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Games A Halogaf Community Thread: The Old Becomes New

Pfhunkie

Formerly 'As7raios'
May 10, 2014
116
16
490
as7raios.933industries.com
I just don't get how Halo players have resorted to saying they can "live with enhanced mobility" like it's a burden they have to bare. Halo is Halo. If it betrays the core gameplay, it shouldn't exist. Nothing should be allowed to be changed in a franchise like this that betrays the core of the design. If you look at games that successfully adapted, they don't betray it in the way that enhanced mobility does to Halo. The only times where drastic design changes need to take place to the core gameplay are like the jump from 2D to 3D.

You look at a game like Counter-Strike and how the core of the gameplay has gone unchanged pretty much forever. It's just been tweaked and balanced over the decades. It still has a strong playerbase, it has a strong eSports scene, and if a new one came out with prettier graphics that stayed true to CS:GO's balance, it would generate a lot of hype. When it comes to the competitive multiplayer, no matter what people say, I think what Halo needs is to honestly go back to its roots in its gameplay with prettier graphics and a strong focus on giving players more options on how they want to play the game. If Halo Infinite comes out with a proper dev kit, a proper server browser, and a multiplayer with classic Halo intact, I think it has the potential to sell really, really well.

I've had long time friends that I used to play Halo with that aren't even willing to take a glance at Halo Infinite because they know it's not going to be "really Halo". Everyone I talk to, even people who aren't huge Halo fans, clearly have the impression that Halo isn't really Halo anymore like it's a band that has changed its members too many times to be honestly considered the same band that released the albums you love. However, when they heard MCC was coming out on PC, they were hyped about it.

I think it's important to take a step back and realize that the decline of Halo started with Halo: Reach. Many of us, myself included, loved Reach but we know that armor abilities caused a giant rift that has been growing since. We can debate all day but when I ask everyone around me (online and in person) that had any experience playing the original Halo games why they aren't interested in playing the game, it always comes back to armor abilities (including sprint). Always. Every single time. No exception.
 
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jdouglas

Member
Apr 14, 2012
543
2
555
Huh. First time I log in in a long time to post about how Reach ruined halo by introducing sprint, bloom, armor abilities and the poster above me beats me to it.

Anyway, no need to reinvent the wheel. Just look at Call of Duty Warzone. Setting records while changing nothing for the last 10 years.

Too bad for corporate politics or whatever was going on behind the scenes that caused such massive disconnect from reality, and incredible inflexibility, lack of reflection and introspection, accountability, that prevented 343 from admitting Reach was a monumental mistake.
 
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-Arcadia-

Gold Member
Aug 20, 2019
3,920
12,104
645
On a lark, I figured I’d install the MCC and play the Halo 1 visual remake, despite all the issues I’ve heard with both. Give it a chance, you know?

I’m really glad I did. Those issues remain a thing (this redo at times has some of the most controversial art choices I’ve ever seen for this type of thing), but being away from Halo for so long, about ten years or so, I’ve just started to fall in love all over again.

Halo 1 is doing that thing where it slowly takes over your life to me again. When you’re not playing it, you’re thinking about it, and wanting to get home to immerse yourself in it. It isn’t exactly 2001 all over again, as things have noticeably aged, but the effect is still there.

It’s just an incredibly well-paced, well-designed game, that draws you into an experience of continuous adventure and wonder. I don’t know that any subsequent Halo game made you feel like you were on an epic, singular journey like this.

Likewise, for as much as I can and will bitch about some art style choices, the fact is that the original has been dated to the point where it’s visuals are a pretty big minus too — not so much the indoor visuals, but the game’s once beautiful depictions of nature seem pretty flat, retro, and simplistic these days, even if Bungie’s art direction is absolutely on point.

Seeing the game reinvigorated with something closer to a modern game (this version is quite old itself, but holds up generally well) is fantastic, then. It gives a whole new life to a game that I’ve been through countless times before, brings it in line with the other Halo games, and most importantly, expresses the vision in a way that original Xbox hardware never could.

Online multiplayer for the first has also been a trip. Did you guys know there were other Halo 1 maps besides Blood Gulch? 😋 I’ve never really got the chance to explore this multiplayer in-depth, in terms of all the different modes and maps, because of that Team Slayer LAN Party obsession back in the day, and it’s quite fun, if weapon limited. It’s even pulled me away from Fortnite, which is quite the accomplishment for a twenty year old game.

IDK. I don’t want to ramble. I just wanted to share how much life this old classic still has in it, and how much I’m enjoying it. For all the missteps of the MCC and 343, it’s pretty special that I can be fully immersed in every aspect of Halo 1, twenty years after the fact, on a modern console.
 

Cutty Flam

Member
Dec 3, 2019
1,039
932
440
If all else fails with Halo Infinite (doubt it will be too bad, hopefully and likely they finally nail it with a Halo game and celebrate / all is well) I’m sure MCC will be available for the Xbox Series X
 
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-Arcadia-

Gold Member
Aug 20, 2019
3,920
12,104
645
If all else fails with Halo Infinite (doubt it will be too bad, hopefully and likely they finally nail it with a Halo game and celebrate / all is well) I’m sure MCC will be available for the Xbox Series X
Fundamentally, it should be backwards compatible. So, worst case scenario 4K/60 for all games.

An update for 120FPS would be pretty sweet, though...
 
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II_JumPeR_I

Member
Dec 20, 2018
342
381
320
Germany
I just don't get how Halo players have resorted to saying they can "live with enhanced mobility" like it's a burden they have to bare. Halo is Halo. If it betrays the core gameplay, it shouldn't exist. Nothing should be allowed to be changed in a franchise like this that betrays the core of the design. If you look at games that successfully adapted, they don't betray it in the way that enhanced mobility does to Halo. The only times where drastic design changes need to take place to the core gameplay are like the jump from 2D to 3D.

