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23 Times America Failed Black People in 2014

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n64coder

Member
4 is not about fucking Macklemore. 4 is not about fucking Macklemore. 4 is about how much is stings to see a white rapper winning in a year where (at a much higher rate than the norm) white people are appropriating black culture. Miley Twerk Cyrus and all.

Let's say you play Halo, some person in pink armor totally clowns your ass. Every damn time, this person in pink armor makes you look like shit. Like you can't play at all. After a while, you would get sick of players in pink armor. Like you see pink and you like "fuck that dude". Even if this particular person in pink armor ain't done anything, you still wouldn't want to see them winning. It's a rough metaphor that skips all the nuance of racism via appropriation, but hopefully it gets the point across.

I don't understand this reference to pink armor. Are you saying that it irks you that a white rapper won a bunch of awards in a music genre that was started by blacks?

I never heard of Macklemore until GAF made a deal of it. Just not a fan of rap although I do love the blues & soul music.
 

Malyse

Member
I don't understand this reference to pink armor. Are you saying that it irks you that a white rapper won a bunch of awards in a music genre that was started by blacks?

I never heard of Macklemore until GAF made a deal of it. Just not a fan of rap although I do love the blues & soul music.

*sigh*. When someone mistreats you, it's difficult to see someone else just like them being awarded (particularly when the awards are likely not based on actual merit but rather an attempt to appease the audience and remain relevant)
 
So about 4, and please clarify if I miss the point or part of it, because I actually am curious and would like to understand at this point.

Having just read the links and getting a random understanding of those two, or at least the lady more than the guy, the problem is not that they are white rappers who found public success but they (and once again referring to Iggy since thats what they were mainly about) are adding a fake layer of what they/the public would call blackness to their persona that does not naturally exist given their upbringing? As opposed to say what would be considered a normal progression if they were say... I dunno gew up in an area where they would have picked it up naturally? Like I said this is the first time reading anything about them, though have heard the names tossed around before.

Or/and is it that the public seemingly accepted rap because two white artists were recognized multiple times this year as opposed to if a black artist would have won.

If so I get the argument now, but the quote can be easy to see as "because they are white, they cant be rappers" which might have messed a bunch of people up... that and not having a good grasp of the word appropriation.
 

Malyse

Member
So about 4, and please clarify if I miss the point or part of it, because I actually am curious and would like to understand at this point.

Having just read the links and getting a random understanding of those two, or at least the lady more than the guy, the problem is not that they are white rappers who found public success but they (and once again referring to Iggy since thats what they were mainly about) are adding a fake layer of what they/the public would call blackness to their persona that does not naturally exist given their upbringing? As opposed to say what would be considered a normal progression if they were say... I dunno gew up in an area where they would have picked it up naturally? Like I said this is the first time reading anything about them, though have heard the names tossed around before.

Or/and is it that the public seemingly accepted rap because two white artists were recognized multiple times this year as opposed to if a black artist would have won.

If so I get the argument now, but the quote can be easy to see as "because they are white, they cant be rappers" which might have messed a bunch of people up... that and not having a good grasp of the word appropriation.
You pretty much nailed it. The only thing is that there is also the sting of there being much worst offenders out there, people so bad that you just don't want any one similar to win (which is unfair at its core, but understandable). But for the sake of failings of America RE: this article, you got it.
 

sans_pants

avec_pénis
*sigh*. When someone mistreats you, it's difficult to see someone else just like them being awarded (particularly when the awards are likely not based on actual merit but rather an attempt to appease the audience and remain relevant)

This reads like you are saying you dont want any white person to succeed because other white people treat black people poorly
 

Aselith

Member
4 is not about fucking Macklemore. 4 is not about fucking Macklemore. 4 is about how much is stings to see a white rapper winning in a year where (at a much higher rate than the norm) white people are appropriating black culture. Miley Twerk Cyrus and all.

