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Bayonetta 2 off to a slow start in Japan [Update: Week 2 sales]

ftfy. seems you still don't understand that there is no true objectivity when it comes to games.

Incorrect. There's plenty of objectivity in gaming. Destiny's mission structure is objectively garbage as an example.

I would have as well, but the store I bought it from had an online sale that was going to end in a few hours that had 10% off pre-orders. I'm in Canada, under NOA's rule, so I'm not expecting very much. :(

Shoulda pre-ordered during BestBuy Canada's preorder deal, 30% off preordered games when preordering 3+ games.
 
I would have as well, but the store I bought it from had an online sale that was going to end in a few hours that had 10% off pre-orders. I'm in Canada, under NOA's rule, so I'm not expecting very much. :(
I understand completely, I'm Canadian as well but really haven't noticed much in the way of preorder offers. Regardless, we shall unite with our American brothers under the Platinum banner in the name of Bayonetta!! :) I'll get my copies one way or another.
 
What? You're just going to stop there?

You want me to explain the meaning of objectivity to you? You claimed that so and so aspect of a video game is objectively garbage. Please prove that it is objectively garbage in some way past your own subjective opinions, preferences and beliefs on the matter. I would love to hear it
 
You want me to explain the meaning of objectivity to you? You claimed that so and so aspect of a video game is objectively garbage. Please prove that it is objectively garbage in some way past your own subjective opinions, preferences and beliefs on the matter. I would love to hear it

As would I.
 
You want me to explain the meaning of objectivity to you? You claimed that so and so aspect of a video game is objectively garbage. Please prove that it is objectively garbage in some way past your own subjective opinions, preferences and beliefs on the matter. I would love to hear it

Requiring players to undergo the same cookiecutter handful of missions repeatedly is objectively bad, and frankly, lazy design. It would have been no different if half of the game had been excised and players were to do it arbitrarily.

edit: Did you want to get started on the objectively bad design of omitting story content and lore from the game itself? Requiring one to exit their software and open an app or site to understand what they're doing is sheer madness.

I understand completely, I'm Canadian as well but really haven't noticed much in the way of preorder offers. Regardless, we shall unite with our American brothers under the Platinum banner in the name of Bayonetta!! :) I'll get my copies one way or another.

Best Buy e3 deal.
 
Requiring players to undergo the same cookiecutter handful of missions repeatedly is objectively bad, and frankly, lazy design. It would have been no different if half of the game had been excised and players were to do it arbitrarily.

It is not objectively anything. That is your subjective take on the matter at hand. Your take on Destiny's mission design is based entirely on your own personal experiences with mission design and thus could never be an objective truth

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Objectivity_(philosophy)

A proposition is generally considered objectively true (to have objective truth) when its truth conditions are met and are "bias-free"; that is, existing without biases caused by, feelings, ideas, etc. of a sentient subject.

And I don't actually disagree that Destiny has poor mission design but that in no way makes it objectively bad. You are simply using the word incorrectly

The lore aspect of the game with the need to look outside the game is in my subjective opinion horrible design and my biggest gripe about it although I have yet to play it. That being said it is also in no way objectively bad
 
Requiring players to undergo the same cookiecutter handful of missions repeatedly is objectively bad, and frankly, lazy design. It would have been no different if half of the game had been excised and players were to do it arbitrarily.

edit: Did you want to get started on the objectively bad design of omitting story content and lore from the game itself? Requiring one to exit their software and open an app or site to understand what they're doing is sheer madness..

You still haven't objectively proven anything because you're using subjective terms.
 
It is not objectively anything. That is your subjective take on the matter at hand. Your take on Destiny's mission design is based entirely on your own personal experiences with mission design and thus could never be an objective truth

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Objectivity_(philosophy)



And I don't actually disagree that Destiny has poor mission design but that in no way makes it objectively bad. You are simply using the word incorrectly

This is why post modernists are useless. Destiny's mission structure being garbage is as true as staring at drying white paint is bland. If people like it, they can keep liking it, but it's junk.
 
