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[hououinkyouma00]

Good. Fuck Epic and that cunt Sweeney. I can't stand that guy.

 

[K' Dash]

I'm pretty shocked to see so many siding with Apple on this. Not that Epic are exactly "the good guys", but this seems like complete BS on Apple's part.

idiots all of them, and IDGAF about Epic or Fortnite.

It's clearly personal and this is a spoiled child tantrum.

 

[ScHlAuChi]

Apple invented the so called "app" on phones. It's their O/S and if you don't want to play by their rules then don't try to develop for it. Simple

EU invented the so called "DMA" in its territory. It´s their laws and if Apple dont want to play by their rules, then don't try to sell in the EU. Simple

 

[Dirk Benedict]

Based; Epic should tone down on the Fortnite PR dunks on Apple and Sweeney's Twitter rants if they want to gain some trust after their original contract break. Watching them piss on each other is somehow entertaining.

Tim Apple VS Tim Sweeney.

 

[Topher]

I'm starting to think these two companies don't like each other

 

[cartman414]

 

[PropellerEar]

Apple invented the so called "app" on phones.

No they didn't.

 

[Hudo]

Apple invented the so called "app" on phones. It's their O/S and if you don't want to play by their rules then don't try to develop for it. Simple

They actually did not come up with the idea of apps on phones IBM and Blackberry had apps well before Apple even thought of building a phone.

 

[Robb]

Don’t really care for either company. Apple should’ve probably done this long ago though, no point in working with a company that breaks contracts and then sue you over it.

 

[StueyDuck]

Did epic even deliver half of what they promised? Their store is still hot shit and do devs get like 95% cut or whatever silly numbers they were quoting back in the day?

 

[SJRB]

Domain Expansion: Infinite L's

 

[Unknown Soldier]

 

[crackajack]

what?
I don't follow the details and understand the reasoning anyway not really, but didn't EU just put some mega penalty on Apple for not allowing competition on their platform and now they kick out one major game provider? Is Apple trying to get banned in EU all together? Europe generally likes Android more, but having only Google is making them really a monopoly even if they never had such a strict walled garden. Which would make that Huawei OS on phones and web OS on TVs the only alternatives?

 

[Kerotan]

It's like watching two kids in school go at it.

 

[MaestroMike]

Meanwhile, Apple stock being dumped.

cuz everyone is hyped on the AI stuff from microsoft and google and nvidia and putting their money there don't bet against apple yet tho

 

[Fashionably Late]

I think Apple is flirting with another major fine with this move, and 10% of their worldwide turnover would be very painful even for them. Epic broke the previous “contract” (aka mandatory, unilaterally imposed ToS) and I think the EU will see through Apple’s reasoning. This was not like a mutually beneficial contract that was negotiated between two equal parties like the supplier/B2B sales analogy. Epic did lose their case in the US but it’s clear the DMA was created in the EU to prevent these tech companies from having exactly this much leverage.

Gatekeeping the creation of an appstore should (per the law) only happen in exceptional circumstances where security is involved and I think that would mean literal viruses and malware, not merely a previous legal dispute with the company in another territory. TBF I can understand why Apple is taking such a hard line as the creation of appstores outside their control is an existential threat to their business model in the long term. However, the idea that you need Apple’s approval to even compete with them is IMO against the spirit of the DMA and they could be in for a nasty fine.

 

[cyberheater]

I think Apple is flirting with another major fine with this move, and 10% of their worldwide turnover would be very painful even for them. Epic broke the previous “contract” (aka mandatory, unilaterally imposed ToS) and I think the EU will see through Apple’s reasoning. This was not like a mutually beneficial contract that was negotiated between two equal parties like the supplier/B2B sales analogy. Epic did lose their case in the US but it’s clear the DMA was created in the EU to prevent these tech companies from having exactly this much leverage.

Gatekeeping the creation of an appstore should (per the law) only happen in exceptional circumstances where security is involved and I think that would mean literal viruses and malware, not merely a previous legal dispute with the company in another territory. TBF I can understand why Apple is taking such a hard line as the creation of appstores outside their control is an existential threat to their business model in the long term. However, the idea that you need Apple’s approval to even compete with them is IMO against the spirit of the DMA and they could be in for a nasty fine.

Thanks. Someone else gets it. It’s not about two companies fighting. It’s about the blatant disregard to fairness to the consumer.

 

[DaleinCalgary]

They actually did not come up with the idea of apps on phones IBM and Blackberry had apps well before Apple even thought of building a phone.

