It'll at least look far better than Inquisition. The cross gen and current gen only games on Frostbite look considerably better.
-
Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!
Are we going to see a marked improvement in graphics later in this generation?
- Thread starter chronic_archaic
- Start date
Dee Dah Dave
Member
All other gens have been roughly equal in length, around 5 or 6 years. Last gen was an anomaly.
Not only that, the performance increase in hardware we got this time is a little on the low side. A couple more years and consoles are going to be really struggling to put out something that's even close to medium settings on PC.
Microsoft have the worst of it and I'm sure they will be looking to "move on" as soon as possible, which in turn will spur Sony on.
I see new machines being released in 2018/19 at the latest.
You do realize you can remove most of the film grain and vignetting in The Order 1886, right? It's already been debunked. The game looks much sharper and there aren't these low quality assets you claim they tried to hide.
Vital Tundra
Member
True, forgot it was cross gen. Uncharted 4 is just looking to be a crowning achievement of optimization.
Walter Matthau
Member
Uncharted 4 looks like a marked improvement over launch titles. We still really haven't gotten to see what Rockstar will be able to do with the hardware.
Green Yoshi
Member
It might become the best looking open-world game ever if they improve Frostbite 3 even further.
But Uncharted 4 will still look better because it is a strictly linear game.
Really? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uG8V9dRqSsw
And thats from a footage 1.5 year before release.
You really underestimate next gen only Frostbite 3.
---
How can You say that when Battlefront looks much better than U4 MP mode.
It is a bold prediction but I doubt it. There might be things it does better but as a whole I seriously can't see it getting close to Uncharted 4.
I am going to take a guess it is because Battlefront is only a MP game and with Uncharted 4, most of the resources would have gone into the SP (which is what most people are buying it for).
Vital Tundra
Member
Really didn't see anything that made me go wow when this trailer pop'd up. U4 made me go "wow". What's so impressive about this trailer?
Dreamwriter
Member
We just got it, you won't see anything look better than Star Wars Battlefront on XB1 or PS4.
I fully believe we will see some significant improvements. Some new techniques are bound to become further optimized and then there are things like Media Molecule's engine showing promise.
Also, Guerilla's clouds in Horizon are a perfect example of how a dev can achieve something beatiful at relatively low cost, whereas it was not possible before.
That and UC4 has a great amount of interactivity. The e3 gameplay had an insane amount of physics going on and displayed a very complex animation system. Which is offcourse also graphical progression (as can be judged in motion), but not in the sense of textures and image quality.
I don't think W3 was ever cross gen though? But yes, I agree with your point. Edit, my bad! I read your sentence wrong
Also, Guerilla's clouds in Horizon are a perfect example of how a dev can achieve something beatiful at relatively low cost, whereas it was not possible before.
That and UC4 has a great amount of interactivity. The e3 gameplay had an insane amount of physics going on and displayed a very complex animation system. Which is offcourse also graphical progression (as can be judged in motion), but not in the sense of textures and image quality.
I don't think W3 was ever cross gen though? But yes, I agree with your point. Edit, my bad! I read your sentence wrong
This is very subjective, so stop making it sound like a fact. Personally, I disagree, Battlefront does have the upper hand overall currently, but UC4 MP still looks amazing IMO.
It's still new tech - granted some devs had their hands on the 7th generation for a while, but if we do see improvements it will come by way of - improvements to already relevant production studios, optimizing motion capture and other production utilities - and other aspects to this nature.
Unlike previous generations, there is very little in the way of mysteries in these boxes. Wsiwyg. The smart devs will find ways to make things look a bit nicer within the context of shaving resources elsewhere or dropping res/fps/etc but what you guys call "optimization" benefits all platforms now.
MAX PAYMENT
Member
I think this generation's graphics have been hugely underwhelming and will continue to be that way until the generation's end.
slavesnyder
Member
Yes. 3D
I get where you're coming from, but one thing this gen has taught me is that games don't always look better as time goes by. Sometimes they look worse than they did one year before release.
