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Bethesda Was “Surprised How Few People Wanted to Take Part in PvP” in Fallout 76
- Thread starter Bullet Club
- Start date
Newly Vacant
Member
I don't know how any of the Wastelanders news or videos give anyone hope for Fallout 76. It's still the same Fallout 76. They're adding minor-instancing and dialog, but it's still built on the same core gameplay. I don't get it.
Bought this on sale awhile ago, still haven't tried it.. surprised at their surprise, too - nothing about Fallout screams "duels".. Fallout Shelter was an entertaining spin-off, and there's plenty of creative fan energy with mods and with base-building in Fallout 4, so they probably got too optimistic about "emergent gameplay"..
I guess maybe there could be a fun mechanic with players forming/joining their own factions, fighting over territory, bases, negotiating resource trades... something like that might work.
I guess maybe there could be a fun mechanic with players forming/joining their own factions, fighting over territory, bases, negotiating resource trades... something like that might work.
triplestation
Member
so epic
that's what people always love about fallout is that it was always so epic, it made us feel heroic
a sense of PURPOSE
hope
THE WASTELAND NEEEDS ME
i must save my beeble
that's what people always love about fallout is that it was always so epic, it made us feel heroic
a sense of PURPOSE
hope
THE WASTELAND NEEEDS ME
i must save my beeble
Screamer-RSA
Member
Can't create a system of the haves and the have nots if they players aren't online can you?
They’re adding NPCs - you know, like in the single player Fallout games. What exactly don’t you ‘get’ about this?
Screamer-RSA
Member
Its as if Todd and crew was so engrossed in the fact that years from now they can still "engage" with players as he puts it, ie. have a store constantly in your face, that they forgot what type of game the people who play their games like.
Single player games with mod support. People still play Skyrim due to mods, and fallout 76 doesn't allow free mods.
Single player games with mod support. People still play Skyrim due to mods, and fallout 76 doesn't allow free mods.
VertigoOA
Banned
It’s the same as the core gameplay as in Fallout 4 except it actually plays better anyway. The shooting, world design, character movement, enemy encounters/monsters, and player builds are all superior to the prior game.
The “gameplay” of nearly all Bethesda games are mediocre at best. Without the choose your own adventure stuff it lost its biggest fan favorite element when it launched as only a survival game.
I wouldn’t even call them the B team as the Austin studio took the task of cleaning up this piece of shit game engine and made a shit-ton of progress.
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TeddyShardik
Banned
Maybe they shouldn't have made it so shit then?
Their kind of "opt-in" pvp was just a bad idea. It doesn't work within their world.
This shit should have been Ultima Online level of PvP.
You get to attack anyone if you wnt, but later down the road you have to deal with groups of people just salivating at the thought of seeing you dead and looting your corpse...
Sorry....PTSD kicking in...
Their kind of "opt-in" pvp was just a bad idea. It doesn't work within their world.
This shit should have been Ultima Online level of PvP.
You get to attack anyone if you wnt, but later down the road you have to deal with groups of people just salivating at the thought of seeing you dead and looting your corpse...
Sorry....PTSD kicking in...
DoctorEkkoUK
Member
heres the thing, they wanted some of that GTA Online money. Unfortunatley for them, they were not even close to being able to make a game to fit that bill, also GTA online was free for anyone who owned GTA5. Maybe if this shipped as a free mode with FO4 they might have stood a chance.
droid_orat
Neo Member
Bethesda Was “Surprised How Few People Wanted to Pay for Crap None Asked For” aka Fallout 76. Here I fixed it for you.
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Newly Vacant
Member
I don’t get how adding NPC’s makes this a good game. It’s still going to be full of micro transactions. It’s still going to have the same VATS system. Bethesda is trying to add a Fallout-ish story into a game where the main world space can’t be changed. Fallout 76 won’t turn into Fallout 4 or Fallout 3.
anthraticus
Banned
Turns out ppl can only stomach Bethesda’s awful gameplay if it’s wrapped in at least a thin veneer of player driven narrative. You strip out human characters, towns, and a plot and even Bethtards start to notice they’re playing a shit game. As bad as their writing and characters may be, that's what sustains the illusion of awesomeness for these people... Instead they got a limited multiplayer experience that brings very little to the table. 