Real apps, let's not go back to downloads from the blackberry store. You have to give credit when it is due, they changed phones forever with the 2nd phone they released and everyone copied them after.

 

[Fashionably Late]

And just like that, the EU opens a probe into Apple‘s actions.

https://www.reuters.com/technology/eu-regulators-seek-details-escalating-apple-epic-games-spat-2024-03-07/

This was not a wise move on Apple’s part after just being hit with the fine regarding Spotify.

 

[DaGwaphics]

The children are fighting again.

 

[Hudo]

Real apps, let's not go back to downloads from the blackberry store. You have to give credit when it is due, they changed phones forever with the 2nd phone they released and everyone copied them after.

Still doesn't justify Apple not playing by the rules of the EU if they want to sell their shit there.

This whole thing is just 2 shitty companies behaving like little bitches in public. Both Epic/Tim Sweeny and his Twitter rants against Apple and Apple with how they approach implementing compliance to the DMA in the most "spoiled brat throwing a temper tantrum in public because the Mom doesn't want to buy a toy"-way I have ever seen.

 

[FStubbs]

PC has always been an open platform. iOS never has been. Why don’t PS and Xbox offer alternative stores? It’s their hardware and their ecosystem. Apple is the same way.

For what it's worth, they do. The physical retail market.

 

[FStubbs]

Still doesn't justify Apple not playing by the rules of the EU if they want to sell their shit there.

This whole thing is just 2 shitty companies behaving like little bitches in public. Both Epic/Tim Sweeny and his Twitter rants against Apple and Apple with how they approach implementing compliance to the DMA in the most "spoiled brat throwing a temper tantrum in public because the Mom doesn't want to buy a toy"-way I have ever seen.

Let's be clear, Tencent/Epic/Sweeney. The goal is to commoditize the hardware, remove all control from the platform holder, and then push WeChat, EGS, and other Tencent software.

 

[Hudo]

Let's be clear, Tencent/Epic/Sweeney. The goal is to commoditize the hardware, remove all control from the platform holder, and then push WeChat, EGS, and other Tencent software.

As opposed to Apple's shitty software stack? Both options are shit. But I would at least like to pick my poison.

Why can't I choose the browser engine that I find to be the least worst?

 

[phant0m]

For what it's worth, they do. The physical retail market.

The platform holder still gets a cut there too (albeit much less than 30%).

 

[phant0m]

As opposed to Apple's shitty software stack? Both options are shit. But I would at least like to pick my poison.

Why can't I choose the browser engine that I find to be the least worst?

Apples software stack is 10000% better than a Tencent/Epic one.

 

[cyberheater]

And just like that, the EU opens a probe into Apple‘s actions.

https://www.reuters.com/technology/eu-regulators-seek-details-escalating-apple-epic-games-spat-2024-03-07/

This was not a wise move on Apple’s part after just being hit with the fine regarding Spotify.

That's excellent news. I hope the EU nails them to the wall and forces them to comply properly.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

As opposed to Apple's shitty software stack? Both options are shit. But I would at least like to pick my poison.

Why can't I choose the browser engine that I find to be the least worst?

You can already pick your poison by switching to Android

 

[Durin]

I do enjoy the companies dragging each other down, and Apple having to slightly crack open their dumb walled garden is nice to watch.

Every mobile OS sucks compared to Windows, much less Linux is offering consumer rights and control over their own device they pay for, along with what developers can produce on them.

 

[FalconPunch]

That's excellent news. I hope the EU nails them to the wall and forces them to comply properly.

I actually like most of the EU consumer moves but they’re doing too much now. There are lots of other phone options and consumers/epic can go elsewhere. Those who buy the iPhone do so because they like its ecosystem and what it offers. EU just trying to ruin a good thing for everyone with their out of touch rulings.

 

[Dirk Benedict]

The children are fighting again.

I want to throw a running chainsaw into the mix.

 

[polybius80]

If Microsoft isn't allowed a cut for every single sale made on Windows, then Apple shouldn't be allowed for every single sale on iOS. Windows itself is also just "popular", people have plenty of other OS' to choose from such as Linux.

MS can do that but what will happen is that people will start using alternatives, in fact I remember there was lot of comments years ago about the idea MS was planning doing that to affect steam and that's why steam invested heavily in linux in order to have a plan if that happens, its a tactic to have some things "free", imagine if they start asking devs for money for using direct3d 12? people will simply use other libraries, the "free" google store in android was prohibited in chinese phones in order to affect chinese brands, not everything that is "free" has a good intention behind

 

[DaleinCalgary]

Still doesn't justify Apple not playing by the rules of the EU if they want to sell their shit there.

