They aren't calling this AllStars 2.
 

Pkaz01

Member
StuBurns said:
What does that have to do with the name? They aren't calling this AllStars 2.
They are calling it Dota 2 but technically they aren't making a sequel to Dota they are making a sequel to Dota all stars. In WC3 reign of chaos when the community thought of Dota it was Eul's in Frozen Throne it was Guinsoos. Valve is making a sequel to the frozen throne version which is pretty different in a lot of ways. Either way though no one can say anything because valve isn't taking the defense of the ancients name and is just using Dota as a separate word instead of an acronym
 

demigod

Member
lol, did they hire Eul just in case they got sued for Dota naming rights? Oh well at least Eul is making money for his creation.
 

StuBurns

Banned
Pkaz01 said:
They are calling it Dota 2 but technically they aren't making a sequel to Dota they are making a sequel to Dota all stars. In WC3 reign of chaos when the community thought of Dota it was Eul's in Frozen Throne it was Guinsoos. Valve is making a sequel to the frozen throne version which is pretty different in a lot of ways. Either way though no one can say anything because valve isn't taking the defense of the ancients name and is just using Dota as a separate word instead of an acronym
I've never heard anyone complain they're making an AllStars clone. The argument seems to always be they shouldn't be using the name DotA.
 

Card Boy

Banned
This needs to come out Asap. Im tired of grinding for shit , sick of runes/masteries/summoner spells in LoL and 80% of the heroes in HoN lack soul and personality.
 

Pkaz01

Member
StuBurns said:
I've never heard anyone complain they're making an AllStars clone. The argument seems to always be they shouldn't be using the name DotA.
Oh I am not complaining I am just saying technically speaking just having Eul's doesn't really save them because the game they are copying was started by Guinsoo. But at this point it is almost irrelevant because no one can really do anything about it, and the dota community won't really care as long as the game is good. The only person who has any right to complain its Guinsoo but he might have lost that when he handed the game over to icefrog.

eurogamer wrote a really good article about dota and how it all started.. really amazing to see how far its come.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-08-16-the-story-of-dota-article
 

markot

Banned
Its pretty great how 2, soon to be 3, of Valves biggest games started as mods for games they had nothing to do with ^.^
 

StuBurns

Banned
Pkaz01 said:
Oh I am not complaining I am just saying technically speaking just having Eul's doesn't really save them because the game they are copying was started by Guinsoo. But at this point it is almost irrelevant because no one can really do anything about it, and the dota community won't really care as long as the game is good. The only person who has any right to complain its Guinsoo but he might have lost that when he handed the game over to icefrog.

eurogamer wrote a really good article about dota and how it all started.. really amazing to see how far its come.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-08-16-the-story-of-dota-article
I didn't mean to suggest you were complaining, I was just addressing the common complaint which Tekno alluded to was about the name, not the game design.
 

Duran

Member
1UP said:
There are a lot of heroes in DOTA2 -- 105 so far

Just thought I'd point out that there are 104 heroes in DotA right now. So either that extra hero will show up in DotA eventually, or there are going to be some exclusive heroes for DotA2.
 

Spookie

Member
*ctrl+f* Beta

:(

In all seriousness though, can't wait to see how they do the meet the heroes even if it does take upwards of a century to put them all out. I guess Dark Horse will be putting out the comic since they are doing the Valve comic which is due in November.
 

deleted

Member
So in one interview he's sure the game will come out in 2012 in another it will come out in 2011 "pretty sure". Valve time indeed ;)

2011 or 12 doesn't matter, just get the public beta out asap and make sure to invite me!
 

Vaporak

Member
markot said:
Why are Eul and Icefrog anonymous >.>?

They're known on the internet by their Screen names; if Valve used their real names no one would know who they're talking about.
 
I always wondered where Eul went.

Good to see him finally get a piece of the money.

They should keep the original name of the Scepter of Divinity.
 

DaBuddaDa

Member
Great to hear that Eul has been working on the game with Valve and IceFrog. I was getting tired of constantly defending Valve's 'Dota 2' move anyway. I hope nobody is bothered by this anymore.
 

Ikuu

Had his dog run over by Blizzard's CEO
markot said:
Wats a control group. And whys there 15 milllllllllllllllion people playin?!
Because there's 15million people in the beta, it has nothing to do with using a large number to test the UI.
 

Archie

Second-rate Anihawk
Kelen's Dagger of Escape = Blink Dagger
Eul's Scepter of Divinity = Eul's Scepter of Divinity
Guinsoo's Scythe of Vyse = Scythe of Vyse
 
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