I saw this headline on Reddit, and had to laugh. This is pure damage control. My personal theory is, they knew Starfield was not coming out for another 3-4 years so they had to do SOMETHING. They had bought a company that was making a survival game like Rust, and they thought it would do well if they tossed a fallout paint job onto it. They were also eyeing the success many of these PVP centric games' success with micro transactions and storefronts were having, and figured they could cash in on that as well. Then to make it even worse, they insisted on using the same tools they use to make single player games, and the database they use for item tracking and what not was just not built to handle keeping track of the stashes of 24 individual players. All the while, forcing a fan base that are mostly not the same as those who play said competitive PVP games into something completely different than what they enjoy.
They would have been much better off just making 76 a spin off title like New Vegas, complete with mods and what have you that allowed the players to invite 3 friends to join them in their game. They could have also had a PVP mode where people could "invade" like you can in Dark Souls. What makes this even more perplexing to me, is they (the parent company Zenimax) already had those lumps from ESO. It started out as a PVP heavy game and they revamped it to be more PVE and they are having great success. So instead of having a stop gap release that helps fill in the void left by games that are too far off, they ended up with a complete disaster, and they kept shooting themselves in the foot long after release. Who can forget the fiasco of the canvas bag? Or their inept security practices where account information was exposed. It was a perfect shit storm of disaster. Misaimed hardly describes what they did to muck this all up.
They would have been much better off just making 76 a spin off title like New Vegas, complete with mods and what have you that allowed the players to invite 3 friends to join them in their game. They could have also had a PVP mode where people could "invade" like you can in Dark Souls. What makes this even more perplexing to me, is they (the parent company Zenimax) already had those lumps from ESO. It started out as a PVP heavy game and they revamped it to be more PVE and they are having great success. So instead of having a stop gap release that helps fill in the void left by games that are too far off, they ended up with a complete disaster, and they kept shooting themselves in the foot long after release. Who can forget the fiasco of the canvas bag? Or their inept security practices where account information was exposed. It was a perfect shit storm of disaster. Misaimed hardly describes what they did to muck this all up.
Caffeine
Member
this was during the announcement of the game but when i thought fallout i thought pve in no way shape or form did pvp come to my mind since the franchise has always been pve.
your target audience was expecting pve and you gave them an empty map to kill other players in of course it bomba'd.
so i'm glad they are making it more traditional now I just think its hilarious the devs were surprised.
your target audience was expecting pve and you gave them an empty map to kill other players in of course it bomba'd.
so i'm glad they are making it more traditional now I just think its hilarious the devs were surprised.
VertigoOA
Banned
the micro transactions are mostly cosmetics as all weapons and armor are earned thru gameplay. They’re literally changing a lot of the map too with a world state change no less and there’s plenty of areas in it that can be fleshed out and populated. The game is designed to be changed and built upon with player feedback so the cluelessness with the driveby shitposting by those who never played it is entertaining. Will be more entertaining when the shit posts continue and it still manages to be one of the most popular online games of 2020 and while appeasing the peasants by offering all this new content at no cost.
up until division 2 hit 3$ Fallout 76 has been outperforming it across the board with both content and playerbase so comparisons to less successful games is misplaced.
Wastelanders looks like a huge improvement to the game across the board. A narrative, dialogue options, more loot, more dungeons, a world state change, a revamped lighting system, a new end game, etc...
76 launched with only relying on the core gameplay of a Bethesda game, which is mostly shit across the board for all their games. It had none of the other stuff their games were known for aside from having the best exploration aspect of any of their games to date. And since then it’s seen a lot of work and improvement to that core gameplay, which above all else is the most important part of any game.
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Plague Doctor
Member
What all you haters fail to acknowledge is 16 times the detail given by the Todd.