You look at a game like Counter-Strike and how the core of the gameplay has gone unchanged pretty much forever. It's just been tweaked and balanced over the decades. It still has a strong playerbase, it has a strong eSports scene, and if a new one came out with prettier graphics that stayed true to CS:GO's balance, it would generate a lot of hype. When it comes to the competitive multiplayer, no matter what people say, I think what Halo needs is to honestly go back to its roots in its gameplay with prettier graphics and a strong focus on giving players more options on how they want to play the game. If Halo Infinite comes out with a proper dev kit, a proper server browser, and a multiplayer with classic Halo intact, I think it has the potential to sell really, really well.

I've had long time friends that I used to play Halo with that aren't even willing to take a glance at Halo Infinite because they know it's not going to be "really Halo". Everyone I talk to, even people who aren't huge Halo fans, clearly have the impression that Halo isn't really Halo anymore like it's a band that has changed its members too many times to be honestly considered the same band that released the albums you love. However, when they heard MCC was coming out on PC, they were hyped about it.

I think it's important to take a step back and realize that the decline of Halo started with Halo: Reach. Many of us, myself included, loved Reach but we know that armor abilities caused a giant rift that has been growing since. We can debate all day but when I ask everyone around me (online and in person) that had any experience playing the original Halo games why they aren't interested in playing the game, it always comes back to armor abilities (including sprint). Always. Every single time. No exception.
Couldnt agree more. I was a diehard Halo fan until 343 Industries and all their fuck ups happened. I really dont have any faith in Infinite... Changing the ArtStyle doesnt hype me... show me that they care about the Halo legacy and that they are willing to give the classic gameplay style another chance...
Im tired and exhausted of having to hope for proper Halo game...

Im still waiting for a proper sequel to Halo 3. Halo 4 wasnt that to me in my eyes.
 
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Jul 6, 2015
4,386
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If all else fails with Halo Infinite (doubt it will be too bad, hopefully and likely they finally nail it with a Halo game and celebrate / all is well) I’m sure MCC will be available for the Xbox Series X
MCC 2 with H3A, all 6 games on disc (they can leave out Halo 5), and the buggy achievements finally fixed. Do it Microsoft.
 

Ho Kogan

Neo Member
Apr 28, 2020
8
12
85
New here but have been a Halo fan for ages. My two cents on Infinite are that I'm a bit beyond caring about the gameplay as I feel it's a losing battle at this point, as much as it sucks to say. I'd prefer sprint and all the other stuff to not be there but I just don't think it's gonna happen. Personally as someone who’s primarily into the campaigns these days, I just want them to unfuck the story. Halo 5's was so atrocious it nearly killed my interest in the series. I like what I’ve seen from Infinite so far with how it seems to be taking inspiration from the old games, and there’s small signs they’re gonna be reversing the main issue I had with Halo 5 (evil Cortana), but the lack of actual gameplay and just info in general is worrying to me. Pretty sure the toylines have revealed more about the game than the trailers have, which is a bit silly.

As for MCC, I don’t even know what to think at this point. H2A campaign runs pretty well on my PC but it’s a horrorshow on my Xbox One X with frequent massive framerate drops. I’d say it must be the hardware but it didn’t used to be this way, as I remember it running decently when it released on my launch Xbox One. Hopefully they either patch it or the Series X will be able to power through… whatever is going on. Haven’t tried the multiplayer at all yet but I hear it has a lot of problems too.
 
Jul 6, 2015
4,386
1,819
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New here but have been a Halo fan for ages. My two cents on Infinite are that I'm a bit beyond caring about the gameplay as I feel it's a losing battle at this point, as much as it sucks to say. I'd prefer sprint and all the other stuff to not be there but I just don't think it's gonna happen. Personally as someone who’s primarily into the campaigns these days, I just want them to unfuck the story. Halo 5's was so atrocious it nearly killed my interest in the series. I like what I’ve seen from Infinite so far with how it seems to be taking inspiration from the old games, and there’s small signs they’re gonna be reversing the main issue I had with Halo 5 (evil Cortana), but the lack of actual gameplay and just info in general is worrying to me. Pretty sure the toylines have revealed more about the game than the trailers have, which is a bit silly.
I just want them to fix the gameplay on legendary. Halo 5 has the worst legendary gameplay out of any game in the series except for Halo 2. Every fight just turns into a long range battle and you have to hide behind cover, running and gunning is so discouraged in that game its insane. I did a full Halo marathon and after playing Halo 5 on legendary I went to Halo ODST legendary and immediately I was like holy shit I can run and gun again without getting instantly killed!
 

Ho Kogan

Neo Member
Apr 28, 2020
8
12
85
I just want them to fix the gameplay on legendary. Halo 5 has the worst legendary gameplay out of any game in the series except for Halo 2. Every fight just turns into a long range battle and you have to hide behind cover, running and gunning is so discouraged in that game its insane. I did a full Halo marathon and after playing Halo 5 on legendary I went to Halo ODST legendary and immediately I was like holy shit I can run and gun again without getting instantly killed!
I think that was a symptom of the (poorly executed) squad system - you could really tell the game was tuned for 4 players because of how often they would just flood the arenas with enemies to an obnoxious degree. The same thing also happened in Spartan Ops.

I know 343 initially said they'd be keeping the squad system for future games but with how poorly received it was and how IIRC the main guy behind it left the studio recently I wonder if they're pulling back from it. Plus there's the fact that the promotional material has only focused on Chief with no Blue Team/Osiris running around.
 
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