Let's say you play Halo, some person in pink armor totally clowns your ass. Every damn time, this person in pink armor makes you look like shit. Like you can't play at all. After a while, you would get sick of players in pink armor. Like you see pink and you like "fuck that dude". Even if this particular person in pink armor ain't done anything, you still wouldn't want to see them winning. It's a rough metaphor that skips all the nuance of racism via appropriation, but hopefully it gets the point across.

And you're out your damn mind if you think those headlines are okay.

Fucking Drake won last year, Kanye the year before, Pharrell won THIS year for Album of the Year for his work on Random Acces Memories. It's hardly a can't win situation.
 
You pretty much nailed it. The only thing is that there is also the sting of there being much worst offenders out there, people so bad that you just don't want any one similar to win (which is unfair at its core, but understandable). But for the sake of failings of America RE: this article, you got it.

k, cool. Just making sure it wasn't the dreaded "only these people can do this type of music end of discussion" argument cause as someone who listens to random stuff from other countries... that annoys me to no end.

Its a good point, would have had more initial impact on me if once again I was familiar with their work haha.
 

kingslunk

Member
You complaining about "white" people stealing "black" peoples stuff in regards to music is ridiculous.

Quit trying to divide race further by declaring one race owns something. That's just silly.

There is no "black" thing. There is no "white" thing. Just human things.

Richard Sherman got flack because he called another player garbage. Poor sportsmanship is why they got upset. Not because he was over celebrating.
 
Fucking nerds claiming everything as "clickbait"

Go away
The worst part of this is how people like Mumei will then come in with legit long form studies and articles, but then those get ignored and dismissed, too. They really mean they don't want to see or have to do anything at all, but it's easier to just call shit clickbait and check out.
 

poppabk

Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
4 is not about fucking Macklemore. 4 is not about fucking Macklemore. 4 is about how much is stings to see a white rapper winning in a year where (at a much higher rate than the norm) white people are appropriating black culture. Miley Twerk Cyrus and all.

Let's say you play Halo, some person in pink armor totally clowns your ass. Every damn time, this person in pink armor makes you look like shit. Like you can't play at all. After a while, you would get sick of players in pink armor. Like you see pink and you like "fuck that dude". Even if this particular person in pink armor ain't done anything, you still wouldn't want to see them winning. It's a rough metaphor that skips all the nuance of racism via appropriation, but hopefully it gets the point across.
Isn't that a round about way of saying racism.

"Let's say you play Halo, some black guy totally clowns your ass. Every damn time, this black guy makes you look like shit. Like you can't play at all. After a while, you would get sick of black players. Like you see a black guy and you like "fuck that dude". Even if this particular black guy ain't done anything, you still wouldn't want to see them winning."
I know it isn't exactly a good analogy, but that doesn't sound too good does it.
 

Sai-kun

Banned
You complaining about "white" people stealing "black" peoples stuff in regards to music is ridiculous.

Quit trying to divide race further by declaring one race owns something. That's just silly.

There is no "black" thing. There is no "white" thing. Just human things.

Richard Sherman got flack because he called another player garbage. Poor sportsmanship is why they got upset. Not because he was over celebrating.

post racial society confirmed

You haven't been paying attention if you think that's even remotely true in America.
 

kingslunk

Member
post racial society confirmed

You haven't been paying attention if you think that's even remotely true in America.

Of course not. I didn't say that. However getting angry at things like white people winning in rap categories because they are white is not helping the situation.
 

gerg

Member
Not at all. There's a lot of nuance being intentionally omitted from my responses because of ignorance or outright stupidity causing people to miss the point.

I'm not sure if you missed my post on the last page, but I followed the dialogue between you and Valkerionseven, and I would question what it is to "naturally" be exposed to "black culture", as they suggest with:

Having just read the links and getting a random understanding of those two, or at least the lady more than the guy, the problem is not that they are white rappers who found public success but they (and once again referring to Iggy since thats what they were mainly about) are adding a fake layer of what they/the public would call blackness to their persona that does not naturally exist given their upbringing? As opposed to say what would be considered a normal progression if they were say... I dunno gew up in an area where they would have picked it up naturally? Like I said this is the first time reading anything about them, though have heard the names tossed around before.