I have no idea whether or not Fallout 76 will be a ‘good game’ after the Wastelanders update - but it’s pretty obvious that it’s going to be a much different game. A game that I’m now willing to look at because the update addresses my chief complaint with this game - that there were no human NPCs.
You’re not paying a whole lot of attention here. I made it clear that I don’t own this game and have never played it. You’re responding to me as though I’m defending the game. I’m not.
Honestly, at this point, you’ve more or less revealed yourself to be a Bethesda hater. I’m sorry, but wondering why populating this game with NPCs would change the game is actually pretty stupid. I’m not saying that you yourself are stupid - I just think you’ve put up a wall here and are going to argue against anything Bethesda does.
Myself, I’m open to changes. If a dev makes mistakes, and then works hard to remedy those mistakes, then I’m willing to listen. This update looks pretty significant to me - so I’ll wait to read more.
Atanascovich
Member
I just bought it for about 11 usd In my country. Will play in the weekend.
I just want to walk around the map for about 2 hours, shoot some different enemies and never play it again. Its better than spending money in theaters this week.
But I can feel that I still going to be disappointed by this.
I just want to walk around the map for about 2 hours, shoot some different enemies and never play it again. Its better than spending money in theaters this week.
But I can feel that I still going to be disappointed by this.
Newly Vacant
Member
I played Fallout 76 in the B.E.T.A., at launch, and multiple other times. I'm not coming at this from an outside position. I've tried to find a way to enjoy the game. I've given the game multiple tries, at various points. I do not like Fallout 76. If you're enjoying the game, then great. Really, in all sincerity, good for you. I, personally, find no enjoyment in the game. I'm not telling you to hate the game, or stop playing. Maybe it's the game that happens to align with your tastes specifically. I don't know. What I am trying to say, albeit poorly, is that I had so much frustration with the game that I cannot fathom how you, or anyone else, can continue to play the game. It's been broken every time I've given it a chance.
Ballthyrm
Member
I don't understand why they keep slapping PvP mode to games.
To get a good PvP game you need a long learning curve and enough depth to get a Meta going.
They have to be hard to master.
Most PvP games don't have either of those intrinsic qualities so they get boring really fast.
PvP is not something you slap on a game.
PvP is the game.
To get a good PvP game you need a long learning curve and enough depth to get a Meta going.
They have to be hard to master.
Most PvP games don't have either of those intrinsic qualities so they get boring really fast.
PvP is not something you slap on a game.
PvP is the game.
HaveButOneLife
Banned
It makes sense when you know you're not the only survivor in the world and I definitely wanted a MP Fallout game until this controversy happened.
EDMIX
Member
You talked to everyone to know this?
Riven326
Banned
This company is so clueless. It's incredible.
Torrent of Pork
Banned
I've said it a million times that had 76 just been a traditional Bethesda Fallout game with optional 4 player co-op, having friends jump into your world for a bit, it would have been well-received. Invent a bullshit reason why VATS doesn't work in co-op, "The interference from another patented Pip-Boy targeting system will temporarily disable the feature," and wham-bam thank you ma'am.
newtypepilot
Member
Do people still believe whatever crap comes out of Bethesda's mouth, despite all the lies??
FO76 was just a lazy attempt at getting on the live service gravy train. A low effort product by reusing an dated engine and as many as assets as they can possibly could. Having PvP is just so that they can have an excuse for being online only, since they knew if they pitched it as a single player only, the reception would've been poor. They knew they could milk their die hard fans regardless how buggy and barebones the product is.
FO76 was just a lazy attempt at getting on the live service gravy train. A low effort product by reusing an dated engine and as many as assets as they can possibly could. Having PvP is just so that they can have an excuse for being online only, since they knew if they pitched it as a single player only, the reception would've been poor. They knew they could milk their die hard fans regardless how buggy and barebones the product is.
SmoothRunningGun
Member
I'll buy it on steam if you can actually play solo now. Only took a year but it actually sounds like a fallout game now.
OuterLimits
Member
Make a really good game Bethesda, and people will play all the modes you offer, including pvp.
