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Age of Empires Castle Siege announced

Soph

Member
May 7, 2014
1,173
1
0
Please don't torture my favourite game series anymore Microsoft... why... why O_O
 

Barack Lesnar

Banned
Jun 7, 2010
19,181
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Company of Heroes 2 sold 380,000 copies in the first 5 days.

Age of Empires has a much larger mindshare than that game.
"As of March 31, 2014, the game has sold 680,000 copies in Europe and North America.[25]"

Like I was saying, the genre is dead. Spending 2 or 3 years developing a AAA game to sell 700k copies isn't going to get it done. It sucks, RTS is one of my fav genres. I still remember playing Red Alert over a 28.8 modem.


I also don't understand why a new AoE needs to be a "massive AAA sequel". That seems like arbitrarily setting the bar to further your point.
Age of Empires IV would be a huge undertaking. Minimum 2-3 years development, that's a AAA sequel. How else would they do the franchise justice?
 

Sir TapTap

Member
Jun 17, 2014
19,094
0
425
USA
sirtaptap.com
Bring back good memories of another game.

Oh man, Lords of the Realm 2 was sweet. I'm sure I've long since lost the disk like most of my early PC games.

Don't worry, 8 people will buy the eventual PC port on the Windows Store.
It will already be out on the Windows Store, I guess for touch devices only? But it's right in the trailer. I guess I could play it on my Surface Pro 3...then delete it and download Age of Empires 2 HD instead...
 

Vhalyar

Member
Jul 17, 2009
1,578
0
0
Potentially? The same people who give Supercell this much on a daily basis.



The game's not for you, but it is for someone. And MS has judged that this "someone" is a more lucrative market than you are.
 

Sentenza

Member
Dec 3, 2011
14,035
686
685
"As of March 31, 2014, the game has sold 680,000 copies in Europe and North America.[25]"

Like I was saying, the genre is dead. Spending 2 or 3 years developing a AAA game to sell 700k copies isn't going to get it done.
You keep making ass pull claims about the market and its reasons. Where's your proof about the genre being dead?
Starcraft 2 sold several millions. Age of Empire used to be arguably the biggest RTS franchise just behind Blizzard products, and it had the differentiating factor of appealing to a vastly different audience ranging from core gamers to middle age people.
Age of Empires III had a lukewarm reception, was heavily criticzed by most core fans of the franchise and released in a historical moment where PC gaming was arguably at its worst in term of popularity and sales and STILL managed to sell over two million copies.

SO, care to point what's exactly "delusional" about my claim that a *good* AoE today could sell above two million copies?
Possibly without making shit up in the process.
Because I don't just think I'm not delusional, I actually think I'm being reasonably conservative, too.
 

mkenyon

Banned
Feb 9, 2010
19,031
0
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Age of Empires IV would be a huge undertaking. Minimum 2-3 years development, that's a AAA sequel. How else would they do the franchise justice?
By making a solid game with a smaller budget, mainly coming from the graphics/art side of things.

Making it a game that is accessible to tons of people on a varying level of hardware with solid mechanics seems like a much better bet.

I think your arbitrary "AAA or die" stance is the source of your confusion here.
 

Maztorre

Member
Feb 12, 2006
1,547
0
0
34
www.selectbutton.net
Age of Empires IV would be a huge undertaking. Minimum 2-3 years development, that's a AAA sequel. How else would they do the franchise justice?
You do not know how game development works if you think the financial requirements for an RTS in terms of content are anywhere near those for a typical modern AAA title. Most of the time and cost requirements for AAA games are related to the huge amount of unique asset creation required to build a linear cinematic experience of any decent length without repetition. An RTS game like AoE is intrinsically cheaper to develop because a huge amount of the content is fundamentally designed to be experienced repeatedly (same 3-4 tilesets required for an entire campaign of maps, same sets of models and voice sample sets used for units, most of which are shared among the factions in the game) instead of linearly.
 

Fox_Mulder

Rockefellers. Skull and Bones. Microsoft. Al Qaeda. A Cabal of Bankers. The melting point of steel. What do these things have in common? Wake up sheeple, the landfill wasn't even REAL!
Jun 22, 2010
2,022
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nope nope nope
 

Kinthalis

Banned
Jun 13, 2013
4,750
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USA
"As of March 31, 2014, the game has sold 680,000 copies in Europe and North America.[25]"

Like I was saying, the genre is dead. Spending 2 or 3 years developing a AAA game to sell 700k copies isn't going to get it done. It sucks, RTS is one of my fav genres. I still remember playing Red Alert over a 28.8 modem.