Is it "natural" to have listened to rap music by black artists on the internet, and use that as a source of inspiration, even if they are not in direct contact with black people? Or is there a certain amount of exposure that you need for it to be considered sufficient?

On the other hand, I do agree that suggesting that Iggy Azalea "runs" rap is a highly ignorant statement.
 
As a black man, I don't care about the appropriation of black culture, so long as it's not done as a means of deriding it or cashing in on it. Some artists are more guilty of doing this than others, but sometimes it's difficult to draw the line between what is genuine appreciation of a cultural aesthetic and what is patronizing it. Likewise, I don't think all black musicians are exempt from also cashing in on the aesthetic to make record sales.

It's an issue worth exploring, but in the grand scheme of things, it just seems considerably less important than other issues affecting blacks in the US. A large segment of the popular music industry is motivated purely by what sells and what the flavor of the week is and elements of black culture are always popular go-tos.

It doesn't incense me that some people see Iggy Azaelia as "running hip hop" or to see Macklemore sweep the rap categories. Regardless of their roots or authenticity, they garner fans. I may rather listen to "oldies" like Black Sheep, Tribe or O.C., but I don't fault those that are able to succeed within a genre regardless of that genre's roots or the artists' skin color (although, again, it bugs me if they utilize black culture as a means of selling their music and not because that's just who they are).
 

-COOLIO-

The Everyman
4 is not about fucking Macklemore. 4 is not about fucking Macklemore. 4 is about how much is stings to see a white rapper winning in a year where (at a much higher rate than the norm) white people are appropriating black culture. Miley Twerk Cyrus and all

and this is a problem because?

are black people not allowed to eat chinese food?
 

Empty

Member
america fails black people time after time. it's woven in the fabric of society and its institutions so deeply, and it's both tragic and disgusting. it's awkward to see some trivial, ephemeral pop culture stuff next to strong, long standing political issues on this list though.
 

Enron

Banned
Yes. A single shitty one in that list makes it about that shitty one. Which is sad since it defers attention from the serious ones...

Did I fucking say that? No, I don't think so. And I don't think anyone else posting in this thread said that either.
 
Yes. A single shitty one in that list makes it about that shitty one. Which is sad since it defers attention from the serious ones...
No, it doesn't. You just want to say that to dismiss the efforts and thoughts of others. You even just went as far to admit you just read a title before completely dismissing the story.

People can prioritize things. People can think about many things at once.
 

itsgreen

Member
Did I fucking say that? No, I don't think so. And I don't think anyone else posting in this thread said that either.

I am saying that. That a far fetched one is going to make the thing people talk about being that crappy one, and people will argue about if that is really the case, while ignoring all the other horrible stuff in that list.
 

rexor0717

Member
Cultural appropriation can be a valid argument, like with people going around in native American headdresses. White people winning awards for rapping or popularizing twerking is not. Is not like people have forgotten that black people started rap, we just live in a society that infuses specific cultural elements into a larger national culture.
 

Malyse

Member
Cultural appropriation can be a valid argument, like with people going around in native American headdresses. White people winning awards for rapping or popularizing twerking is not. Is not like people have forgotten that black people started rap, we just live in a society that infuses specific cultural elements into a larger national culture.
Well, they forgot that black people started rock and punk, so...
 

Macattk15

Member
I'm sure you'll do well here.


Not at all. There's a lot of nuance being intentionally omitted from my responses because of ignorance or outright stupidity causing people to miss the point.

I've been here longer than you .....

A lot of the mentions made in the article are such non-things .... not to mention it just is begging for someone to make a "Blah Blah Times America failed White People" to follow-up with this.
 

ChawlieTheFair

pip pip cheerio you slags!
Punk? The delineation of punk is fairly arbitrary so I think it would be hard to really ascribe it to any particular group.