That's the spirit.
thelastword
Banned
Consoles have never been about catching up to PC's, consoles have always been about maxing the hardware that was finalized for (them).....`
Yes, very. I don't know how much you want to stress "significantly", but we will see some impressive leaps in what you see on screen, it's one of the reasons I want to see a sequel to two of the best looking games out there atm. 1886 and Driveclub....With the pedigree of these teams we know they will push the envelope even further.
Looking at all the cross gen games this gen, the bad and underperforming ports, the substandard AAA games. It highlights just how below the curve most of the efforts have been generally. I've seen you noted a Sony first party and crytek title, and that's fine that they looked good on their hardware, but they were also rushed launch titles, with the latter having many framerate niggles that I'm sure could be sorted out with the improvements Crytek made on their engine and of course SDK optimizations on the platform side.
The SDK's and memory allocation have improved a great deal on both platforms, optimizations on the software side is also significant for Cryengine and Shadowfall engine as you saw some notable improvements in UD under the shadowfall engine.
Let's be fair here, these machines (moreso the PS4) is not as vanilla in it's architecture as some people think, there was always a plan to utilize Async Compute to push the envelope in the latter years. The most prominent graphical wizards have not even launched their products yet. ND, SSM, POLIPHONY.....the three games from these guys are going to blow Shadowfall, Driveclub and 1886 out of the water, and the other graphical juggernaut (Guerilla Games) will also outdo shadowfall and set the technical standard for open world games on consoles.
Then we will have some gems from lower key and relatively unknown studios like the Edge of Eternity devs, Studio Bend's project etc....all mixing in and making things interesting visually...At the moment, I'm seeing some really impressive looking titles from mid-tier studios in the works.
Look at something like Destiny, should that not look much better and operate at 1080p 60fps for part 2? I think it can.......Then we have Sucker Punch working on their second project, which will look much better than ISS, and we have a stellar third party dev like Rocksteady's on the next batman game on UE4 native....the gains in visuals will undoubtedly be steady as there were many issues in UE3 which held back performance which are ironed out in UE4.
I don't think the XB1 will gain as much of a leap, but we will see it manifested there as well. The PS4 however is where we will see the most impressive titles ongoing, not only because of it's hardware advantage but the quality of developers under it's belt.
Dictator93
Member
It will look quite a bit better than inquisition if you have been following Frostbite's development iterations since.
When INQ came out, it was already using an older engine than even the one in BF4.
The thing is, I wouldn't use Battlefront as a benchmark for all upcoming Frostbite titles. I mean if you compare Battlefield 4 to Hardline it is clear that Dice were able to better utilize the technology to produce a far more attractive game, which they again achieved with Battlefront. While I am sure ME will look great(better than Inquisition), I am not expecting it to look close to what Dice achieved. The scope of the game will also be far greater which will probably hold them back as well.
JordanN
Banned
Everytime I read "exotic hardware, not PC" I want to bang my head.
PS1 was the easiest to work with in the 32-bit gen but the games still went through massive changes. Even more so than the more powerful N64 or Saturn.
Crash 1
Crash 3
This was also on the same console that had a 33mhz CPU when PC's had 100mhz or more. So that argument doesn't hold up.
Dictator93
Member
I am not using battlefront as a benchmark, I am using its engine iterrations as presented at GDC and siggraph and extrapolating that they will use the more, if not most recent, feature set.
Since INQ the engine has added a PBS pipeline, a pipeline for volumetric rendering, and the most realistic screen space reflection method to date. All those things propel it quite a bit beyond INQ, not even considering the fact that it has to have a larger scope.
Triggerhappytel
Member
I doubt visuals are going to get much better than The Order 1886 or Rise of the Tomb Raider.
thelastword
Banned
Uncharted 4 is not as linear as you're thinking. I also think Andromeda will blow Battlefront out of the water visually, it really won't be a contest, since that title barely makes a top ten list of visuals for this gen so far. I think too many people are bent up on the photogrammetry which in kind presents a very limited scope in world detail.
Okay, I can agree with that.
I guess the point I was making is that having a great engine is only one step in producing a great looking game. I feel there was a general sentiment (not necessarily from you btw) that all Frostbite games will just automatically look amazing now.