Requiring players to undergo the same cookiecutter handful of missions repeatedly is objectively bad, and frankly, lazy design. It would have been no different if half of the game had been excised and players were to do it arbitrarily.

i disagree. it's only bad when you execute it poorly. a recent example of repeating objectives is the p.t. for silent hills, but it's handled and executed in an amazing way. the execution may be lacking but that is partly the fault of the designer, and partly your own opinion. some people enjoy repetition and patterns and trying the same thing again because they liked the previous thing. i don't understand those people. it's okay. they can have their fun and i'll have mine. i can still complain about it though- it's my time and money too, but it doesn't make them objectively wrong.

anyway this gets us far away from what the point about liking a system or a library goes. i too believe that if you enjoy video games, you should find something that serves your tastes somewhere. maybe that's me having broad tastes- maybe it's me having excellently refined tastes. i do believe it's the latter, because i am an incredible specimen unto humanity.

and from here it's another long walk to the idea that it should be okay to express anger at a company for releasing a game you claim to want when the only alternative was the game not coming out. and i've said before but i think it's so very not okay. but even that's a long long distance from bayonetta 2 selling 38,000 units in its first week, which is supposedly what this nearly 2000-post thread is about. so let me help get this thread back on topic.

boy that bayonetta 2 sure did sell 38,000 copies in one week. that sure is a really bad number and i don't mean that sarcastically.
i really don't. the spoiler tags probably aren't helping
 
I'm sorry for using the generally agreed upon definition of objectivity and not your own subjective take on the matter

Apology not accepted.

i disagree. it's only bad when you execute it poorly. a recent example of repeating objectives is the p.t. for silent hills, but it's handled and executed in an amazing way. the execution may be lacking but that is partly the fault of the designer, and partly your own opinion. some people enjoy repetition and patterns and trying the same thing again because they liked the previous thing. i don't understand those people. it's okay. they can have their fun and i'll have mine. i can still complain about it though- it's my time and money too, but it doesn't make them objectively wrong.

anyway this gets us far away from what the point about liking a system or a library goes. i too believe that if you enjoy video games, you should find something that serves your tastes somewhere. maybe that's me having broad tastes- maybe it's me having excellently refined tastes. i do believe it's the latter, because i am an incredible specimen unto humanity.

and from here it's another long walk to the idea that it should be okay to express anger at a company for releasing a game you claim to want when the only alternative was the game not coming out. and i've said before but i think it's so very not okay. but even that's a long long distance from bayonetta 2 selling 38,000 units in its first week, which is supposedly what this nearly 2000-post thread is about.

What I'm getting at is that they can keep doing that repetitive thing, but whether or not it's idiotic design isn't really something that's up for debate. Incidentally, Bayo 2 existing at all, let alone in the form its coming out in which looks top notch is indisputably better than not existing at all.
 
This is why post modernists are useless. Destiny's mission structure being garbage is as true as staring at drying white paint is bland. If people like it, they can keep liking it, but it's junk.

You cannot win this argument, good sir.

No amount of correct thought would be enough to convince them.

Their argument is tantamount to "beauty is in the eye of the beholder".

And darn you to heck, if you think Freddy Krueger is universally hard on the eyes.
 
Not even close. Talk about hyperbolic pulled out of your ass bullshit.


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That was my honest opinion when i played the demo. here are direct feed pics from DF, this how the game looked to me on my set, combine that with me hating the art style, and the disgusting use of the yellow piss filter fog ever where, and you would see where i'm coming from. keep in my mind that i got my 360 in the end of 2008, and only played games with high ratings.
 
You cannot win this argument, good sir.

No amount of correct thought would be enough to convince them.

Their argument is tantamount to "beauty is in the eye of the beholder".

And darn you to heck, if you think Freddy Krueger is universally hard on the eyes.

The argument is the simple definition of what objectivity means, of which I have posted it above. Objectivity is completely and utterly detached from the "eye of the beholder" and is something that exists entirely without an individuals own personal preferences, or opinions.