I commented in another thread on this, but it seems like there’s a ton of potential for “pvp” outside combat, and for building a grammar for emergent narratives.. I hope they actually get it together and build something there instead of just shifting to straight NPC interactions and quest lines
Starbuck2907
Member
Anyone else feel like Bethesda price their single player expansions about right but their micro transactions are way, way overpriced?
joe_zazen
Member
what kind of pvp outside of combat do you mean? Isnt the gameplay just building and combat? Building pvp?
JSoup
Banned
You're gonna have to explain that one a little better, champ.
Saying there is player vs player content that isn't player vs player means nothing without details.
Like, card games and pet battles, ala FF14 and WoW?
anthraticus
Banned
And the same thing can be said about sp, but even more so.
Bethesduh trying to please everybody and play both sides of the fence again.
Freakin' sellouts only care about the bottom line and will never learn.
CitizenX3639
Banned
I wouldnt say sellouts as more a victim of trend watching, especially on the PC side. Games like Rust, 7 Days, etc are popular because they are not causal games like FO. They wanted to try and copy that success, but the first rule of business, KNOW your audience. Another example would be CoD, BF, etc, etc with BR. its only reason for its minor success, its free though BF died without even a blip.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Horse. Armor.
MiguelItUp
Member
It's what happens when you try to incorporate something into a series that fans never wanted. New things are good, sure, but they have to work.
I like that they were like, "We got PVP!" and no one was excited. Then they were like, "We have a BR mode!" and no one cared. 76 just feels like the laziest cash in across the board. It has reused assets from FO4, and they trying to cash in on things that don't feel very Fallout-like.
I like that they were like, "We got PVP!" and no one was excited. Then they were like, "We have a BR mode!" and no one cared. 76 just feels like the laziest cash in across the board. It has reused assets from FO4, and they trying to cash in on things that don't feel very Fallout-like.
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
During Fallout 76 development
- Ok guys, make it MP and jam in as many microtrans as possible. Those SP Fallout and ES games aren't making much DLC money
After MP backfired
- Ok guys, let's play dumb and make it sound like gamers wanted MP the whole time. We were just appeasing the masses in theory, so it's not our fault as gamers turned on us when it came to sales
- Ok guys, make it MP and jam in as many microtrans as possible. Those SP Fallout and ES games aren't making much DLC money
After MP backfired
- Ok guys, let's play dumb and make it sound like gamers wanted MP the whole time. We were just appeasing the masses in theory, so it's not our fault as gamers turned on us when it came to sales
Gavin Stevens
Formerly 'o'dium'
I just wanted a traditional fallout 3 experience but with coop play... that was all...
That wasn’t too much to ask, was it...?
That wasn’t too much to ask, was it...?
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
It's modern age. Every game has to have a MP component, DLC and microtrans. Got to boost and brag about increasing sales ratios of digital vs. disc at quarterly earning reports.
Next up, King's Quest will have battle royale mode. Take control as Sir Graham and save the princess before 99 other gamers called Sir Graham(1), Sir Graham(2).... to win the match.
Get bonus XP if you enter the game as the last parachutist as Sir Graham(99) and win.
I mean, if they wanted people to "create stories", they have to build in ways for it to happen.. like, let people make bets on their combat, trade items for favors/quests, form groups, factions, etc. - something like this bounty hunting system could have been built in: https://www.polygon.com/2019/7/12/20690651/fallout-76-talon-company-appalachia-bounty-bethesda-group ; have reputation systems with and between players, have NPC allies that can be traded, fought over, recruited/wooed away - let two players procreate or adopt an NPC child - include some kind of gamey "parley" mechanic where players can interact with dialogue options, even basic speech cards w/ rare one-liners etc. - you could also set up some kind of reputation system - e.g. V.A.U.L.T. (virtue, anger, ugliness, luck, tenacity) - on a -5 to +5 scale - based just on interactions with other players, and changing the ways you can interact with them
There's tons they could've provided in the base game even without quests or factions.. and none of it really demanding in design or function, with room to balance the systems over time