Eh doesn't really matter because it all goes back to Chuck Berry and Muddy Waters kinda guys. Without them you get none of it.
 

Foggy

Member
Punk? The delineation of punk is fairly arbitrary so I think it would be hard to really ascribe it to any particular group.

Yeah I'd be curious how this is justified. And no, people are not going to forget rap was started by black people, lol
 
With the white rapper thing, from what I've seen it's more about them being involved with a culture without actually doing something for that culture. "Everyone wants to be black, but they don't want to be black." Azealia Banks called Iggy out the other day for her silence on the recent police murder stories.
 

rexor0717

Member
Well, they forgot that black people started rock and punk, so...

This is true, but I don't think rock had a popular 30+ year history before prominent white artists popped onto the scene. Its a different situation, and I still don't think thats cultural appropriation. What was Elvis supposed to do, not play rock'n'roll? The blame should be placed on the record companies that didn't promote black artists. Thats more racist promotion if anything.
 
You complaining about "white" people stealing "black" peoples stuff in regards to music is ridiculous.

Quit trying to divide race further by declaring one race owns something. That's just silly.

There is no "black" thing. There is no "white" thing. Just human things.

Have you ever heard of cultural appropriation?
 

Undubbed

Member
There's a nuance in these issues that requires either experience and/or intelligence. People keep on missing the point, again and again and again. After a while you're just burnt out explaining.

I'll only talk about one thing here and that's cultural appropriation when it comes to white rap stars like Iggy. The problem isn't necessarily that they won something, the problem is that someone like Iggy takes a stereotypical black accent in her songs that's not her own at all... and then wins awards for it. She only does it for style apparently. That's cultural appropriation.

I've noticed a few other white artists do the same stuff in they're music. I mean if you grew up in a place where you have a typical black accent, that's perfectly fine. If not though it just SCREAMS cultural appropriation to me and Iggy is the epitome. She has an Australian accent for christ's sake.
 

-COOLIO-

The Everyman
With the white rapper thing, from what I've seen it's more about them being involved with a culture without actually doing something for that culture. "Everyone wants to be black, but they don't want to be black." Azealia Banks called Iggy out the other day for her silence on the recent police murder stories.

i'm still not sure why that's an issue. going to back to the chinese food example. is it wrong to cook chinese food without speaking out for workers rights at foxconn? i mean, that's definitely a good thing to do, but i dont see many chinese takeout customers doing that. if the analogy doesnt work, then let me know why.
 

rexor0717

Member
There's a nuance in these issues that requires either experience and/or intelligence. People keep on missing the point, again and again and again. After a while you're just burnt out explaining.

I'll only talk about one thing here and that's cultural appropriation when it comes to white rap stars like Iggy. The problem isn't necessarily that they won something, the problem is that someone like Iggy takes a stereotypical black accent in her songs that's not her own at all... and then wins awards for it. She only does it for style apparently. That's cultural appropriation.

I've noticed a few other white artists do the same stuff in they're music. I mean if you grew up in a place where you have a typical black accent, that's perfectly fine. If not though it just SCREAMS cultural appropriation to me and Iggy is the epitome. She has an Australian accent for christ's sake.
This seems totally valid to me, a clear example of cultural appropriation.
 

ChawlieTheFair

pip pip cheerio you slags!
This is true, but I don't think rock had a popular 30+ year history before prominent white artists popped onto the scene. Its a different situation, and I still don't think thats cultural appropriation. What was Elvis supposed to do, not play rock'n'roll? The blame should be placed on the record companies that didn't promote black artists. Thats more racist promotion if anything.

Elvis did steal songs written by Black musicians though. Hound Dog is a total rip. Guys like the Stones used Chuck berry songs. Chuck Berry and the like really have only recently started getting the credit they deserve.

Edit: That's not to say Elvis is just a hack though, in terms of old rock n roll he's my favorite just because of his voice.
 
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