The only means by which to measure the quality of [in this case] Destiny's mission structure is through our own subjective personal beliefs on the matter and hence regardless of what we all think of the quality of it, the quality cannot objectively be anything
 
The argument is the simple definition of what objectivity means, of which I have posted it above. Objectivity is completely and utterly detached from the "eye of the beholder" and is something that exists entirely without an individuals own personal preferences, or opinions.

The only means by which to measure the quality of [in this case] Destiny's mission structure is through our own subjective personal beliefs on the matter and hence regardless of what we all think of the quality of it, the quality cannot objectively be anything

This is one of the rare cases in which Kant and I would find ourselves in complete concord.
 
Well at least this page so far has generally been more productive than a lot of this thread so that's nice

This is one of the rare cases in which Kant and I would find ourselves in complete concord.

If you would like to water down the meaning of objective truth to Kant's level then you would still have to prove that everyone that has ever played Destiny's mission structure [in this case] thinks the missions structure is garbage, if even one person thinks it's not garbage then even by Kant's definition of objective truth it wouldn't be one. Same goes for Freddy's complexion btw :P
 
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That was my honest opinion when i played the demo. here are direct feed pics from DF, this how the game looked to me on my set, combine that with me hating the art style, and the disgusting use of the yellow piss filter fog ever where, and you would see where i'm coming from. keep in my mind that i got my 360 in the end of 2008, and only played games with high ratings.

Are you Phoenician Viking's alter ego? I wonder if we look at your other forum memberships we'll find your posts about how wonderful you thought it was. Considering how interested you are in its sequel, that must be the case.
 
Well at least this page so far has generally been more productive than a lot of this thread so that's nice



If you would like to water down the meaning of objective truth to Kant's level then you would still have to prove that everyone that has ever played Destiny's mission structure [in this case] thinks the missions structure is garbage, if even one person thinks it's not garbage then even by Kant's definition of objective truth it wouldn't be one. Same goes for Freddy's complexion btw :P

No. Not at all. Subjective opinion can be objectively wrong.

Kant even cedes this; nay, insists it. It is a factual defect in said individual(s), not apprehending a given truth.
 
No. Not at all. Subjective opinion can be objectively wrong.

Kant even cedes this; nay, insists it. It is a factual defect in said individual(s), not apprehending a given truth.

How is Destiny's mission structure being garbage or Freddy's complexion a given truth? By that definition of objectivity, anything that is not measurable could be argued to objectively be, I don't see the value in the definition as we already have the term and notion of subjectivity and could thus explain it just as adequately in those terms
 

Pretty much what I'm thinking. Might be time for mods to kill this thread... as this discussion at best is becoming circular, and at worst going super off-topic.

In summary:
Bayo 2 had a bad first 2 days of sales in Japan. Knowing typical software title trends, it will sell a lot less next week barring something unusual we're unaware of. The only thing potentially making that decline less may be that Fatal Frame released on Wii U yesterday and maybe those picking up Fatal Frame might pick up Bayo 2.

Bayo 1 sold much worse in the US than it did in Japan. Thus any argument saying "it'll definitely do better in the West because that's what happened with Bayo 1" is incorrect. It may do better in the West than it's done in Japan for other reasons, but that's a separate argument to be had.

We'll find out how well Bayo 2 does in its second week in 3 days. No need to waste so much time trying to predict the future or accusing people of whatever...
 
Let's keep it up guys, I heard Platinum gets a huge performance bonus from Nintendo if this thread reaches 2000 posts.


You'd only fool yourself if you think Bayonetta 3 will happen. The series is pretty much over with the Wii U exclusive fiasco.
It was over before the Wii U exclusive "fiasco."

It's such a shame that an extremely high-quality game coming out when it wouldn't have otherwise is somehow a "fiasco." If that's the case I'm hoping for a full-on shitstorm apocalypse.



I'll enjoy it, but from a sales perspective it was suicide.