Age of Empires IV would be a huge undertaking. Minimum 2-3 years development, that's a AAA sequel. How else would they do the franchise justice?
Those are almost 700,000 copies in ONE month. Rome 2 has sold well over 1.5 million copies by now in about 8 months.

We're not asking for some ridiculous Halo 5 budget. You can make a really good strategy game with a small, talented team in a couple of years.

For 5-10 million dollars and with the right team you can make a kick ass sequel to this game, and you can EASILY double your investment - ~175,000 - 300,000 sales at $40 should do it and that game would sell a LOT more than 175,000 copies.
 

Barack Lesnar

Banned
Jun 7, 2010
19,181
0
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By making a solid game with a smaller budget, mainly coming from the graphics/art side of things.

Making it a game that is accessible to tons of people on a varying level of hardware with solid mechanics seems like a much better bet.

I think your arbitrary "AAA or die" stance is the source of your confusion here.
AoE games are massive. I don't know how you could make a real sequel with a smaller budget. That's a bold claim to make... a lot easier said than done.

Those are almost 700,000 copies in ONE month. Rome 2 has sold well over 1.5 million copies by now in about 8 months.

We're not asking for some ridiculous Halo 5 budget. You can make a really good strategy game with a small, talented team in a couple of years.
CoH2 released on June 25, 2013. That quote of its sales says as of "March 31, 2014". Correct me if I'm wrong but that's not one month.
 

mkenyon

Banned
Feb 9, 2010
19,031
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]AoE games are massive[/B]. I don't know how you could make a real sequel with a smaller budget. That's a bold claim to make... a lot easier said than done.
This is categorically untrue. They're massive in terms of mindshare, absolutely. RTS games are naturally less intensive in terms of asset creation than any AAA today.
 

Barack Lesnar

Banned
Jun 7, 2010
19,181
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This is categorically untrue. They're massive in terms of mindshare, absolutely. RTS games are naturally less intensive in terms of asset creation than any AAA today.
AoE3 had what, 8 nations? Each with some distinct units. It had natives, it had a campaign, multi-player, and really good graphics for its time, easily the best of any RTS out when it released...not even close. If you want them to make some barebones sequel with average graphics for $5 mil or whatever that guy above said, then don't call it Age of Empires IV.
 

NaDannMaGoGo

Member
Oct 31, 2013
6,201
0
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This is categorically untrue. They're massive in terms of mindshare, absolutely. RTS games are naturally less intensive in terms of asset creation than any AAA today.
I really don't agree with that. RTSs require a ton of models, including a lot of different animations if they want to be considered high quality. Sure, it doesn't have to be as much as say Starcraft 2, but a proper Age of Empire game would still have lots of assets.
 

AdrianWerner

Banned
Dec 27, 2004
17,232
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www.gry-online.pl
T
The reason it's irrelevant is because gaming habits have changed. Mobas and F2P are huge now. The RTS genre is a fraction of what it was in 1999, which is why it's silly to compare sales of a game from 1999 to today.
Ermm...look at how crazy Starcraft 2 sales have been . It's the fastest selling RT of all time an. AoE is the second biggest IP in tje genre. If Starcraft 2 still sold like crazy new AoE would too. Especially since strategy games are booming right now and pcgaming as a whole completely dwarfs the state it was in 2000.
You got petite indie strategy games like Reus selling 700K, ,Civ V is nearing 6 mlns and Total Wars are constantly increasing their sales too.

The reason why Microsoft won't make the game is simple:Xbox. Nothing else. They see PC gaming as direct competition to their console, so every dolar spent on PC gaming is not only a dolar that could have been spent on Xbox, but it's a dolar spent againt Xbox. AoE wouldn't work on Xbox,same with Flight Simulator. So they get killed, despite the fact that they were highly profitable.]

Also...this is RTS genre, not open world sandbox genre. "AAA" level here is very low, with team counting dozens, not hundreds people and budget not needing to be more than 10 mln dollars. Those are very cheap games to make. Enough that they can bring profit with even 1 mln units,let alone 3-4 this could easily sell in entire lifetime
 

Sentenza

Member
Dec 3, 2011
14,035
686
685
You people sure do love to whine about mobile games, don't you?
To be honest I mostly like to ignore mobile games.
It's just painful when you have to watch a franchise you used to love going to die in the mobile gaming graveyard.
 