This whole thing is just 2 shitty companies behaving like little bitches in public. Both Epic/Tim Sweeny and his Twitter rants against Apple and Apple with how they approach implementing compliance to the DMA in the most "spoiled brat throwing a temper tantrum in public because the Mom doesn't want to buy a toy"-way I have ever seen.

Then Apple should get out of the EU. They are the ones that changed things by innovation and if that is the way to go then leave. Punish EU users and they will revolt. Apple doesn't have the same grasp that they do in North America but they should give Europe a giant fuck you and leave.

 

[cyberheater]

Then Apple should get out of the EU. They are the ones that changed things by innovation and if that is the way to go then leave. Punish EU users and they will revolt. Apple doesn't have the same grasp that they do in North America but they should give Europe a giant fuck you and leave.

I'm amazed how anti-consumer some of the comments in this thread are.

 

[DaGwaphics]

I want to throw a running chainsaw into the mix.

I have no personal animosity towards either company, in fact I think UE and the innovations they make easier to implement for devs is cool.

But the way that both have acted publicly in regards to this situation makes me chuckle.

 

[ReBurn]

I actually like most of the EU consumer moves but they’re doing too much now. There are lots of other phone options and consumers/epic can go elsewhere. Those who buy the iPhone do so because they like its ecosystem and what it offers. EU just trying to ruin a good thing for everyone with their out of touch rulings.

I don't think their stance here is out of touch at all. A competitor creating an alternative app store for Apple devices doesn't necessarily change anything about what Apple's customers like in regard to Apple's ecosystem. Consumers who don't want an alternative app store don't need to use it. Their experience can stay the same as it is today.

Consumers who want to use the devices they paid for in the way they want to use them should be able to source apps from wherever they want to source them. Apple sold the device to the consumer. They don't own it any more. They shouldn't be able to dictate how the consumer uses it. If someone wants to get apps from somewhere else and take the risk that what they're loading could compromise them in some way then they should be able to do that. If they get their data stolen or their device gets wrecked then that's on them. Put up a scare notice like they do on MacOS and call it a day.

 

[adamsapple]

 

[ScHlAuChi]

Then Apple should get out of the EU. They are the ones that changed things by innovation and if that is the way to go then leave.

Yes, fantastic idea!
Here´s all the positive effects that will happen when Apple does that:
- get sued by EU customers and Apple shareholders
- give up a huge lucrative market
- ruins their reputation / marketing image

Punish EU users and they will revolt.

So you think that when Apple leaves the EU, that all the disappointed Apple users will declare war on the EU and vote them out?
Tens of millions of Apple user protesting in the streets forcing the EU to quit! All that for a fucking mobile phone?
Is that how it works in your fantasy Lala land?

Apple doesn't have the same grasp that they do in North America but they should give Europe a giant fuck you and leave.

Do you really believe that Europe needs Apple so much? Samsung & Co will be super happy if Apple leaves and they have the market for themselves.....

 

[Minsc]

Good. Fuck Epic and that cunt Sweeney. I can't stand that guy.

Man this comment didn't age well.

Wonder how much Apple will be fined for fucking Epic this time.

 

[hououinkyouma00]

Man this comment didn't age well.

Wonder how much Apple will be fined for fucking Epic this time.

How did it not age well? Doesn’t matter if you are a fan of Apple. Doesn’t matter if Apple reversed it.

Sweeney is still a whiny cunt, will be a whiny cunt, and always has been a whiny cunt.

 

[Minsc]

How did it not age well? Doesn’t matter if you are a fan of Apple. Doesn’t matter if Apple reversed it.

Sweeney is still a whiny cunt, will be a whiny cunt, and always has been a whiny cunt.

I dunno, I'm just not a fan of the whole I'm glad Apple can have their monopoly and dictatorship over their devices. IMO all products would be better off if they had an open marketplace when they reach a set size. Same for Sony, Nintendo and everyone else.

But most certainly for Apple and MS.

 

[IFireflyl]

I dunno, I'm just not a fan of the whole I'm glad Apple can have their monopoly and dictatorship over their devices. IMO all products would be better off if they had an open marketplace when they reach a set size. Same for Sony, Nintendo and everyone else.

But most certainly for Apple and MS.

It's better that Epic can intentionally disregard signed contracts of behavior and do what they want? Okay. Tim Sweeny is a giant child, and he should be smacked at every opportunity. And I'm saying this as someone who hates Apple.