"Well, Bayonetta is dead, guys. We can't get it funded. Oh well, it was fun while it lasted."
"Wait, Nintendo is willing to pay for it."
"We can't put it on a Nintendo! Putting it on the Wii U would kill it!"


How does that make any sense.
 
I'm debating on purchasing 3 copies of the game for myself and 2 friends. I know for a fact that they wouldn't go out and buy it themselves and I really want to support Platinum. So much love was put into this game, and it'd be such a shame to see it do poorly.
 
I'm debating on purchasing 3 copies of the game for myself and 2 friends. I know for a fact that they wouldn't go out and buy it themselves and I really want to support Platinum. So much love was put into this game, and it'd be such a shame to see it do poorly.

I told my friends that if they bought a wii u then I would supply Bayo 2.

Happily.
 
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That was my honest opinion when i played the demo. here are direct feed pics from DF, this how the game looked to me on my set, combine that with me hating the art style, and the disgusting use of the yellow piss filter fog ever where, and you would see where i'm coming from. keep in my mind that i got my 360 in the end of 2008, and only played games with high ratings.

Way to link non-hot linkable images. You don't even know what you're doing went trying to post an image.
 
I don't think future collaboration between PlatinumGames and Nintendo depends on how much Bayonetta 2 (or W101 for that matter) sells. They share adesign vision that almost no other developer upholds so they're ideal partners in my eyes.
 
Shoulda pre-ordered during BestBuy Canada's preorder deal, 30% off preordered games when preordering 3+ games.

I preordered during that sale. Unfortunately, there were 9 other games that I did have the console for that I chose to preorder instead. Like I said, this was more to support the fact it was getting released more than anything else. I dd the same thing for xenoblade chronicles when it came out by pre-ordering 2 copies of that.

In the end though, 10% off is better than nothing.
 
Except many folks enjoy music and do hate the Beatles. Your point? People may enjoy more realistic looking games which Nintendo doesn't do. Folks may not enjoy the IPs that Nintendo produces. There is no objectively bad or good in gaming. They're opinions. Or is this a new I like something so everyone else has to also.

I was using "objective" rhetorically, not literally. Of course you can not like things. But I'm not going to take your tastes seriously if you don't like certain things. Like the poster who said "the Beatles suck": it's cool if they're not your favorite band (they're not mine either), but if you take music seriously and you can't even appreciate them then I'm not going to take your opinion seriously, because you clearly lack any kind of historical or critical perspective.

Edit; this is way off topic though so I'm not gonna argue it anymore. Just wanted to clarify my deliberately polemical original post.
 
It was over before the Wii U exclusive "fiasco."

You can keep saying that, but none of them will hear/believe you.

In their minds, it was only a matter of time before Bayo II would have come out for the PS4 and Xbox One.

This is one of the rare cases in which Kant and I would find ourselves in complete concord.

I think "accord" is what you're looking for -- but, we can see your history regarding word usage.
 
I don't think future collaboration between PlatinumGames and Nintendo depends on how much Bayonetta 2 (or W101 for that matter) sells. They share adesign vision that almost no other developer upholds so they're ideal partners in my eyes.

I agree. Though, I'm still expecting good sales of Bayonetta 2 in the U.S. Not as good as they would be if Nintendo of America had released the game in September instead of pushing it back to October where it will have more competition, but good nonetheless.
 
Week 2 sales added in the OP.

Format is ThisWeek / LTD (percent change from last week).

Media Create:
12./03. [WIU] Bayonetta 2 <ACT> (Nintendo) {2014.09.20} (¥8.316) - 6,970 / 45,797 (-82%)

Famitsu:
11./03. [WIU] Bayonetta 2 <ACT> (Nintendo) {2014.09.20} (¥8.316) - 9,284 / 42,398 (-72%)
 
massive wall coming through:

I guess this is going to continue to be ignored and not discussed.

and maybe wait till it launches everywhere or we have more than 2 days worth of date in japan? 3D World was also off to a slow start before selling better for several weeks afterwards.

How many days did the 360 version have?