UnblessedSoul

Member
Dec 6, 2009
2,989
0
0
Uk
steamcommunity.com
Looks like they didn't learn from age of empires online, you don't take a popular pc franchise and turn it into f2p mess, they should have continued to evolve the game every few years on pc as a full paid game with expansion dlc, and maybe as a side project develop something related to aoe on mobile/tablet if you wish. I'd fire all microsoft management who green lighted these decisions.
 

Barack Lesnar

Banned
Jun 7, 2010
19,181
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Ermm...look at how crazy Starcraft 2 sales have been . It's the fastest selling RT of all time an. AoE is the second biggest IP in tje genre. If Starcraft 2 still sold like crazy new AoE would too. Especially since strategy games are booming right now and pcgaming as a whole completely dwarfs the state it was in 2000.
You got petite indie strategy games like Reus selling 700K, ,Civ V is nearing 6 mlns and Total Wars are constantly increasing their sales too.
That's Starcraft. It's like using Diablo 3's 15-20 million sales as a baseline. Blizzard is in another stratosphere in terms of sales.

By the way, anecdotal of course but Heart of the Swarm was the first Blizzard RTS game (full or expansion, and including Warcraft 1-3) that I never bought, which was something I never thought could happen.

The reason why Microsoft won't make the game is simple:Xbox. Nothing else. They see PC gaming as direct competition to their console, so every dolar spent on PC gaming is not only a dolar that could have been spent on Xbox, but it's a dolar spent againt Xbox. AoE wouldn't work on Xbox,same with Flight Simulator. So they get killed, despite the fact that they were highly profitable.
My only question for this is how could AoE be competition to their Xbox? It's a genre that's non-existent on consoles. A full-fledged AoE4 sequel would have no impact on Xbox at all in terms of competition.
 

Kinthalis

Banned
Jun 13, 2013
4,750
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USA
That's Starcraft. It's like using Diablo 3's 15-20 million sales as a baseline. Blizzard is in another stratosphere in terms of sales.

By the way, anecdotal of course but Heart of the Swarm was the first Blizzard RTS game (full or expansion) that I never bought, which was something I never thought could happen.


My only question for this is how could AoE be competition to their Xbox? It's a genre that's non-existent on consoles. A full-fledged AoE4 sequel would have no impact on Xbox at all in terms of competition.
I don't think they would see it as competition so much as simply resources that could be going to improve that console's offerings.

I think even a budget as high as 25 million for this game would end up returning a really nice profit for them.
 

inky

Member
Dec 20, 2010
23,493
0
0
(*< - - - - - -
steamcommunity.com
You people sure do love to whine about mobile games, don't you?
There are some great mobile games out there.

When publishers take beloved franchises they are doing nothing with only to crap on the name in their transparent attempts to clone success, you can bet fans of said franchises are not going to like it.

Doesn't mean they are just whining about mobile games because they are mobile games, but I'm pretty sure you can't understand those reasons. You just like to whine about the whiners =)
 

Open Source

Banned
Jun 11, 2004
3,846
0
0
Oakland, CA
You people sure do love to whine about mobile games, don't you?
I think it's more about the opportunity cost of development dollars and IPs being used for mobile F2P shitware. EA effectively killed the Dungeon Keeper IP when they attached it to one of those games, practically guaranteeing there won't be a real DK game for a long time. I figured Microsoft did the same with AoE Online, but this should hammer the nails into the coffin.
 

Sentenza

Member
Dec 3, 2011
14,035
686
685
That's Starcraft. It's like using Diablo 3's 15-20 million sales as a baseline. Blizzard is in another stratosphere in terms of sales.
Are you even trying to pay any attention to the discussion?
Two distinct people already pointed to you that AoE used to be the second biggest franchise in genre.
Not to mention no one is predicting to see a new AoE dwarfing Starcraft in sales, which is why my estimation -the one you labeled as "delusional"- was of "merely" two millions copies sold, against the several millions sold by Starcraft II (one million just in the first day, something like 4,5 in the first month).