 

[hououinkyouma00]

I dunno, I'm just not a fan of the whole I'm glad Apple can have their monopoly and dictatorship over their devices. IMO all products would be better off if they had an open marketplace when they reach a set size. Same for Sony, Nintendo and everyone else.

But most certainly for Apple and MS.

Whether or not it should be that way is a different story.

If Epic doesn’t like it then they can fuck off. They aren’t special, and nobody is forcing them to be part of Apples ecosystem.

Same applies for Sony, Microsoft, Nintendo, Google, etc.

The facts are that Epic intentionally broke the rules and then wants to cry when they get disciplined. They are like a child that’s mom should have swallowed.

 

[Hudo]

Then Apple should get out of the EU. They are the ones that changed things by innovation and if that is the way to go then leave. Punish EU users and they will revolt. Apple doesn't have the same grasp that they do in North America but they should give Europe a giant fuck you and leave.

Ok. So they open up a very lucrative market to their competitors. Apple's investors will be chuffed to bits, I bet.

 

[Minsc]

It's better that Epic can intentionally disregard signed contracts of behavior and do what they want? Okay. Tim Sweeny is a giant child, and he should be smacked at every opportunity. And I'm saying this as someone who hates Apple.

I don't really put much faith in contracts of giant corporations adhering to my best interests. So yeah, I don't give a shit about contracts, EULAs and other BS that companies want to further their own agenda.

 

[DaleinCalgary]

Yes, fantastic idea!
Here´s all the positive effects that will happen when Apple does that:
- get sued by EU customers and Apple shareholders
- give up a huge lucrative market
- ruins their reputation / marketing image


So you think that when Apple leaves the EU, that all the disappointed Apple users will declare war on the EU and vote them out?
Tens of millions of Apple user protesting in the streets forcing the EU to quit! All that for a fucking mobile phone?
Is that how it works in your fantasy Lala land?


Do you really believe that Europe needs Apple so much? Samsung & Co will be super happy if Apple leaves and they have the market for themselves.....

Look, I don't want Apple to leave any markets but these countries brought on this lawsuit and to blame. Apple created a product and it's good and they made the rules that we develop it , you can make an app for it and you give us 30%. They create the market and you make money off their users. This is what Sony does with Playstation and MS does with Xbox.

They are being punished for doing a good job, this is what pisses me off. Developers have a choice to make an app or not and if you don't want to play by the rules don't do it, simple.

Apple didn't become a government service to make life better for its people, it's a business and if you piss off business they leave.

 

[NinjaBoiX]

Good, fuck Epic on this one.

Complaining about the policies after knowing about them upfront was childish nonsense.

Don’t get involved if you don’t like the rules, simple.

 

[thief183]

Then Apple should get out of the EU. They are the ones that changed things by innovation and if that is the way to go then leave. Punish EU users and they will revolt. Apple doesn't have the same grasp that they do in North America but they should give Europe a giant fuck you and leave.

You know that europe have 3 times the population of the US right?

It is never gonna a happen.

 

[IFireflyl]

You know that europe have 3 times the population of the US right?

And one-third the intelligence.

Spoiler

 

[ScHlAuChi]

Look, I don't want Apple to leave any markets but these countries brought on this lawsuit and to blame.

Yes, and why did that happen? Becasue Apple broke their laws!

Apple created a product and it's good and they made the rules that we develop it , you can make an app for it and you give us 30%. They create the market and you make money off their users.

Apple created a good product, but if their rules violate anti trust laws in other country, then it doesnt matter, they are invalid.
Apple can indeed demand 30%, but they cannot hinder the competition by bending the rules so they themselves benefit.
They created a market, but that doesnt make you "their user".
Why exactly does Apple deserve 30% when I buy something from another store?

This is what Sony does with Playstation and MS does with Xbox.

They do, but consoles unlike mobile phones arent general computing devices, therefore different laws apply to them.
Consoles dont have core platform services, you can only use them to play games, not to do banking or online shopping.

They are being punished for doing a good job, this is what pisses me off. Developers have a choice to make an app or not and if you don't want to play by the rules don't do it, simple.

They are punished for... BREAKING THE LAW!
If Apple doesnt want to play by the rules of the EU or other markets, they can leave and sell elsewhere!

Apple didn't become a government service to make life better for its people, it's a business and if you piss off business they leave.

Business have rules to follow - other companies have no problem following them, why cant Apple?
The reason why the EU created the DMA was becasue all the big companies kept breaking laws and instead of stopping to do that, they just paid the fines that were pocket change for them.