I love how they compared the first week sales of the PS360 numbers to the first four days of the Wii U numbers.

But still, we all knew this game would bomba no matter what console it was released on. Still getting it day one.

Didn't it say it hasn't been a week yet, though?

Smh at "journalism" they can't even wait for the full week to end...cause by then it'll be on par with the original 360 release numbers.

Poor from IGN

Exactly, but IGN felt like it needed to make an article on it for click bait, we dont even know the digital numbers, even in the link they say it was out for 2 days.

I bet the life time numbers are much better then the 360 numbers

IGN couldn't even wait for a full week of sales data, bet they were chomping at the bit, as they know it's click worthy...

Kinda sad that people deem failure after a few days, but whatever I'll be enjoying it once it hits stateside....

Everyone else can enjoy beating this topic to death.

So IGN saw the "Media Create Sales: Week 38, 2014 (Sep 15 - Sep 21)"...

...saw that Bayonetta released on Sept 20th and only sold 38,828 in 2 days on an exclusive console...

...against Bayo 1's 200,000 copies over a course of a full week across 2 platforms



I wasn't expecting Bayo2 to sell at all, but this article is just click bait.
What were they honestly expecting to happen with the sells of an exclusive game over the course of 2 days?

Look at this thread, no one wants the truth in here...


holy shit... man we need more people like you witht his type of mind set. gret post

nicolas-cage-laughing.gif


I don't think Bayonetta 2's gonna get even close to 200k after next week, but that's funny clickbait regardless.

People are jumping the gun here. We should at least wait for a full week to have passed. Those numbers, while still low, are unreliable and doesn't show the reality. Way too many people here are making comparisons with the first Bayonetta title on PS3 and 360: Bayonetta 1's numbers are from a whole week worth of sales. It isn't yet the case for Bayonetta 2.

Now, don't get me wrong, I don't expect the numbers of Bayonetta 2 to skyrocket by next saturday, but we should at least refrain from commenting that new and making dishonest comparisons. By the way, what are those numbers exactly refering to? Is it taking into account the Bayo 1 + 2 pack and other limited editions?

These "weekly" numbers only account for two days worth of sales of the game, as it came out on the 20th and they counted from the 15th to the 21st.
Also, they don't count digital sales, which are somewhat big for Nintendo systems (they sell pre-paid game cards that allow you to download specific games at 7-11s here), so the number is bound to grow (a lot) bigger.

This is going to be a slow burner, but eventually it will get to 100.000 (and more) in Japan. And add to that 500.000 from US and Europe.
It won't achieve 1 million, but that's fine. Because the game is good. And original. And that's what matters.

The sales were for 2 days. It sold through over half its shipment in 2 days. Though, I'd image that the sales are not the same nationwide in Japan. Some areas would likely have higher sale rate than others, so its understandable that it didn't sale down to the last copy. Some random shops out in the middle of nowhere are't going to produce a whole lot of sales.

Nintendo of Japan really should have shipped more copies of the game. At least 100k.

I just found out that this report is only showing sales for 1 day and not a weeks worth. IGN and the rest of the media just loves to attack Nintendo in every way possible. Even with dishonest reporting.

It's been stated multiple times, in this very thread, and it's glossed over each time...

How is that funny? Unless you can see the future I dont see how this even is a point at this time. When Bayo 2 next week sales come out then report it correctly then. IGN created a click bait headline and thats just a fact.



I agree, i was completely under the impression that those numbers was during a 7 day span until i looked a bit further. IGN story is misleading.

Dont do what? Express my opinion? Sorry but its done. Its only 1 day sales, Ill wait for a full weeks sales before jumping to conclusions like you are.



You dont know that, 6 days more of sales could go either way. Keep using your magic 8 ball. Ill wait for real sales information then to declare whats actually happening with Bayo 2 in JP.

What question? Didnt see one.

All this front loaded talk from a past generation during a different market talk is funny to me. No one has hard evidence this is the case. Ill wait for real numbers from a full week of release. Thanks
 
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