My only question for this is how could AoE be competition to their Xbox? It's a genre that's non-existent on consoles.
That's precisely the point. By not being on consoles and being something capable of remembering to people that Xbox isn't the alpha and omega of gaming, it implicitly becomes a "competing product" to the Xbox brand for Microsoft.
Or at least that's how they used to act in the past decade. hard to say if things are going to change now.
 

AdrianWerner

Banned
Dec 27, 2004
17,232
0
0
www.gry-online.pl
That's Starcraft. It's like using Diablo 3's 15-20 million sales as a baseline. Blizzard is in another stratosphere in terms of sales.
And AoE is another stratosphere in terms of sales compared to other RTSes aside from Starcraft. It's like saying investing in Assassin's Creed doesn't make sense because they sell less than Call of Duty titles each year. Sure...AC isn't as big, but it's still ridiculously massive IP that has no problem making huge profit with each entry. AoE is the same in RTS genre.

T
My only question for this is how could AoE be competition to their Xbox? It's a genre that's non-existent on consoles. A full-fledged AoE4 sequel would have no impact on Xbox at all in terms of competition.
Not according to Microsoft. Every dolar I as a PCgamer spend on PC game is a dolar that I should have spent on Xbox. Every hour I've poured into playing on PC is an hour Microsoft fialed to make me spent on their console.

Microsoft views every pc-only gamer as failure on their part. It's ridiculous, but that's just how the company operates. The internal sabotaging and bickering there is legendary and you can bet any attempt at doing anything truly pcgaming friendly is instantly torpedoed. You even recently had Valve vet trying to do something and then running away after few months.
 

Armaros

Member
Sep 18, 2013
7,766
0
0
ITT: People applying console AAA budgets for PC only RTS games while talking about the second most popular RTS IP.
 

Barack Lesnar

Banned
Jun 7, 2010
19,181
0
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And AoE is another stratosphere in terms of sales compared to other RTSes aside from Starcraft. It's like saying investing in Assassin's Creed doesn't make sense because they sell less than Call of Duty titles each year. Sure...AC isn't as big, but it's still ridiculously massive IP that has no problem making huge profit with each entry. AoE is the same in RTS genre.
AoE3 sold 2 million lifetime. Regardless if it was a disappointing sequel or not, how is that in another stratosphere compared to non-Blizz RTS games?
 

Dezzy

Member
Sep 25, 2013
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0
395
Does Microsoft really believe that all the old Age of Empires fans moved onto tablets?
Why are some companies so out of touch?
 

Armaros

Member
Sep 18, 2013
7,766
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AoE3 sold 2 million lifetime. Regardless if it was a disappointing sequel or not, how is that in another stratosphere compared to non-Blizz RTS games?
Do you even know what game genre you are talking about when you post in this thread?
 

maquiladora

Member
Jun 7, 2011
22,661
0
0
I avoided clicking on this thread because I was worried of what I found when I did click on this thread. Ugh.
 

AdrianWerner

Banned
Dec 27, 2004
17,232
0
0
www.gry-online.pl
AoE3 sold 2 million lifetime. Regardless if it was a disappointing sequel or not, how is that in another stratosphere compared to non-Blizz RTS games?
First of all, no..it didn't sell 2 mln units in lifetime. It sold that much till mid 2008.
Second...you think quality of a game has nothing to do with it's sales? Especially for a pc title where sales aren't frontloaded and instead are spreat through multiple years, so pre-launch hype matters little.
And third, you could make a worthy seque lto AoE IV today and still make a a good profit with even only 2 mln sales. That is ignoring how much better the current pc market's condition is than when AoE III launched. But even if it was as bad as in 2005 you could still make great profit with 2 mln sales of AoE IV.

Meanwhile, you're unlikely to make any real money on this F2P monstrocity. Even games like those on iOS and Android flop in 99,99% of cases. And it being WindowsPhone/8 exclusive kills any financial viability this project might have
 

Iorv3th

Member
Jan 16, 2013
5,351
643
560
G%* Damnit microsoft.

I mean.... c'mon. Nobody wanted this. They could have just made a new name without using Age of Empires.

Wish they would go back to the core AoE1/2 design and make a good sequel. Some of my best PC gaming memories were from AoE1 and 2 on zone.com
 

Uzzy

Member
Mar 2, 2014
7,740
0
0
I am shocked that Microsoft continue to not give a damn about PC gaming.

Shocked I tell you.