Btw, what was the first Frostbite game to implement PBS? Was it Battlefront?
Dictator93
Member
GrotesqueBeauty
Banned
God of War will probably blow everyone's balls off. Last gen you could argue about what game was the most technically impressive, but God of War 3 was the only game that actually melted my brain the first time I played it. I think the last time that happened was Rogue Leader, and before that Super Mario 64. I'd put my money on Sony Santa Monica again this generation.
What limited scope in world detail are you specifically referring to? I mean, these don't know an appreciable degree of world detail?
Don't mind thelastword. He hates on every game on PS4 that is not 1080p, regardless of how much it has going on technically.What limited scope in world detail are you specifically referring to? I mean, these don't know an appreciable degree of world detail?
I know you aren't too hot on Battlefront but you have to be joking here.
I don't think s/he's yet seen the 4K screens or the mod that tweaks the colour treatment to make it look like the original trilogy.
Tal Shiar Agent
Banned
He trolls because the game isn't 1080p.
That mod kind of looks like crap. Oversharpened and overblown contrast. I'm not even talking about 4k screens, even at 900p that game floors me.
I know he hates sub 1080 but at 60fps doing what it does and not even in the top 10?
It could be just me, but I was watching a video DF made that used the mod to make the game look like the original trilogy and I prefer the original color scheme.
Oh, good. RoboPlato agrees with me too.
The mod does give it a realistic look, but it also looks awful in areas too. The over sharpening is horrible imo, and it just looks overly harsh.
Yep, seems to really mess up the color scheme as well. The unmodded game has more vibrant colors.
sixteen-bit
Member
RotTR 360 version is also a benchmark for gen 7 games.
dragonelite
Member
Not many devs will drop to 720/900p.
On top off it, the next gen has the greatest chance of being 100% backwards compatible out of the box. They could easily do a shorter console life cycle since the new gen would be guaranteed to work with the current gen.
Melchiah
Member
As far as I know, none of the late PS3 1st party titles were sub-720p, apart from Resistance 3.
I expect to see some visual improvement, when the developers start to take more advantage of GPU compute.
Dictator93
Member
Devs are taking advantage of compute functions and have for quite some time now.
Its not subjective. Battlefront has particles shadows, U4 has not, Battlefront has full tessellated world, U4 has not. Battlefront has bigger levels and more dense levels, more characters/vehicles. Its objectively technologically better or, i would say, more demanding.
Battlefront running in stable 60fps on consoles with full tessellation and almost all Frostbite 3 features is kind of miracle.
Compare geometry of U4 MP with Battlefront geometry in shots above. Its a big difference.
http://images.gamersyde.com/image_uncharted_4_a_thief_s_end-30059-2995_0003.jpg
http://images.gamersyde.com/image_uncharted_4_a_thief_s_end-30059-2995_0001.jpg
Battlefront has the best geometry i've seen in any game to date, mostly due to fact being fully tessellated.
Unless they free up resources or have some secret sauce (like increasing cpu clock speed via firmware like the PSP), and diminishing returns, development budgets etc, I don't think the improvement from the beginning to the end of this gen will be nearly as big when compared to the last gen, due to the hardware being easier to program for/adapt to.
That's pretty much reserved for exclusives given the tradeoffs it comes with, so it'll remain limited I guess - PS2 was probably the last gen when you'd see 3rd parties experiment with alternative visualizations.Dictator93 said:
But then again, PS4 already has more to show for it than PS3 did in its entire lifespan, so it kind of feels reminiscent of PS2 era again in that respect.
I take it you didn't see my earlier post, but I am not sure why you are only using UC4 MP footage to support your argument that began with someone saying UC4 looks to be greatly optimized. As I said, the bulk of the resources are going into the SP (what most people buy the game for) so it is not a surprise that the MP visuals are downgraded. I mean look at some UC3 MP screens which ran at the same framerate as the SP in that game.
Hardly stacks up to the SP visuals so I don't think using U4 MP screens as an argument holds much merit tbh.
This isn't to take anything away from Battlefront which obviously looks amazing, but I am not sure why you are so focused on that comparison, especially considering none of us have even played UC4 yet. (Beta next week)